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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Nov 3, 2016 21:50:57 GMT
It's such a stupid fucking idea anyway. If anyone needed any confirmation of that just look at what happened to our currency as soon as this verdict was announced, then just watch what will happen to it when we continue along the path (and we will) towards the exit door and further decline. Sheer lunacy if you really can't see that. Serious question. When are moving to the EU?? Soon to beat the rush? Or later just in case, but you do risk higher prices.
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Nov 3, 2016 21:53:16 GMT
So do you accept that the UK will eventually after a while, and after your gloating, and after some legal shenanigans Leave the EU? Yes, I said so on the first page of this thread. Almost missed it - but nice trying saying that I'm gloating. Remember, I voted to remain - I essentially lost. No gloating here.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 3, 2016 21:55:07 GMT
So do you accept that the UK will eventually after a while, Leave the EU? Everyone who isn't insane accepts that. Today was about not accepting one persons potentially warped and party political view of this. She already campaigned on a false premise for personal ambition, why should we allow here to negotiate that decision without scrutiny. For a Brexiteer you don't half show a blatant disregard for our laws, constitution and sovereignty, Rog.
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Post by numpty40 on Nov 3, 2016 22:05:44 GMT
You seriously think there would be this hysteria from the Leavers if the vote had gone the other way??
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Nov 3, 2016 22:08:41 GMT
You seriously think there would be this hysteria from the Leavers if the vote had gone the other way?? "If the vote is 52-48, there is unfinished business." Nigel Farage. Yeah, I reckon there would be.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 22:11:45 GMT
Ok I'm doing some micro pubs tonight so I'll make this short.... "I might be in"..... we've already had the vote mate. If you think you can do better than existing MP's then put yourself forward. It's not like you didn't know this was coming........ hang on....... you did know this was happening right? You were following politics before the 2015 GE? The rest of the post is white noise. Although Mo likes it so it must be ace. "To conclude" :-) I wouldn't go near organising this clusterfuck if you paid me all the money in the treasury, although that's fast dwindling as well I admit to not knowing our political system was quite as much of a mess as it is. We've offered a referendum that was advisory, forget to really mention that it was advisory, tried making it legally binding after the referendum has been held, and have now been pulled up by our own legal system for trying to pull a fast one over our democratically elected parliament. All of this done in the name democracy. I was fully aware this was coming - I know Brexit will be rumbling on for years, and will be pissing myself laughing at all the brave, noble Brexiteers on here who are getting more pissed off that it's not already done and dusted. Comedy gold, and the length of proceedings means it will be so for some time to come. Have a good time at your "micro pubs" :-) I am sure cameron did say the result of the referendum would stand and that it was a first past the post vote. So if he has, then to deny the people what they voted for would cause riots. To deny a democratic vote should even anger people who voted remain too as it would make a mockery of the system which people put their faith in. To go against democracy would mean we are not a democratic country and everybody should be angry. I don't know what you find so funny about that. People feel the system looks after London and sticks 2 fingers up to the rest of england and wales, being in the EU has not seen improvements all over England. What should people do just carry on living their lives being shit on at every given opportunity. Brexit will be used to by businesses to ram up prices purposely to keep the squeeze on the poor. The recession was used to offload staff and replace them with cheap labour from abroad, cut wages, raise prices, get rid of interest rates and although things got better wages stayed down, then foreign labour got exploited through agencies whilst banging on about english people being lazy to try and somehow strengthen the argument. Small businesses having to pay the customer for work just to keep staff employed. In the meantime the british man is supposed to keep his mouth shut and say nothing. You obviously have no friends and family here as you would have more sympathy for people here than you do.
