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Post by Olgrligm on Feb 16, 2009 22:39:06 GMT
Playing Devil's Advocate here, aren't you being a touch hypocritical? In what sense? Innocent people have been caught up in violence, therefore we should destroy them. As for the 'And regardless of that, even if the other people were happy to 'fight', what kind of people take pleasure in fighting?', isn't that a bit 'thought police'-ish?
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Post by hanibal7 on Feb 17, 2009 5:44:42 GMT
I heard from a Blackpool bar owner that Jasper is a doorman at a club in Bispham.Didnt think he was doing that stuff now.
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Post by PONTAFCE on Feb 17, 2009 8:27:13 GMT
They should be in jail, not out pretending to be good citizens. COCK
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Post by Will_75 on Feb 17, 2009 10:21:00 GMT
well done pointy, i see what you did there. nice avatar, by the way
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Post by PONTAFCE on Feb 17, 2009 10:24:44 GMT
well done pointy, i see what you did there. nice avatar, by the way Cheers fella wind up merchants ay ;D
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Post by Will_75 on Feb 17, 2009 10:26:38 GMT
*slaps forehead*
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Post by boscfc on Feb 17, 2009 10:35:05 GMT
;D
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Post by roro on Feb 17, 2009 10:55:18 GMT
And regardless of that, even if the other people were happy to 'fight', what kind of people take pleasure in fighting? [/quote] Boxing?
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Post by exiledstokie on Feb 17, 2009 11:06:53 GMT
anybody know which bar he's the doorman on? Me and a few mates are heading up that way for a stag night and i'd love to meet the guy
(purely because his book was such a good read, i am in no was condoning the actions but like someone mentioned, if two groups want to knock each other about then let them do it, rather that than innocent joe pubilc getting targetted)
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Post by jimmygscfc on Feb 17, 2009 11:56:54 GMT
The first rule of Fight Club is that we don't talk about it! Let's move on lads. The two views being expressed here aren't likely to become one anytime soon.
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Post by Gods on Feb 17, 2009 12:32:37 GMT
I just wonder if it would serve the opposite purpose for which it is intended.
There is something heroic to many about these old 'gunslingers' from the N40 and that comes not from their present day pipe and slippers lifestyle rather from their more illustrative past.
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Post by apb1 on Feb 17, 2009 13:14:10 GMT
Football hooligans always say they only ever fought: 1) against other hooligans 2) to protect innocent people from being hurt What a load of shit. I'm sure there were some individuals who had some kind of bizarre code of honour as per above, but most people who have been caught up in crowd violence will tell you that it's punch first and ask questions never. Many many innocent people have been beaten up for wearing a scarf (asking for it obviously) or having the wrong accent. Or if they lived in any country when England were playing there they were just fair game for the noble hooligans on account of being foreign. Regarding this project, I think it's a good idea. If a previous reputation makes kids more likely to listen to and respect these guys' message, then great. Maybe there'll be less violence as a result.
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Post by myleftboot on Feb 17, 2009 13:39:08 GMT
I say good on them myself like a lot on here.
Lets face it saying they should be put in jail for the episodes in the 80's is complete tosh because applying logic like that then half the old Boothen End and Paddock should have been locked up.
Anyone who attended during that era could have easily got "involved" and a good many did also outside the N40 so is there such hatred reserved for Jasper and the like when I am sure some people on here are overlooking their own antics if they were going to Stoke during the 80's themselves.
I aren't saying it is right or wrong but to me it just feels like some daft moral hatred campaign for stuff that happened years ago. Let it rest for god sake. Half the kids causing mither these days have nothing to even do with the N40 and Jasper and to say that have barely even met the guy if at all.
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Post by stokiegav on Feb 17, 2009 14:31:45 GMT
am in two minds about this - on first glance it smacks of middle class desperation - oh we cant reach the "kids" so lets get someone whose from the "streets". Almost like the lunatics running the asylum and hope there is careful monitoring of the scheme -has MC renounced violence etc? on the other hand if he is genuine it will almost certainly be a massive success - there are not many that command the level of respect he has in the city (sadly) and the level of experience he has is probably invaluable in showing kids the right path - id certainly like to be a fly on the wall at his meetings (having previously worked in the area) without a shadow of a doubt schemes like this change lives and all involved work hard but theres a lot of money to be made in this area - its def a business for some people
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Post by myleftboot on Feb 17, 2009 14:52:35 GMT
MC has made inroads to document the culture and how wrong it is with seminars organised by previous old hooligans themselves as well as previous community projects. This is another step to them putting something back in my opinion. Hardly like they will be recruiting isn't it. With kids out of control maybe they will be able to reach some of them. Lets face it most other things have failed in the community.
Infact if you look at a lot of it you will find that most connections between a lot of the N40 and Stoke violence was cut years ago. It is a common misconception they are pushing the flags around the map at the moment.
Like I say if you can look into your hearts and say you yourselves have never been in trouble with stoke then only you have the right to express a hatred of these people. The rest are just hangers on to something a moral few have picked up.
It is over, leave them be and lets move on. If they can do good in the community then who benifits. I will tell you US.
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Post by Parkerson on Feb 17, 2009 14:55:57 GMT
It isn't in Bispham, there isn't any clubs in Bispham......i should know as i live there
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Post by exiledstokie on Feb 17, 2009 16:31:20 GMT
someone surely knows which club it is, any clues Parkerson??
