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Post by roylandstoke on Sept 24, 2023 17:13:58 GMT
Was going to post my own summary of the managers performance today, but the OP has got it spot on.
Nothing more to say.
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Post by satoshi on Sept 24, 2023 17:17:16 GMT
What? The Hamilton Academicals GK coach? Well, he might not be any worse... No the guy who manages club phoenix
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Post by nottsover60 on Sept 24, 2023 17:17:33 GMT
As I know live a nine hour round trip away, I at least only have to go to the tv or pc to watch the games! On the subject of Rosenior, very telling in his interview on SS when he said ‘we have a system, the players like the system and we are all comfortable with it’. So ostensibly, this rookie manager challenges teams to play against their system whilst ours empties the midfield and wings, making the same errors virtually every game. The amount of space down our flanks is incredible and every team that plays us with that system know the WBs are out of their natural position and not tracking back. And as has been added a number of times, sign wingers, sell our only WB and the play a WB system. Almost like Neil is an agent of the fail! Got to be gone soon, he looked bereft of any idea during the match and in his post match interview. In my opinion the best way to get a squad to play well together is to have a system and coach them in that system until they are all comfortable playing it. This must be especially true when the squad don't all speak the same language. Today there seemed to be so many players telling each other what they should be doing. That shouldn't be necessary, if should have been done on the training pitch. If we worry about how, we play rather than how the opposition play then football is a lot simpler. Instead we seem to try to match up with the opposition changing our formation for every match. We don't have enough training days with two matches a week to design a system to play the next opposition. By all means highlight the opposition's strengths and weaknesses but keep our formation the same. No wonder the players look confused. We've tried three, four or five at the back, one or two defensive midfielders, two up front, a lone striker with two men wide, wingers, wing backs. I didn't have a clue what Burger's role was today as he seemed to be playing further forward alongside Laurent but that isn't his game. I'd rather play square pegs in round holes in a system every body knows rather than all this chopping and changing of tactics and formations.
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Post by jeycov on Sept 24, 2023 17:19:14 GMT
Like other recent managers at Stoke, he’s been reasonably successful in this division elsewhere What is the difference? Major change of personnel in the last 6 months, accepted but they should be working more effectively by now Are they still playing for a place in the starting 11. - if so that’s not working I’m sure he was hoping to buy a centre back with some organisational skills, and is hoping his forwards will convert more chances He needs to keep the squad and fans onside and hope that we can upgrade our defence in January However, who would want to come here atm ?
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Post by iglugluk on Sept 24, 2023 17:21:55 GMT
5 of the usual starting 11 missing then two more key players injured within the first 30 mins. However, let’s over react. It’s more fun!! Are you the same March4 who commented at the bottom of the Sentinal ' Sky Sports Pundits Savage Stoke City..' article?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2023 17:22:41 GMT
TP and Shawcross in by Xmas. Only joking. The sad part is in the unlikely event of AN getting the chop, who would be next on the rank. Wilder? There’s an infinitely long list of things I’d rather see than Chris Wilder manage Stoke. Kylie Minogues glistening clout lowering itself onto my face is top of my list. Susan Boyles fly ridden minge in my gaze is just above Chris Wilder as Stoke manager on my list.
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Post by s7oke on Sept 24, 2023 17:32:41 GMT
Says we have played well in previous games Huddersfield apart we have been wank and undone away from home only improving when he had made wholesale changes in the second half of games Too much messing about with different systems Choose one and fucking stick to it It looks grim at the moment and I can’t see an improvement our defence and midfield is reminiscent of Moses parting the Red Sea Everyone can see we need an old or calming head at the back to organise things and a captain that is fit to be a captain It’s no good just chucking players on all over the place in different positions Sort this fucking shambles out Stoke it’s embarrassing as we still have league one standard players trying to do it at a level that is obviously above their skill level
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Post by collo68 on Sept 24, 2023 17:35:34 GMT
He's got one more game for me. Bin this 5-3-2/3-5-2 shit forever, set up 4-2-3-1 with Wes leading the line and three quick and skillful fuckers as the 3, Burger and Pearson as the two holders in midfield (drop Laurent, please...) drop one of the crap centre-backs and play a proper full-back (even a right-footed one) as LB. Do that and we'll pick up a decent amount of points. This isn't like last season when the squad was lacking in quality and options were limited: this is a fairly talented bunch who should be doing much better than they are. Spot on and then stick to it
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Post by rivival on Sept 24, 2023 17:53:38 GMT
Why oh why on why must we be so so so shit all the time?? Does this happen to everyone? Is it just the norm?? We are shit season after season and I’m absolutely sick of it. If you bang your head against a wall you get used to it after a while, at 62 I've been banging my head after most Stoke games. You live in Stoke a small City with a very small ambition. When we do have a good team the years of shit make it all the sweeter though. People talk about great Stoke teams like they talk about bad winters rare events that live long in the memory.
