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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 3, 2024 17:14:00 GMT
It was a shit attempt to overthrow the government but it was still an attempt to overthrow the government. Trump uses dog whistle phrases that he knows his hardcore supporters will pick up on while maintaining a distance from taking responsibility from the consequences of his supporters actions. The people who turned up to the White House believed they were doing Trump's bidding in claiming the election for him and at one point even Trump thought it might happen and tried to get himself in with the mob. When it failed he distanced himself from their actions and many of those arrested realised they had been used and let down by him. After the rioting was quashed Trump continued to work behind the scenes to claim an election he lost. The man does not believe in democracy - he believes in the acquisition of power at any cost. I think you're mostly right in that assessment. However I don't see this end of democracy argument that people talk about if he gets back in. He didn't end democracy in his 2016 to 2020 term. And I don't see the route through to achieving anything else in their political system other than the 2 party system that they currently have. Not that I like their political system anyway because the whole thing is corrupt to high heaven with all this fund raising and shyte. But I guess you'll let me know why I'm talking shit again 😆 I'll let you know if I think you're talking shit again if I think you are talking shit again - and I'm sure you will recipricate😀. In this case I disagree with you but I dont think you are talking shit. The issue as I see it with the US system is how far Trump can push the role of President in terms of controlling the levers of power. Supreme court judges and the equivalent of our civil service are political appointments and the system has relied on the past on Presidents respecting the conventions of the democratic system and seeing themselves as cogs in the wheel. Trump sees himself as the only thing that matters and has no respect for democracy - he sees himself as above it. He's already tested the waters by getting the Supreme Court to agree that a President can't be charged or convicted for acts they did while performing their roles as President. The test is what is deemed as a Presidential act - Trump will almost certainly claim it is anything he does while he is President and he will appoint people who will agree with him. In many ways Trump is a joke character but I really think you are under estimating just how dangerous he is.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 3, 2024 18:47:28 GMT
I can't believe I watched nearly 2 minutes of that shit 🤦 I'd love to know how people get taken in by this fruit loop 🤔 It's a fuckin cult and the sad thing is, is that people who can't afford to, will be sending him their money. He keeps telling everybody how rich he is, whilst at the same time, begging people to send him money. How can such a grifter pass the fit and proper person test to run the most powerful nation on earth? He repeatedly demonstrates that he is wide open to being bought by the highest bidder. It is truly frightening. I’d rather buy some Trump cards than an Oasis reunion ticket. Guess there was a copyright issue with calling them Top Trumps. Love to get my hands on one of those 5 special cards though
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 3, 2024 20:46:10 GMT
I think you're mostly right in that assessment. However I don't see this end of democracy argument that people talk about if he gets back in. He didn't end democracy in his 2016 to 2020 term. And I don't see the route through to achieving anything else in their political system other than the 2 party system that they currently have. Not that I like their political system anyway because the whole thing is corrupt to high heaven with all this fund raising and shyte. But I guess you'll let me know why I'm talking shit again 😆 I'll let you know if I think you're talking shit again if I think you are talking shit again - and I'm sure you will recipricate😀. In this case I disagree with you but I dont think you are talking shit. The issue as I see it with the US system is how far Trump can push the role of President in terms of controlling the levers of power. Supreme court judges and the equivalent of our civil service are political appointments and the system has relied on the past on Presidents respecting the conventions of the democratic system and seeing themselves as cogs in the wheel. Trump sees himself as the only thing that matters and has no respect for democracy - he sees himself as above it. He's already tested the waters by getting the Supreme Court to agree that a President can't be charged or convicted for acts they did while performing their roles as President. The test is what is deemed as a Presidential act - Trump will almost certainly claim it is anything he does while he is President and he will appoint people who will agree with him. In many ways Trump is a joke character but I really think you are under estimating just how dangerous he is. I don't think I know enough about it all to be honest. I just have suspicions about how bad he is because of the way the media have hammed a lot of stuff up so take a bit of a devils advocate role with it a lot of the time. I still however believe some of those court cases were over played. But either way I'm no super fan of his and I am surprised about how poor the candidates are for President and VP picks. Amazing out of 400m odd people.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 21:07:06 GMT
He's having a shocker, be surprised if the wheels aren't off completely before November I don't think Trump voters care. And the right wing media machine has persuaded so many people it's not a big deal that he tried to overthrow democracy, is a criminal, completely failed at legitimate business etc. I don't see how it matters. People who support Trump support a guy who intentionally committed a mass child abuse campaign, tried to overthrow democracy, packed the courts with extremists who strip away basic human rights, shifted money and power wherever possible to the richest, who spat on veterans, whose campaign worked with russian intelligence and who now supports Putin brutally conquering a democracy. Will they change their mind because he says some more stuff out loud?
