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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2017 3:16:39 GMT
Excellent footage of the 1935 semi-final between West Brom and Bolton taken from the open embankment.
The Butler Street stand also seems to have been hugely developed from the pictures we've seen before but it doesn't yet extend up to the corners, I think it would be safe to assume that this had been developed in the summer of 1934 when the roof on the Stoke End was removed.
I'm sure I'd read that the last FA cup semi-final to be played at the Vic was in 1906, this is clearly not true.
Just over 49000 at the match  With over 51000 at the Arse game how on earth did they all fit in...... Just to add to this England v Ireland in 1936, 48000 turned up >>>> www.englandfootballonline.com/Seas1900-39/1936-37/M0206Ire1936.html#team |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Feb 28, 2017 3:27:27 GMT
Great find.
The club were obviously quickly rewarded for the investment(s) they made in the summer of 1934.
Maybe the Butler Street stand had been developed even further by then but I can't find any photos/footage to confirm.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 28, 2017 10:39:46 GMT
I love that old Stoke End stand. It didn't look like it could be anything more than a barn on the first photos but it really is quite something!
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Post by onionman on Feb 28, 2017 12:11:06 GMT
Excellent footage of the 1935 semi-final between West Brom and Bolton taken from the open embankment.
The Butler Street stand also seems to have been hugely developed from the pictures we've seen before but it doesn't yet extend up to the corners, I think it would be safe to assume that this had been developed in the summer of 1934 when the roof on the Stoke End was removed.
I'm sure I'd read that the last FA cup semi-final to be played at the Vic was in 1906, this is clearly not true.
Just over 49000 at the match With over 51000 at the Arse game how on earth did they all fit in...... Imagine the chaos when they started "Doing the Herbert Chapman" |
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Post by Davef on Feb 28, 2017 12:14:50 GMT
A few more photos...  This is Stoke v Sheffield Wednesday in December 1933. You can clearly see the extended lighter coloured roof of the Boothen Stand in this picture. From this picture I think it's safe to conclude that the very first photo in this thread is likely from the very early 1930's.  This is a picture of the Butler Street Block E corner being erected in 1936.  This is a photo from December 1938 with the completed Butler Street corner at the Stoke End in the background. |
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Post by Davef on Feb 28, 2017 12:32:02 GMT
 And this one is from britainfromabove.org and is from July 1931. Looks pretty much exactly like the ground was in the photo in the OP. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2017 15:23:24 GMT
yes, remember the gasometer (not gas tower) in the 60's. Also before I joined the Boothen tribe, used to enjoy the Stoke End, mightly climb up those steps, reach the top and then the scene, the image, the Vic laid out before my eyes. Got right down to pitch-side behind the goal, remember Harry Burrows canonballs into that goal. wet but happy times!
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Post by Billy the kid on Mar 2, 2017 9:23:09 GMT
I really love these old pictures, not just of the Victoria Ground but local places too.
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Post by Davef on Mar 2, 2017 12:19:36 GMT
 I've read a few accounts of the Victoria Ground which state that the Butler Street Stand was built in 1935. This is a photo from 1921 and that is quite clearly the Butler Street Stand featured in the aerial photos (it doesn't look any different from the footage in the WBA v Bolton Semi Final). It's got the same barrel roof and stanchions. The stand was obviously completed in 1936, but it's a bit disappointing that there is no historical confirmation about this. I'd also like to know when the Stoke End terracing was completed. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2017 12:51:54 GMT
I've read a few accounts of the Victoria Ground which state that the Butler Street Stand was built in 1935. This is a photo from 1921 and that is quite clearly the Butler Street Stand featured in the aerial photos (it doesn't look any different from the footage in the WBA v Bolton Semi Final). It's got the same barrel roof and stanchions. The stand was obviously completed in 1936, but it's a bit disappointing that there is no historical confirmation about this. I'd also like to know when the Stoke End terracing was completed. Love the refs attire......  |
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Post by Gods on Mar 2, 2017 13:02:17 GMT
Good find, it'd be interesting to know what year the picture was taken?
dict.eudic.net/dicts/en/Victoria_Ground.html
"The players changing rooms were set in the corner of the ground which also included a stove so players could keep warm. Above the changing 'hut' was the directors box, a rather primitive building but could hold around 12 people. During the early 1920s a new, mainly wooden main stand was erected alongside the 'hut' and this could hold 2,000 fans. By 1930 Stoke had added 'City' to their name and the Boothen End was terraced and later covered, and consequently the ground lost its oval shape. 1935, when the likes of Stanley Matthews was beginning to draw in the crowds, the Butler Street Stand was built, giving seating to 5,000 people. In front of the seats was a small paddock, room for another 2,000"
If the Boothen stand could hold 2,000 and the Butler Street Stand and paddock, 7,000, then that would mean there there must have been over 20,000 in each of the Stoke End and Boothen terraces for the Arsenal game capacity crowd of 51,000 in 1935!
