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Post by musik on Sept 23, 2019 10:36:05 GMT
I'm the most patient person in the world, but I would say : this week. For his own sake!
If any of these two games ends in a loss, then it's farewell.
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Post by pavel on Sept 23, 2019 10:44:28 GMT
Well the last international break was the right time but that didn't happen, so I'll go for now.
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Post by vahl on Sept 23, 2019 10:45:00 GMT
We should let him proceed.
We don’t have the patience, it’s been nothing but disappointment after disappointment so it’s entirely understandable but this will pay off in the end.
Give him the time he needs to make it better.
Patience is a virtue here.
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Post by iglugluk on Sept 23, 2019 10:48:13 GMT
We should let him proceed. We don’t have the patience, it’s been nothing but disappointment after disappointment so it’s entirely understandable but this will pay off in the end. Give him the time he needs to make it better. Patience is a virtue here. The board simply cannot sit on their hands waiting for him to get it together if that means relegation as far as I'm concerned.
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Post by madnellie on Sept 23, 2019 10:49:52 GMT
This came on the radio earlier. Clearly a sign.
(Also, what a tune! Hadn't heard it in years).
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Post by MilanStokie on Sept 23, 2019 10:53:36 GMT
It should really be today.
However, a small part of me wants to see if the elements of pragmatism (even if it was boring as) displayed against Brentford could be used to get 3 points vs Forest. If so, then I think he deserves to keep the job.
90% of me has no faith in the above happening though.
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Post by lordb on Sept 23, 2019 11:12:10 GMT
If Hughton doesn't want it then we may as well stick. However confident he would take the job. I'm sure all ex Premier League managers will sit tight and wait for the next club in the top flight that is in trouble and wants a new manager to save them from the drop. Why on earth should they pass on those opportunities that come up as the season progresses and take on a mess of a club at the bottom of the Championship? There were managers passing up the chance to move to Stoke when Hughes was sacked, including Rowett at Derby, so why should we be attractive to anyone now? The only managers who would jump at the chance are lower league managers who want to move up the ladder and we got the best of those in Jones. 100% Hughton would jump at any Premier League job however think he'd be way down the list of any Premier League club & thibk he knows it's extremely likely he's going to have to take a Championship Club The club, despite the league position, will still be more attractive than the likes of Barnsley or Wigan think that, right now, Hughton & Stoke are a good fit for each other Of course another six weeks & we might not be.
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Post by mamasgloves on Sept 23, 2019 11:16:27 GMT
It should really be today. However, a small part of me wants to see if the elements of pragmatism (even if it was boring as) displayed against Brentford could be used to get 3 points vs Forest. If so, then I think he deserves to keep the job. 90% of me has no faith in the above happening though. Lets say he nicks the game with more pulisball, is that really a positive when you look at the bigger picture? It's not his chosen/preferred style or system and he'll change again once he feels safe, at which point we'll be back to square one.
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Post by gingerninja on Sept 23, 2019 11:19:27 GMT
If Hughton has expressed interest in joining should the chance arrive, them 100% yes we should be all over him like a rash.
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Post by str8outtahampton on Sept 23, 2019 11:33:59 GMT
It should really be today. However, a small part of me wants to see if the elements of pragmatism (even if it was boring as) displayed against Brentford could be used to get 3 points vs Forest. If so, then I think he deserves to keep the job. 90% of me has no faith in the above happening though. Some would call Saturday pragmatic. For me it was closer to "hanging on". Brentford are, I would judge, an averagely competent Championship side. I seriously doubt they will be relegated. And I am very confident they won't make top 6. Yet they cut our defence to ribbons on 5 or 6 occasions, simply passing their way through. Their movement was better, their pressing was better, their options were better. Thankfully their finishing was as bad as ours. So I agree with your 90% assessment. Whether the club does is another question. But at the moment I just do not see us getting another 48 points. Or anywhere near.
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Post by gingerninja on Sept 23, 2019 11:36:30 GMT
I agree the last poster, yes Butland made few saves but we were passed through too many times for comfort, with a decent strike force we could have lost quite comfortably.
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Post by chigstoke on Sept 23, 2019 12:19:08 GMT
If Hughton has expressed interest in joining should the chance arrive, them 100% yes we should be all over him like a rash. Definitely. We have to be at least getting the feelers out to him. The board have to know that we potentially have to swing the axe soon if we lose Friday, and God forbid next Tuesday as well. If we haven't at least gauged his interest level during this situation then we need fucking. We cannot get rid of Jones until we know we have someone lined up with certain interest. We've made this mistake before. If he's interested now, get rid, and if we get embarrased on national TV on Friday then we absolutely have no choice surely?
