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Post by jeycov on Jul 19, 2020 20:18:57 GMT
I'm saying he's a useful player to keep around the squad, and that because he's never been a prolific striker at this level doesn't mean he won't be useful. People need to look at Chris Wilder and the example he set at this level - an example we need to be acutely aware of over the next few years with FFP imminent. That being, be very careful of what you keep, be very careful of what you throw away and don't assume because something looks like it's broken, that it is. When Sheffield United signed Leon Clarke aged 30, they were his 19th club. He played his part in getting them promotion in the right system. I'm chuffin sick of "useful" players making up the squad. We need some quality of we are going to get back to the Prem (or even stay afloat safely in the Champs) We cannot keep thinking thses type of players are "useful"... If you told me that he was part of a MON plan such as Cresswell with Pulis then I'd have some process to think. Sorry mate. We've got to recruit or develop better. Its unrealistic to think that we will take that step to the Premiership immediately The current squad have underachieved considerably Useful players who were with our last promotion? Whitehead, Whelan, Wilkinson, Higinbotham, Wilson - they played their part
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 20:20:45 GMT
Awful player. Get rid if we can.
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Post by smallthorner on Jul 19, 2020 20:26:15 GMT
I'm chuffin sick of "useful" players making up the squad. We need some quality of we are going to get back to the Prem (or even stay afloat safely in the Champs) We cannot keep thinking thses type of players are "useful"... If you told me that he was part of a MON plan such as Cresswell with Pulis then I'd have some process to think. Sorry mate. We've got to recruit or develop better. Its unrealistic to think that we will take that step to the Premiership immediately The current squad have underachieved considerably Useful players who were with our last promotion? Whitehead, Whelan, Wilkinson, Higinbotham, Wilson - they played their part We were starting from ground zero then. We have had a decade in the Prem and should know our onions. Those players had a part on a team built by Pulis. You may be suggesting Gregory is going to be part of MON's promotion team. Fair point.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2020 20:29:14 GMT
I'm saying he's a useful player to keep around the squad, and that because he's never been a prolific striker at this level doesn't mean he won't be useful. People need to look at Chris Wilder and the example he set at this level - an example we need to be acutely aware of over the next few years with FFP imminent. That being, be very careful of what you keep, be very careful of what you throw away and don't assume because something looks like it's broken, that it is. When Sheffield United signed Leon Clarke aged 30, they were his 19th club. He played his part in getting them promotion in the right system. I'm chuffin sick of "useful" players making up the squad. We need some quality of we are going to get back to the Prem (or even stay afloat safely in the Champs) We cannot keep thinking thses type of players are "useful"... If you told me that he was part of a MON plan such as Cresswell with Pulis then I'd have some process to think. Sorry mate. We've got to recruit or develop better. Every successful squad in the Championship has those types of players in it. The issue we have is if we get rid of Gregory he will have to be replaced by another cheapo or freebie, on top of whatever it would cost us to subsidise his contract elsewhere. On top of that, we've got the following players to get rid of: Wimmer Woods Afobe(?) Bauer N'Diaye Etebo BMI(?) There comes a time when you have to weigh everything up and make a judgement call on whether it will be worth keeping a player like Gregory around, rather than paying money to get rid, which hampers your spending power like for like on a replacement. It's judgement calls like those that put clubs in trouble. If it was left to me, I'd get rid of Vokes (if we can!?), keep Gregory and Campbell and bring in a front line, younger target man along with another younger striker. That would then give you a good balance of youth, experience and a good contrast in styles. People need to realise the time where we can go picking and choosing around the transfer market like a 10 year old used to go at the Woolworths pick and mix are long gone. Gary Rowett had that and blew all of his load on out of date Fizzy Cola Bottles that had lost their fizz. It doesn't mean we can't be successful but we now have to think before we put those sweets in the bag, rather than blindly filling it up.
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Post by stantheman on Jul 19, 2020 20:29:24 GMT
Gregory is the least of our problems. MON said there would be 31/32 players under contract when they all come back from loan. A massive and expensive squad, many of which we need to cull and lose a fortune. Free transfer Gregory is good to stay.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 20:31:26 GMT
Gregory is the least of our problems. MON said there would be 31/32 players under contract when they all come back from loan. A massive and expensive squad, many of which we need to cull and lose a fortune. Free transfer Gregory is good to stay. He’s a League One player at best. He’s an issue.
