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Post by vinnyoverson on Jul 7, 2022 22:11:10 GMT
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Post by Gods on Jul 7, 2022 22:17:59 GMT
Try as I might I'm struggling to believe this is a complete figment of George Blackstock and his pals imagination.
Whether you think its horse play commensurate with behaviour at many of our institutions at the time or serious sexual assault is in the eye of the beholder.
It certainly wouldn't pass muster today, and didn't then in all truth.
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Post by telfordstokie on Jul 7, 2022 22:35:25 GMT
Reading that, it clearly needs a new investigation. Not the type of allegation you’d disclose lightly or bring up again following a court case seven years ago.
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Post by callas12 on Jul 8, 2022 1:13:03 GMT
This seems to have been gathering pace again behind the scenes for quite some time, especially as detailed as that Times article is aswell.. & The Times appear to have spoken to all the potential witnesses & victims over a period of time whilst the Police have by their own admission been 'keeping a lid on it'.. Awkward!
Does seem strange having a civil case heard before a criminal case, definitely isn't normal protocol.
Never knew Keith Rowley the physiotherapist from back in the Mills era was on the sexual offenders list 😲😬
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2022 2:22:31 GMT
I used to work with a gal who always squeezed your arse. If you reported her would be laughed at.
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Post by willieeetmiout on Jul 8, 2022 5:38:33 GMT
Reading that, it clearly needs a new investigation. Not the type of allegation you’d disclose lightly or bring up again following a court case seven years ago. It really doesn't. A civil court decided on the balance of probability that it didn't happen. The witnesses must have given massively conflicting accounts. You are never getting home a criminal conviction on it so why waste anymore time on it |
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Post by telfordstokie on Jul 8, 2022 5:41:32 GMT
Reading that, it clearly needs a new investigation. Not the type of allegation you’d disclose lightly or bring up again following a court case seven years ago. It really doesn't. A civil court decided on the balance of probability that it didn't happen. The witnesses must have given massively conflicting accounts. You are never getting home a criminal conviction on it so why waste anymore time on it Civil case was one person. Even in that case the judge ruled: “I do not find the claimant’s allegations are consciously dishonest or that nothing untoward ever occurred between players and apprentices at the club all those years ago.” But he said he was unable to find as fact the specific events alleged - i.e. they couldn’t be conclusively 100 per cent proved. Now there are 11 people who have come forward as alleged victims or witnesses. I don’t want it to be true but there does seem some substance to the allegations. |
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Post by JoeinOz on Jul 8, 2022 6:18:04 GMT
I used to work with a gal who always squeezed your arse. If you reported her would be laughed at. That's that sorted then |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Jul 8, 2022 7:26:06 GMT
I used to work with a gal who always squeezed your arse. If you reported her would be laughed at. That's that sorted then Summing up the judge said "While the testimonies of the eight witnesses were consistent and indeed very powerful, one person on a messageboard once had their arse touched by a woman at work. With all that in mind, I find in favour of the defendant. |
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Post by leicspotter on Jul 8, 2022 7:27:15 GMT
"Initiations" were (maybe still are) pretty common place at many work settings, this seems way beyond that though.
Much as I love SCFC and George Berry, Peter Fox etc, if this is true then action is required
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Post by chad on Jul 8, 2022 7:31:22 GMT
I used to work with a gal who always squeezed your arse. If you reported her would be laughed at. There was a lot worse than that on the factory at Wedgwood back in the day. Walking through the decorating department was traumatic for young lads just starting in the office 🤔😛 |
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Post by santy on Jul 8, 2022 7:31:23 GMT
He lost a civil case where the bar is lower, and the story was quite high profile before the case with the allegations going public. Cynically, that could easily make it quite easy for people to link their stories up.
After the last case it was a 6 figure sum. I would much rather hope this is the concoction of a few people who are now too deep in with their fabrication to go back on it now, for Blackstock especially. Because it would be far, far better that it was just people trying to get money, and now get out of the money owed as a result of the case rather than it actually being true.
With all the other stories that have come out since everything that went down at Crewe it'd be fairly strange if Stoke were the only ones somehow not only getting away with it but also having the other side forced to pay costs.
