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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 7:42:07 GMT
Wollscheid was marking Kolarov. That is irrelevant when it comes to Wolly as you well know. Sorry yes, you are right. He should have been marking three and stopped all three. My mistake.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 22, 2016 7:43:04 GMT
The second just questions the organisation and stuff on the training ground.
Why was Whelan marking their biggest threat?
Who's daft idea was that?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 7:45:12 GMT
Wollscheid was marking Kolarov. And if we'd have put somebody taller than Whelan as the first defender Aguero would never have got the ball in the first place. Never understood why we don't have Ryan doing it. If he's going to get over zealous refs watching him for tugging then take him out of the firing line and have a tall, aggressive centre half attacking the first ball and play the odds on any back post crosses.
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Post by skemstokie on Aug 22, 2016 7:47:50 GMT
Whelan hasn't been doing what Whelan does best and hasn't for some time now. Pieters hasn't been doing what he normally does best and hasn't for some considerable time. Now we see Ryan struggling after injury (although I believe it goes a lot deeper than that) That's 3 players in and around Wolly who are currently underperforming. Now it would seem that Wolly is the common denominator but for me they all need to pull their socks up and concentrate on their own game and start making Wolly look like the useless git many think he is instead of making him look like mr dependable he currently is. Just a thought I agree with 90% of your argument apart from Wooly being useless, he has NO support at times.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 22, 2016 7:48:42 GMT
Whelan hasn't been doing what Whelan does best and hasn't for some time now. Pieters hasn't been doing what he normally does best and hasn't for some considerable time. Now we see Ryan struggling after injury (although I believe it goes a lot deeper than that) That's 3 players in and around Wolly who are currently underperforming. Now it would seem that Wolly is the common denominator but for me they all need to pull their socks up and concentrate on their own game and start making Wolly look like the useless git many think he is instead of making him look like mr dependable he currently is. Just a thought I agree with 90% of your argument apart from Wooly being useless, he has NO support at times. He had plenty of support.
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Post by skemstokie on Aug 22, 2016 7:50:35 GMT
I agree with 90% of your argument apart from Wooly being useless, he has NO support at times. He had plenty of support. Your opinion,not mine.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 22, 2016 7:52:08 GMT
He had plenty of support. Your opinion,not mine. Well yeah.
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Post by potterpaul on Aug 22, 2016 7:54:40 GMT
Whelan hasn't been doing what Whelan does best and hasn't for some time now. Pieters hasn't been doing what he normally does best and hasn't for some considerable time. Now we see Ryan struggling after injury (although I believe it goes a lot deeper than that) That's 3 players in and around Wolly who are currently underperforming. Now it would seem that Wolly is the common denominator but for me they all need to pull their socks up and concentrate on their own game and start making Wolly look like the useless git many think he is instead of making him look like mr dependable he currently is. Just a thought I agree with 90% of your argument apart from Wooly being useless, he has NO support at times. I don't think Wolly is useless but there are many who do
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 8:09:26 GMT
Very close to MOM??? We conceded 4?! Without Wollscheid it would have been 8. Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening.
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Post by sufolkstokie on Aug 22, 2016 8:14:39 GMT
Without Wollscheid it would have been 8. Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening. At the moment you could make an argument to replace anyone of our back 4
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 8:16:53 GMT
Without Wollscheid it would have been 8. Totally agree with that without wollscheid it could of atleast doubled stop de Bruyne or silva going through cant remember. But the same names keep popping up to slate him. Constantly on his back Well no, if you're going by that theory I could say if we'd have bought in a replacement who started ahead of Wolly then it could've halved the scoreline as a pose to doubled. Can't just say without him we'd have conceded 8, who are you putting in as a replacement? And for the record I started this thread and have never said a bad word about him before, but feel free to add me to the list for future reference because I can't see him improving. If he does, I'll be the first to say.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Aug 22, 2016 8:18:19 GMT
Butland back to command the area will help more than you think. It looks like we've got a bunch of players who don't trust each other at both ends of the pitch.
Defence don't trust Given, especially with crosses and I can't see Ryan being too happy not having Johnson next to him on the pith.