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Post by andystokey on Jul 19, 2020 20:33:24 GMT
I'm chuffin sick of "useful" players making up the squad. We need some quality of we are going to get back to the Prem (or even stay afloat safely in the Champs) We cannot keep thinking thses type of players are "useful"... If you told me that he was part of a MON plan such as Cresswell with Pulis then I'd have some process to think. Sorry mate. We've got to recruit or develop better. Its unrealistic to think that we will take that step to the Premiership immediately The current squad have underachieved considerably Useful players who were with our last promotion? Whitehead, Whelan, Wilkinson, Higinbotham, Wilson - they played their part Whitehead and Wilson joined when we were already in the PL and Higginbotham only rejoined after promotion.
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Post by smallthorner on Jul 19, 2020 20:42:56 GMT
I'm chuffin sick of "useful" players making up the squad. We need some quality of we are going to get back to the Prem (or even stay afloat safely in the Champs) We cannot keep thinking thses type of players are "useful"... If you told me that he was part of a MON plan such as Cresswell with Pulis then I'd have some process to think. Sorry mate. We've got to recruit or develop better. Every successful squad in the Championship has those types of players in it. The issue we have is if we get rid of Gregory he will have to be replaced by another cheapo or freebie, on top of whatever it would cost us to subsidise his contract elsewhere. On top of that, we've got the following players to get rid of: Wimmer Woods Afobe(?) Bauer N'Diaye Etebo BMI(?) There comes a time when you have to weigh everything up and make a judgement call on whether it will be worth keeping a player like Gregory around, rather than paying money to get rid, which hampers your spending power like for like on a replacement. It's judgement calls like those that put clubs in trouble. If it was left to me, I'd get rid of Vokes (if we can!?), keep Gregory and Campbell and bring in a front line, younger target man along with another younger striker. That would then give you a good balance of youth, experience and a good contrast in styles. People need to realise the time where we can go picking and choosing around the transfer market like a 10 year old used to go at the Woolworths pick and mix are long gone. Gary Rowett had that and blew all of his load on out of date Fizzy Cola Bottles that had lost their fizz. It doesn't mean we can't be successful but we now have to think before we put those sweets in the bag, rather than blindly filling it up. I get what you're saying mate. I just don't think he's any good. 😁😁 We need to expand our thinking ... With a chief scout like Craig Shakespeare. Or is that a midsummers night dream.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2020 20:46:22 GMT
Every successful squad in the Championship has those types of players in it. The issue we have is if we get rid of Gregory he will have to be replaced by another cheapo or freebie, on top of whatever it would cost us to subsidise his contract elsewhere. On top of that, we've got the following players to get rid of: Wimmer Woods Afobe(?) Bauer N'Diaye Etebo BMI(?) There comes a time when you have to weigh everything up and make a judgement call on whether it will be worth keeping a player like Gregory around, rather than paying money to get rid, which hampers your spending power like for like on a replacement. It's judgement calls like those that put clubs in trouble. If it was left to me, I'd get rid of Vokes (if we can!?), keep Gregory and Campbell and bring in a front line, younger target man along with another younger striker. That would then give you a good balance of youth, experience and a good contrast in styles. People need to realise the time where we can go picking and choosing around the transfer market like a 10 year old used to go at the Woolworths pick and mix are long gone. Gary Rowett had that and blew all of his load on out of date Fizzy Cola Bottles that had lost their fizz. It doesn't mean we can't be successful but we now have to think before we put those sweets in the bag, rather than blindly filling it up. I get what you're saying mate. I just don't think he's any good. 😁😁 We need to expand our thinking ... With a chief scout like Craig Shakespeare. Or is that a midsummers night dream. Given Craig Shakespeare is a coach, then i'd say it's a brain dead idea. Are you getting mixed up with Steve Walsh, who was at Leicester with Pearson and Shakespeare?