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Post by MilanStokie on Sept 23, 2019 12:22:01 GMT
It should really be today. However, a small part of me wants to see if the elements of pragmatism (even if it was boring as) displayed against Brentford could be used to get 3 points vs Forest. If so, then I think he deserves to keep the job. 90% of me has no faith in the above happening though. Lets say he nicks the game with more pulisball, is that really a positive when you look at the bigger picture? It's not his chosen/preferred style or system and he'll change again once he feels safe, at which point we'll be back to square one. I dont think we are in a position to worry about the bigger picture. Relegation would be disastrous and therefore worrying about how pretty the nogger is should be bottom of our priorities. We need to win games and if that means the ugliest football seen in decades, then so be it.
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Post by MilanStokie on Sept 23, 2019 12:23:50 GMT
It should really be today. However, a small part of me wants to see if the elements of pragmatism (even if it was boring as) displayed against Brentford could be used to get 3 points vs Forest. If so, then I think he deserves to keep the job. 90% of me has no faith in the above happening though. Some would call Saturday pragmatic. For me it was closer to "hanging on". Brentford are, I would judge, an averagely competent Championship side. I seriously doubt they will be relegated. And I am very confident they won't make top 6. Yet they cut our defence to ribbons on 5 or 6 occasions, simply passing their way through. Their movement was better, their pressing was better, their options were better. Thankfully their finishing was as bad as ours. So I agree with your 90% assessment. Whether the club does is another question. But at the moment I just do not see us getting another 48 points. Or anywhere near. I did say the elements of pragmatism. I am not sure the entire approach was pragmatic though. Clearly he set up to avoid defeat, hoping to nick a 1-0 win. He nearly did it as well if that 1 on 1 was put away late on. I still dont think he is the right man though, but the situation can still allow for a turn around (just). Last chance saloon on Friday though, which is already a must-win game, which is sad given we arent even 2 months into the season!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2019 12:30:47 GMT
And if a new manager loses his first ten games and draws the next three, do we get rid of him as well?
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Post by chigstoke on Sept 23, 2019 12:31:46 GMT
Lets say he nicks the game with more pulisball, is that really a positive when you look at the bigger picture? It's not his chosen/preferred style or system and he'll change again once he feels safe, at which point we'll be back to square one. I dont think we are in a position to worry about the bigger picture. Relegation would be disastrous and therefore worrying about how pretty the nogger is should be bottom of our priorities. We need to win games and if that means the ugliest football seen in decades, then so be it. I know it's happened before, but if we fell into the third tier nowadays, it's going to be disastrous on all fronts. Player wise, finanial wise, massively reduced attendances, we'd be so far up shit creek than the paddle has been worn completely thin.
We'll be stuck in League 1 for years to come because I can't forsee us escaping it very quickly if we do go down.
The fact that this is all now a realistic possibility is just staggering after being in the Premier League for 10 years. How have Stoke City allowed it to get to this point?
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Post by shangamuzo on Sept 23, 2019 12:37:09 GMT
God isn't impressed with Nathan so far as manager of Stoke City.
Intervene God because Jones appears to have unshakeable faith in you.
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Post by str8outtahampton on Sept 23, 2019 12:43:34 GMT
Some would call Saturday pragmatic. For me it was closer to "hanging on". Brentford are, I would judge, an averagely competent Championship side. I seriously doubt they will be relegated. And I am very confident they won't make top 6. Yet they cut our defence to ribbons on 5 or 6 occasions, simply passing their way through. Their movement was better, their pressing was better, their options were better. Thankfully their finishing was as bad as ours. So I agree with your 90% assessment. Whether the club does is another question. But at the moment I just do not see us getting another 48 points. Or anywhere near. I did say the elements of pragmatism. I am not sure the entire approach was pragmatic though. Clearly he set up to avoid defeat, hoping to nick a 1-0 win. He nearly did it as well if that 1 on 1 was put away late on. I still dont think he is the right man though, but the situation can still allow for a turn around (just). Last chance saloon on Friday though, which is already a must-win game, which is sad given we arent even 2 months into the season! Quite right - you did. My comment was aimed more at those who weren't there and for whom the result and bare statistics might suggest it was a solid and satisfactory performance, and the start of a brighter tomorrow. For me it just wasn't. Notwithstanding the one on one, which was a gilt-edged opportunity, we were second best to an average side. The performance had relegation written all over it. That said, even if we do lose on Friday (and nothing on Saturday suggested we won't), I do not think the club will pull the trigger. It feels like someone in the casino, losing heavily, and continuing to double the stake. Of course eventually that gambler will win, assuming he has enough capital. Sadly there is no guarantee that a poor team will do the same.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 23, 2019 12:44:37 GMT
He should have gone after the Leeds game where it was so abundantly clear how far we had regressed now he had his own team.