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Post by Gunslinger on Sept 24, 2023 17:55:25 GMT
Alex Neil games managed (career) - 459 Liam Rosenior games managed - 49 Which manager has got his side tactically solid; hard to break down; defensively strong; well organised; and looking like they know what they're supposed to be doing? Experience counts for nothing, it would seem. Liam Rosenior
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Post by mozzer on Sept 24, 2023 18:06:18 GMT
Totally agree but please please will people stop suggesting the capped one, my day is bad enough without him been mentioned Totally agree. It's been unicorns and rainbows since he left. What were we thinking
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Post by questionable on Sept 24, 2023 18:18:15 GMT
Without a doubt he needs to go as soon as possible, honestly I’ve never come across a manager who’s completely clueless towards the game.
Honestly I haven’t got a clue what he’s trying to implement other than we’re spineless, predictable and utterly pathetic thanks to him and him alone.
If he’s not sacked soon I can see us being relegated, it’s that bad.
Neil out
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Post by danceswithclams on Sept 24, 2023 18:19:22 GMT
I preferred it when we pressed teams high up. Hull defence and keeper were all over the place early on het me didn't really press them, just let them have it and they were still giving it away. If we'd pressed them I'm sure we'd have had early joy. It also, especially at home, gets the crowd up with the tempo. I preferred it when we weren't absolutely fucking shit all the fucking time. (It seems long, long ago now)
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 24, 2023 18:21:00 GMT
I preferred it when we pressed teams high up. Hull defence and keeper were all over the place early on het me didn't really press them, just let them have it and they were still giving it away. If we'd pressed them I'm sure we'd have had early joy. It also, especially at home, gets the crowd up with the tempo. I preferred it when we weren't absolutely fucking shit all the fucking time. (It seems long, long ago now) We have to be the most turgid side in the country right now, I can’t believe anyone else is worse to watch
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Post by Olgrligm on Sept 24, 2023 18:21:13 GMT
Why do people have such a downer on Chris Wilder? His teams have always looked impressive against us. He did poorly at Watford, like everybody else, and I thought his Middlesbrough team were in a false position.
Moot point. I think it's Neil for the foreseeable.
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Post by questionable on Sept 24, 2023 18:24:30 GMT
Prior arrangements but what was the crowds reaction today??
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Post by boskampsflaps on Sept 24, 2023 19:12:22 GMT
Playing gooch ahead of Hoever as attacking full back Playing Jordan Thompson Playing two men up front, both wingers. Playing our biggest slowest defender as a wide centre back being pulled out and exposed constantly None of it makes sense. Gooch has looked the better of the two and I can fully understand why Campbell has been played up front, he helps stretch the play and create space which Wesley can't, it worked well against Huddersfield.
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Post by shakermaker on Sept 24, 2023 21:11:27 GMT
I’ve tried to implore that we need to give him time, but when you see performances like that, there’s only so much of a defence you can put up. In what realm that side became a possibility fuck only knows. We’ve lost Stevens and decided that we now need to play the most lopsided, fragile formation possible. There is no way this side was one we thought we’d see when these players were signed, yet somehow it’s manage to find itself fielded twice more than it should have been. Fuck me Alex, do yourself a favour. You’ve managed Daniel Johnson for years in a central midfield role at Preston and then somehow decided that, for Stoke, he’s some versatile utility man who can now play at wing back, when you’ve signed actual wing backs and sold probably the best one we had in Tymon. I’m edging towards believing he hasn’t got a fucking clue. Lots of decent enough players but no idea what to do with them. I didn't bother predicting a team sheet on the match thread in the days leading up to the game, because I knew it was as clear as day Neil would select the same team that played against Huddersfield. He and some others on here got hoodwinked by the performance against a gash team who we could still only manage a draw against. Hull are far and away a better side than 'Udders, and this afternoon was the sorry result. If he was so desperate to play wing backs, why couldn't he at least start Hoever and put Gooch as LWB? DJ was completely exposed as WB against a superior, well-drilled team. Even Haks would surely have been a better option there! Neil is a rabbit in headlights with these new players and doesn't know what to do with them.
