olias
Academy Starlet
Posts: 190
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Post by olias on Oct 1, 2023 13:23:34 GMT
They'll be asking groundsmen to be mowing the grass a certain way to help out with VAR decisions. Or, shudder, have markings on the side, the way they do on American handegg pitches.
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Post by cheadlepotter on Oct 1, 2023 13:25:05 GMT
I’m glad we don’t have to put up with VAR at Stoke. Whilst there will be times where we need it, there will be times where we’re grateful it’s not there. It ruins the sport when you can’t celebrate a goal until you’ve waited an age for the plebs in an office to make a decision.
The biggest problem is the Premier League and the FA’s refusal to accept that the standards of officiating are at an all time low. All this respect the ref stuff is useless when they don’t earn it and can’t command it because of their constant mistakes. I’m not talking misjudging a foul or a dive, giving a throw in the wrong way, though this happens far too often, I’m talking the inconsistency in their approaches and the laziness of their implementation of the laws of the game. And it seems this problem has moved into the VAR room.
And quite how with the technology available these days they can’t get an offside decision correct I don’t know.
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Post by spitthedog on Oct 1, 2023 13:28:37 GMT
Awful balls up yesterday but it’s down to window-licking, keyboard face-rolling human incompetence. I am still a huge fan of the tech. It’s win for better decisions overall. We are in the 21st century and need to get with the times. Don’t blame the tech for human idiocy. VAR stands for Video Assistant Referee That is , a person assisted by technology Nobody is blaming the technology, but when you have people in charge of technology who don’t understand it nor how to use it, which is clearly the case, it is a problem, just like you would like someone who understood the technology looking after your nuclear facilities. In the future people will be splitting their sides at how this is being used. So many aspects of it are incompetent. It’s also clearly lowering the standard of refereeing.
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Post by y_oh_y_delilah on Oct 1, 2023 15:05:12 GMT
Referees getting decisions wrong has always been part of football and gives fans something to discuss and argue about in the pub after the match. Now everything is sanitised and all the fun is being sucked out of the game. Premier League fans can’t now even celebrate a goal until minutes later, it’s all so wrong. Only time I wished VAR was in existence was FA cup semi final v Arsenal at Goodison. Older fans will know what I mean. Agreed but the trouble is that so much money can be won/lost on wrong decisions and VAR should have reduced them. The VAR is a referee and whether knowingly or not it is obvious that most referees are biased. Stoke are an example of non VAR bias - a lot of the bookings dished out to Stoke players are because of our reputation under Pulis and from the high publicity given to Ramsey's leg break. Unfortunately that carries over to the VAR official. Yesterday it seems that they were too lazy to do their job properly and didn't give the ref all the information that was available, not even showing the lines apparently, just a replay. Do VAR officials who make these obvious mistakes get any punishment or do they just remain hidden in their little room where no one can see what they are doing. I understand the two (allegedly) corrupt officials have been suspended from their next Premier League fixtures. If we do really have to have VAR (which I hate with a passion) then it’s up to the Premier League to make sure it isn’t operated by incompetent morons. It really isn’t rocket science and in fact should be operated by technicians, rather than people who have merely passed refereeing courses. It’s not open to interpretation so people who understand the technology and know how to use it should be feeding the on-file referee the correct information.
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Post by mrcoke on Oct 1, 2023 15:07:57 GMT
VAR has been a huge annoyance to me in both Prem league football and international rugby union.
It has destroyed the momentum of the game.
It has undermined referees decision making.
It has undermined referees authority with the players in football.
Both the above damage a referees self confidence and sows dought in his mind.
It is fraught with errors by the VAR officials - many decisions at the end of the day are a matter of opinion.
Referees are now afraid of making a decision in case AR proves them wrong and opt out leaving it to someone not in the field of play and examining what happened in slow motion which can appear quite different to real time.
It is supposed to correct a significant error by the ref, but is being used to examine the minutiae of an incident at extreme length, and even then is down to opinion as often expressed by the pundits differing with each other.
Unfortunately I think we are saddled with it and no one is brave enough to ditch it.