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Post by Orbs on Jul 8, 2022 7:48:09 GMT
I used to work with a gal who always squeezed your arse. If you reported her would be laughed at. There was a lot worse than that on the factory at Wedgwood back in the day. Walking through the decorating department was traumatic for young lads just starting in the office 🤔😛 Worse that having deep heat forced up your bum hole off a goalie glove? Go on… |
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Post by Veritas on Jul 8, 2022 8:11:53 GMT
Try as I might I'm struggling to believe this is a complete figment of George Blackstock and his pals imagination. Whether you think its a bit of horse play commensurate with the time or serious sexual assault is in the eye of the beholder. Horse play!! In any era this sort of thing is a brutal assault, back in the day it may have been more prevalent but it was always a brutal assault. |
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Post by willieeetmiout on Jul 8, 2022 8:21:52 GMT
It really doesn't. A civil court decided on the balance of probability that it didn't happen. The witnesses must have given massively conflicting accounts. You are never getting home a criminal conviction on it so why waste anymore time on it Civil case was one person. Even in that case the judge ruled: “I do not find the claimant’s allegations are consciously dishonest or that nothing untoward ever occurred between players and apprentices at the club all those years ago.” But he said he was unable to find as fact the specific events alleged - i.e. they couldn’t be conclusively 100 per cent proved. Now there are 11 people who have come forward as alleged victims or witnesses. I don’t want it to be true but there does seem some substance to the allegations. The civil case wasn't one person. As noted above the Judge didn't have to be 100% certain he had to be certain on the balance of probability. Was it more likely than not. He found not. Simple. End of criminal prosecution. |
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Post by flea79 on Jul 8, 2022 8:25:50 GMT
if true its terrible and those responsible should be punished
but having said that (and it doesnt excuse it) it seems to be a powerplay by senior players that has gone too far and been left unchecked
listening to some of the old pros who go on undr the cosh things like this were commonplace
i heard a story from Craig Davies on there recently who told a story about a senior player who had a set too with a youth teamer who he then sodomised with a banana in the dressing room, was there anything sexual from this, i doubt it but it is too much
but it all leads to what is a toxic atmosphere in clubs changing rooms that may still be going on to this day
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Post by Squeekster on Jul 8, 2022 8:36:53 GMT
Anyone who started work in the 80's (86 myself) will have many a tale of high jinx it was common place, not saying it was right but you just got on with it.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jul 8, 2022 8:59:39 GMT
Anyone who started work in the 80's (86 myself) will have many a tale of high jinx it was common place, not saying it was right but you just got on with it. If this happened it goes beyond 'high jinx' though doesn't it? |
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Post by stokemark on Jul 8, 2022 9:02:39 GMT
I imagine there is already a long thread on the 'Stoke is where the heart is' Facebook page where people are fondly reminiscing on about how brutal workplace 'inauguration ceremonies' were character building and how todays 'snowflake generation' would all benefit from a goalkeeper gloved finger covered in deep heat up the anus.
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Post by stroller on Jul 8, 2022 9:06:38 GMT
Sorry to say this, but after reading the article Peter Fox comes across as a sexual pervert. This needs a proper investigation. If the allegations are not true Fox and the other players named need to be exonerated, if allegations are true the players need to be punished. This is the best course of action for justice and Stoke City.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jul 8, 2022 9:19:13 GMT
Try as I might I'm struggling to believe this is a complete figment of George Blackstock and his pals imagination. Whether you think its a bit of horse play commensurate with the time or serious sexual assault is in the eye of the beholder. Horse play!! In any era this sort of thing is a brutal assault, back in the day it may have been more prevalent but it was always a brutal assault. Absolute nonsense that’s just judging past events by the standards of today. All manner of shit was fairly routine in schools and workplaces back in the day. Most teachers at my school would be behind bars nowadays and workplace experiences right up until the 90’s would lead to the same venue. Times and standards have changed markedly nobody died let sleeping dogs lie. |
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Post by chuckrocky on Jul 8, 2022 9:22:20 GMT
There was a lot worse than that on the factory at Wedgwood back in the day. Walking through the decorating department was traumatic for young lads just starting in the office 🤔😛 Worse that having deep heat forced up your bum hole off a goalie glove? Go on… Still a common practice in the forces, just minus the goalie glove. |
