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Post by march4 on May 7, 2016 19:39:12 GMT
Lets hope we can finish 8th next season without 'playing well'. After half a season the table doesn't lie. And to dismiss our magnificent European campaign is a bit off, mate. TP was sacked for a spell of decline that was 4 months long. He was sacked for wasting money. He was sacked for a derisory style of football. And he had 10 years of credit in the bank. LMH has 2 years credit and he is guilty of exactly the same as TP. He will suffer the same fate. We were 8th in March this season. It counts for exactly the same as it counted for then. F**k all. Interesting you don't set the same store in that though. Pulis was sacked for a dreadful last 18 months and for wasting a f**kton of money to dismantle the fine side he himself had built. Europe was great (until he threw the towel in) but he didn't change the side up enough in the league and we scraped through the end of the season devoid of ideas. He ran certain players into the ground and didn't use others and people slowly got fed up of it. LMH has wasted £40M in less than 12 months. Two of these players can't even get a game. There were empty seats all round the ground vs Sunderland. People had paid for their tickets in advance and not bothered turning up. This is a serious decline, mate. I know I am bonkers, but I am a committed Stokie and I think we are in a very difficult place. And on a less serious note, I was at a meeting in London last week and while I was waiting at the hotel reception, a bloke walked up to me and shook me by the hand telling me he had always wanted to meet me. He then apologised profusely saying that he had confused me for Tony Pulis! If only I had been wearing a tracksuit and baseball cap. TP wouldn't have been impressed as there is an age gap of a couple of decades!
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Post by hchpotter on May 7, 2016 19:39:37 GMT
Long ball 2011 preferable to whatever 2016 is.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2016 19:40:20 GMT
The game I prefer is high intensity. Pressure, harassing and then letting your so called flair players play. I want my defenders be hard. I don't care if they can pass a ball square I want hard tackle and simple 2 yard passes to creative players. When's the last time we really CRUNCHED someone and left them in a broken heap????
Don't want to advocate thuggish tactics but its that crunch we seem to miss
One of the things I like about long ball is the old big man/little man striker set up, the big 'un flicking it on etc and tussling with the CB
Call me old fashioned but I liked it, same as I still like my CDs and DVDS (Took years to persuade me to throw out my VHS)
Probably rewind to when we had our best defensive partnership which was Huth and ryan. We go rid of Huth because he couldn't 'play'. Well that's what shaq arnie Bojan imbula etc are for. To allow them play you need steel behind them. Hughes simply has to bring in some steel to protect these flair players or were in deeper shit than a puffs prick
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Post by march4 on May 7, 2016 19:43:18 GMT
When's the last time we really CRUNCHED someone and left them in a broken heap????
Don't want to advocate thuggish tactics but its that crunch we seem to miss
One of the things I like about long ball is the old big man/little man striker set up, the big 'un flicking it on etc and tussling with the CB
Call me old fashioned but I liked it, same as I still like my CDs and DVDS (Took years to persuade me to throw out my VHS)
Probably rewind to when we had our best defensive partnership which was Huth and ryan. We go rid of Huth because he couldn't 'play'. Well that's what shaq arnie Bojan imbula etc are for. To allow them play you need steel behind them. Hughes simply has to bring in some steel to protect these flair players or were in deeper shit than a puffs prick I said it when he sold Huth that the decision would cost LMH big style.
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Post by chiefdelilah on May 7, 2016 19:48:05 GMT
We were 8th in March this season. It counts for exactly the same as it counted for then. F**k all. Interesting you don't set the same store in that though. Pulis was sacked for a dreadful last 18 months and for wasting a f**kton of money to dismantle the fine side he himself had built. Europe was great (until he threw the towel in) but he didn't change the side up enough in the league and we scraped through the end of the season devoid of ideas. He ran certain players into the ground and didn't use others and people slowly got fed up of it. LMH has wasted £40M in less than 12 months. Two of these players can't even get a game. There were empty seats all round the ground vs Sunderland. People had paid for their tickets in advance and not bothered turning up. This is a serious decline, mate. I know I am bonkers, but I am a committed Stokie and I think we are in a very difficult place. And on a less serious note, I was at a meeting in London last week and while I was waiting at the hotel reception, a bloke walked up to me and shook me by the hand telling me he had always wanted to meet me. He then apologised profusely saying that he had confused me for Tony Pulis! If only I had been wearing a tracksuit and baseball cap. TP wouldn't have been impressed as there is an age gap of a couple of decades! I think it's too early to say it's been definitively wasted.
