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Post by bash62 on Oct 10, 2009 21:47:44 GMT
you get life for murder ? Yes, you do. What's your point? the goverment ,royals did not want her to marry dodi so get rid of her . |
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Post by Olgrligm on Oct 10, 2009 21:57:07 GMT
But that's nonsense.
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Post by salopstick on Oct 10, 2009 22:04:39 GMT
agreed too many people think there is conspiracy in everything |
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Post by Olgrligm on Oct 10, 2009 22:10:52 GMT
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Post by march4 on Oct 10, 2009 22:27:06 GMT
But did Hugh Gaitskill really contract an extremely rare tropical disease that killed him and allowed Harold Wilson to become PM.
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Post by salopstick on Oct 10, 2009 22:37:59 GMT
i dont know but i do know that gordon brown fucked this country up on purpose in a secret pact to secure demi-god status for the rt hon anthony blair
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Oct 10, 2009 23:03:26 GMT
Australia took up the challenge and regulated their banks, so did other countries, it wasn't the rest of the world. It was the greed of the "want it now" people who borrowed and borrowed that stoked the fires. You don't think the people who lent them the money in the first place are to blame at all then? You know the ones with massive insurance policies that traded this "toxic debt" like some kind of global casino? Lehman brothers, Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae..etc etc etc...? |
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Post by march4 on Oct 10, 2009 23:38:53 GMT
I was talking to a friend who has 2 children working for US banks in Canary Wharf. They both had bonuses of above £1M the year before last. I'll be damned if I can determine what they actually do that is worth that amount of money. One of them produces monthly newsletters for other employees!!
Then you have our MPs claiming oodles of cash for spurious expenses.
It all amounts to greed and that is why the world economy is in meltdown.
Just a word on Australia, which is one of the countries with whom I do business. Business is very bad at the moment, the country is spiralling down into deep debt and companies that I have worked with for years have gone or have real cash flow problems. There is talk of the economy being taken over by the IMF. With climate change affecting the country badly, Australia is sadly turning into a country where few will want to live.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Oct 11, 2009 10:05:19 GMT
Absolute rubbish... The Peace Process occurred because more and more Nationalists who'd previously voted SDLP were turning to Sinn Fein..and both British and Irish Governments shit themselves...hence the need for Garrett Fitzgerald and Maggie Thatcher sitting down WITH the IRA Army Council and the UVF leadership to try and hammer out a deal.. 9/11 had absolutely fuck all to do with it...a deal was struck in the mid 1990's with both UVF/UFF and IRA/INLA leaderships via London and Dublin which eventually became known as The Good Friday Agreement...Labours lasting legacy and Tony Blair..love or loathe him has won his place in History as i said the negotiations had already started in the 80/90s blair was the pm in charge when the good friday agreement was finally signed in april 98, he had been in power for 11 months so how he gets the credit i dont know a good read www.csmonitor.com/2005/0729/p01s04-woeu.htmlJust for the record Salop...the British Government first started negotiations with the IRA Army Council in 1972...the IRA leadership (including Gerry Adams and Martin McGuiness, Brendan Hughes and Sean McStiofan) were flown by helicopter from Londonderry to William Whitelaws house in Chaney Walk, Chelsea...where they sat down and discussed 'terms'...and as a result of these talks an IRA ceasefire was announced..only to be broken when the UVF's 'assasination wing' the UFF planted a number of bombs in the Falls/Clonnard/Anderson Town areas of Belfast...as well as a number of 'selective' assasinations..randomly..of catholics...to antagonise the Nationalist population. The point I'm making...extremely boringly ;D is that The Peace Process started a long long time befoe Tony Blair came to office...he was the right man in the right place at the right time and Mo Molam did the dirty work in his administration....as you rightly say Margaret Thatcher...despite banning anyone from the IRA's Army Council to speak on TV/Radio...and despite having a very hard line on Republicans publicly...never stopped negotiationg with the IRA..because she finally got the message that there was NO military solution to Northern Ireland only a POLITICAL one...a point made to Edward Heath and Harold Wilson 15 years earlier...Once you stop talking to the IRA they start bombing again....unless their Historical grievances and terms of negotitions were at least partially met.. Historically speaking..the only way to get rid of Terrorists is by putting them into office  ...and that's precisely what the Good Friday Agreement did...'Political Prisoners' were released from The Maze Prison...and sat down in Stormont together to help run Northern Ireland...IRA/SDLP and UVF/DUP..... |
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Post by salopstick on Oct 11, 2009 11:11:00 GMT