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Post by supersimonstainrod on Jul 19, 2020 20:46:45 GMT
I'm chuffin sick of "useful" players making up the squad. We need some quality of we are going to get back to the Prem (or even stay afloat safely in the Champs) We cannot keep thinking thses type of players are "useful"... If you told me that he was part of a MON plan such as Cresswell with Pulis then I'd have some process to think. Sorry mate. We've got to recruit or develop better. Every successful squad in the Championship has those types of players in it. The issue we have is if we get rid of Gregory he will have to be replaced by another cheapo or freebie, on top of whatever it would cost us to subsidise his contract elsewhere. On top of that, we've got the following players to get rid of: Wimmer Woods Afobe(?) Bauer N'Diaye Etebo BMI(?) There comes a time when you have to weigh everything up and make a judgement call on whether it will be worth keeping a player like Gregory around, rather than paying money to get rid, which hampers your spending power like for like on a replacement. It's judgement calls like those that put clubs in trouble. If it was left to me, I'd get rid of Vokes, keep Gregory and Campbell and bring in a front line, younger target man along with another younger striker. That would then give you a good balance of youth, experience and a good contrast in styles. People need to realise the time where we can go picking and choosing around the transfer market like a 10 year old used to go at the Woolworths pick and mix are long gone. Gary Rowett had that and blew all of his load on out of date Fizzy Cola Bottles that had lost their fizz. It doesn't mean we can't be successful but we now have to think before we put those sweets in the bag, rather than blindly filling it up. Most level-headed assessment i've read hitherto. Seriously doubt we're going to ameliorate all the squads ills in one or maybe even two transfer windows,especially with the constraints imposed by FFP ,unfortunately,hence the commendable 'triers' such as Gregory and McClean will have a role to play. Yes you want better if you're going to make a concerted assault on automatic promotion or the play-off places,but committed players will at least buy MON some time to adress the more urgent concerns within the group. For me,Ince represents a bigger problem than JM,despite possessing more ability.
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Post by wrighter on Jul 19, 2020 20:50:02 GMT
leave all the transfers etc to MON
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sean
Academy Starlet
Posts: 236
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Post by sean on Jul 19, 2020 20:51:00 GMT
Gregory is the least of our problems. MON said there would be 31/32 players under contract when they all come back from loan. A massive and expensive squad, many of which we need to cull and lose a fortune. Free transfer Gregory is good to stay. Bosman signing Gregory is one of the best paid players at the club and for someone of his very limited ability we could do with moving him on as quickly as possible and that is also why he wants to stay as nobody else will pay him what he's getting here.
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Post by smallthorner on Jul 19, 2020 20:51:34 GMT
I get what you're saying mate. I just don't think he's any good. 😁😁 We need to expand our thinking ... With a chief scout like Craig Shakespeare. Or is that a midsummers night dream. Given Craig Shakespeare is a coach, then i'd say it's a brain dead idea. Are you getting mixed up with Steve Walsh, who was at Leicester with Pearson and Shakespeare? No.
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Post by smallthorner on Jul 19, 2020 20:52:40 GMT
Gregory is the least of our problems. MON said there would be 31/32 players under contract when they all come back from loan. A massive and expensive squad, many of which we need to cull and lose a fortune. Free transfer Gregory is good to stay. Bosman signing Gregory is one of the best paid players at the club and for someone of his very limited ability we could do with moving him on as quickly as possible and that is also why he wants to stay as nobody else will pay him what he's getting here. Yep
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Post by smallthorner on Jul 19, 2020 20:56:18 GMT
Every successful squad in the Championship has those types of players in it. The issue we have is if we get rid of Gregory he will have to be replaced by another cheapo or freebie, on top of whatever it would cost us to subsidise his contract elsewhere. On top of that, we've got the following players to get rid of: Wimmer Woods Afobe(?) Bauer N'Diaye Etebo BMI(?) There comes a time when you have to weigh everything up and make a judgement call on whether it will be worth keeping a player like Gregory around, rather than paying money to get rid, which hampers your spending power like for like on a replacement. It's judgement calls like those that put clubs in trouble. If it was left to me, I'd get rid of Vokes, keep Gregory and Campbell and bring in a front line, younger target man along with another younger striker. That would then give you a good balance of youth, experience and a good contrast in styles. People need to realise the time where we can go picking and choosing around the transfer market like a 10 year old used to go at the Woolworths pick and mix are long gone. Gary Rowett had that and blew all of his load on out of date Fizzy Cola Bottles that had lost their fizz. It doesn't mean we can't be successful but we now have to think before we put those sweets in the bag, rather than blindly filling it up. Most level-headed assessment i've read hitherto. Seriously doubt we're going to ameliorate all the squads ills in one or maybe even two transfer windows,especially with the constraints imoosed by FFP ,unfortunately,hence the commendable 'triers' such as Gregory and McClean will have a role to play. Yes you want better if you're going to make a concerted assault on automatic promotion or the play-off places,but committed players will at least buy MON some time to adress the more urgent concerns within the group. For me,Ince represents a bigger problem than JM,despite possessing more ability. Surely that is an indication of the coach's ability.