Early 60's Late 50's?? This shows the ground in 63 from the clubs website,  Boothern stand/corner not yet complete, . players sill coming out from the corner? like yourself i'm struggling to find anything from the earlier rebuild. Typical of the progress, or lack of, we made in the late 70's/early 80's does this make us the only club ever to "unfill" a corner ? Meantime I propose Tony Scholes appoints Paul Spencer as "Official Victoria Ground historian" he has the intellect and tenacity required for this difficult role! |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 2, 2017 15:14:11 GMT
I've read a few accounts of the Victoria Ground which state that the Butler Street Stand was built in 1935. This is a photo from 1921 and that is quite clearly the Butler Street Stand featured in the aerial photos (it doesn't look any different from the footage in the WBA v Bolton Semi Final). It's got the same barrel roof and stanchions. The stand was obviously completed in 1936, but it's a bit disappointing that there is no historical confirmation about this. I'd also like to know when the Stoke End terracing was completed.
If you look back through the thread Dave that barrel roof and stanchions are there as early as 1906!
We've pretty much established for certain that the Stoke End terrace was done in the summer of 1934 oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/post/5462027/thread and we speculated that the Butler Street stand was developed at the same time, where the seating may have been improved but your picture shows that it was already in!
The Butler Street stand was finished with the corners as you know in 1936.
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Post by Davef on Mar 2, 2017 15:45:08 GMT
 Paul If you look at this image and then the one Gods posted from the early 60's, you can clearly see that more terracing was added to the Stoke End embankment over time, but I have no idea when that work was undertaken. Also, if you look at the Stoke players training film from 1934, you'll notice that there was a wall at the bank of the terracing which then wasn't much bigger than the paddocks would've been. Sorry, I should've been a bit clearer about that. |
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Post by Davef on Mar 2, 2017 15:50:41 GMT
Actually, looking at that film again, that doesn't look like a wall, but the old embankment that was eventually terraced.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 2, 2017 16:00:35 GMT
Paul If you look at this image and then the one Gods posted from the early 60's, you can clearly see that more terracing was added to the Stoke End embankment over time, but I have no idea when that work was undertaken. Also, if you look at the Stoke players training film from 1934, you'll notice that there was a wall at the bank of the terracing which then wasn't much bigger than the paddocks would've been. Sorry, I should've been a bit clearer about that. Ah right, got yer.
What are your thoughts at 0.38 on this Dave?
EDIT: This is probably a better image actually.
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Post by Davef on Mar 2, 2017 16:09:33 GMT
I think those fans are stood on the old unterraced embankment...they certainly seem to be shuffling about more than those at the front.  |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 2, 2017 16:15:40 GMT
I think those fans are stood on the old unterraced embankment...they certainly seem to be shuffling about more than those at the front.
I've just edited my post Dave, I think that's a better image.
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Post by Davef on Mar 2, 2017 16:25:57 GMT
I think those fans are stood on the old unterraced embankment...they certainly seem to be shuffling about more than those at the front.
I've just edited my post Dave, I think that's a better image.
If you look at that picture of Stan and the groundsman thawing the pitch, you'll notice that the snow completely covers the unterraced part of the embankment, but you can see some of the terracing despite the snow at the bottom. That picture is from late 1938. |
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Post by Davef on Mar 2, 2017 16:27:15 GMT
 Mind you, looking at this image from 1974, the Stoke End looks a real crumbling mess by then! |
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Post by Mendicant on Mar 2, 2017 16:30:59 GMT
I've read a few accounts of the Victoria Ground which state that the Butler Street Stand was built in 1935. This is a photo from 1921 and that is quite clearly the Butler Street Stand featured in the aerial photos (it doesn't look any different from the footage in the WBA v Bolton Semi Final). It's got the same barrel roof and stanchions. The stand was obviously completed in 1936, but it's a bit disappointing that there is no historical confirmation about this. I'd also like to know when the Stoke End terracing was completed. Love the refs attire...... Someone tell Angus Young his touring costume has been found. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 2, 2017 16:35:33 GMT
I've just edited my post Dave, I think that's a better image.