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Post by march4 on May 7, 2016 19:49:02 GMT
LMH has wasted £40M in less than 12 months. Two of these players can't even get a game. There were empty seats all round the ground vs Sunderland. People had paid for their tickets in advance and not bothered turning up. This is a serious decline, mate. I know I am bonkers, but I am a committed Stokie and I think we are in a very difficult place. And on a less serious note, I was at a meeting in London last week and while I was waiting at the hotel reception, a bloke walked up to me and shook me by the hand telling me he had always wanted to meet me. He then apologised profusely saying that he had confused me for Tony Pulis! If only I had been wearing a tracksuit and baseball cap. TP wouldn't have been impressed as there is an age gap of a couple of decades! I think it's too early to say it's been definitively wasted. We said that with Palacios ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif)
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Post by mrred on May 7, 2016 19:54:22 GMT
To the OP, it doesn't have to be all or nothing. I never want to watch a Pulis side again but he was capable of playing excellent football, some of the most exiting games I've ever watched. Hughes is also capable of providing that, without the dire 1 enjoyable match experience of the former.
I just want to see players to fight tooth and nail for my club and actually look like they care. As it is, they can fuck off because I'm not seeing anything near that.
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Post by crapslinger on May 7, 2016 20:11:52 GMT
So just so we're clear, you're giving Pulis the credit for Hughes' success? Why couldn't his own teams finish higher in the league than Hughes managed?Boom. The question that never gets answered. Pulis had very limited ambition, his first and only goal every season was survival, based on sound defence and pretty much destroy games tactics picking up goals from set pieces, he did however achieve promotion to the Prem. managed to establish us in the Prem, reach an FA Cup Final and a European adventure, after that he lost the plot big style and we stagnated even regressed, the football was boring, predictable, and at times shocking, he was rightly sacked leaving the club £30 million in debt, he did leave a solid base upon which to build to his credit.
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Post by crapslinger on May 7, 2016 20:16:31 GMT
Right now I would, however it is not up to me the Coates family will be taking that decision, they sacked Pulis for failure to achieve what they expected, would they do the same to Hughes ? most business operators are ruthless people which is why they are in the position they are in, in any business you are only as good as your last result. So does credit in the bank not count? Do you sack your manager at the first sign of trouble, regardless of what he's delivered? You asked me I told you what I would do, what's up can you not take any one else's opinions on board, like I said it is a business if as a manager you fail to deliver you will be sacked, you have had a mare on here tonight you need a rest.
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Post by trentvale68 on May 7, 2016 21:21:25 GMT
As much as I hate this Leicester 'thing' and this odious twat
This is a prime example of English football as I like
IMHO, id take that over triangles anyday but each to their own
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Post by dieguito88 on May 7, 2016 21:30:48 GMT
Honest question, not totally to do with recent results but do you, secretly, prefer it??
Personally, I have to say, when it's done well, give it me all day
All this fannying around at the back & pointless, going nowhere build up play??!!
Why does a defender need to pass sideways to another defender anyway?
Im no scholar of the game but I don't really get the thing for it, its passing for the sake of it and unless you're Barcelona does it really come off that often?
Its worked pretty well for Leicester (even though I fucking hate them)
I guess its why I have such fond memories of the Macari/Stein years. It makes me cringe when people say playing the 'right way' or even worse the 'Vale/Crewe way'
There isn't a 'right way' to play. the object is to put the ball in the net more often than the other lot. Anything else is pretty irrelevant
Is it just me stuck in the Neolithic times?? Exactly, the problem is that with both managers setup (TP and MH) we not score enough goals. So a mixed, more running setup will be better definitely.
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banx10
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Post by banx10 on May 7, 2016 23:02:15 GMT
The premier league seems to be going down the pressing game route with high tempo fast football which we are light years away from We started this under Tony.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2016 23:03:26 GMT
Why can't we mix it up?