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 3, 2024 21:40:57 GMT
I'll let you know if I think you're talking shit again if I think you are talking shit again - and I'm sure you will recipricate😀. In this case I disagree with you but I dont think you are talking shit. The issue as I see it with the US system is how far Trump can push the role of President in terms of controlling the levers of power. Supreme court judges and the equivalent of our civil service are political appointments and the system has relied on the past on Presidents respecting the conventions of the democratic system and seeing themselves as cogs in the wheel. Trump sees himself as the only thing that matters and has no respect for democracy - he sees himself as above it. He's already tested the waters by getting the Supreme Court to agree that a President can't be charged or convicted for acts they did while performing their roles as President. The test is what is deemed as a Presidential act - Trump will almost certainly claim it is anything he does while he is President and he will appoint people who will agree with him. In many ways Trump is a joke character but I really think you are under estimating just how dangerous he is. I don't think I know enough about it all to be honest. I just have suspicions about how bad he is because of the way the media have hammed a lot of stuff up so take a bit of a devils advocate role with it a lot of the time. I still however believe some of those court cases were over played. But either way I'm no super fan of his and I am surprised about how poor the candidates are for President and VP picks. Amazing out of 400m odd people. The court cases are important because there is a fundamental principle of democratic government at stake - the separation of the legal system from the executive and the principle that everyone is equal under the rule of law. Trump is looking to exempt himself from the rule of law and make the legal system subservient to his will. He hasn't put together a coherent, evidence based defence in any of his trials - if you actually analyse his defence it basically amounts to I'm Donald Trump, normal rules do not apply. My favourite is the one where he claimed that overstating the floorspace of his New York apartment in order to over inflate his wealth was fine because the size of the apartment is a subjective matter. The man either doesn't believe tape measures are a thing or his subjective view of the size of his apartment is more accurate/important than the one you get by actually measuring it.
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 3, 2024 21:44:32 GMT
I don't think Trump voters care. And the right wing media machine has persuaded so many people it's not a big deal that he tried to overthrow democracy, is a criminal, completely failed at legitimate business etc. I don't see how it matters. People who support Trump support a guy who intentionally committed a mass child abuse campaign, tried to overthrow democracy, packed the courts with extremists who strip away basic human rights, shifted money and power wherever possible to the richest, who spat on veterans, whose campaign worked with russian intelligence and who now supports Putin brutally conquering a democracy. Will they change their mind because he says some more stuff out loud? I'm convinced 😆. I've just listened to a low IQ moron sat in his back garden tell me republicans are all low intelligence morons and that he's now a high intelligence non moron because he's no longer a Republican 😆 Come on chief there must be better snippets than that to convince me. Has this guy ever heard Bidens racial jungle rant or the countless other gaffs on the racial side of things. Ah I guess not.. They're all full of shit all of em.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 21:56:13 GMT
I'm convinced 😆. I've just listened to a low IQ moron sat in his back garden tell me republicans are all low intelligence morons and that he's now a high intelligence non moron because he's no longer a Republican 😆 Come on chief there must be better snippets than that to convince me. Has this guy ever heard Bidens racial jungle rant or the countless other gaffs on the racial side of things. Ah I guess not.. They're all full of shit all of em. He said that the majority of Trump supporters were of low IQ, not that all Republicans were. For me, he's trying to make the same point that Lyndon Johnson once made ... "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 3, 2024 22:06:10 GMT
I'm convinced 😆. I've just listened to a low IQ moron sat in his back garden tell me republicans are all low intelligence morons and that he's now a high intelligence non moron because he's no longer a Republican 😆 Come on chief there must be better snippets than that to convince me. Has this guy ever heard Bidens racial jungle rant or the countless other gaffs on the racial side of things. Ah I guess not.. They're all full of shit all of em. He said that the majority of Trump supporters were of low IQ, not that all Republicans were. For me, he's trying to make the same point that Lyndon Johnson once made ... "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." Fair enough chief i get your point 👍
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 4, 2024 10:59:06 GMT
What an idiotic thing to do ...
He's exposing himself as a flat out liar.
We know he went to the island because his name appears in the flight logs presented at the Maxwell trial.
What is he even trying to achieve here?