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Post by nottsover60 on Oct 1, 2023 15:17:29 GMT
Agreed but the trouble is that so much money can be won/lost on wrong decisions and VAR should have reduced them. The VAR is a referee and whether knowingly or not it is obvious that most referees are biased. Stoke are an example of non VAR bias - a lot of the bookings dished out to Stoke players are because of our reputation under Pulis and from the high publicity given to Ramsey's leg break. Unfortunately that carries over to the VAR official. Yesterday it seems that they were too lazy to do their job properly and didn't give the ref all the information that was available, not even showing the lines apparently, just a replay. Do VAR officials who make these obvious mistakes get any punishment or do they just remain hidden in their little room where no one can see what they are doing. I understand the two (allegedly) corrupt officials have been suspended from their next Premier League fixtures. If we do really have to have VAR (which I hate with a passion) then it’s up to the Premier League to make sure it isn’t operated by incompetent morons. It really isn’t rocket science and in fact should be operated by technicians, rather than people who have merely passed refereeing courses. It’s not open to interpretation so people who understand the technology and know how to use it should be feeding the on-file referee the correct information. I agree totally. It should be operated by technicians rather than referees. Using the VAR technology shouldn't need someone who understands football to look at it. Technicians can decide if a player is offside, if a hand touches the ball, if contact is made with a player, if studs are up. If it comes down to a decision that requires some understanding of the rules then the VAR can tell the on field ref to look at the replay from different angles and decide. I thought the idea of VAR was to reduce the amount of influence the possible personal bias of officials has on decisions.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Oct 1, 2023 15:42:24 GMT
Players make mistakes. Officials make mistakes - it's all part of the game. All that's happened with VAR is that it's created a whole new layer of people who will make mistakes. But this time they put the game on hold while they make them. Just get rid. It was a stupid idea in the first place and its just put making stupid mistakes on a whole new level of stupidity.
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Post by matelot1996 on Oct 1, 2023 18:36:07 GMT
When the injustice affects clubs outside the Top 6 or so it is ignored soon after MOD. Their is no right of reply for the smaller clubs. No Justice. When it happens to Liverpool it’s supposedly cataclysmic and a potential end to to footballing governance as we know it. The massive media overreaction is the most embarrassing thing for me. Fuck the Scouse twa@s. Deserve everything they get.
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Post by leicspotter on Oct 1, 2023 18:41:05 GMT
But possibly the worst decision in that match was the first yellow which then led to Liverpool’s second red. The Spurs player tripped himself up. And that didn’t involve VAR. The problem, as I’ve said many times before, is the system that football has chosen to use which has ignored the lessons leaned by other sports which introduced video officials long before. There will always be some decisions which come down to opinion but VAR should eliminate the vast majority of mistakes. The fact that it doesn’t shows that the way it’s being used is wrong. Spot on. Other sports use technology far better that football does
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Post by thornestein on Oct 1, 2023 18:42:25 GMT
But possibly the worst decision in that match was the first yellow which then led to Liverpool’s second red. The Spurs player tripped himself up. And that didn’t involve VAR. The problem, as I’ve said many times before, is the system that football has chosen to use which has ignored the lessons leaned by other sports which introduced video officials long before. There will always be some decisions which come down to opinion but VAR should eliminate the vast majority of mistakes. The fact that it doesn’t shows that the way it’s being used is wrong. Spot on. Other sports use technology far better that football does are yellow cards ever over ruled by Var ??
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Post by leicspotter on Oct 1, 2023 18:45:54 GMT
Spot on. Other sports use technology far better that football does are yellow cards ever over ruled by Var ?? No idea other than when they go to red, but so many decisions made by var give rise to debate which suggests it is mossing it's original 'clear and obvious' brief...even when var intervene they still seem to get it wrong too often
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Post by thornestein on Oct 1, 2023 18:51:08 GMT
are yellow cards ever over ruled by Var ?? No idea other than when they go to red, but so many decisions made by var give rise to debate which suggests it is mossing it's original 'clear and obvious' brief...even when var intervene they still seem to get it wrong too often i’d get rid , it’s caused more problems than it’s solved
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Post by scarlet on Oct 1, 2023 19:11:20 GMT
The BBC are reporting that both VAR officials and the fourth official Michael Oliver were all part of a match officiating team in charge of a league game in the UAE two days before the Spurs v Liverpool game. Could fatigue have played a part 🤔
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Post by metalhead on Oct 1, 2023 19:53:13 GMT
Liverpool have repeatedly done well from VAR. They basically won the league after a very generous VAR laden season.
What a shame that they've been robbed.
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Post by swampySCFC on Oct 1, 2023 21:13:12 GMT
Fuck it off, goal line technology is all that's needed! 👌
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Post by spitthedog on Oct 1, 2023 22:17:41 GMT
The more they fuck around with the rules and involve VAR the worse the game is getting.
Nobody understands handball anymore, offside is a lottery and players are getting sent off for making contact because it looks bad when you freeze frame.
Notts Forest game was another farce today.
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Post by BuzzB on Oct 1, 2023 22:29:44 GMT
Liverpool have repeatedly done well from VAR. They basically won the league after a very generous VAR laden season. What a shame that they've been robbed. saw a quip on Twitter today.... Liverpool now know what its like to play Liverpool under VAR
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Post by scfcnicholas on Oct 2, 2023 2:11:25 GMT
While there’s been an even bigger and seemingly vast amount of fuck ups this season, the bottom line is it has drastically increased decision accuracy over all by a huge %. Which is failed to mention too often, as positive news doesn’t to sell or spread as much. And people will just fucking moan regardless particularly managers.
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Post by matelot1996 on Oct 2, 2023 5:10:54 GMT
When you have overly authoritarian sports governance it will cease to be a fun sport to watch. VAR is and always was going to be about “We’re in charge” mentality. Never about getting decisions right. Although I do love it when bad decisions affect top teams and suddenly it’s a major problem.