Long when needed, played out when needed etc.
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Post by banx10 on May 7, 2016 23:05:15 GMT
Long ball football is the most efficient way of playing the game. Some folk think it is unpleasant on the eye. However, it must be better than the turgid tip tap tripe we have witnessed since Christmas. I agree it is not only totally pointless, unless you're like a Barcelona, it's really boring and incredibly stupid. football is about getting the ball in the net. Rugby the ball over the line etc. Not creating a beautiful corriographed dance.
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Post by banx10 on May 7, 2016 23:10:26 GMT
Football is an easy game; 1 Defend deep 2 Ignore possession 3 Concentrate on set pieces 4 And boot the ball as far down the pitch as you can at every single opportunity. It has worked beautifully for Leicester this season. It's hard to reply to this without using the words "crock" and "shit". And it hasn't worked for West Brom this season has it! Different players & lack of money. We have better facilities etc. Tony transformed us, Palace & done ok at Albion with limited everything.
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Post by samba :) on May 7, 2016 23:24:52 GMT
No, but our home form Is alot worse than it used to be
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Post by Olgrligm on May 7, 2016 23:59:29 GMT
It depends, doesn't it? We've gone long under Hughes with good results, but when the passing stuff is good, it's very good. When we go in for the self-indulgent tapping around the box, or the mind numbing halfway-line tippy tappy, that's about as dull as it gets.
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Post by march4 on May 8, 2016 0:04:55 GMT
It depends, doesn't it? We've gone long under Hughes with good results, but when the passing stuff is good, it's very good. When we go in for the self-indulgent tapping around the box, or the mind numbing halfway-line tippy tappy, that's about as dull as it gets. You could say the same thing about TP's style of football. I don't know why, but LMH looks like a man with umph!
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Post by milky on May 8, 2016 6:08:49 GMT
It's hard to reply to this without using the words "crock" and "shit". And it hasn't worked for West Brom this season has it! Different players & lack of money. We have better facilities etc. Tony transformed us, Palace & done ok at Albion with limited everything. So your friend Tony hasn't spent anything at West Brom eh? I'd check that if I were you. No posts since last August and about half a dozen last night basically saying you want "Tony " back. Interesting. ...
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Post by milky on May 8, 2016 6:12:08 GMT
I can't believe how many posts on different threads I've read where folk are wanting us to go back to the "Pulis Way "because. ..and this is the best bit...that's how Leicester play !!
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Post by owdestokie on May 8, 2016 6:31:16 GMT
Pace, power, aggressive direct football. Direct football with a mixture of passing styles. The game is about scoring more goals than the opposition, entertainment is about getting people's backsides of their seats.
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Post by fishlovesoatcakes on May 8, 2016 6:46:22 GMT
If we ever went back to the days of Pulis ball, my Stoke days would be over after over 40 years of supporting them. I suspect thousands of others would do the same. Hughes has got a job on his hands next season though. I loved Pulis and what he did for us but the style of football that I witnessed stopped me from going to an away match for over 3 seasons. Like I say, Hughes needs to get his finger out of his arse and be more consistent. We have been plagued with injuries this season though.
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Post by milky on May 8, 2016 6:53:55 GMT
I'm definitely in the mix it up camp..there's more than one way to skin a cat.. Like most I can't be doing with slow ponderous stuff..its why I like Charlie in the side as it seems to make us move the ball quicker.We need a front man with pace and strength and hopefully someone who can score . daft as it sounds a Kenwyne in his prime who could be arsed would have been just the ticket. For the record...The team you know who had in the run up to the Cup final were great to watch..its a pity he hadn't the bollocks to play JP and Ethers together in away games and didn't eventually shit himself and revert to type. With a few tweaks here and there he could have built an exciting side
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Post by chiefdelilah on May 8, 2016 7:34:21 GMT
So does credit in the bank not count? Do you sack your manager at the first sign of trouble, regardless of what he's delivered? You asked me I told you what I would do, what's up can you not take any one else's opinions on board, like I said it is a business if as a manager you fail to deliver you will be sacked, you have had a mare on here tonight you need a rest. So answer the question then? Do you believe that a club manager should be sacked at the first sign of trouble? That's what you're advocating. With you, winning the league wouldn't be enough to stop your relentless whinging.