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Post by elystokie on Sept 4, 2024 11:41:34 GMT
Finally going where he deserves with any luck unless his corrupt mates can pull some more strings.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 4, 2024 13:24:45 GMT
Finally going where he deserves with any luck unless his corrupt mates can pull some more strings. That was interesting. The fact that a Federal Court judge has had to rule (twice) that paying hush money to a porn star when you weren't President does not qualify as a Presedential act just shows how far Trump is prepared to brass it out. Does he really think everybody is stupid enough to accept that as a defence? There is a classic comedy to be written about all of this but unfortunately at the moment it isn't funny.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Sept 5, 2024 2:27:57 GMT
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Post by mtrstudent on Sept 5, 2024 2:51:14 GMT
What an idiotic thing to do ... He's exposing himself as a flat out liar. We know he went to the island because his name appears in the flight logs presented at the Maxwell trial. What is he even trying to achieve here? It's part of a loyalty test I think. His followers have to learn to reject their own lying eyes, and by being public about their support for Trump over reality they're emotionally tying themselves to him. I read a bit about Hitler, Mussolini, Mao, Hussein and Putin. You deny reality and force your loyalists to do more and more extreme things until they feel trapped on your side. Trump is of the same ilk.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Sept 5, 2024 4:25:50 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Sept 5, 2024 11:21:59 GMT
Now this could be curtains for the Tango Fascist.
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Post by gawa on Sept 5, 2024 12:27:32 GMT
Starmers a communist, Harris is a communist, everyone is a communist.
In 20 years time when we are even further down the path of right wing authoritarianism and inequality - I wonder if they'll refer to Trump and Farage as communists?
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Post by elystokie on Sept 5, 2024 13:08:15 GMT
Things you love to see.
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Post by georgeberrysafro on Sept 5, 2024 13:59:22 GMT
Starmers a communist, Harris is a communist, everyone is a communist. In 20 years time when we are even further down the path of right wing authoritarianism and inequality - I wonder if they'll refer to Trump and Farage as communists? You'd hope one day they'd actually understand the definition of the words they use but highly unlikely as the MAGA lot just parrot anything the Orange Clown says. It's just dumb politics that people lap up on social media. politics Mar. 6, 2022 Do Republicans Know What Communism Is?
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Post by wannabee on Sept 5, 2024 14:07:18 GMT
Finally going where he deserves with any luck unless his corrupt mates can pull some more strings. That was interesting. The fact that a Federal Court judge has had to rule (twice) that paying hush money to a porn star when you weren't President does not qualify as a Presedential act just shows how far Trump is prepared to brass it out. Does he really think everybody is stupid enough to accept that as a defence? There is a classic comedy to be written about all of this but unfortunately at the moment it isn't funny. He doesn't care whether people consider his argument is fatuous or not, he only cares that his argument is heard by the Supreme Court and ultimately 5 of the 9 Supreme Court Judges agree with his argument. He may succeed. In order to get the Supreme Court to hear any petition it must first have been rejected in a lower Federal or State Court. The only thing that will matter to his MAGA Followers is the outcome. If he wins the argument it will prove that the "little guy" Trump has beaten the corrupt system If he doesn't win the argument and it goes to sentencing on 18th September does anyone think he'll do gaol time? no not me either. He will be hit with a large fine and possibly disbarment from operating a Company in NY for a period of time. Trump will organise a fund raiser, maybe a commemorative T-shirt to pay the fine and end up gaining financially No matter what happens it won't sway the MAGA Fanatics, it might sway some undecided or even some Republicans with a conscience that Law & Order matter so it's worth pursuing.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 5, 2024 16:04:14 GMT
That was interesting. The fact that a Federal Court judge has had to rule (twice) that paying hush money to a porn star when you weren't President does not qualify as a Presedential act just shows how far Trump is prepared to brass it out. Does he really think everybody is stupid enough to accept that as a defence? There is a classic comedy to be written about all of this but unfortunately at the moment it isn't funny. He doesn't care whether people consider his argument is fatuous or not, he only cares that his argument is heard by the Supreme Court and ultimately 5 of the 9 Supreme Court Judges agree with his argument. He may succeed. In order to get the Supreme Court to hear any petition it must first have been rejected in a lower Federal or State Court. The only thing that will matter to his MAGA Followers is the outcome. If he wins the argument it will prove that the "little guy" Trump has beaten the corrupt system If he doesn't win the argument and it goes to sentencing on 18th September does anyone think he'll do gaol time? no not me either. He will be hit with a large fine and possibly disbarment from operating a Company in NY for a period of time. Trump will organise a fund raiser, maybe a commemorative T-shirt to pay the fine and end up gaining financially No matter what happens it won't sway the MAGA Fanatics, it might sway some undecided or even some Republicans with a conscience that Law & Order matter so it's worth pursuing. If the Supreme Court rule that paying hush money to a porn star when not actually President is a Presenditial Act then the rule of law is over because you can only base law on language that is logically consistent. That ruling would defy logic - in effect Trump would own the meaning of words.