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 24, 2023 21:15:27 GMT
There’s an infinitely long list of things I’d rather see than Chris Wilder manage Stoke. Kylie Minogues glistening clout lowering itself onto my face is top of my list. Susan Boyles fly ridden minge in my gaze is just above Chris Wilder as Stoke manager on my list. Thanks for that. I've not laughed all fucking day, but now I have. Thank you most kindly 🙏
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Post by kidcrewbob on Sept 24, 2023 21:22:47 GMT
Prior arrangements but what was the crowds reaction today?? Fuckin booooooooo
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 24, 2023 21:25:01 GMT
Prior arrangements but what was the crowds reaction today?? Boos, not enough in my opinion. The fan base has become apathetic to the current situation
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Post by peterthornesboots on Sept 24, 2023 21:25:12 GMT
He needs to decide on his best 11 players, get them into a workable system, and then stick with them for the next 3/4 league games with minimal rotation (where possible).
Travers
Hoever Rose Wilmot Gooch
Pearson Burger Jun-Ho/Johnson
Vidigal Haksobanovic Wesley
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Post by kustokie on Sept 25, 2023 2:42:20 GMT
Gooch was our best player, with a steady 7 I can't remember one single attempt at a cross all game. I remember watching second half when he plenty of chances to cross it and he kept trying take his man on and run it into the boothen. Plenty of effort though and certainly not the worst of the bunch There were enough crosses but all terrible except one that Wesley fluffed.
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Post by kustokie on Sept 25, 2023 2:42:35 GMT
Gooch was our best player, with a steady 7 I can't remember one single attempt at a cross all game. I remember watching second half when he plenty of chances to cross it and he kept trying take his man on and run it into the boothen. Plenty of effort though and certainly not the worst of the bunch There were enough crosses but all terrible except one that Wesley fluffed.
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Post by kustokie on Sept 25, 2023 2:43:02 GMT
Gooch was our best player, with a steady 7 I can't remember one single attempt at a cross all game. I remember watching second half when he plenty of chances to cross it and he kept trying take his man on and run it into the boothen. Plenty of effort though and certainly not the worst of the bunch There were enough crosses but all terrible except one that Wesley fluffed.
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Post by kaney78 on Sept 25, 2023 3:28:24 GMT
No, can't agree, his c.v says different. Needing a whole new squad does look like a sizeable challenge though that he's just not conquering at the moment. As much as I want to support him I like to be honest aswell and this formation for this team and that formation for that team is proving to be absolute crap and adding to the challenge of settling 18 new players. Stick to the f'ng formation you've had success with in previous jobs Alex, stop trying to be a smart arsed ffs, 4231, 433 all the way. With Haksabanovic & Vidigal fit enough to play now hopefully this will be the case with one on either side and Junho Centre in a 4231 because Wesley needs energy around him he’s a deadman walking , the fans have started turn , no one survives that , his record here is awful , he will be gone before the next international weekend unless he wins every game till then totally agree.Once the supporters turn on a manager the writings on the wall...
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Post by J-Roar on Sept 25, 2023 5:19:51 GMT
As so often happens when I hear the team read out pre-match, my heart sinks, knowing that we're in for yet another aimless, shapeless display. The 3-5-2 system we adopted at Huddersfield looked like a dog's dinner, and it only picked up a point due to how bad the opposition were. Sticking with it against a decent Hull side was the first of many poor decisions from Alex Neil today. First of all, Daniel Johnson isn't a wing back. He's versatile, but only in an attacking sense. Could it be that a decision to sell our best (only) left wing-back an hour before the transfer window closed then switch to a system that uses wing-backs is actually the most thick-as-pigshit decision we've seen in recent times? I'm not sure, because the decision to load the squad with wingers, have four of them on the pitch at one time today, but not a single one actually playing as a winger could equal it. Yep, how about a forward pairing of two tricky wingers who both look like they can beat a man and cut in...why don't we pair them up and lump the ball forward to them, while we leave our target man on the bench. How's that for a plan? Or what about this:we'll line up with 3 at the back and very high wing backs. So high up in fact (none of those stupid fans will be able to say we were negative then!) that there are two enormous spaces on either flank. Acres of room...hectares of room...great fucking swathes of African plain levels of room...where wildebeests can roam and Hull wingers can run into space completely unopposed, pulling our Three Stooges backline (or the Three Fannies as I've christened them) all over the place. Fair play to Liam Rosenior because he spotted this after about ten minutes, switching from a 4-4-2 to a 4-3-3 with his wingers high up in these unmanned spaces. A competent manager, however- someone who knows how tactics work rather than, say, a