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Post by crapslinger on May 8, 2016 9:22:54 GMT
You asked me I told you what I would do, what's up can you not take any one else's opinions on board, like I said it is a business if as a manager you fail to deliver you will be sacked, you have had a mare on here tonight you need a rest. So answer the question then? Do you believe that a club manager should be sacked at the first sign of trouble? That's what you're advocating. With you, winning the league wouldn't be enough to stop your relentless whinging. The first sign of trouble ? this has been going on all season he has not really replaced the players we sold adequately despite spending a shed load of cash, a decision needs to be taken now before the summer, I think he may walk any way personally, I would be quite happy if we won the league but we won't a cup final would be a bonus though, a European campaign good as well.
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Post by johnnysoul60 on May 8, 2016 9:45:47 GMT
I don't think it is an either or option .
Both long ball and passing can be exiting if it is done with pace and purpose , our problems under Hughes and TP has always been that often it is with neither , TP would never allow players to get forward quickly enough and once Crouch was signed , never had any pace in the team . So the forwards were isolated and incapable of making much happen
MH has had a few with pace on loan but this season losing Moses and not playing Diouf , we are simply far too slow Also when Adam does not play we don't look for enough quick forward passes . We have shown we can do it , but for whatever reason they don't often enough
you only have to look at Leicester and Southampton to see the way we should be playing but it does require a lot of energy and hard work
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Post by milky on May 8, 2016 11:30:43 GMT
[quote author=" Sergeant Muttley" source="/post/5117384/thread" timestamp="1462640805"]The premier league seems to be going down the pressing game route with high tempo fast football which we are light years away from We started this under Tony.[/quote] Not that often as I recall. We generally let the opposition within 30 yards of our goal keeping a rigid two banks of four and basically invited them to try and break through us.
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Post by trentvale68 on May 8, 2016 15:29:00 GMT
I don't think it is an either or option . Both long ball and passing can be exiting if it is done with pace and purpose , our problems under Hughes and TP has always been that often it is with neither , TP would never allow players to get forward quickly enough and once Crouch was signed , never had any pace in the team . So the forwards were isolated and incapable of making much happen MH has had a few with pace on loan but this season losing Moses and not playing Diouf , we are simply far too slow Also when Adam does not play we don't look for enough quick forward passes . We have shown we can do it , but for whatever reason they don't often enough you only have to look at Leicester and Southampton to see the way we should be playing but it does require a lot of energy and hard work Moses' form has been mixed this season at West Ham but I agree we have missed him
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Post by johnnysoul60 on May 8, 2016 15:39:06 GMT
I don't think it is an either or option . Both long ball and passing can be exiting if it is done with pace and purpose , our problems under Hughes and TP has always been that often it is with neither , TP would never allow players to get forward quickly enough and once Crouch was signed , never had any pace in the team . So the forwards were isolated and incapable of making much happen MH has had a few with pace on loan but this season losing Moses and not playing Diouf , we are simply far too slow Also when Adam does not play we don't look for enough quick forward passes . We have shown we can do it , but for whatever reason they don't often enough you only have to look at Leicester and Southampton to see the way we should be playing but it does require a lot of energy and hard work Moses' form has been mixed this season at West Ham but I agree we have missed him It didn't necessarily need to be him but we have needed a pacy option on both flanks in terms of cover for Arnie and a more direct wide man than Shaquiri, Joselu is also not the quickest so we really needed to see more of the Diouf we had at times last season and the pre-injury Bojan who seems a shadow of his old self most of the time
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Post by trentvale68 on May 8, 2016 16:37:43 GMT
Ill get my tin hat on for this but I just aren't impressed by Shaqiri at all. Couple of wonder goals, a few assists, a few cameos but just no consistency. variable work rate as well. I find he can slow the play down too often. Would have taken Matty Etherington prior to injury over him 10/10 times. The games at Everton & against Man City aren't representative of the season.
Maybe there is a good player in there and we'll see next season but I remain unconvinced. Desperately hope to be proved wrong though.
Without Arnautovic & Butland we would have been in the relegation mix this year, at the very least ala Palace uncomfortably close
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