wizzard, i agree that the peace process started long ago, i just made a valid point that 911 changed the way the world looked at terrorists and that after the event the ira could never go back to the way they were
it was not the cause of peace but a factor in the eventual result
and then mumf knowing better decides to have a go, then clears off - typical mumf
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Oct 11, 2009 11:22:06 GMT
Soz Salop...I misunderstood your point...and jumped to the wrong conclusions My mistake  |
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Post by hoekofneverland on Oct 11, 2009 16:47:44 GMT
wizzard, i agree that the peace process started long ago, i just made a valid point that 911 changed the way the world looked at terrorists and that after the event the ira could never go back to the way they were it was not the cause of peace but a factor in the eventual result and then mumf knowing better decides to have a go, then clears off - typical mumf I'm glad you and wizzard understand each other Because i love you both  |
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Oct 11, 2009 17:45:52 GMT
wizzard, i agree that the peace process started long ago, i just made a valid point that 911 changed the way the world looked at terrorists and that after the event the ira could never go back to the way they were it was not the cause of peace but a factor in the eventual result and then mumf knowing better decides to have a go, then clears off - typical mumf I'm glad you and wizzard understand each other Because i love you both That's comforting to know frasier  |
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Post by hoekofneverland on Oct 11, 2009 17:48:28 GMT
You're welcome Mucka ;D
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Oct 11, 2009 18:28:47 GMT
;D
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Post by serpico on Oct 11, 2009 22:35:57 GMT
ARE YOU SURE were is tony liar now ,he should be in the same place as my mate 21 year old private cutts from mansfield . Blair has his place in history as our greatest peacetime Primeminister since Victorian times. No Primeminister had managed low unemployment and inflation before. He managed to pay off all of the country's debts dating back to the 2nd World War and the IMF. He set aside enough money to rebuild every single school and hospital in the country. He brought about peace in Northern Ireland, a feat that had escaped every previous Primeminister. He presided over Britain's change from an industrial society to a service/finance society without any of the civil unrest associated with previous changes to the structure of society. He also changed the face of modern diplomacy by using force to dislodge immoral regimes in other countroes, thus establishing the UK and USA as the world's policemen ( this will see him venerated for centuries in world politics). His final triumph is just months away when he will become the first President of Europe. I really hope this is sarcasm ??? particularly the highlighted bit. How about the bit where he helped lie the country into war ? seems to be missing from your Orwellian re-writing of history. |
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Post by kidsgrove4 on Oct 11, 2009 22:48:41 GMT
Maggie may ? ??? Maggie who,Sal?
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Post by tassiepotter on Oct 12, 2009 3:32:37 GMT
Just a word on Australia, which is one of the countries with whom I do business. Business is very bad at the moment, the country is spiralling down into deep debt and companies that I have worked with for years have gone or have real cash flow problems. There is talk of the economy being taken over by the IMF. With climate change affecting the country badly, Australia is sadly turning into a country where few will want to live. Wtf? news to us down here, where interest rates have gone up because of the strength of the dollar and public spending. This on top of both major parties saying we are not in recession... |
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Post by hoekofneverland on Oct 12, 2009 5:54:04 GMT
Sal, you created a monster :-)
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Post by Northy on Oct 12, 2009 6:23:35 GMT
Just a word on Australia, which is one of the countries with whom I do business. Business is very bad at the moment, the country is spiralling down into deep debt and companies that I have worked with for years have gone or have real cash flow problems. There is talk of the economy being taken over by the IMF. With climate change affecting the country badly, Australia is sadly turning into a country where few will want to live. Wtf? news to us down here, where interest rates have gone up because of the strength of the dollar and public spending. This on top of both major parties saying we are not in recession... Nice to hear it from the horse's mouth tassie ;D and I don't mean your a Van Nistleroy  Well March4? Was that pure lies just to try and discredit the woman who dragged this country from the nadir of union jackboots and the 3 day week? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2009 9:31:57 GMT