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Post by capto on Nov 3, 2016 22:31:51 GMT
I wouldn't go near organising this clusterfuck if you paid me all the money in the treasury, although that's fast dwindling as well I admit to not knowing our political system was quite as much of a mess as it is. We've offered a referendum that was advisory, forget to really mention that it was advisory, tried making it legally binding after the referendum has been held, and have now been pulled up by our own legal system for trying to pull a fast one over our democratically elected parliament. All of this done in the name democracy. I was fully aware this was coming - I know Brexit will be rumbling on for years, and will be pissing myself laughing at all the brave, noble Brexiteers on here who are getting more pissed off that it's not already done and dusted. Comedy gold, and the length of proceedings means it will be so for some time to come. Have a good time at your "micro pubs" :-) I am sure cameron did say the result of the referendum would stand and that it was a first past the post vote. So if he has, then to deny the people what they voted for would cause riots. To deny a democratic vote should even anger people who voted remain too as it would make a mockery of the system which people put their faith in. To go against democracy would mean we are not a democratic country and everybody should be angry. I don't know what you find so funny about that. People feel the system looks after London and sticks 2 fingers up to the rest of england and wales, being in the EU has not seen improvements all over England. What should people do just carry on living their lives being shit on at every given opportunity. Brexit will be used to by businesses to ram up prices purposely to keep the squeeze on the poor. The recession was used to offload staff and replace them with cheap labour from abroad, cut wages, raise prices, get rid of interest rates and although things got better wages stayed down, then foreign labour got exploited through agencies whilst banging on about english people being lazy to try and somehow strengthen the argument. Small businesses having to pay the customer for work just to keep staff employed. In the meantime the british man is supposed to keep his mouth shut and say nothing. You obviously have no friends and family here as you would have more sympathy for people here than you do. Ha ha, just trot out the lies you've been told by the mail / express. Blah blah eu to blame for everything; blah blan Brit politicians on the side of the working man; blah blah boring boring just sod off
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Nov 3, 2016 22:41:16 GMT
So do you accept that the UK will eventually after a while, Leave the EU? Everyone who isn't insane accepts that. Today was about not accepting one persons potentially warped and party political view of this. She already campaigned on a false premise for personal ambition, why should we allow here to negotiate that decision without scrutiny. For a Brexiteer you don't half show a blatant disregard for our laws, constitution and sovereignty, Rog. I'm insane then because the ruling today was about having a vote in parliament and not allowing the elected Government, to press on with the majority's wishes. Christ Mo. I was asked to put a cross in a box on a piece of paper. That (majority) decision is now being discussed, debated, delayed and possibly rejected. This isn't democracy mate.
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Post by stokemark on Nov 3, 2016 22:49:47 GMT
It seems to me that we are facing years of uncertainty that will,benefit no one and disadvantage many (anyone who wishes to travel, take a holiday abroad, buy produce from the USA / Europe etc.
The poor will get poorer and the rich may get a little less rich as banks and international business moves away to countries that can provide stability, certainty and guaranteed tariff free access to a market of 500m rather than 70m. The poor will suffer as they will need to take on the tax burden due to shortfalls from the loss of said highly paid individuals.
Anyone over 40 will unlikely see any benefit whatsoever from Brexit as by the time any potential for it to be successful happens they will likely be dead and gone.
What a fucking mess this all is whichever side you are on
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 22:55:34 GMT
I am sure cameron did say the result of the referendum would stand and that it was a first past the post vote. So if he has, then to deny the people what they voted for would cause riots. To deny a democratic vote should even anger people who voted remain too as it would make a mockery of the system which people put their faith in. To go against democracy would mean we are not a democratic country and everybody should be angry. I don't know what you find so funny about that. People feel the system looks after London and sticks 2 fingers up to the rest of england and wales, being in the EU has not seen improvements all over England. What should people do just carry on living their lives being shit on at every given opportunity. Brexit will be used to by businesses to ram up prices purposely to keep the squeeze on the poor. The recession was used to offload staff and replace them with cheap labour from abroad, cut wages, raise prices, get rid of interest rates and although things got better wages stayed down, then foreign labour got exploited through agencies whilst banging on about english people being lazy to try and somehow strengthen the argument. Small businesses having to pay the customer for work just to keep staff employed. In the meantime the british man is supposed to keep his mouth shut and say nothing. You obviously have no friends and family here as you would have more sympathy for people here than you do. Ha ha, just trot out the lies you've been told by the mail / express. Blah blah eu to blame for everything; blah blan Brit politicians on the side of the working man; blah blah boring boring just sod off Try living it.
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Post by PotteringThrough on Nov 3, 2016 23:32:56 GMT
So it would appear no one won in the end, in fact we all lost.
Is this the reason article 50 has not been triggered yet - is the government just towing the line right now?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 23:42:05 GMT
"It has emerged Baron Thomas of Cwmgiedd - the UK's Lord Chief Justice - was a founding member of the European Law Institute, which says it works towards the "enhancement of European legal integration"." Say no more.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 3, 2016 23:50:59 GMT
"It has emerged Baron Thomas of Cwmgiedd - the UK's Lord Chief Justice - was a founding member of the European Law Institute, which says it works towards the "enhancement of European legal integration"." Say no more. You can question the motives of those who brought the action to a degree but The Judges? Give over. They ruled on a relatively simple bit of law and constitutional precedent. One that the Tory machine and May in particular massively fucked up on.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 23:59:28 GMT
How can the Tories be trusted to do what's right for Britain? Their leader called for a referendum and then quit when he didn't get the expected result. Wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them. It should be an across the board decision. When I say I don't trust them, worker's rights come high on the agenda!
