|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 11:52:09 GMT
He wouldn't be my first choice but he's much better than Whelan.
|
|
|
Post by Stretfordpotterer on Jan 22, 2014 11:52:32 GMT
Great example, but I was thinking more about Assaidi and Ireland. I also stated 'recent' which Palacios is not. You're missing my point mate. There would be a fair few Stokies sticking up for Assaidi or Ireland or Whelan or (even) Walters if they were offski but hardly anybody would be sticking up for Palacios. Like hardly any of the Sunderland fans are sticking up for Cattermole. You can't just dismiss ALL of them as being wrong, it would be very similar to fans of another club suggesting that ALL Stokies were wrong about Palacios, if there was a chance of him joining their club. I used to think Cattermole was a pretty decent player but maybe (actually probably) he isn't anymore, just like Palacios isn't anymore ... there were Spurs fans laughing at us when we signed him but we all knew better at the time (of course). For all this supposed lack of support among the Sunderland faithful, he is the one player for them whose name you hear sung from the stands every single game. I'm far from convinced, i do think we need some bite, someone to get the fans going and the rest of the team, in the middle of the park, i'm just not sure Cattermole is the answer though.
|
|
|
Post by jonnysidparto on Jan 22, 2014 11:53:32 GMT
There must be a better player to spend 5m on!???!!?!?!?? Our transfer scouting network seems to be doing well then!??!
|
|
|
Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 22, 2014 11:54:50 GMT
If anybody bothered to read the thread on the Sunderland board, you will find more than a few think Cattermole is their best midfielder (a bit like the blinkered Whelan brigade) and just the guy to have while trying to scrap out of a relegation battle. Maybe Leslie fancies 2 holding midfielders, and his passing cannot be anyworse than Nonzi. The only reason for getting rid, is that he does not suit Poyet's way of playing is will be replaced by a cheaper dubious Sussex Sliced bread. So far Poyet seems to be doing us a great job by signing total unknowns from foreign leagues and potentially weakening the side. As many on the Sunderland board said, why on earth sell him to a relegation rival. What this one? www.readytogo.net/smb/threads/cattermol-to-stoke.865739/I only got about 7 or 8 pages in last night and it's moved on a bit since then but it appears the majority are happy to see him go. As I said, I always used to think he was a very good player and a couple of seasons ago I would have loved to have seen him here but I'm concerned now by how many Sunderland fans no longer seem to rate him. If we're going to replace Whelan, I'd be hoping for more of a sure thing.
|
|
|
Post by realstokebloke on Jan 22, 2014 11:54:52 GMT
Great example, but I was thinking more about Assaidi and Ireland. I also stated 'recent' which Palacios is not. You're missing my point mate. There would be a fair few Stokies sticking up for Assaidi or Ireland or Whelan or (even) Walters if they were offski but hardly anybody would be sticking up for Palacios. Like hardly any of the Sunderland fans are sticking up for Cattermole.You can't just dismiss ALL of them as being wrong, it would be very similar to fans of another club suggesting that ALL Stokies were wrong about Palacios, if there was a chance of him joining their club. I used to think Cattermole was a pretty decent player but maybe (actually probably) he isn't anymore, just like Palacios isn't anymore ... there were Spurs fans laughing at us when we signed him but we all knew better at the time (of course). Maybe we all read different Sunderland boards or even subconsciously self-select the posts we need to support a particular argument but I really don't see "hardly any" sticking up for him.
My perception, without a statistical analysis or instigating a poll amongst them, is that quite a few are not happy - or at least worried - about letting him go. Indeed, a few really rate him highly compared with the rest of their MF cohort (albeit with the usual & expected injury & mental stability caveats).
But...of those that rate him or would rather not sell, all are almost universally agreed that for the Spinksy-pie-in-the-sky £5m, it is a good deal and one they should take.
Equally of course, of those that haven't fooked off up the vale in disgust at the very thought, nearly every Stokie willing to give him a chance, thinks the price is way too high.
i.e. We sort of agree.
(It is useless to compare it, even to previous Sunderland acquisitions like "we paid that for Dean Whitehead" as they were just i. bad deals & ii. from a different era.)
Perhaps the most telling fan reference we can draw upon and best barometer of his ability however is that of his 'football dad', Mr Bruce. Perhaps it is interesting that he isn't banging down the door to get him (maybe he's got a defensive MF mental case at Hull already but can't think of one).
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 11:55:33 GMT
Question: Has this article been planted to deflect everyone's attention from what Stoke are really up to? If so it has certainly attracted a lot of attention in the last 16 hours. Yes Hope this is the reason
|
|
|
Post by jeycov on Jan 22, 2014 11:59:27 GMT
I thought that we are trying to build a squad.
There are players that I would like to see move on before Whelan, if that is a possible plan.
A striker remains our priority
|
|
|
Post by realstokebloke on Jan 22, 2014 12:00:25 GMT
He wouldn't be my first choice but he's much better than Whelan. Muted in the extreme WD.