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Post by PotterLog on Jul 8, 2022 9:46:01 GMT
Horse play!! In any era this sort of thing is a brutal assault, back in the day it may have been more prevalent but it was always a brutal assault. Absolute nonsense that’s just judging past events by the standards of today. All manner of shit was fairly routine in schools and workplaces back in the day. Most teachers at my school would be behind bars nowadays and workplace experiences right up until the 90’s would lead to the same venue. Times and standards have changed markedly nobody died let sleeping dogs lie. But much of that “routine shit” was just as illegal then as it is now. |
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jul 8, 2022 9:56:58 GMT
Absolute nonsense that’s just judging past events by the standards of today. All manner of shit was fairly routine in schools and workplaces back in the day. Most teachers at my school would be behind bars nowadays and workplace experiences right up until the 90’s would lead to the same venue. Times and standards have changed markedly nobody died let sleeping dogs lie. But much of that “routine shit” was just as illegal then as it is now. It was, it happened, nobody died, move on. I got beaten on a regular basis by a teacher who’d been to the pub at dinner time quite often for things I hadn’t even done. It wasn’t just me he continued being a violent bastard after I’d left. No long term damage honest. You just have to be glad that that sort of behaviour is no longer tolerated. |
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Post by wakeypotter on Jul 8, 2022 10:16:25 GMT
I always wondered why everything stuck so well to Peter foxs glove
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Post by PotterLog on Jul 8, 2022 10:19:00 GMT
But much of that “routine shit” was just as illegal then as it is now. It was, it happened, nobody died, move on. I got beaten on a regular basis by a teacher who’d been to the pub at dinner time quite often for things I hadn’t even done. It wasn’t just me he continued being a violent bastard after I’d left. No long term damage honest. You just have to be glad that that sort of behaviour is no longer tolerated. Your own experience notwithstanding, “nobody died, move on” doesn’t seem a sensible approach to criminal justice for potential violent abusers to me. |
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Post by cvillestokie on Jul 8, 2022 10:38:01 GMT
if true its terrible and those responsible should be punished but having said that (and it doesnt excuse it) it seems to be a powerplay by senior players that has gone too far and been left unchecked listening to some of the old pros who go on undr the cosh things like this were commonplace i heard a story from Craig Davies on there recently who told a story about a senior player who had a set too with a youth teamer who he then sodomised with a banana in the dressing room, was there anything sexual from this, i doubt it but it is too much but it all leads to what is a toxic atmosphere in clubs changing rooms that may still be going on to this day Is there anything sexual? Yes, the banana in the arse sounds quite sexual. If they wanted to do something that wasn’t sexual, there are plenty of ways to beat up/humiliate a young person. “A power play that has gone too far”, nope if true, it was sexual assault. Edit: it’s also this kind of crap that makes me laugh at statements about society never being worse etc. That couldn’t have anything to do with the fact that so much more was left underreported and worse, swept under the rug. |
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Post by FranktheRabbit on Jul 8, 2022 10:46:30 GMT
But much of that “routine shit” was just as illegal then as it is now. It was, it happened, nobody died, move on. I got beaten on a regular basis by a teacher who’d been to the pub at dinner time quite often for things I hadn’t even done. It wasn’t just me he continued being a violent bastard after I’d left. No long term damage honest. You just have to be glad that that sort of behaviour is no longer tolerated. Maybe you are stronger mentally, others aren't. To say "nobody died" like it's a fact is just completely ignorant. People who suffered historical abuse take their own lives on a regular basis. |
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Post by Squeekster on Jul 8, 2022 11:02:39 GMT
Anyone who started work in the 80's (86 myself) will have many a tale of high jinx it was common place, not saying it was right but you just got on with it. If this happened it goes beyond 'high jinx' though doesn't it? It probably was mate, my brother was having a shower after a shift in a foundry at Chesterton and they got some thick black grease and greased his meat and 2 veg , he didn't think it was any way perverse but more so the time and trouble to clean it all off. There are many more had a few things done to myself not like that but probably worthy of action nowadays. |
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Jul 8, 2022 11:15:42 GMT
If this was coming out about any other Club, I doubt many would be referencing “horseplay” or “high jinks”
Utterly reprehensible if true and given more complainants are coming forward this needs to be re investigated.
If someone did that to one of my kids…
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