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Post by crapslinger on Mar 25, 2021 15:28:56 GMT
Sadly children mainly vulnerable kids have and most likely are still being subjected to sexual abuse and rape on an industrial scale on the streets of the UK, despite authorities knowing about it including councils, the police, social services and local community leaders, it's a national disgrace which should be investigated via a national enquiry but I very much doubt this will ever happen, we have let these children down as a nation.
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Post by Vermelho20312505 on Mar 25, 2021 18:35:29 GMT
I would hope that nowadays the DBS (previously CRB) checks would go a long way to putting parents' minds at ease...and, more importantly, protecting the kids I guess these too may be fallible, but 'back in the day' they didn't exist at all Whilst I hope I'm wrong I don't see that these checks make any real impact other than for appearance. Benwell and most of these other scumbags would have been given a certificate until they were arrested. So it only seems to prevent repeat offenders (after they've been caught I mean).
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Post by jeycov on Mar 25, 2021 19:00:52 GMT
Agree the introduction of DBS checks acknowledge that the problems exist, however until any sort of incident is formally recorded then nothing can happen.
Gaining evidence is also difficult, the premise with any crime is that you are innocent until proven guilty
Better awareness for young people to feel confident to approach a trained counselling / support service. This exists in an educational setting and
should be developed beyond the classroom. The recent programmes reveal for those desparate to succeed in sport, they are less likely to seek help
The FA and other governing bodies need to be more procative, monitoring exactly what is going on
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Post by Godo on Mar 25, 2021 19:07:18 GMT
I didn't see the programme, wasn't even aware it was being broadcast,but will endeavour to do so. I played against Paul Stewart in the illustrious North West Counties/Trains league and he clearly still loved the game to carry on playing at that level. He was slow but had good upper body strength and you just wonder why that strength wasn't put to excellent use beating the shit out of these rat turds. Sad that the innocent abused feel a sense of shame. That vulnerability must be what these bastards feed on.
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Post by mattface on Mar 25, 2021 22:21:11 GMT
Having watched it I followed up with the Dispatches program from 1997. It's shocking how this was dismissed. The same names and incidents were highlighted and yet nothing was done. The FA seemed totally disinterested.
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Post by stokeykez on Mar 25, 2021 22:53:40 GMT
I am watching it currently, it is totally heartbreaking for these lads it really is. To think that it was covered up by anyone in that position of power is disgusting.
These deplorable, disturbed, filthy men have ruined so many lives
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4ndr3w
Academy Starlet
Posts: 178
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Post by 4ndr3w on Mar 25, 2021 23:19:33 GMT
I am watching it currently, it is totally heartbreaking for these lads it really is. To think that it was covered up by anyone in that position of power is disgusting. These deplorable, disturbed, filthy men have ruined so many lives Put my youngest to bed hours ago and was thinking of all this as he was saying good night and saying he loved me etc. My lad is so happy and innocent he could be easily led if was put in that position. I can’t even begin to imagine what these poor blokes went through. Having there childhoods completely robbed of them just to please some sick bastards desires. There’s nothing worse than this. I saw a clip of Andy Woodward’s interview. I turned it off in disgust at what went on and can’t bring myself to watch more of it
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4ndr3w
Academy Starlet
Posts: 178
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Post by 4ndr3w on Mar 25, 2021 23:24:21 GMT
Got me thinking as well. I’m 32 and when I was about 10/11 onwards I always used to go out to play all day and as long as I was home before dark my parents were fine with it. I wouldn’t let my kids do that these days though in fear of what might happen. Yet my parents just let me be back then 20 years ago and I lived out a happy childhood
Why is it different now? It is it just me being over protective?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 6:20:38 GMT
Got me thinking as well. I’m 32 and when I was about 10/11 onwards I always used to go out to play all day and as long as I was home before dark my parents were fine with it. I wouldn’t let my kids do that these days though in fear of what might happen. Yet my parents just let me be back then 20 years ago and I lived out a happy childhood Why is it different now? It is it just me being over protective? I think people are just more aware of what goes on and educated about it and attitudes have changed, not always for the better in some areas but i can remember for instance as a kid was a local flasher. was seen more a humorous by many and a bizarre thing to do. People who had seen him joked about it more than worried re the welfare of kids etc and didn't really see it as a threat. I do think people can be over protective but is just natural , the amount of people who have come forward in different cases shows that this was rife and nobody knew and people were afraid to report for fear of ridicule. John Bowler in the doc just struck me as someone who didn't give a toss and more worried re himself and the reputation of the club.
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Post by pottersrule on Mar 26, 2021 7:51:43 GMT
I am watching it currently, it is totally heartbreaking for these lads it really is. To think that it was covered up by anyone in that position of power is disgusting. These deplorable, disturbed, filthy men have ruined so many lives Put my youngest to bed hours ago and was thinking of all this as he was saying good night and saying he loved me etc. My lad is so happy and innocent he could be easily led if was put in that position. I can’t even begin to imagine what these poor blokes went through. Having there childhoods completely robbed of them just to please some sick bastards desires. There’s nothing worse than this. I saw a clip of Andy Woodward’s interview. I turned it off in disgust at what went on and can’t bring myself to watch more of it It's a bloody hard watch and I experienced a whole gamut of emotions watching the three episodes.Anger,Frustration,Sadness but ultimately a great sense of Admiration for the lads who had the balls to speak out about the abuse they suffered. I would have been too embarrassed to contemplate it,and theses guys are bloody heroes in my eyes.
