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Post by mrcoke on Nov 23, 2020 21:52:16 GMT
What is also truly impressive is that 6 of the last 10 matches have been against teams in the top half of the table.
Furthermore the first 2 games of the league season were also against teams in the top half of the table and we are the second highest scorers.
So maybe the fact that we often don't look good and have conceded too many goals is because we have played 8 of the top half teams in the first 12 matches and hopefully we will look a lot better when we play more bottom half teams.
We play the top team tomorrow and we only have beat them to match their goal difference and points. Considering the injuries, chopping and changing of the team till recently, and the number of young players still learning their trade, we have done extremely well so far.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Nov 23, 2020 21:54:21 GMT
So, MON will have some Damascene experience where he suddenly becomes Pep? Not sure you believe what you’re saying yourself lad. I don’t see a team inhibited in how they play, just one that is limited in certain positions. He managed it with 4-2-3-1
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 22:01:21 GMT
So, MON will have some Damascene experience where he suddenly becomes Pep? Not sure you believe what you’re saying yourself lad. I don’t see a team inhibited in how they play, just one that is limited in certain positions. He managed it with 4-2-3-1 I think that’s what annoys me so much tbh. He’s shown he allow his sides to do it. And it doesn’t need to be the ridiculousness of liking it to wanting him to become Pep.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2020 22:15:11 GMT
It is wank. I hate winning. If we beat Norwich tomorrow with a goal off a long ball, I'm tearing up my S/T. Shite, O'Neill. We won’t beat Norwich if we play like we did on Saturday. He needs to trust this team to play. If we defend like we did vs Huddersfield you mean? Our defence is the one glaring boil on our arse, that could cost us a shot at promotion. We've got back into the swing of scoring goals, fine. But defensively we're woeful at times. Backs-to-the wall we're OK, but in open play, so naive.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 22:21:29 GMT
We won’t beat Norwich if we play like we did on Saturday. He needs to trust this team to play. If we defend like we did vs Huddersfield you mean? Our defence is the one glaring boil on our arse, that could cost us a shot at promotion. We've got back into the swing of scoring goals, fine. But defensively we're woeful at times. Backs-to-the wall we're OK, but in open play, so naive. The full backs are an issue but I think the protection from the midfield is as big an issue. Also they were under a lot of pressure. Keep the ball and that’s relieved.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Nov 23, 2020 22:25:19 GMT
Walk into dressing room. Instruct players to "Play some football". Walk out of dressing room. Win game. Piece of piss. It’s better than the “hoof it lads” instruction they have at present. Setting aside just instructing a team to "Play some football" isn't that easy....you have a point about hoofing it too much. Early season we were doing this far too much but once the defence and Davies bedded in we started to play more from the back - helped in part in that we have 3 CBs in Collins, Souttar and the much maligned Chester who are actually comfortable with the ball at their feet. I think we've resorted to hoofing it again is in large part to Davies getting injured and the understanding between the defence and the goalie being disrupted, Against Huddersfield Bursik kicked long every time he got the ball - whether that is because his distribution is a bit iffy or he was instructed to do this until they'd done more work on the training ground I don't know. I don't have a problem mixing it up - there are far too many teams looking pretty stupid at the moment pretending to be Liverpool - and I really don't have O'Neill down as just a hoofball merchant. However I do think he's pragmatic and while the defence isn't settled he's quite right to play a percentage game,
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 22:28:17 GMT
It’s better than the “hoof it lads” instruction they have at present. Setting aside just instructing a team to "Play some football" isn't that easy....you have a point about hoofing it too much. Early season we were doing this far too much but once the defence and Davies bedded in we started to play more from the back - helped in part in that we have 3 CBs in Collins, Souttar and the much maligned Chester who are actually comfortable with the ball at their feet. I think we've resorted to hoofing it again is in large part to Davies getting injured and the understanding between the defence and the goalie being disrupted, Against Huddersfield Bursik kicked long every time he got the ball - whether that is because his distribution is a bit iffy or he was instructed to do this until they'd done more work on the training ground I don't know. I don't have a problem mixing it up - there are far too many teams looking pretty stupid at the moment pretending to be Liverpool - and I really don't have O'Neill down as just a hoofball merchant. However I do think he's pragmatic and while the defence isn't settled he's quite right to play a percentage game, Kicking is about Bursik’s best attribute. And I know we can do it, that’s why it annoys me when we don’t and I think it hinders us. And despite winning on Saturday, I think it hindered us.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Nov 23, 2020 22:46:04 GMT