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Post by J-Roar on Oct 2, 2023 6:08:51 GMT
When you have overly authoritarian sports governance it will cease to be a fun sport to watch. VAR is and always was going to be about “We’re in charge” mentality. Never about getting decisions right. Although I do love it when bad decisions affect top teams and suddenly it’s a major problem. Agree. If the decision had been made against Bournemouth the pundits would have had a laugh about it and moved on.
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Post by svengaliinplatforms on Oct 2, 2023 6:36:28 GMT
Just seen the Wissa one.
Imagine getting a 2nd, 3rd, 4th look at these decisions & as a professional, getting them wrong.
You only had one job, etc.
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Oct 2, 2023 6:52:16 GMT
Wonder who is in ultimate charge of referees in the premier league as surely they will do the decent thing and fall on their sword .
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Oct 2, 2023 7:51:45 GMT
I’m glad we don’t have to put up with VAR at Stoke. Whilst there will be times where we need it, there will be times where we’re grateful it’s not there. It ruins the sport when you can’t celebrate a goal until you’ve waited an age for the plebs in an office to make a decision. The biggest problem is the Premier League and the FA’s refusal to accept that the standards of officiating are at an all time low. All this respect the ref stuff is useless when they don’t earn it and can’t command it because of their constant mistakes. I’m not talking misjudging a foul or a dive, giving a throw in the wrong way, though this happens far too often, I’m talking the inconsistency in their approaches and the laziness of their implementation of the laws of the game. And it seems this problem has moved into the VAR room. And quite how with the technology available these days they can’t get an offside decision correct I don’t know. It's the disruption to the flow of the game I can't stand - I'd far rather live with the occasional cock up than wait for the gods in the studio to decide whether we've scored it not. And you are spot on about officiating standards - the officials on the pitch have been deskilled and it's showing more and more.
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Post by Malex on Oct 2, 2023 10:46:48 GMT
Liverpool FC statement"Liverpool Football Club acknowledges PGMOL’s admission of their failures last night. It is clear that the correct application of the laws of the game did not occur, resulting in sporting integrity being undermined.
We fully accept the pressures that match officials work under but these pressures are supposed to be alleviated, not exacerbated, by the existence and implementation of VAR.
It is therefore unsatisfactory that sufficient time was not afforded to allow the correct decision to be made and that there was no subsequent intervention.
That such failings have already been categorised as “significant human error” is also unacceptable. Any and all outcomes should be established only by the review and with full transparency.
This is vital for the reliability of future decision-making as it applies to all clubs with learnings being used to make improvements to processes in order to ensure this kind of situation cannot occur again.
In the meantime, we will explore the range of options available, given the clear need for escalation and resolution."
Wonder what their options are for that last line?
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Post by Goonie on Oct 2, 2023 11:00:48 GMT
What about linos either side or behind the goal?
Or goaline type technology in players boots re offsides
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Post by superjw on Oct 2, 2023 11:27:30 GMT
The clubs should come together and agree to get it binned off in its current form, leave goal line tech in and allow a period of review and reflection about VAR in its current state.
When the technology and governance around it comes into disrepute, it’s time to pause.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Oct 2, 2023 11:29:24 GMT
Liverpool FC statement"Liverpool Football Club acknowledges PGMOL’s admission of their failures last night. It is clear that the correct application of the laws of the game did not occur, resulting in sporting integrity being undermined.
We fully accept the pressures that match officials work under but these pressures are supposed to be alleviated, not exacerbated, by the existence and implementation of VAR.
It is therefore unsatisfactory that sufficient time was not afforded to allow the correct decision to be made and that there was no subsequent intervention.
That such failings have already been categorised as “significant human error” is also unacceptable. Any and all outcomes should be established only by the review and with full transparency.
This is vital for the reliability of future decision-making as it applies to all clubs with learnings being used to make improvements to processes in order to ensure this kind of situation cannot occur again.
In the meantime, we will explore the range of options available, given the clear need for escalation and resolution."
Wonder what their options are for that last line? There are none. It's a fucking daft thing to say.
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Post by mallorcanstokie on Oct 2, 2023 11:35:09 GMT
VAR is supposed to clear up ‘obvious’ referees errors, let them draw one ‘accurate’ line, if you can’t obviously see an offside, call it level, and give the attacking side the benefit of the doubt (level used to be onside…..) sounds easy 😳
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Post by J-Roar on Oct 2, 2023 14:44:10 GMT
What about linos either side or behind the goal? Or goaline type technology in players boots re offsides There is automatic offside technology used in Champions League which PL clubs rejected. No special boots required
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Post by Los Alfareros on Oct 2, 2023 15:09:54 GMT
Fucking Liverpool will be milking this one for years, remember folks, no other football club has EVER had a bad decision go against them in the history of football, EVER.
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