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Post by dozintheseventees on Jun 19, 2014 21:33:03 GMT
On this subject, I just keep repeating myself. The worrying thing for me is that I would have picked the same two that Roy did because, in all honesty, I think they're probably the best of the poor bunch of CHs we have available for England right now. I rate Ryan on a level with most in the England squad, a bit better than some and a bit behind others. He should certainly be a contender but we really are very low on quality at CH right now.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 21:33:55 GMT
shawcross wouldn't of done any better than jags or cahill I've seen milk turn quicker than jagielka! The bloke is shit. Ryan is by far a better defender than jagielka
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 21:33:58 GMT
Exactly. Aslong as Shawcross stays a rock for us like he has been since he arrived I couldn't care less if he plays for England or notIt could be the reason we end up losing him if he feels it's hampering his England chances playing for an "unfashionable club" It could be, but maybe he is one of those who thinks his reputation and club career are more important (I hope!)
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 21:34:01 GMT
shawcross wouldn't of done any better than jags or cahill We'll never know. If Ron Vlaar can fit into a decent international team there's got to be hope for Shawcross...
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Post by efc on Jun 19, 2014 21:34:21 GMT
Jagielka was more of a letdown tonight for sure. Don't think i would have put Jagielka in my squad, nevermind the 1st team. aye the guys been the main part of one of the strongest defence's in the Premier League and cleared a certain goal off the line against Italy but being beaten by a world class striker fed from a world class cross means he's not England quality. Would love to know who these world class CB's are who can come in and replace him? Terry is past his best, Jones and Smalling are inept, Shawcross should be in the squad imo but isn't any better than Cahill/Jags and Stones isn't ready right now.
End of the day we don't put away our chances, Rooney scores against Italy its a draw, if he doesn't hit the post, hits his shot straight at the GK and sturridge diving every 5 minutes rather than staying on his feet we could have gotten much more tonight. You wont see a single defender not slip up at one point in a WC as the quality of the opposition is always high.
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Post by bignickhowes on Jun 19, 2014 21:35:30 GMT
This is like me saying put nathan baker in the england squad, its just not going to happen
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Post by bignickhowes on Jun 19, 2014 21:36:49 GMT
shawcross wouldn't of done any better than jags or cahill Oh, fuck off Nick he wouldnt though if you looked at it as a neutral you'd realise too
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Post by philm87 on Jun 19, 2014 21:38:13 GMT
Never been a fan of Cahill but he has had a good season with Chelsea and had a decent game tonight. Pains me to admit it, but he is a better option than Shawcross at this level because he is quicker, better on the ball and has more experience. He's not quite as consistent as Ryan, but he's the best option we have right now.
Jagielka is a good player at club level, but Shawcross is better. After this World Cup, given Jagielka's age, Shawcross has to be given a chance in a few friendlies to prove he is good enough.
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Post by stokemanusa on Jun 19, 2014 21:40:37 GMT
shawcross wouldn't of done any better than jags or cahill Oh, fuck off Nick I think he would.
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Post by mrpickles on Jun 19, 2014 21:40:42 GMT
This is like me saying put nathan baker in the england squad, its just not going to happen Why, has Nathan Baker had 6 consistently brilliant seasons at premier league level? Give it a fucking rest Nick. You've proved you know jack shit about Ryan plenty of times, and your replies now are just out of stubbornness.
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Post by dozintheseventees on Jun 19, 2014 21:41:50 GMT
Don't think i would have put Jagielka in my squad, nevermind the 1st team. aye the guys been the main part of one of the strongest defence's in the Premier League and cleared a certain goal off the line against Italy but being beaten by a world class striker fed from a world class cross means he's not England quality. Would love to know who these world class CB's are who can come in and replace him? Terry is past his best, Jones and Smalling are inept, Shawcross should be in the squad imo but isn't any better than Cahill/Jags and Stones isn't ready right now.
End of the day we don't put away our chances, Rooney scores against Italy its a draw, if he doesn't hit the post, hits his shot straight at the GK and sturridge diving every 5 minutes rather than staying on his feet we could have gotten much more tonight. You wont see a single defender not slip up at one point in a WC as the quality of the opposition is always high.
All fair comment IMO. We're looking for easy targets and Cahill/Jagielka aren't great defenders by any stretch of the imagination but there isn't a huge list of better alternatives. Ryan deserves a 'proper' chance but (IMO) he is (at best) on a level with those two. England is woefully short of quality CHs at this moment IMO. BTW: I should add that neither are helped by bloody awful full backs (in terms of defending).