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Post by Parkerson on Feb 17, 2009 16:36:34 GMT
Of course i know. Dnt think he'd be too happy advertising where he worked though, infact he probably knows already and im in the shit ;D
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Post by myleftboot on Feb 17, 2009 16:56:54 GMT
Parkerson <waves finger>
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Post by stokiegav on Feb 17, 2009 17:21:41 GMT
MC has made inroads to document the culture and how wrong it is with seminars organised by previous old hooligans themselves as well as previous community projects. This is another step to them putting something back in my opinion. Hardly like they will be recruiting isn't it. With kids out of control maybe they will be able to reach some of them. Lets face it most other things have failed in the community. Infact if you look at a lot of it you will find that most connections between a lot of the N40 and Stoke violence was cut years ago. It is a common misconception they are pushing the flags around the map at the moment. Like I say if you can look into your hearts and say you yourselves have never been in trouble with stoke then only you have the right to express a hatred of these people. The rest are just hangers on to something a moral few have picked up. It is over, leave them be and lets move on. If they can do good in the community then who benifits. I will tell you US. i agree with all that - tho the fact he clearly still commands complete respect of old and new down stoke may suggest his involvement isnt truly THAT far in the distance proof will be in the pudding tho and if he is genuine then hell do an awful lot of good....
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Post by guernseydave on Feb 17, 2009 17:39:38 GMT
Cor I just love the logic on this thread.
So lets take it a step further or sideways depending on your point of view.
Once a smoker always a smoker. Given up ? Tough shit. You'll still probably get nasty diseases but because you once smoked its still your fault and you'll get not medical help from us. Just DIE
Alcohol problem ? Carry on drinking. You're a twat anyway and a drain on resources. Hurry up and get liver disease. Its all you deserve anyway
Drug Addict ? 10 years clean ? Fuck you sunshine. Up against the wall. People like you shouldn't deserve to live. You AIDS ridden scum.
Rehabilitation of offenders. Sod that for a lark. Up against the wall. Costs a lot less, saves money on do gooding jobs and purifies the gene pool.
Come to think of it the only decent person around here is me. I'll just carry on smug in the knowledge of my superiority and purity.
GD
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Post by myleftboot on Feb 17, 2009 17:47:21 GMT
MC has made inroads to document the culture and how wrong it is with seminars organised by previous old hooligans themselves as well as previous community projects. This is another step to them putting something back in my opinion. Hardly like they will be recruiting isn't it. With kids out of control maybe they will be able to reach some of them. Lets face it most other things have failed in the community. Infact if you look at a lot of it you will find that most connections between a lot of the N40 and Stoke violence was cut years ago. It is a common misconception they are pushing the flags around the map at the moment. Like I say if you can look into your hearts and say you yourselves have never been in trouble with stoke then only you have the right to express a hatred of these people. The rest are just hangers on to something a moral few have picked up. It is over, leave them be and lets move on. If they can do good in the community then who benifits. I will tell you US. i agree with all that - tho the fact he clearly still commands complete respect of old and new down stoke may suggest his involvement isnt truly THAT far in the distance proof will be in the pudding tho and if he is genuine then hell do an awful lot of good.... The fact the guy commands a lot of respect if brilliant for these kids whether wrong or right. These kids need a helping hand in life some of them and who is best to sort the problem out. Someone who has been there. Sorry but it is time Stoke fans woke up and saw the bigger picture in my opinion. I aren't saying what happened is wrong or right again but it is the way the fuiture is put across that matters.
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Post by Del Boy on Feb 17, 2009 18:05:13 GMT
FFS the guy cant do right for doing wrong.
He is helping young kids and stoping them going the wrong way in life, being helped by a model profesional boxer. Full stop.
Can somebody please explain what these 2 are doing wrong?
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jonnyd
Youth Player
Posts: 377
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Post by jonnyd on Feb 17, 2009 18:11:11 GMT
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Post by McLovin on Feb 17, 2009 18:17:04 GMT
Hopefully this works. Reading the paper yesterday, the front page story was about a bloke who was beaten up in the street where I spent my youngest days and some teens. None of those cunts about when I used to live there. I went "out to play" as the saying goes everyday. No trouble off no one ever. How times have changed. Bet you think i'm about 40, i'm fucking 21!!!!
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Post by myleftboot on Feb 17, 2009 21:12:39 GMT
Hopefully this works. Reading the paper yesterday, the front page story was about a bloke who was beaten up in the street where I spent my youngest days and some teens. None of those ***** about when I used to live there. I went "out to play" as the saying goes everyday. No trouble off no one ever. How times have changed. Bet you think i'm about 40, i'm fucking 21!!!! Talking to my next door neighbour about that yesterday afternoon in the pub. We both know him. Like I say anything to sort the problems this area has out is the best.
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Post by OldStokie on Feb 17, 2009 22:29:09 GMT
I don't usually get involved in these threads but if these former naughty people are now putting something back into society, what's the problem? For Christ's sake, these guys are not Mad Frankie Frazers we're talking about! Just let them be and if they keep just one kid on the rails then they will have done a good job.
OS.
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Post by meirsquare on Feb 17, 2009 22:31:53 GMT
I was lucky enough to be present at the workshop that was delivered at the Attendance Centre in Hanley on Saturday . The presentation left little or no doubt that Mark and the lads can reach young people who the authorities cannot.
It is these so called "hard to reach" young people who are in most danger of losing their futures..... I witnessed these young people actively and positively engaging with the lads who delivered a professional session.
Whats more I know for a fact that an offer of payment for this session was refused by those who delivered it..... go figure eh ?
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Post by hanibal7 on Feb 18, 2009 1:32:21 GMT
I didnt think Bispham had a night club,but thats what i was told by a Blackpool bar owner.Laws of average says its a Blackpool night club.
The people that knew Kenny Franklin know that he did a lot of good after packing up his wild hooligan life and went on to teach boxing at Northwood stadium. R.I.P Kenny
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Post by millermay1968 on Feb 18, 2009 1:44:05 GMT
Are you all gay?thats when football as fun ;D
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