Setting aside just instructing a team to "Play some football" isn't that easy....you have a point about hoofing it too much. Early season we were doing this far too much but once the defence and Davies bedded in we started to play more from the back - helped in part in that we have 3 CBs in Collins, Souttar and the much maligned Chester who are actually comfortable with the ball at their feet. I think we've resorted to hoofing it again is in large part to Davies getting injured and the understanding between the defence and the goalie being disrupted, Against Huddersfield Bursik kicked long every time he got the ball - whether that is because his distribution is a bit iffy or he was instructed to do this until they'd done more work on the training ground I don't know. I don't have a problem mixing it up - there are far too many teams looking pretty stupid at the moment pretending to be Liverpool - and I really don't have O'Neill down as just a hoofball merchant. However I do think he's pragmatic and while the defence isn't settled he's quite right to play a percentage game, Kicking is about Bursik’s best attribute. And I know we can do it, that’s why it annoys me when we don’t and I think it hinders us. And despite winning on Saturday, I think it hindered us. I've not seen enough of Bursik to comment - but he was definitely the main culprit for hoofing it on Saturday. I think you're under estimating the impact of losing 2 keepers in a few weeks on our ability to play out from the back - give it time.
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Post by ethers26 on Nov 23, 2020 22:47:19 GMT
So, MON will have some Damascene experience where he suddenly becomes Pep? Not sure you believe what you’re saying yourself lad. I don’t see a team inhibited in how they play, just one that is limited in certain positions. Who mentioned anything about Pep? We need to actually try to keep the ball and let them play a bit more. We’re not doing it at all atm. I think MON is the biggest stumbling block at present to this team getting promoted. No I don’t want him sacked and I think he’s been very good but do I want the front 3 given more freedom and him to get rid of the underdog mentality? Yes. We're top of the form table Scored more goals than anyone else Close to overtaking Brentford for the most in-form team of 2020 And yet you're saying Michael O'Neill is a fucking 'stumbling block'?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 22:48:11 GMT
Kicking is about Bursik’s best attribute. And I know we can do it, that’s why it annoys me when we don’t and I think it hinders us. And despite winning on Saturday, I think it hindered us. I've not seen enough of Bursik to comment - but he was definitely the main culprit for hoofing it on Saturday. I think you're under estimating the impact of losing 2 keepers in a few weeks on our ability to play out from the back - give it time. Possibly but he is very much a modern keeper with it. And we’ve seen first hand about over playing as it’s basically how we beat Reading and Huddersfield. But a happy mix can and needs to be achieved.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 22:49:27 GMT
Who mentioned anything about Pep? We need to actually try to keep the ball and let them play a bit more. We’re not doing it at all atm. I think MON is the biggest stumbling block at present to this team getting promoted. No I don’t want him sacked and I think he’s been very good but do I want the front 3 given more freedom and him to get rid of the underdog mentality? Yes. We're top of the form table Scored more goals than anyone else Close to overtaking Brentford for the most in-form team of 2020 And yet you're saying Michael O'Neill is a fucking 'stumbling block'? Yes. We’re a lot better than he’s setting us up to be imo. I find it exciting tbh because I do expect him to figure it out soon enough.
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Post by ethers26 on Nov 23, 2020 22:54:01 GMT
We're top of the form table Scored more goals than anyone else Close to overtaking Brentford for the most in-form team of 2020 And yet you're saying Michael O'Neill is a fucking 'stumbling block'? Yes. We’re a lot better than he’s setting us up to be imo. I find it exciting tbh because I do expect him to figure it out soon enough. We're only (potentially) a lot better because of his management of the squad and transfers. It could have been very different if we'd kept the same squad we had 12 months ago with a manager who couldn't sort all that out. Be careful what you wish for!