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Post by wearepremierleague on Jun 19, 2014 21:43:51 GMT
shawcross wouldn't of done any better than jags or cahill Yeah it's been hard to do worse
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Post by dazzler on Jun 19, 2014 21:43:51 GMT
Question: what do you want a centre half to do?
Until we get rid of this idea that centre halves need to be as skilful as messi he'll never be picked. As an out and out defender he's probably in the 3 centre halves in the prem
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 21:44:53 GMT
Ryan is best off as far away from that shower of tossers as possible. There isn't a defender worthy of the name in that squad. Because of who he is and who he plays for he'd never be cut any of the slack the likes of Cahill and Jageilka repeatedly have. Ryan gets done by one of the world's best defenders in a 15 minute appearance and is slaughtered. Cahill gets done by Kenny fucking Miller and will probably go on and win at least 70 caps. And while I'm on, Hart isn't fit to lace Asmir's boots. Hooray, thank god someone sees sense - Hart cost us tonight. Playing for Stoke Ryan has no chance of England - especially with 'Woy' in charge.
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Post by bettyswallox on Jun 19, 2014 21:45:33 GMT
he wouldnt though if you looked at it as a neutral you'd realise too I've asked a Liverpool fan and a Man United fan tonight on Twitter if they' pick Shawcross. Both said yes.
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Post by 11wilkosinateam on Jun 19, 2014 21:46:54 GMT
I like how Shawcross got crucified after coming on cold against a shit hot Ibrahimovic and being below par for 15 mins
Where Cahill and Jagielka got given the run around by a 75% fit Suarez and the lazy Balotelli for 90
Also Whelan would have done a better job than Gerrard tonight
Rant over
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Post by bignickhowes on Jun 19, 2014 21:47:24 GMT
he wouldnt though if you looked at it as a neutral you'd realise too I've asked a Liverpool fan and a Man United fan tonight on Twitter if they' pick Shawcross. Both said yes. ahh 2 fans, yea your right shawcross is amazing then..
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 21:48:40 GMT
I like how Shawcross got crucified after coming on cold against a shit hot Ibrahimovic and being below par for 15 mins Where Cahill and Jagielka got given the run around by a 75% fit Suarez and the lazy Balotelli for 90 Also Whelan would have done a better job than Gerrard tonight Rant over Whelans Irish though mate ;-)
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Post by stokemanusa on Jun 19, 2014 21:49:18 GMT
I like how Shawcross got crucified after coming on cold against a shit hot Ibrahimovic and being below par for 15 mins Where Cahill and Jagielka got given the run around by a 75% fit Suarez and the lazy Balotelli for 90 Also Whelan would have done a better job than Gerrard tonight Rant over I agree this is Gerrard's last WC. Henderson is a possible replacement but England need a line change.
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Post by passtheoatcakes on Jun 19, 2014 21:50:17 GMT
Ryan is best off as far away from that shower of tossers as possible. There isn't a defender worthy of the name in that squad. Because of who he is and who he plays for he'd never be cut any of the slack the likes of Cahill and Jageilka repeatedly have. Ryan gets done by one of the world's best defenders in a 15 minute appearance and is slaughtered. Cahill gets done by Kenny fucking Miller and will probably go on and win at least 70 caps. And while I'm on, Hart isn't fit to lace Asmir's boots. This +1000 dave. The Enland back four are second rate, really poor. Hodgson is second sorry third rate, he needs to go and quickly, what a bloody joke. Henderson and Gerrard are second rate and Gerrard is way past it too. Asmir will always be way way superior to the over hyped Hart. Ryan is best well away from this pile of crap he really is. I lost count this season of how many supposed 'wonder' strikers he had in his pocket, he is a genuine full bloodied body on the line English defender, hope he stays at Stoke for a little while longer yet.... I can live in hope. Time to ring the changes yet again Engerland.......pack your bags now and come home.......sack the manager and sort out the bloody inept defence, it's not rocket science as they say. 50 years is coming up and you still fail miserably where it matters, on this the biggest of international stages.
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Post by bettyswallox on Jun 19, 2014 21:50:43 GMT
I've asked a Liverpool fan and a Man United fan tonight on Twitter if they' pick Shawcross. Both said yes. ahh 2 fans, yea your right shawcross is amazing then.. You implied any neutrals would see Shawcross the way you do. Clearly some don't. I apologise I didn't conduct a worldwide survey, which would obviously proved you right ![:-*](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/ibsKtmyxvmCS4ld9vDzv.gif) Haven't you got a club that's going down quicker than Hodgson's reputation to worry about anyway?