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Post by Gabrielzakuaniandjuliet on Sept 5, 2024 17:14:32 GMT
He doesn't care whether people consider his argument is fatuous or not, he only cares that his argument is heard by the Supreme Court and ultimately 5 of the 9 Supreme Court Judges agree with his argument. He may succeed. In order to get the Supreme Court to hear any petition it must first have been rejected in a lower Federal or State Court. The only thing that will matter to his MAGA Followers is the outcome. If he wins the argument it will prove that the "little guy" Trump has beaten the corrupt system If he doesn't win the argument and it goes to sentencing on 18th September does anyone think he'll do gaol time? no not me either. He will be hit with a large fine and possibly disbarment from operating a Company in NY for a period of time. Trump will organise a fund raiser, maybe a commemorative T-shirt to pay the fine and end up gaining financially No matter what happens it won't sway the MAGA Fanatics, it might sway some undecided or even some Republicans with a conscience that Law & Order matter so it's worth pursuing. If the Supreme Court rule that paying hush money to a porn star when not actually President is a Presenditial Act then the rule of law is over because you can only base law on language that is logically consistent. That ruling would defy logic - in effect Trump would own the meaning of words. Might be worth mentioning that though clearly immoral, paying hush money is not in and of itself a crime. Most of the cases against him are highly politicized and ridiculous. Classified docs looked like the most likely, but then Hilary and Biden could have had similar cases brought against them. I challenge anyone to explain the case for which he has been convicted (in new york of course), in person and without referring to any notes 😂 I don't see why the dems didn't just run on him being a scumbag and cheat, because their attempts to nail him like this during an election run actually help him set up a new 'rigged election' type message. He would have a point! I don't even like the orange man but the amount of projection from the left is incredible.
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 5, 2024 17:18:17 GMT
If the Supreme Court rule that paying hush money to a porn star when not actually President is a Presenditial Act then the rule of law is over because you can only base law on language that is logically consistent. That ruling would defy logic - in effect Trump would own the meaning of words. Might be worth mentioning that though clearly immoral, paying hush money is not in and of itself a crime. Most of the cases against him are highly politicized and ridiculous. Classified docs looked like the most likely, but then Hilary and Biden could have had similar cases brought against them. I challenge anyone to explain the case for which he has been convicted (in new york of course), in person and without referring to any notes 😂 I don't see why the dems didn't just run on him being a scumbag and cheat, because their attempts to nail him like this during an election run actually help him set up a new 'rigged election' type message. He would have a point! I don't even like the orange man but the amount of projection from the left is incredible. Otherwise known as trump derangement syndrome 😆
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Post by wannabee on Sept 5, 2024 19:02:14 GMT
He doesn't care whether people consider his argument is fatuous or not, he only cares that his argument is heard by the Supreme Court and ultimately 5 of the 9 Supreme Court Judges agree with his argument. He may succeed. In order to get the Supreme Court to hear any petition it must first have been rejected in a lower Federal or State Court. The only thing that will matter to his MAGA Followers is the outcome. If he wins the argument it will prove that the "little guy" Trump has beaten the corrupt system If he doesn't win the argument and it goes to sentencing on 18th September does anyone think he'll do gaol time? no not me either. He will be hit with a large fine and possibly disbarment from operating a Company in NY for a period of time. Trump will organise a fund raiser, maybe a commemorative T-shirt to pay the fine and end up gaining financially No matter what happens it won't sway the MAGA Fanatics, it might sway some undecided or even some Republicans with a conscience that Law & Order matter so it's worth pursuing. If the Supreme Court rule that paying hush money to a porn star when not actually President is a Presenditial Act then the rule of law is over because you can only base law on language that is logically consistent. That ruling would defy logic - in effect Trump would own the meaning of words. As Gabriel has already pointed out paying hush money is not an illegal act, but that is somewhat irrelevant as that's not what Trump was convicted of, but falsification of accounting records to conceal the repayment to his Lawyer Michael Cohen Of course it would be perverse if the Supreme Court considers the case on a request to quash the conviction, but most things attached to Trump are perverse. I have absolutely no doubt if the Supreme Court decides to review the case it will quash the conviction Most media commentary of the Supreme Court ruling centred on Trumps immunity while carrying out his core duties while President in relation to matters