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Nov 4, 2016 0:13:33 GMT
I wouldn't go near organising this clusterfuck if you paid me all the money in the treasury, although that's fast dwindling as well I admit to not knowing our political system was quite as much of a mess as it is. We've offered a referendum that was advisory, forget to really mention that it was advisory, tried making it legally binding after the referendum has been held, and have now been pulled up by our own legal system for trying to pull a fast one over our democratically elected parliament. All of this done in the name democracy. I was fully aware this was coming - I know Brexit will be rumbling on for years, and will be pissing myself laughing at all the brave, noble Brexiteers on here who are getting more pissed off that it's not already done and dusted. Comedy gold, and the length of proceedings means it will be so for some time to come. Have a good time at your "micro pubs" :-) I am sure cameron did say the result of the referendum would stand and that it was a first past the post vote. So if he has, then to deny the people what they voted for would cause riots. To deny a democratic vote should even anger people who voted remain too as it would make a mockery of the system which people put their faith in. To go against democracy would mean we are not a democratic country and everybody should be angry. I don't know what you find so funny about that. People feel the system looks after London and sticks 2 fingers up to the rest of england and wales, being in the EU has not seen improvements all over England. What should people do just carry on living their lives being shit on at every given opportunity. Brexit will be used to by businesses to ram up prices purposely to keep the squeeze on the poor. The recession was used to offload staff and replace them with cheap labour from abroad, cut wages, raise prices, get rid of interest rates and although things got better wages stayed down, then foreign labour got exploited through agencies whilst banging on about english people being lazy to try and somehow strengthen the argument. Small businesses having to pay the customer for work just to keep staff employed. In the meantime the british man is supposed to keep his mouth shut and say nothing. You obviously have no friends and family here as you would have more sympathy for people here than you do. If you read what I wrote, I said I would be pissing myself laughing at the gobby Brexiteers who get more and more frustrated that the biggest overhaul of political system in centuries is not completed within a couple of months. I won't be laughing at the poor bastards who have to face the consequences of this vote. As for having sympathy for people back home. I have sympathy for some, and not for others. The people who voted for Brexit are getting exactly what they voted for - uncertainity (that may yet turn out OK, of course). No need for sympathy when someone is given exactly what they asked for, is there?
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Post by Northy on Nov 4, 2016 7:16:28 GMT
How can the Tories be trusted to do what's right for Britain? Their leader called for a referendum and then quit when he didn't get the expected result. Wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them. It should be an across the board decision. When I say I don't trust them, worker's rights come high on the agenda! So a bit like labours Blair who promised us a referendum in his 2007 election mandate and then they signed the Lisbon treaty without giving us that referendum, is that trust?
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Post by partickpotter on Nov 4, 2016 7:20:38 GMT
How can the Tories be trusted to do what's right for Britain? Their leader called for a referendum and then quit when he didn't get the expected result. Wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them. It should be an across the board decision. When I say I don't trust them, worker's rights come high on the agenda! Speaking as someone who voted to remain, the question isn't whether or not the Tories can be trusted to do what is right for Britain but whether the British population can be trusted. That's the whole point of Brexit from a democratic perspective; we elect a government and that government does what it was elected to do. It doesn't have an external body mandating law. So if you don't trust the Tories on employment law, maybe you should have more trust in the British people to vote in a party that you do trust in that regard.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Nov 4, 2016 8:46:20 GMT
So do you accept that the UK will eventually after a while, and after your gloating, and after some legal shenanigans Leave the EU? Yes, I said so on the first page of this thread. Almost missed it - but nice trying saying that I'm gloating. Remember, I voted to remain - I essentially lost. No gloating here. "I know Brexit will be rumbling on for years, and will be pissing myself laughing at all the brave, noble Brexiteers" "Comedy Gold" That's gloating mate.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2016 8:58:32 GMT
"It has emerged Baron Thomas of Cwmgiedd - the UK's Lord Chief Justice - was a founding member of the European Law Institute, which says it works towards the "enhancement of European legal integration"." Say no more. You can question the motives of those who brought the action to a degree but The Judges? Give over. They ruled on a relatively simple bit of law and constitutional precedent. One that the Tory machine and May in particular massively fucked up on. How can three overrule 17.4m people? 3 people are easily corruptible .....17.4 million are not
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Post by bringmesunshine on Nov 4, 2016 9:04:03 GMT
You seriously think there would be this hysteria from the Leavers if the vote had gone the other way?? Tragically that’s exactly what he believes.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 4, 2016 9:07:59 GMT
You can question the motives of those who brought the action to a degree but The Judges? Give over. They ruled on a relatively simple bit of law and constitutional precedent. One that the Tory machine and May in particular massively fucked up on. How can three overrule 17.4m people? 3 people are easily corruptible .....17.4 million are not They haven't overruled them in any fashion. First paragraph of the ruling, 'This court is not concerned with and expresses no opinion about leaving the European Union'. Leavers should be pleased. Arrogant May was leading us into a constitutional nightmare which could have seen Brexit dogged by legal process for decades. The judges have done you a right favour.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 4, 2016 9:13:42 GMT
You seriously think there would be this hysteria from the Leavers if the vote had gone the other way?? Tragically that’s exactly what he believes. There, there david, the men are talking in the drawing room. We'll shout you when the trifle comes out. I mean UKIP, Farrage and some of the verminous creatures that attach themselves to them are known for their level head aren't they. No hysteria there at all!