At the other end, our attacking players don't trust Diouf and 90% of the time ignore his runs. Explains our form to me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 8:19:20 GMT
Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening. At the moment you could make an argument to replace anyone of our back 4 I agree with that, but we're not going to. Therefore we must focus on the priority, that's a CB for me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 8:21:03 GMT
Butland back to command the area will help more than you think. It looks like we've got a bunch of players who don't trust each other at both ends of the pitch. Defence don't trust Given, especially with crosses and I can't see Ryan being too happy not having Johnson next to him on the pith. At the other end, our attacking players don't trust Diouf and 90% of the time ignore his runs. Explains our form to me. Summed up most of it there
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 22, 2016 8:24:27 GMT
Butland back to command the area will help more than you think. It looks like we've got a bunch of players who don't trust each other at both ends of the pitch. Defence don't trust Given, especially with crosses and I can't see Ryan being too happy not having Johnson next to him on the pith. At the other end, our attacking players don't trust Diouf and 90% of the time ignore his runs. Explains our form to me. So the players don't trust other players the manager has bought !, feck me.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Aug 22, 2016 8:34:32 GMT
Butland back to command the area will help more than you think. It looks like we've got a bunch of players who don't trust each other at both ends of the pitch. Defence don't trust Given, especially with crosses and I can't see Ryan being too happy not having Johnson next to him on the pith. At the other end, our attacking players don't trust Diouf and 90% of the time ignore his runs. Explains our form to me. So the players don't trust other players the manager has bought !, feck me. Some of the them, yeah, why is that so shocking? It's obvious that Butland is going to be trusted more because he's one of the best in the country. Shaqiri looks a completely different player with Johnson in the team, I wonder what he thinks when he's got Bardsley offering him "support" ? It's the same for every team in the world, players have their favourites in regards to who they play with.
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Post by philb on Aug 22, 2016 9:35:07 GMT
Without Wollscheid it would have been 8. Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening. He isn't going anywhere anytime soon and any cb Hughes brings in will probably be for cover not first choice.
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Aug 22, 2016 10:29:10 GMT
Without Wollscheid it would have been 8. Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening. Why? - are we going to replace him with a CB that can also score 20 goals a season? Because replacing Wolly won't solve the chronic imbalance, lack of pace and creativity and inability to defend as a unit in a goal shy side. Seems to me that week in week out we have 10 players who play absolutely out of their skins and would be walking into the Champions League if it wasn't for that useless German twat leting them down. Or at least that appears to be the view of many on here.
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Post by nott1 on Aug 22, 2016 12:19:02 GMT
Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening. Why? - are we going to replace him with a CB that can also score 20 goals a season? Because replacing Wolly won't solve the chronic imbalance, lack of pace and creativity and inability to defend as a unit in a goal shy side. Seems to me that week in week out we have 10 players who play absolutely out of their skins and would be walking into the Champions League if it wasn't for that useless German twat leting them down. Or at least that appears to be the view of many on here. Getting rid of him should solve the goals against stats though!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 12:27:48 GMT
I did wonder how far he'd take it. Got my answer in spades. No point in carrying on the debate. Shawcross looks a different player when he's not playing with Wolly. Why? Because he has faith to do things that he doesn't when Wolly is on the pitch. Wolly brings those around him down and that's been evident from the off and I've pretty much said it from the Rochdale cup game. If you play alongside someone you don't trust you will play worse as you try to think what cock up they're going to do next and how to cover that. Trust is a massive part of a defensive unit and it just isn't there. The main reason for that I believe is Wolly. Bayern, a serious question. Do you actually believe everything you say on here to be right?