Will the fireworks, bunting and street party announcing Glenda's demise be confirmed on LC's signing?
|
|
|
Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 22, 2014 12:02:21 GMT
You're missing my point mate. There would be a fair few Stokies sticking up for Assaidi or Ireland or Whelan or (even) Walters if they were offski but hardly anybody would be sticking up for Palacios. Like hardly any of the Sunderland fans are sticking up for Cattermole.You can't just dismiss ALL of them as being wrong, it would be very similar to fans of another club suggesting that ALL Stokies were wrong about Palacios, if there was a chance of him joining their club. I used to think Cattermole was a pretty decent player but maybe (actually probably) he isn't anymore, just like Palacios isn't anymore ... there were Spurs fans laughing at us when we signed him but we all knew better at the time (of course). Maybe we all read different Sunderland boards or even subconsciously self-select the posts we need to support a particular argument but I really don't see "hardly any" sticking up for him.
My perception, without a statistical analysis or instigating a poll amongst them, is that quite a few are not happy - or at least worried - about letting him go. Indeed, a few really rate him highly compared with the rest of their MF cohort (albeit with the usual & expected injury & mental stability caveats).
But...of those that rate him or would rather not sell, all are almost universally agreed that for the Spinksy-pie-in-the-sky £5m, it is a good deal and one they should take.
Equally of course, of those that haven't fooked off up the vale in disgust at the very thought, nearly every Stokie willing to give him a chance, thinks the price is way too high.
i.e. We sort of agree.
(It is useless to compare it, even to previous Sunderland acquisitions like "we paid that for Dean Whitehead" as they were just i. bad deals & ii. from a different era.)
Perhaps the most telling fan reference we can draw upon and best barometer of his ability however is that of his 'football dad', Mr Bruce. Perhaps it is interesting that he isn't banging down the door to get him (maybe he's got a defensive MF mental case at Hull already but can't think of one).Fair do's rsb - I think the 'fee' that Spinks has quoted is (and you're right) definitely fanning some flames here.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 12:04:04 GMT
He wouldn't be my first choice but he's much better than Whelan. Muted in the extreme WD.
Will the fireworks, bunting and street party announcing Glenda's demise be confirmed on LC's signing? Possibly mate
|
|
|
Post by nott1 on Jan 22, 2014 12:05:03 GMT
He may be a red card magnet but he IS better than Palacios and Whelan!
|
|
|
Post by jeycov on Jan 22, 2014 12:13:11 GMT
Is he likely to feature in the capital cup semi final tonight?
|
|
|
Post by realstokebloke on Jan 22, 2014 12:15:37 GMT
If anybody bothered to read the thread on the Sunderland board, you will find more than a few think Cattermole is their best midfielder (a bit like the blinkered Whelan brigade) and just the guy to have while trying to scrap out of a relegation battle. Maybe Leslie fancies 2 holding midfielders, and his passing cannot be anyworse than Nonzi. The only reason for getting rid, is that he does not suit Poyet's way of playing is will be replaced by a cheaper dubious Sussex Sliced bread. So far Poyet seems to be doing us a great job by signing total unknowns from foreign leagues and potentially weakening the side. As many on the Sunderland board said, why on earth sell him to a relegation rival. What this one? www.readytogo.net/smb/threads/cattermol-to-stoke.865739/I only got about 7 or 8 pages in last night and it's moved on a bit since then but it appears the majority are happy to see him go. As I said, I always used to think he was a very good player and a couple of seasons ago I would have loved to have seen him here but I'm concerned now by how many Sunderland fans no longer seem to rate him. If we're going to replace Whelan, I'd be hoping for more of a sure thing. This.
(And as per your most recent reply) yes Cattermole is pure marmite, as this thread demonstrates - but the fee cited is further confusing matters.
Almost nobody (including Les hopefully) thinks he still merits a £5m price tag.
And, likewise, I'd also like a more obvious upgrade that was genuinely in the £5m (& upwards if needs be) price bracket.
|
|
|
Post by devondumpling on Jan 22, 2014 12:16:11 GMT
If he does not feature tonight, presumably a clue somewhere.
|
|
|
Post by mrcoke on Jan 22, 2014 12:16:15 GMT
If anybody bothered to read the thread on the Sunderland board, you will find more than a few think Cattermole is their best midfielder (a bit like the blinkered Whelan brigade) and just the guy to have while trying to scrap out of a relegation battle. Maybe Leslie fancies 2 holding midfielders, and his passing cannot be anyworse than Nonzi. The only reason for getting rid, is that he does not suit Poyet's way of playing is will be replaced by a cheaper dubious Sussex Sliced bread. So far Poyet seems to be doing us a great job by signing total unknowns from foreign leagues and potentially weakening the side. As many on the Sunderland board said, why on earth sell him to a relegation rival. www1.skysports.com/football/news/11065/9075025/premier-league-lee-cattermole-adamant-gus-poyet-can-keep-sunderland-upWith what Sunderland fans think and Gus Poyet, you must wonder whether Sunderland are serious about selling to a direct rival club.
|
|
|
Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Jan 22, 2014 12:26:08 GMT
Wasn't Cattermole once hyped as the next Steven Gerrard? Just trying to look at this a little more positively. Where's Captain Fishpaste when you need him?
|
|
|
Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Jan 22, 2014 12:28:25 GMT
If he does not feature tonight, presumably a clue somewhere. Would the clue point to him moving or him being too crap for selection?
|
|
|
Post by Clem Fandango on Jan 22, 2014 12:30:03 GMT
He's something of a slight sideways move and I'm not 100% sure what to make of him although Ive got a niggling feeling that he would a good signing for us and add some energy and bite to the midfield.