If you look at that picture of Stan and the groundsman thawing the pitch, you'll notice that the snow completely covers the unterraced part of the embankment, but you can see some of the terracing despite the snow at the bottom. That picture is from late 1938.
Great spot, we've been talking at slightly cross purposes (which is totally my mistake - I see it now). Yes the whole of the embankment is there but only a part of the terracing, which is what you've said all along.
Right then, next challenge ...
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Post by lagwafis on Mar 2, 2017 17:02:32 GMT
Great thread. I'd always thought of the Stoke End as an open terrace / bank until now. Wondering if 'The Boothen Ends' and 'History of Stoke City' VHS tapes will throw any further light on things. I'll give them another watch at some point.   |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 2, 2017 17:08:47 GMT
Great thread. I'd always thought of the Stoke End as an open terrace / bank until now. Wondering if 'The Boothen Ends' and 'History of Stoke City' VHS tapes will throw any further light on things. I'll give them another watch at some point.
Oh they're fantastic pictures mate, where did you find them and any ideas on the year?
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Mar 2, 2017 17:23:37 GMT
Great thread. I'd always thought of the Stoke End as an open terrace / bank until now. Wondering if 'The Boothen Ends' and 'History of Stoke City' VHS tapes will throw any further light on things. I'll give them another watch at some point. Yes and me mate I've got this image of a black ash bank going back for miles. i can't remember any terracing at all. I started going in 1970 so I was a kid. |
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Post by Dutchpeter on Mar 2, 2017 17:28:43 GMT
Didn't footage of Stoke v Grimsby at the Victoria Ground, from before WW1 surface a few years ago?
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Post by block22stokie on Mar 2, 2017 17:31:51 GMT
Great thread. I'd always thought of the Stoke End as an open terrace / bank until now. Wondering if 'The Boothen Ends' and 'History of Stoke City' VHS tapes will throw any further light on things. I'll give them another watch at some point.
Oh they're fantastic pictures mate, where did you find them and any ideas on the year?
I swear these photos are from very early days when we were formed? I could be wrong but just thought I had read that somewhere. |
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Post by lagwafis on Mar 2, 2017 17:39:42 GMT
Great thread. I'd always thought of the Stoke End as an open terrace / bank until now. Wondering if 'The Boothen Ends' and 'History of Stoke City' VHS tapes will throw any further light on things. I'll give them another watch at some point.
Oh they're fantastic pictures mate, where did you find them and any ideas on the year?
I can't find an exact date on the ones above unfortunately (beyond being 'turn of the century'). Going further back into the late 1800s, I'm not sure what corner this first (below) image is but apparently it's from about 1868 when the Vic was still an athletics ground. Apparently the second image is from a time when each goal was an open grassy bank with only a small stand on Boothen Road. I've got quite a few photos from old archive footage etc. which hasn't been posted on this thread yet. I'll have a go at uploading them + try to piece together a time line for the early 20th century from a couple of other books and videos.   |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 2, 2017 17:52:24 GMT
Oh they're fantastic pictures mate, where did you find them and any ideas on the year?
I can't find an exact date on the ones above unfortunately (beyond being 'turn of the century'). Going further back into the late 1800s, I'm not sure what corner this first (below) image is but apparently it's from about 1868 when the Vic was still an athletics ground. Apparently the second image is from a time when each goal was an open grassy bank with only a small stand on Boothen Road. I've got quite a few photos from old archive footage etc. which hasn't been posted on this thread yet. I'll have a go at uploading them + try to piece together a time line for the early 20th century from a couple of other books and videos.
We know from the picture below that there wasn't a bank at the Stoke End in 1906, so if the top picture from above is from 1868 then it would suggest that we're looking at the Butler St./Boothen corner. Having said that, I suspect it was taken a lot later than 1868 if the original pictures that you posted were from the turn of the century.
I have no idea what to make of the second picture though, it doesn't really seem to fulfil any criteria that we've seen so far.
It would be fantastic if you could upload those other pictures when you have time.
Cheers
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Mar 2, 2017 17:53:14 GMT
Great thread. I'd always thought of the Stoke End as an open terrace / bank until now. Wondering if 'The Boothen Ends' and 'History of Stoke City' VHS tapes will throw any further light on things. I'll give them another watch at some point.
Oh they're fantastic pictures mate, where did you find them and any ideas on the year?
Players are wearing stripes with dark shorts,which suggests it's around the 1890s. |
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Post by march4 on Mar 2, 2017 18:22:47 GMT
Wow!!!
What a fantastic thread.
Thank you to everyone contributing.
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With over 51000 at the Arse game how on earth did they all fit in......