ARE YOU SURE were is tony liar now ,he should be in the same place as my mate 21 year old private cutts from mansfield . Blair has his place in history as our greatest peacetime Primeminister since Victorian times. No Primeminister had managed low unemployment and inflation before. He managed to pay off all of the country's debts dating back to the 2nd World War and the IMF. He set aside enough money to rebuild every single school and hospital in the country. He brought about peace in Northern Ireland, a feat that had escaped every previous Primeminister. He presided over Britain's change from an industrial society to a service/finance society without any of the civil unrest associated with previous changes to the structure of society. He also changed the face of modern diplomacy by using force to dislodge immoral regimes in other countroes, thus establishing the UK and USA as the world's policemen ( this will see him venerated for centuries in world politics). His final triumph is just months away when he will become the first President of Europe. Oh dear. Where do you start with that little lot? Blair and Brown inherited an excellent economy in 1997 and one that had been performing well since the 92 recession. They simply used that economy to fuel their additional tax income before having to increase borrowing a few years later. Brown famously always mentioned economic growth since 97 and failed to inform the stupid that the economy had been growing for 4 years before he became chancellor. When the 'real' Labour economy kicked in so did the borrowing and so did the result of low interest rates and an economy built on debt. Well done Tone, you're a star! Also, well done Tony for paying the miniscule WWII debt off. Maybe he should come back and have a crack at the current debt which he helped to build? John Major started the NI peace process and did the majority of the work until it was finally sealed by Blair. Yet again, Blair enjoyed taking the applause for this and repeatedly failed to commend Major for getting the process going in the first place. There's a pattern developing here - can you see it? Thatcher presided over the change from a manufacturing to service based economy and took the stick for doing so. That's why there are so many moaning bleating mardarses on this site who can't credit Thatcher for having the guts to change the way our economy works. To credit Blair for this is so fucking stupid it's untrue. He planned to rebuild all the schools and hospitals and ensured that he taxed and borrowed to do so but managed to fuck it all up by using PFI in the wrong way. The number of schools and hospitals that have been rebuilt is a disgrace when linked to the extra funds they've received for getting this work done. Of course, now we're in the shit, we won't see much in the way of new builds because we can't afford. A magnificent example of Labour waste. Any man who reveals that 'god will judge' him on his wars is seriously deluded and quite dangerous.  |
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Post by redstriper on Oct 12, 2009 10:08:30 GMT
hats off to the people (of whatever opinion), who have made this post an interesting an informative read. The type we used to have more of... I'm very interested as to what will happen as maggies funeral cortege passes through London. I will be standing in respectful silence for the woman I consider our best (at least for the first two terms - like most who are in power too long, she went a bit strange towards the end) post-war leader. I am not going to be happy if there are disrespectful idiots hurling abuse in the vicinity. The subsequent fall-out could see the most divisive civil scenes for many many years.  |
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Post by mumf14 on Oct 12, 2009 11:02:23 GMT
hats off to the people (of whatever opinion), who have made this post an interesting an informative read. The type we used to have more of... I'm very interested as to what will happen as maggies funeral cortege passes through London. I will be standing in respectful silence for the woman I consider our best (at least for the first two terms - like most who are in power too long, she went a bit strange towards the end) post-war leader. I am not going to be happy if there are disrespectful idiots hurling abuse in the vicinity. The subsequent fall-out could see the most divisive civil scenes for many many years. Margaret Thatcher deserves the same amount of respect in death as she did in life. Infact the same amount of respect that she showed to the mining communities who had to resort to soup kitchens and charity aid in order to survive. She will go down in history as the most hated and despised Prime Minister in history...a woman who was hated by senior members of her own party...Ted Heath, Geoffrey Howe , Norman Lamont to name but a few.It has even been rumoured that even the Queen herself couldn't stand the sight of her. REDSTRIPER is correct to suspect that there will be scenes of civil unrest...and rightly so.I wouldn't condone or condemn such action myself , but instead I would suggest that ultimately she got what she deserved for the way she treated the poor of this country. Tough shit.  |
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Post by vestanpance on Oct 12, 2009 11:27:31 GMT