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Post by smallthorner on Jul 19, 2020 21:36:20 GMT
We need to be realistic and MON has said that a top half finish is the next target (I'm sure like all of us, a top 6 finish would be a bonus) We have too many players in the squad and I think O'Neil knows who he wants to keep and who he wants to move on He'll also be looking at a few to bring in, but too many changes isn't necessarily the best way to progress. Our route to the Premiership came from a group of players who gave everything for the club and worked as a team Most of them improved as we played against better opposition We played some amazing football under Hughes, but getting out of the Championship (promotion) needs a different sort of character MON has a vision for our future (he wouldn't have accepted the job if that wasn't the case) I think that the likes of Vokes, Gregory, Batth fit that bill. I also believe that he will develop some of our younger players, Collins, Campbell, Verlinden, Sorensen playing alongside those with experience at that level Get to the Premiership then yes we would need a serious upgrade, just as Wolves have done Vokes Gregory and Batth Leading our Prrmiership assault?? Okeydokey
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Post by lordb on Jul 19, 2020 21:47:26 GMT
Gregory is the least of our problems. MON said there would be 31/32 players under contract when they all come back from loan. A massive and expensive squad, many of which we need to cull and lose a fortune. Free transfer Gregory is good to stay. Bosman signing Gregory is one of the best paid players at the club and for someone of his very limited ability we could do with moving him on as quickly as possible and that is also why he wants to stay as nobody else will pay him what he's getting here. He's no where bear the highest Ince,Adobe,Wimmer, Butland, Shawcross, Allen, Clucas,Diouf all on more or a lot more
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Post by supersimonstainrod on Jul 19, 2020 21:49:17 GMT
Most level-headed assessment i've read hitherto. Seriously doubt we're going to ameliorate all the squads ills in one or maybe even two transfer windows,especially with the constraints imoosed by FFP ,unfortunately,hence the commendable 'triers' such as Gregory and McClean will have a role to play. Yes you want better if you're going to make a concerted assault on automatic promotion or the play-off places,but committed players will at least buy MON some time to adress the more urgent concerns within the group. For me,Ince represents a bigger problem than JM,despite possessing more ability. Surely that is an indication of the coach's ability. I think MON has already signposted his coaching ability to get a disparate group of individuals functioning as a coherent disciplined unit with what he's achieved with us this season.(Notwithstanding the odd tactical/selection brainfart on his part along the way.) His work with Ireland testifies to his facility for getting a group of quite mediocre talents to punch collectively and sustainedly above their weight. Does he have the managerial nous to improve players individually,and can he engender in the likes of Ince and Powell the will and desire to influence games with the regularity that their skillset should enable them to remains to be seen,but will be an interesting development if he's not able to simply bring in better alternatives for positions than the current incumbent.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 22:15:18 GMT
Bosman signing Gregory is one of the best paid players at the club and for someone of his very limited ability we could do with moving him on as quickly as possible and that is also why he wants to stay as nobody else will pay him what he's getting here. He's no where bear the highest Ince,Adobe,Wimmer, Butland, Shawcross, Allen, Clucas,Diouf all on more or a lot more Not what I’ve been told tbf.
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Post by pottersrule on Jul 19, 2020 22:29:19 GMT
What are peoples thoughts on this?On Stoke-on-Trent live. It's for the manager to decide I'd say.We need players that are committed and give it all out on the pitch,and Gregory fits the mould.He is an O'Neill type of player,and he wants to stay. A definite yes from me.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 22:31:53 GMT
What are peoples thoughts on this?On Stoke-on-Trent live. It's for the manager to decide I'd say.We need players that are committed and give it all out on the pitch,and Gregory fits the mould.He is an O'Neill type of player,and he wants to stay. A definite yes from me. But he’s fucking dreadful! He’s a league one player. His touch is poor. His finishing is beyond dreadful. He offers absolutely fuck all. Before yesterday this wasn’t even a conversation. It should not be changed because of one game. Why are people so short sighted?
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Post by Stretfordpotterer on Jul 19, 2020 22:39:37 GMT
He’s not good enough.
But I, and many more, said that about my a number of the team that got us promoted, and players who kept us in the the Prem.
O’Neill probably needs to start on a basis of players who actually want to be here and go from there.
He’s got a template now, and Gregory, as much as I spent a lot of the Bristol game berating him, just played a big part in what I would say were the best two back to back performances of the season, in terms of tactical discipline.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 22:44:34 GMT
He’s not good enough. But I, and many more, said that about my a number of the team that got us promoted, and players who kept us in the the Prem. O’Neill probably needs to start on a basis of players who actually want to be here and go from there. He’s got a template now, and Gregory, as much as I spent a lot of the Bristol game berating him, just played a big part in what I would say were the best two back to back performances of the season, in terms of tactical discipline. He was piss poor against Brizzle.