arising out of the events of 6th January Your contention is that the Supreme Court can't possibly rule in Trumps favour as he wasn't actually President when he repaid not Stormy Daniels but his Lawyer Michael Cohen. Strictly speaking this is incorrect, Cohen paid Stormy $130K sometime prior to November 2015 Election. Trump didn't repay Cohen $130K but he did pay Cohen $35K a month, part of which was to reimburse Cohen but almost certainly at least some of those payments took place when Trump was President If you read the Majority Opinion written by Chief Justice Roberts in handing down the 6-3 verdict in Trumps favour in part relates to separation of powers he wrote “separation of powers principles … necessitate at least a presumptive immunity from criminal prosecution for a President’s acts within the outer perimeter of his official responsibility” I'm not a Lawyer but even I could build a case that Trump as President in order to not be distracted from his official duties as President agreed to reimburse Cohen Of course it's fanciful but you have a Supreme Court 3 of the 9 appointed by Trump who have already demonstrated they are willing to stretch legality and precedent to its limits and beyond. Its bipartisan and nobody believes its anything other than that. There is no centure, they either retire or die and in the circles they socialise they will be feted. In any case we have just two weeks to see if Trump will be sentenced or not, my point is that I don't think its a slam dunk.
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Post by elystokie on Sept 5, 2024 21:24:32 GMT
Pick of the comments -
'He genuinely sounds like a parody of a serial killer who has stumbled on stage on drugs and is just rambling' 😀
If this was Biden..
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 5, 2024 23:38:24 GMT
If the Supreme Court rule that paying hush money to a porn star when not actually President is a Presenditial Act then the rule of law is over because you can only base law on language that is logically consistent. That ruling would defy logic - in effect Trump would own the meaning of words. Might be worth mentioning that though clearly immoral, paying hush money is not in and of itself a crime. Most of the cases against him are highly politicized and ridiculous. Classified docs looked like the most likely, but then Hilary and Biden could have had similar cases brought against them. I challenge anyone to explain the case for which he has been convicted (in new york of course), in person and without referring to any notes 😂 I don't see why the dems didn't just run on him being a scumbag and cheat, because their attempts to nail him like this during an election run actually help him set up a new 'rigged election' type message. He would have a point! I don't even like the orange man but the amount of projection from the left is incredible. This is about a very specific case - the one where he was found guilty of misreporting hush money sourced from his political campaign fund as legal expenses. You are right - paying hush money to a porn star is not illegal, however the way he did it is. And the badiscof his referral to the federal court was that as it was a Presidentisl act he was immune from prosecution. Don't you actually get how ridiculous that is as a defence?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 5, 2024 23:47:58 GMT
Pick of the comments - 'He genuinely sounds like a parody of a serial killer who has stumbled on stage on drugs and is just rambling' 😀 If this was Biden..
So stupid, that he doesn't even realise how stupid he actually is ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 5, 2024 23:49:50 GMT
Might be worth mentioning that though clearly immoral, paying hush money is not in and of itself a crime. Most of the cases against him are highly politicized and ridiculous. Classified docs looked like the most likely, but then Hilary and Biden could have had similar cases brought against them. I challenge anyone to explain the case for which he has been convicted (in new york of course), in person and without referring to any notes 😂 I don't see why the dems didn't just run on him being a scumbag and cheat, because their attempts to nail him like this during an election run actually help him set up a new 'rigged election' type message. He would have a point! I don't even like the orange man but the amount of projection from the left is incredible. This is about a very specific case - the one where he was found guilty of misreporting hush money sourced from his political campaign fund as legal expenses. You are right - paying hush money to a porn star is not illegal, however the way he did it is. And the badiscof his referral to the federal court was that as it was a Presidentisl act he was immune from prosecution. Don't you actually get how ridiculous that is as a defence?
Exactly.
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Post by RichieBarkerOut! on Sept 7, 2024 8:57:23 GMT
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Post by elystokie on Sept 9, 2024 9:11:24 GMT
The thought of this fruitloop getting elected is absolutely terrifying, just how thick do you have to be to take him seriously, he needs to be imprisoned or institutionalised.
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Post by lordb on Sept 9, 2024 9:33:03 GMT
Be interesting to know what his drug regime is
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