Good posts on here, an excellent read. For my part, there are parts of Thatcher that digust me. Her claims that "there was no such thing as society" provoke disgust and ire in the vast majority of working class voters, whilst "we are a Grandmother" to me at least confirmed that the esteem in which she held herself was not echoed throughout the land. All in all she did a great deal wrong for the majority of people in Northern England (who can forgive her, seriously, for cutting the funding to Liverpool City Council just because it was run by a militant labour faction? That's tantamount to dictatorialism) and she'll not be missed, except in the South East, where for them at least she didn't put a foot wrong. She was also fucking aces during the Falklands War, displaying once again that if we are to deploy armed forces in this country, we are better off doing so under the Tories, who are significantly better at leading a country in conflict than Labour, who by and large would much rather sit around and talk about it rather than doing what needs to be done. However, whether you like it or not, something had to happen with the unions. We are currently staring collectively dumbstruck at the stupidity of the CWU for talking about striking during these straightened times yet throughout the 70's this was de rigeur. The unions were far too powerful and they needed to be brought to task. Thatcher takes huge amounts of blame for the destruction of the mining industry in this coutry, and rightly so. But Scargill turned it into a personal battle between him and Thatcher, and the minute that happened the rest was inevitable. Thatcher destroyed the miners because it became personal. Not the hallmarks of a great leader, in my humble opinion, and not the hallmarks of a great person, but th epoint remains that she did not act alone. She's equally despised and loved in equal measure, dependant on your perspective. But i'll say this for her; at least she stood for something. Look at Gordon Brown and David Cameron now; one man in charge of a dead party walking, yet given hope constantly by the fact that Eton Rifler Dave simply cannot shake the nagging questions in the back of everyone's mind, the devisiveness of his party on key strategy decisions such as Europe; the fact that nearly half of his shadow cabinet went to the same Public School; non-commital policy and the long term damage done by Thatchers children, who'se banking division ironically put this administration in the shit in which it finds itself. So yes, there's much to hate about Thatcher, but it also makes you go a bit misty eyed when you remember a time when Politicians actually had beliefs that were enthrenched, rather than cast away at the whim of an incresingly disillusioned electorate. And Redstriper, the best Prmine Minister post-war was Clement Atlee mate. Glad to help you out there |
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Post by hoekofneverland on Oct 12, 2009 11:41:07 GMT
The best PM is always going to be a personal choice and thank god there is a choice.
So personally speaking, I have never lived under a better leader than Maggie. :-)
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Post by Northy on Oct 12, 2009 11:44:57 GMT
She will go down in history as the most hated and despised Prime Minister in historyvoted in at 3 elections though Mumf You are forgetting Scargills role in the miners strike, pictured on his sit on lawn mower whilst his "comrades" as you say, were living from soup kitchens
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Post by salopstick on Oct 12, 2009 12:03:02 GMT
She will go down in history as the most hated and despised Prime Minister in historyvoted in at 3 elections though Mumf You are forgetting Scargills role in the miners strike, pictured on his sit on lawn mower whilst his "comrades" as you say, were living from soup kitchens ignore mumf, i sense a pattern here: he jumps randomly in a thread derides others opinions offers somthing stupid or without reason fucks off repeat to fade |
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Post by mumf14 on Oct 12, 2009 12:07:24 GMT
She will go down in history as the most hated and despised Prime Minister in historyvoted in at 3 elections though Mumf You are forgetting Scargills role in the miners strike, pictured on his sit on lawn mower whilst his "comrades" as you say, were living from soup kitchens Arthur Scargill was a paid union official. He was also famously pictured getting arrested for the cause.I also witnessed many decent hard working Stoke lads arrested for their fight to keep there jobs and mines open. Scargill will forever hold more respect than Thatcher will ....without a doubt. |
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Post by mumf14 on Oct 12, 2009 12:09:45 GMT
She will go down in history as the most hated and despised Prime Minister in historyvoted in at 3 elections though Mumf You are forgetting Scargills role in the miners strike, pictured on his sit on lawn mower whilst his "comrades" as you say, were living from soup kitchens ignore mumf, i sense a pattern here: he jumps randomly in a thread derides others opinions offers somthing stupid or without reason fucks off repeat to fade I refer you to my previous reply.  |
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Post by mumf14 on Oct 12, 2009 12:10:56 GMT
She will go down in history as the most hated and despised Prime Minister in historyvoted in at 3 elections though Mumf You are forgetting Scargills role in the miners strike, pictured on his sit on lawn mower whilst his "comrades" as you say, were living from soup kitchens ignore mumf, i sense a pattern here: he jumps randomly in a thread derides others opinions offers somthing stupid or without reason fucks off repeat to fade I REFER YOU TO MY PREVIOUS REPLY. |
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...and that's precisely what the Good Friday Agreement did...'Political Prisoners' were released from The Maze Prison...and sat down in Stormont together to help run Northern Ireland...IRA/SDLP and UVF/DUP.....