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Post by slother on Jun 19, 2014 21:51:35 GMT
Quite aside from his merits technically, he's captained a successful Premiership side for six years. He's focused, determined and quietly but undeniably inspirational to those around him.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using proboards
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Post by bignickhowes on Jun 19, 2014 21:55:59 GMT
ahh 2 fans, yea your right shawcross is amazing then.. You implied any neutrals would see Shawcross the way you do. Clearly some don't. I apologise I didn't conduct a worldwide survey, which would obviously proved you right ![:-*](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/ibsKtmyxvmCS4ld9vDzv.gif) Haven't you got a club that's going down quicker than Hodgson's reputation to worry about anyway? I can't speak for everyone but the vast majority would see the same as me Well at the moment Villa and Stoke are both on 0 points..
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 22:00:54 GMT
I like Baines for Everton and think he plays great for them. For this tournament though (all 2 games) I think he has looked one of the weakest. Tonight he got caught in possession three times in the first seven minutes. For Suarez's first goal he should have continued his run back and helped put pressure on the buck toothed goofy one.
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Post by passtheoatcakes on Jun 19, 2014 22:01:40 GMT
Don't think i would have put Jagielka in my squad, nevermind the 1st team. aye the guys been the main part of one of the strongest defence's in the Premier League and cleared a certain goal off the line against Italy but being beaten by a world class striker fed from a world class cross means he's not England quality. Would love to know who these world class CB's are who can come in and replace him? Terry is past his best, Jones and Smalling are inept, Shawcross should be in the squad imo but isn't any better than Cahill/Jags and Stones isn't ready right now.
End of the day we don't put away our chances, Rooney scores against Italy its a draw, if he doesn't hit the post, hits his shot straight at the GK and sturridge diving every 5 minutes rather than staying on his feet we could have gotten much more tonight. You wont see a single defender not slip up at one point in a WC as the quality of the opposition is always high.
Tired of hearing this 'jags' nickname, so fondly written too. Shawcross is way way better than bloody overrated 'jags' and you know it. I have watched a string of top strikers come to the Brit this season and Ryan put each of them in his pocket time and again. Plus let's not beat about the bush, Baines and Johnson are a bloody joke too and Cahill is a pussy. About as scary and tough at the back as my pet hamster would be if he were selected. Get rid of those four and the 'softly softly in safe hands' manager and start to rebuild now. Total abject toss England, fully expected too.
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Post by imallstokedup on Jun 19, 2014 22:03:40 GMT
I like how Shawcross got crucified after coming on cold against a shit hot Ibrahimovic and being below par for 15 mins Where Cahill and Jagielka got given the run around by a 75% fit Suarez and the lazy Balotelli for 90 Also Whelan would have done a better job than Gerrard tonight Rant over Whelans Irish though mate ;-) You could argue Ryan is Welsh. He maybe just as well playing for them
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2014 22:05:19 GMT
You implied any neutrals would see Shawcross the way you do. Clearly some don't. I apologise I didn't conduct a worldwide survey, which would obviously proved you right ![:-*](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/ibsKtmyxvmCS4ld9vDzv.gif) Haven't you got a club that's going down quicker than Hodgson's reputation to worry about anyway? I can't speak for everyone but the vast majority would see the same as me Well at the moment Villa and Stoke are both on 0 points.. Just hope and pray Senderos makes his debut. If he can play international football anyone can......
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Post by Squeekster on Jun 19, 2014 22:08:22 GMT
ahh 2 fans, yea your right shawcross is amazing then.. You implied any neutrals would see Shawcross the way you do. Clearly some don't. I apologise I didn't conduct a worldwide survey, which would obviously proved you right ![:-*](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/ibsKtmyxvmCS4ld9vDzv.gif) Haven't you got a club that's going down quicker than Hodgson's reputation to worry about anyway? Didn't Arsenal fans tweet that Ryan should of been there all be it through gritted teeth?
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Post by passtheoatcakes on Jun 19, 2014 22:09:28 GMT
I agree with mr pickles on this one. The last thing we need tonight is a bloody Villain coming on here and banging on about Ryan. What do you know fella? Watch him regularly do you? No? Thought not.
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Post by bignickhowes on Jun 19, 2014 22:27:52 GMT
I can't speak for everyone but the vast majority would see the same as me Well at the moment Villa and Stoke are both on 0 points.. Just hope and pray Senderos makes his debut. If he can play international football anyone can...... Well he is shit but then again if he played for Stoke you'd be saying he's world class ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/KYqg3pYeaerc5lD_P7BR.gif)
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