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Post by pottersrule on Jul 19, 2020 22:53:15 GMT
It's for the manager to decide I'd say.We need players that are committed and give it all out on the pitch,and Gregory fits the mould.He is an O'Neill type of player,and he wants to stay. A definite yes from me. But he’s fucking dreadful! He’s a league one player. His touch is poor. His finishing is beyond dreadful. He offers absolutely fuck all. Before yesterday this wasn’t even a conversation. It should not be changed because of one game. Why are people so short sighted? As I said I'd leave it too the manager.He hasn't been involved for months and has zero confidence in front of goal,his pressing,hold up play and link up play is very good and the two starts he has had since lock down hasn't done his case any harm.If Michael O'Neil decides to keep him I won't be moaning and calling him short sighted.
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Post by Stretfordpotterer on Jul 19, 2020 22:55:36 GMT
He’s not good enough. But I, and many more, said that about my a number of the team that got us promoted, and players who kept us in the the Prem. O’Neill probably needs to start on a basis of players who actually want to be here and go from there. He’s got a template now, and Gregory, as much as I spent a lot of the Bristol game berating him, just played a big part in what I would say were the best two back to back performances of the season, in terms of tactical discipline. He was piss poor against Brizzle. I’d say he was abject in front of goal. And woeful in general for 45 minutes. But having screamed for him to be hooked in favour of Campbell, by the time he actually came off I thought he was really starting to hold the ball up well and looked way better than Vokes 2nd half. Thought he contributed to a decent 2nd half showing. Then put in another decent shift v Brentford. Like I say, I don’t think he’s good enough. But I do think he’s one of those players that could prove people wrong in the right set up.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 22:57:15 GMT
But he’s fucking dreadful! He’s a league one player. His touch is poor. His finishing is beyond dreadful. He offers absolutely fuck all. Before yesterday this wasn’t even a conversation. It should not be changed because of one game. Why are people so short sighted? As I said I'd leave it too the manager.He hasn't been involved for months and has zero confidence in front of goal,his pressing,hold up play and link up play is very good and the two starts he has had since lock down hasn't done his case any harm.If Michael O'Neil decides to keep him I won't be moaning and calling him short sighted. Him being shit in front of goal is nothing to do with confidence or not being involved for months though. We need so much better.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 19, 2020 22:58:40 GMT
He was piss poor against Brizzle. I’d say he was abject in front of goal. And woeful in general for 45 minutes. But having screamed for him to be hooked in favour of Campbell, by the time he actually came off I thought he was really starting to hold the ball up well and looked way better than Vokes 2nd half. Thought he contributed to a decent 2nd half showing. Then put in another decent shift v Brentford. Like I say, I don’t think he’s good enough. But I do think he’s one of those players that could prove people wrong in the right set up. He’s shown exactly what he is, a League One player. Even in the second half against Brizzle he was piss poor and should have been hooked. We don’t need another striker that can’t score.
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Post by pottersrule on Jul 20, 2020 5:46:04 GMT
As I said I'd leave it too the manager.He hasn't been involved for months and has zero confidence in front of goal,his pressing,hold up play and link up play is very good and the two starts he has had since lock down hasn't done his case any harm.If Michael O'Neil decides to keep him I won't be moaning and calling him short sighted. Him being shit in front of goal is nothing to do with confidence or not being involved for months though. We need so much better. Oh Alright then!
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Post by sheikhmomo on Jul 20, 2020 5:55:41 GMT
Letting him go and keeping planky would be daft.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jul 20, 2020 7:32:35 GMT
I'd keep him with my eyes closed, no problem. Underrated player for me. His movement and work rate shames Vokes, who cost a hell of a lot more and will no doubt be on a lot more too. He's only scored 3 less goals than Vokes too. Keeping players like him will get us nowhere.. He's a league one grafter striker. No more no less. Vokes at least can play as a target man If we keep signing piss poor journeymen like this we will stabilise in this league.(for ever) If by target man you mean an outlet with his back to goal to bring others into play I'd take Gregory over Vokes every time. Vokes hardly ever wins a header with his back to goal and his movement is poor - he looks like he should be a good target man but he actually isn't. Gregory is quicker, makes intelligent runs, closes down defenders and is better at bringing others into play. Vokes is more of a natural goal scorer than Gregory but hardly prolific these days. If we're looking to ship out a striker I'd keep Gregory and let Vokes go - especially as his attitude and work ethic appears more suited to what MON wants in his team.
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