I think we bought him in for more like 2 mill and then got rid of Edu and Palacios then I think we'd be in a slightly stronger position.
|
|
|
Post by FullerMagic on Jan 22, 2014 12:30:49 GMT
Wasn't Cattermole once hyped as the next Steven Gerrard? Just trying to look at this a little more positively. Where's Captain Fishpaste when you need him? He was on last night, Jim... He's a midfield rattler, pure and simple. He closes people down absolutely brilliantly, there is no question about that. The problem is that he sometimes closes people down with so much relish that he gets seriously annoyed when he doesn't get the reward for it. That's when the red mist falls. But he passes the ball quite well, much better than people think. His long passing is especially underrated. I mean he isn't going to spray it around like Pirlo but he's good at spreading the ball out to the flanks. With Poyet though, what he wants for the role Cattermole currently plays is someone with a brain. Someone who will plug the gaps responsibly rather than pursue the ball relentlessly. Cattermole is a very English midfielder in essentially a South American system here (or at least that's the system Poyet wants). But Cattermole is a very good footballer when everything comes together. He can be a genuine force in there. The Brit crowd will love him if/when you see the best of him, and you'd start to understand why Sunderland fans have tended to have been more forgiving of him than the rest of the country think we should be. A few interesting stats about his passing here that we did recently rokerreport.sbnation.com/2014/1/14/5305674/by-the-stats-the-facts-and-figures-behind-sunderlands-passing
|
|
|
Post by realstokebloke on Jan 22, 2014 12:34:35 GMT
He's something of a slight sideways move and I'm not 100% sure what to make of him although Ive got a niggling feeling that he would a good signing for us and add some energy and bite to the midfield. I think we bought him in for more like 2 mill and then got rid of Edu and Palacios then I think we'd be in a slightly stronger position. This.
Then, if he knocks spots off Whelan in that role, then we'll know.
|
|
|
Post by Gods on Jan 22, 2014 12:38:10 GMT
Has the potential to be a real fans favourite and far more likely to get something done than some of the other ridiculous "fancy-dans" the new regime seem uncontrollably attracted to.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 12:50:10 GMT
Just because Poyet doesn't fancy Cattermole, doesn't mean we should consider him a shit signing for us.
AVB didn't fancy Adebayor but he's since become one of their best players under Sherwood.
Sometimes Managers just don't rate particular players for whatever reason.
Cattermole wouldn't be my first choice but I think we could do worse. The main thing is he would be an improvement and that's good enough for me (if there is any truth in this story).
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 13:04:04 GMT
What happens to all the money should he get fined for getting repeatedly sent off.
If it goes back into the clubs coffers then no wonder Coates would have no hesitation in sanctioning this move. What a clever clever man.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Jan 22, 2014 13:05:37 GMT
What happens to all the money should he get fined for getting repeatedly sent off. If it goes back into the clubs coffers then no wonder Coates would have no hesitation in sanctioning this move. What a clever clever man. It goes to buy you a new leather jacket. H
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 13:07:16 GMT
What happens to all the money should he get fined for getting repeatedly sent off. If it goes back into the clubs coffers then no wonder Coates would have no hesitation in sanctioning this move. What a clever clever man. It goes to buy you a new leather jacket. H With an hood on?.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Jan 22, 2014 13:09:40 GMT
It goes to buy you a new leather jacket. H With an hood on?. Of course, nowt but the best for our Taz H
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 13:20:48 GMT
Of course, nowt but the best for our Taz H Ha ha ha.
|
|
|
Post by devondumpling on Jan 22, 2014 13:40:25 GMT
So there we have it, Fishpaste reckons he's pretty darn good, provided we don't play a south american system, whatever that may be.
|
|
|
Post by jarvinski on Jan 22, 2014 13:55:54 GMT
Its a lot of money that could be spent better imho, however he is a major improvement om whelan walters palacios etc, the trouble is nobody wants to buy our garbage to help fund it
|
|
|
Post by StokieAsh13 on Jan 22, 2014 13:59:28 GMT
Its a lot of money that could be spent better imho, however he is a major improvement om whelan walters palacios etc, the trouble is nobody wants to buy our garbage to help fund it I wouldn't be so sure about that 'nobody wants to buy it'
|
|