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4ndr3w
Academy Starlet
Posts: 178
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Post by 4ndr3w on Mar 26, 2021 7:53:35 GMT
Put my youngest to bed hours ago and was thinking of all this as he was saying good night and saying he loved me etc. My lad is so happy and innocent he could be easily led if was put in that position. I can’t even begin to imagine what these poor blokes went through. Having there childhoods completely robbed of them just to please some sick bastards desires. There’s nothing worse than this. I saw a clip of Andy Woodward’s interview. I turned it off in disgust at what went on and can’t bring myself to watch more of it It's a bloody hard watch and I experienced a whole gamut of emotions watching the three episodes.Anger,Frustration,Sadness but ultimately a great sense of Admiration for the lads who had the balls to speak out about the abuse they suffered. I would have been too embarrassed to contemplate it,and theses guys are bloody heroes in my eyes. Hopefully it’ll encourage more sufferers to come out in future
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 8:37:46 GMT
out of curiosity would those with young children feel comfortable with them being at say Crewe and going on tours etc? Just wondering what the knock on effect may be or is it just past history now?
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Post by scfc75 on Mar 26, 2021 8:48:49 GMT
out of curiosity would those with young children feel comfortable with them being at say Crewe and going on tours etc? Just wondering what the knock on effect may be or is it just past history now? Also, how will it make the existing youth coaches at Crewe feel, they must have to double think every single action because they’ll now be under a very bright spotlight. Horrible situation to have to work in.
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Post by pottersrule on Mar 26, 2021 8:57:50 GMT
out of curiosity would those with young children feel comfortable with them being at say Crewe and going on tours etc? Just wondering what the knock on effect may be or is it just past history now? The Crewe chairman resigned yesterday and said it was his intention to do so after the inquiry had been completed.He stated that he was the last person at the club to have any association with the Bennell era. The Crewe board I'm sure will be hoping it's past history.
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Post by stokefc on Mar 26, 2021 9:05:26 GMT
out of curiosity would those with young children feel comfortable with them being at say Crewe and going on tours etc? Just wondering what the knock on effect may be or is it just past history now? Also, how will it make the existing youth coaches at Crewe feel, they must have to double think every single action because they’ll now be under a very bright spotlight. Horrible situation to have to work in. Crewe should have been shut down like any facility that abused children has , they should cease to exist
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 26, 2021 9:18:40 GMT
Also, how will it make the existing youth coaches at Crewe feel, they must have to double think every single action because they’ll now be under a very bright spotlight. Horrible situation to have to work in. Crewe should have been shut down like any facility that abused children has , they should cease to exist Which is perfectly fair comment in many respects but then you see the support they are offering to young Ashton Hulme, and if the club was shut down, that boy would be a lot worse off without their support than he is now. The current staff within the Crewe Academy should not be stigmatised and tarred by events of the past, many of which will have happened whilst the current staff were kids themselves. Some may not have even been born.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 9:25:46 GMT
I thought John Bowler showed no remorse at all and did the easy thing. I get they shouldn't be tarred with the same brush but certainly dragged their once good reputation through some serious mud. Would a potential youth coach perhaps choose another club as a result of this if he had the option though?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 26, 2021 9:29:04 GMT
I thought John Bowler showed no remorse at all and did the easy thing. I get they shouldn't be tarred with the same brush but certainly dragged their once good reputation through some serious mud. Would a potential youth coach perhaps choose another club as a result of this if he had the option though? I'm sure they probably would and I'm sure parents, if their child had a genuine choice, might choose another club rather than Crewe. It will take some time for them to rebuild their reputation but you have to be mindful that it wasn't only Crewe. Southampton had their Barry Bennell and they are one of the top academy set ups in the Country right now.