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 23, 2020 22:57:47 GMT
So we are reduced to criticizing a 20 year old on his debut who has just played for his country and rushed in the first XI at short notice. When it comes to distributing the ball, Bursik will have done exactly what he has been told to do by his manager and GK coach.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 23:00:02 GMT
Yes. We’re a lot better than he’s setting us up to be imo. I find it exciting tbh because I do expect him to figure it out soon enough. We're only (potentially) a lot better because of his management of the squad and transfers. It could have been very different if we'd kept the same squad we had 12 months ago with a manager who couldn't sort all that out. Be careful what you wish for! 😂😂😂 I’m wishing for us to keep a bit more possession and let our attackers play a bit more.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 23:00:23 GMT
So we are reduced to criticizing a 20 year old on his debut who has just played for his country and rushed in the first XI at short notice. When it comes to distributing the ball, Bursik will have done exactly what he has been told to do by his manager and GK coach. Totally agree.
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Post by ethers26 on Nov 23, 2020 23:05:46 GMT
We're only (potentially) a lot better because of his management of the squad and transfers. It could have been very different if we'd kept the same squad we had 12 months ago with a manager who couldn't sort all that out. Be careful what you wish for! 😂😂😂 I’m wishing for us to keep a bit more possession and let our attackers play a bit more. We have scored more goals than anybody else. What is not to like? We don't play possession football and it's working very well, so why change it? I don't get why you have purposefully gone out your way to find something else to moan about here tbh.
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Post by GrahamHyde on Nov 23, 2020 23:07:31 GMT
I still don't think we are good enough for automatic promotion, I expect we'll be anywhere between 5th and 12th. I think I said that at the start of the season and I stand by it.
We are clearly better than half of the teams in this league and then there's a small group of around 4-5 who are probably a level up from us (Watford, Swansea, Bournemouth and Norwich).
We should be competing with a cluster of teams for the final two play-off spots. Whether you'd want to get promoted via the play-offs though is another question, I don't think I would personally. I'd rather have another season in the Championship than be cannon fodder in the Premier League.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 23:08:14 GMT
😂😂😂 I’m wishing for us to keep a bit more possession and let our attackers play a bit more. We have scored more goals than anybody else. What is not to like? We don't play possession football and it's working very well, so why change it? I don't get why you have purposefully gone out your way to find something else to moan about here tbh. I don’t think we’ve played well bar 2 games this season. I think we can be better. I think we can win the league if we get better. That’s pretty much it tbh.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Nov 23, 2020 23:13:32 GMT
So we are reduced to criticizing a 20 year old on his debut who has just played for his country and rushed in the first XI at short notice. When it comes to distributing the ball, Bursik will have done exactly what he has been told to do by his manager and GK coach. Bursik did hoof it every time he got the ball - that's just a statement of fact - and I think you are right that he was instructed to do so. However I don't think that should be read as a criticism of either Bursik or the manager - in the circumstances it was the sensible thing to do. Playing it out from the back requires an understanding between the keeper and the defence that you simply can't build in a few days. The point I was making is that playing hoofball was inevitable given we've lost 2 keepers in less than a month - and that isn't the fault of Bursik or indicative of how O'Neill wants us to play.
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Post by ethers26 on Nov 23, 2020 23:16:54 GMT
We have scored more goals than anybody else. What is not to like? We don't play possession football and it's working very well, so why change it? I don't get why you have purposefully gone out your way to find something else to moan about here tbh. I don’t think we’ve played well bar 2 games this season. I think we can be better. I think we can win the league if we get better. That’s pretty much it tbh. More possession and 'letting our attackers play a bit more' will make us better? We're top scorers and we're winning games home and away. If we cut out our stupid defensive/individual errors and kept a goalkeeper fit, THEN we'd be clear. No problems at the other end of the pitch.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 23, 2020 23:20:01 GMT
I don’t think we’ve played well bar 2 games this season. I think we can be better. I think we can win the league if we get better. That’s pretty much it tbh. More possession and 'letting our attackers play a bit more' will make us better? We're top scorers and we're winning games home and away. If we cut out our stupid defensive/individual errors and kept a goalkeeper fit, THEN we'd be clear. No problems at the other end of the pitch. We haven’t played well though and we can’t keep relying on other teams mistakes. Possession will also help the defence.