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Post by AlliG on Aug 22, 2016 12:32:14 GMT
Shawcross looks a different player when he's not playing with Wolly. Why? Because he has faith to do things that he doesn't when Wolly is on the pitch. Wolly brings those around him down and that's been evident from the off and I've pretty much said it from the Rochdale cup game. If you play alongside someone you don't trust you will play worse as you try to think what cock up they're going to do next and how to cover that. Trust is a massive part of a defensive unit and it just isn't there. The main reason for that I believe is Wolly. Bayern, a serious question. Do you actually believe everything you say on here to be right? Of course he does. When it comes to infallibility, bayern makes the Pope look an uncertain amateur! ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/kwfoKwtHI0jglJZ4qZf6.gif)
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Post by sheikhmomo on Aug 22, 2016 12:40:55 GMT
We can bang on about this all season long and all have opinions on what the root cause is but the fact remains that this back four is entirely incapable of keeping clean sheets anymore. We will need to score at least two goals to win any match and with our fabled problems at that end of the pitch, that really could spell trouble. It’s fucking chaos back there and has been for 8 months.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 22, 2016 12:48:05 GMT
Shawcross looks a different player when he's not playing with Wolly. Why? Because he has faith to do things that he doesn't when Wolly is on the pitch. Wolly brings those around him down and that's been evident from the off and I've pretty much said it from the Rochdale cup game. If you play alongside someone you don't trust you will play worse as you try to think what cock up they're going to do next and how to cover that. Trust is a massive part of a defensive unit and it just isn't there. The main reason for that I believe is Wolly. Bayern, a serious question. Do you actually believe everything you say on here to be right? Yes. Why would I say it else?
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Post by WhyDelilah on Aug 22, 2016 12:50:41 GMT
To sum up: - When Wollscheid makes a mistake, it's his fault. When other players make a mistake, it's Wollscheid's fault. Brilliant. ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/KYqg3pYeaerc5lD_P7BR.gif)
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Aug 22, 2016 12:53:44 GMT
Why? - are we going to replace him with a CB that can also score 20 goals a season? Because replacing Wolly won't solve the chronic imbalance, lack of pace and creativity and inability to defend as a unit in a goal shy side. Seems to me that week in week out we have 10 players who play absolutely out of their skins and would be walking into the Champions League if it wasn't for that useless German twat leting them down. Or at least that appears to be the view of many on here. Getting rid of him should solve the goals against stats though! Absolutley. Get rid of the uselss German fucker and Shawcross will immediately stop pulling people's shirts, Butland and Johnson will return to full fitness, Imbula, Bojan and Shaqiri will bother their lazy arses to track back, ISIS will be destroyed and there will be an end to world poverty.
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Aug 22, 2016 12:54:56 GMT
Bayern, a serious question. Do you actually believe everything you say on here to be right? Yes. Why would I say it else? Who else has Shawcross played with recently to look a different player?
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Post by kustokie on Aug 22, 2016 12:55:35 GMT
I went back and studied each of Man City's four goals (facts are always helpful). Clearly, Shawcross was at fault on the first (dumb!). He was nowhere near the other three. Arguably he was ball watching on the second and fourth, but he was definitely a spectator on the third - he actually gave up chasing back. Interesting viewing.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Aug 22, 2016 12:58:45 GMT
If Wolly is dropped or sold, Shawcross continues to play poorly,who the feck do we play in their positions, if we don't bring anyone new in?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 13:07:04 GMT
Yes. Why would I say it else? Who else has Shawcross played with recently to look a different player? Haha, exactly this. Weren't Ryan and Wolly (both) the catalysts for that spell in the latter part of 2015 where we conceded virtually no goals for a good length of time?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2016 13:17:13 GMT
Sorry my mistake, what a hero. Replace him with a decent cb and we might stand a chance of Europe. With him, I can't see it happening. Why? - are we going to replace him with a CB that can also score 20 goals a season? Because replacing Wolly won't solve the chronic imbalance, lack of pace and creativity and inability to defend as a unit in a goal shy side. Seems to me that week in week out we have 10 players who play absolutely out of their skins and would be walking into the Champions League if it wasn't for that useless German twat leting them down. Or at least that appears to be the view of many on here. We have incredible ability going forward, yes we need a centre forward, but that for me is priority #2 behind a centre back. We're not solid enough, not strong enough, not confident enough. The entire back 4 seems to panic whenever they opposition form any sort of attack. Let's face it, we're not going to replace our captain, he needs a solid partner to instill some confidence back into his game, Wolly isn't that, he is far far from it.
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