complete and utter fuckwit- would respond by switching to 4 at the back and blocking off these sudden avenues of joy that Hull had discovered. We didn't do that though. We just let them keep doing it as our defence flailed about, our midfielders had no idea whether to drop into spaces, track runners or press the ball. Instead they just stood transfixed, unsure as to what was being asked of them, watching waves of Hull players pour forward into our half unchallenged. It's absolutely pathetic. I feel sorry for the players, because it isn't going to be possible for them to gel unless they've actually got some sort of consistent structure and game plan to play to. Whatever we were trying to do today I have absolutely no idea. They didn't either. It was shambolic, and every single one of them was hung out to dry by an idiot who needs to sort his shit out immediately or fuck off out of this job. i was delighted when Tymon went, not because I disliked him. It meant that the hated wingback system was gone forever, once and for all. Never did I think that we would continue to play the wingback system just without the wingbacks to do so There definitely must be something in the water down at CW. It turns managers who've happily played with 4 at the back their entire careers into gibbering idiots who will shoehorn anyone they've got into a back 5. The chairman needs to sit him down and say 'Fuck this gelling bollocks - it may have washed in the 70s when the same 11 played for 3 seasons on end together. The game has moved on and you now pay a kings ransom for tactically aware players who should be able to gel almost instantly. Stop hiding behind shit like that - I'm paying you millions to do your job.' Giving AN carte blanche to restructure the entire club is starting to look like an epically suicidal strategy.
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Post by J-Roar on Sept 25, 2023 5:22:55 GMT
I preferred it when we pressed teams high up. Hull defence and keeper were all over the place early on het me didn't really press them, just let them have it and they were still giving it away. If we'd pressed them I'm sure we'd have had early joy. It also, especially at home, gets the crowd up with the tempo. I preferred it when we weren't absolutely fucking shit all the fucking time. (It seems long, long ago now) Watching the video before the game is really twisting the knife. This is what you had and we managed to fuck it up royally. Now, sit back and enjoy the game.
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Post by nottinghamstokie on Sept 25, 2023 5:54:06 GMT
Alex Neil games managed (career) - 459 Liam Rosenior games managed - 49 Which manager has got his side tactically solid; hard to break down; defensively strong; well organised; and looking like they know what they're supposed to be doing? Experience counts for nothing, it would seem. And yet Rosenior was derided at Derby
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Post by robstokie on Sept 25, 2023 6:13:26 GMT
It's getting towards Nutty Nathan territory now isn't it? Exactly the same sort of flip-flopping between multiple systems without allowing time for the players to adapt, often in games too when we inevitably concede the first goal and are chasing the game, absolute myopia regarding the fact that for vast proportion of games we have lost we have been out fought and out thought - we haven't played well in the league since Rotherham opening game, save for last half hour at Millwall (and even that was a desperate gamble after we were utterly woeful before that), followed by negative shape in the following games which always invites the opposition to bully us and control the tempo. The fact that he always seems to revert to the back 3 even though we recruited to play with width and neglected to add players who fit into that system, and the same players who let us down week after week (Laurent, Rose, Burger to an extent who has struggled to adapt to the physicality of the division) seeming to be undroppable.
Furthermore we look to be a horrible mixture of disorganized behind the ball (we are so easy to pull around, lack leadership and composure across the back line, and in front of it too, we neglect to do the basics of tracking runners and the character to do the dirty work of putting the foot in, closing down the opposition in our own half and playing percentages to relieve pressure) and looking toothless up front (overplaying it backwards and sideways that kill possession and concede territory and when we do get the ball forward, without width, movement off the ball or anyone looking to take charge by looking to gamble either by running at people or playing killer balls that force the opposition backwards and allowing us to build a head of steam).
It's a turgid pile of steaming horseshit served to us through the medium of hyperbole and exoticism but has been shown to be without substance, style or indeed any form of cohesion in any area. MON got sacked with a superior record and after he at least restored a bit of pride to our club, even though he was hamstrung by FFP and not being the afforded the opportunity to rebuild a team in his own image. What's this Charlatans excuse? Has to be gone asap, if the next few games are against the 'better' teams in the division we might as well let Ryan take the reins and see it as a free hit, and learn something new about what we have in the building rather than persist with Neil, inevitably rinse and repeat what we have already seen already this season and get our arses kicked anyway.
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