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Post by stokefc on Mar 26, 2021 9:30:18 GMT
Crewe should have been shut down like any facility that abused children has , they should cease to exist Which is perfectly fair comment in many respects but then you see the support they are offering to young Ashton Hulme, and if the club was shut down, that boy would be a lot worse off without their support than he is now. The current staff within the Crewe Academy should not be stigmatised and tarred by events of the past, many of which will have happened whilst the current staff were kids themselves. Some may not have even been born. i know mate , the red mist appeared reading some of the stuff being said of them though i do think if it was known at the time i think closing them down could have been sanctioned and now thinking about it these vile things could have been going on at numerous clubs ,even Stoke ,would i want us to be shut down ,i doubt it and it's not fair on the fans too
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 9:34:54 GMT
I thought John Bowler showed no remorse at all and did the easy thing. I get they shouldn't be tarred with the same brush but certainly dragged their once good reputation through some serious mud. Would a potential youth coach perhaps choose another club as a result of this if he had the option though? I'm sure they probably would and I'm sure parents, if their child had a genuine choice, might choose another club rather than Crewe. It will take some time for them to rebuild their reputation but you have to be mindful that it wasn't only Crewe. Southampton had their Barry Bennell and they are one of the top academy set ups in the Country right now. Totally but still a cloud hanging over them with a few unanswered issues let's say. Crewe certainly come out if it the worst I think in many minds they will have gone from having that production line to being associated with what has gone on there which will possibly outweigh all the good work.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 26, 2021 9:46:13 GMT
I'm sure they probably would and I'm sure parents, if their child had a genuine choice, might choose another club rather than Crewe. It will take some time for them to rebuild their reputation but you have to be mindful that it wasn't only Crewe. Southampton had their Barry Bennell and they are one of the top academy set ups in the Country right now. Totally but still a cloud hanging over them with a few unanswered issues let's say. Crewe certainly come out if it the worst I think in many minds they will have gone from having that production line to being associated with what has gone on there which will possibly outweigh all the good work. Wonder what likes of Nick Powell and Dean Ashton thought watching it, if indeed they did?
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Post by Gary Hackett on Mar 26, 2021 10:08:20 GMT
Totally but still a cloud hanging over them with a few unanswered issues let's say. Crewe certainly come out if it the worst I think in many minds they will have gone from having that production line to being associated with what has gone on there which will possibly outweigh all the good work. Wonder what likes of Nick Powell and Dean Ashton thought watching it, if indeed they did? The same as everyone else as it happened years before they joined the club.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 26, 2021 10:10:59 GMT
Wonder what likes of Nick Powell and Dean Ashton thought watching it, if indeed they did? The same as everyone else as it happened years before they joined the club. I was more referring to the esteem that they held Dario Gradi in. As a better example, maybe, I wonder what Robbie Savage and Danny Murphy thought and feel. No doubt all will be disgusted as everyone is but it must feel "close to home" for those lads. They obviously will have had a better experience than those that went before them yet all are seeing the name of a person they hold in great esteem dragged through the shittiest of shit.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Mar 26, 2021 10:19:32 GMT
The same as everyone else as it happened years before they joined the club. I was more referring to the esteem that they held Dario Gradi in. As a better example, maybe, I wonder what Robbie Savage and Danny Murphy thought and feel. No doubt all will be disgusted as everyone is but it must feel "close to home" for those lads. They obviously will have had a better experience than those that went before them yet all are seeing the name of a person they hold in great esteem dragged through the shittiest of shit. None of them have anything but the utmost respect for Gradi.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 10:31:40 GMT
One of the footballers interviewed on the program is a friend of mine and it was upsetting to hear the extent and longevity of what he had been through, even though I had some prior knowledge. Absolutely heartbreaking how the abuse has impacted on the victims, lost or torturous careers. The FA’s response in 1997 was appalling as were the actions of Crewe. Southampton deserve some credit, but sadly no conviction was initially obtained.
Each and everyone of these guys are heroes in my eyes, and I how it gives other survivors the courage to come forward to bring other perpetrators to justice.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 10:45:23 GMT
Wasn't there an issue at Chelsea where Geoff Hurst refused to speak up? was talk at a player of the year award ceremony of abuse but no one spoke out.
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Post by alsagerstokie on Mar 26, 2021 10:55:46 GMT
Maybe one of the few that saw nothing at the time.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 26, 2021 10:56:04 GMT
I was more referring to the esteem that they held Dario Gradi in. As a better example, maybe, I wonder what Robbie Savage and Danny Murphy thought and feel. No doubt all will be disgusted as everyone is but it must feel "close to home" for those lads. They obviously will have had a better experience than those that went before them yet all are seeing the name of a person they hold in great esteem dragged through the shittiest of shit. None of them have anything but the utmost respect for Gradi. Clearly, hence my comment. I wonder if that respect has in any way wavered off the back of watching the program?
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Post by Gary Hackett on Mar 26, 2021 12:02:01 GMT
None of them have anything but the utmost respect for Gradi. Clearly, hence my comment. I wonder if that respect has in any way wavered off the back of watching the program? I don't think so. I know a couple of ex players who played under Gradi, they insist Gradi was totally innocent of any wrongdoings. I did actually sell Barry Bennell a TV in the early 90s, obviously I had no idea of what he was up to at the time.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2021 12:09:57 GMT
Clearly, hence my comment. I wonder if that respect has in any way wavered off the back of watching the program? I don't think so. I know a couple of ex players who played under Gradi, they insist Gradi was totally innocent of any wrongdoings. I did actually sell Barry Bennell a TV in the early 90s, obviously I had no idea of what he was up to at the time. i know the one Gary and the parent of a high profile one. Both are more of the opinion that were rumours of sorts but feel because they didn't see it , it doesn't mean it didn't happen. I know one person who worked closely with Dario outside of football and she's not so sure but maybe things have swayed her in the media.
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