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Post by bringmesunshine on Nov 4, 2016 9:17:36 GMT
Tragically that’s exactly what he believes. There, there david, the men are talking in the drawing room. We'll shout you when the trifle comes out. Really, political advise, from you, the intellectual genius who thinks corbin is the answer.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 4, 2016 9:20:59 GMT
There, there david, the men are talking in the drawing room. We'll shout you when the trifle comes out. Really, political advise, from you, the intellectual genius who thinks corbin is the answer. No trifle, I'm sorry david. You can have another slice of Billy Bear and then off to bed with teddy.
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Post by flea79 on Nov 4, 2016 9:25:50 GMT
was there this sort of hysteria in the 70's when the last vote was held?
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Post by serpico on Nov 4, 2016 9:34:04 GMT
so all those people who voted to continue to give away sovereignty and democratic rights to an unelected, unaccountable, technocratic, supranational state, are now claiming to be big lovers of parliamentary sovereignty ? ... so if there were to be a 2nd referendum then surely you'd change your vote in light of your supposed new found love of democracy ?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 4, 2016 9:40:27 GMT
so all those people who voted to continue to give away sovereignty and democratic rights to an unelected, unaccountable, technocratic, supranational state, are now claiming to be big lovers of parliamentary sovereignty ? ... so if there were to be a 2nd referendum then surely you'd change your vote in light of your supposed new found love of democracy ? Alternatively those who voted to fiercely retain the sovereignty of Parliament and our constitution are suddenly happy for an unelected Prime Minister to do deals in secret and cut Parliament out of the process. They're so outraged by the thought, may take this one all the way to the European court for true justice!
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Post by serpico on Nov 4, 2016 9:51:15 GMT
so all those people who voted to continue to give away sovereignty and democratic rights to an unelected, unaccountable, technocratic, supranational state, are now claiming to be big lovers of parliamentary sovereignty ? ... so if there were to be a 2nd referendum then surely you'd change your vote in light of your supposed new found love of democracy ? Alternatively those who voted to fiercely retain the sovereignty of Parliament and our constitution are suddenly happy for an unelected Prime Minister to do deals in secret and cut Parliament out of the process. They're so outraged by the thought, may take this one all the way to the European court for true justice! Love them or hate them this conservative government was elected by the people, we then had a referendum and the people voted to leave the EU, it's now the government of the days job to implement it. This is just another delaying tactic with the end goal being the total watering down of Brexit, we'll probably end up with the worst of both worlds, which is probably what the likes of Nick Clegg want so he can sit smugly on TV and remind us all "lets be absolutely clear.... i was right"
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Post by serpico on Nov 4, 2016 9:54:48 GMT
so all those people who voted to continue to give away sovereignty and democratic rights to an unelected, unaccountable, technocratic, supranational state, are now claiming to be big lovers of parliamentary sovereignty ? ... so if there were to be a 2nd referendum then surely you'd change your vote in light of your supposed new found love of democracy ? Alternatively those who voted to fiercely retain the sovereignty of Parliament and our constitution are suddenly happy for an unelected Prime Minister to do deals in secret and cut Parliament out of the process. They're so outraged by the thought, may take this one all the way to the European court for true justice! well, the European court is the supreme authority in the UK, so it is an option
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2016 10:15:33 GMT
Don't like Blair, northwich, he's a virtual conservative anyway, but IMHO it should be an across the board decision. It was voted on by the nation, so in my view, why should a Tory government have the final say on Brexit! If they all have a say, you couldn't really blame anyone for any cock ups. Like I say, Cameron caused what's happening, and then walks away, after leaving a government with no plan after an out vote. Pathetic IMHO. Yet again the poorer elements suffer at the hands of these politicians.
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