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Post by clarkeda on Nov 24, 2020 7:33:25 GMT
Mon has really done an incredible job. I can see us being top of that by the end of the year
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Post by Rt Hon Reverend Luvpump on Nov 24, 2020 7:57:37 GMT
Bayern, you maintain that we're capable of more in terms of performance, but how do you see us doing that as I assume you won't be including Allen in any team you pick. We are where we are with all of our weaknesses. Are you suggesting Collins instead of Batth will make it all better? The team is fine. They just need to be instructed to play some football. When we try and play football our procession goes up and we tend to lose bizzar really 🤷♂️
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 24, 2020 8:44:39 GMT
So we are reduced to criticizing a 20 year old on his debut who has just played for his country and rushed in the first XI at short notice. When it comes to distributing the ball, Bursik will have done exactly what he has been told to do by his manager and GK coach. Bursik did hoof it every time he got the ball - that's just a statement of fact - and I think you are right that he was instructed to do so. However I don't think that should be read as a criticism of either Bursik or the manager - in the circumstances it was the sensible thing to do. Playing it out from the back requires an understanding between the keeper and the defence that you simply can't build in a few days. The point I was making is that playing hoofball was inevitable given we've lost 2 keepers in less than a month - and that isn't the fault of Bursik or indicative of how O'Neill wants us to play. Apologies for misinterpreting your post. I agree with the above. As I posted on the GK thread, I went to school with John Farmer and I remember the day he played his first game in the top tier old 1st Division as an 18 year old. If young players are good enough, they are old enough and they are given clear guidance on what to do.
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Post by bgreen13 on Nov 24, 2020 9:09:13 GMT
I still don't think we are good enough for automatic promotion, I expect we'll be anywhere between 5th and 12th. I think I said that at the start of the season and I stand by it. We are clearly better than half of the teams in this league and then there's a small group of around 4-5 who are probably a level up from us (Watford, Swansea, Bournemouth and Norwich). We should be competing with a cluster of teams for the final two play-off spots. Whether you'd want to get promoted via the play-offs though is another question, I don't think I would personally. I'd rather have another season in the Championship than be cannon fodder in the Premier League. I agree with this although with our squad and the much moaned about rotation we'll come strong towards the end of the season.
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Post by bgreen13 on Nov 24, 2020 9:10:55 GMT
More possession and 'letting our attackers play a bit more' will make us better? We're top scorers and we're winning games home and away. If we cut out our stupid defensive/individual errors and kept a goalkeeper fit, THEN we'd be clear. No problems at the other end of the pitch. We haven’t played well though and we can’t keep relying on other teams mistakes. Possession will also help the defence. Other teams rely on our players mistakes though (according to you the same ones). I'd be certain you're a parody account if you weren't so 'relentless'.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 24, 2020 10:11:39 GMT
We haven’t played well though and we can’t keep relying on other teams mistakes. Possession will also help the defence. Other teams rely on our players mistakes though (according to you the same ones). I'd be certain you're a parody account if you weren't so 'relentless'. Do you ever talk about the actual thread topic?
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Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Nov 24, 2020 10:43:25 GMT
Bayern, you're being a touch obtuse as usual. You're asking MON to change his ways, and I'm not sure he can. My point is that with a couple of improvements in personnel we'll get better anyway, but it won't come through our manager doing what you want him to do.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 24, 2020 10:46:12 GMT
Bayern, you're being a touch obtuse as usual. You're asking MON to change his ways, and I'm not sure he can. My point is that with a couple of improvements in personnel we'll get better anyway, but it won't come through our manager doing what you want him to do. He's shown he can though. And I disagree, I think it would.
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Post by mickstupp on Nov 24, 2020 10:56:47 GMT
Bayern, you're being a touch obtuse as usual. You're asking MON to change his ways, and I'm not sure he can. My point is that with a couple of improvements in personnel we'll get better anyway, but it won't come through our manager doing what you want him to do. He's shown he can though. And I disagree, I think it would. When has he shown that he can? Seems to me that after continual bleating about our formation earlier in the season, our style of football is your new stick to beat the manager with. Who’s going to play this possession football you’ve started to crave all of al sudden? All of our defenders are limited in possession and we have a dangerous front three, why not move the ball up to them quickly instead of getting caught in possession like we did to Huddersfield and Reading.
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