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Sept 23, 2019 13:00:31 GMT
I dont think we are in a position to worry about the bigger picture. Relegation would be disastrous and therefore worrying about how pretty the nogger is should be bottom of our priorities. We need to win games and if that means the ugliest football seen in decades, then so be it. I know it's happened before, but if we fell into the third tier nowadays, it's going to be disastrous on all fronts. Player wise, finanial wise, massively reduced attendances, we'd be so far up shit creek than the paddle has been worn completely thin. We'll be stuck in League 1 for years to come because I can't forsee us escaping it very quickly if we do go down.
The fact that this is all now a realistic possibility is just staggering after being in the Premier League for 10 years. How have Stoke City allowed it to get to this point?
How it has been allowed has to be down to complacency and incompetence within the senior management at the club that has allowed all the things that have gone on to go uncorrected and has been dicussed on here time and time again. What's gone is gone, however right now are in a position where our supposed target of promotion has been usurped by that of merely staying up before September is out. I'm not sure our squad is necessarily good enough for promotion but I'm damn sure it's too good to be relegation fodder. The fact that we are has to be down to what the manager is getting (or isn't getting) out of that squad. Right now we need someone who can set the side up to get points - any points. No other objective. That requires meticulous preparation regarding the opposition, playing to stop their game (because we certainly don't have one of our own at the moment), everyone knowing their position and their job on the day, picking the team on form not reputation, being fit enough to be playing as hard in the 90th minute as in the first, using our substitutions wisely, getting defensive basics right and making the most of our own set pieces. I'm not sure Jones has shown himself particulalry capabale of delivering any of that, I'm not sure that he's likely to any time soon, and we don't have the luxury of being able to wait while he learns on the job.
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Post by thevoid on Sept 23, 2019 13:16:31 GMT
And if a new manager loses his first ten games and draws the next three, do we get rid of him as well? Yes, because those results would suggest someone being out of their depth and leading us to relegation. Do Stoke fans actually want to see their team win some games of football or are we just going to abandon that notion entirely?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2019 13:44:18 GMT
And if a new manager loses his first ten games and draws the next three, do we get rid of him as well? Yes, because those results would suggest someone being out of their depth and leading us to relegation. Do Stoke fans actually want to see their team win some games of football or are we just going to abandon that notion entirely? I have no idea what you're talking about...
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 23, 2019 14:05:26 GMT
And if a new manager loses his first ten games and draws the next three, do we get rid of him as well? We have to sack Jones now - otherwise we won't be able to appoint our Lord and Saviour Chris The Infallible Hughton before the international break which in turn will mean not being able to sack the fraud Chris The Charlatan Hughton before Xmas in order to give the next saviour/fraud the chance to disappoint with their new year signings. Get with the program. PS I believe the club now include a P45 with every contract to save postage.
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Post by Sfance on Sept 23, 2019 14:15:17 GMT
Every disaster has to have its apologist. KPSJA has answered the call.
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Post by thevoid on Sept 23, 2019 14:29:33 GMT
Yes, because those results would suggest someone being out of their depth and leading us to relegation. Do Stoke fans actually want to see their team win some games of football or are we just going to abandon that notion entirely? I have no idea what you're talking about... Nothing to see here. Get your head back under the sand fella. It's all peachy
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Post by pavel on Sept 23, 2019 14:45:11 GMT
And if a new manager loses his first ten games and draws the next three, do we get rid of him as well? We have to sack Jones now - otherwise we won't be able to appoint our Lord and Saviour Chris The Infallible Hughton before the international break which in turn will mean not being able to sack the fraud Chris The Charlatan Hughton before Xmas in order to give the next saviour/fraud the chance to disappoint with their new year signings. Get with the program. PS I believe the club now include a P45 with every contract to save postage. So you don't want us to act like every other modern successful clubs of the last decade by making hard decisions when the manager just isn't performing and looking at the market for a better product. That's why we are where we are now by not modernising our structure, fishing in a small pool for our managers and sticking our head in the sand hoping for deliverance when everything is going pear-shaped around us. There isn't a program just a god awful mess, lack of any discernible progress and 2 points out of 24 and 3 wins since he arrived. No other forward looking club with ambition would tolerate such a situation.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2019 15:03:43 GMT
Peter Coates said himself that , Paul lambert wasn't given enough time
And Hughes for all his thoughts had a better win rate than zero per cent
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Post by dirtygary69 on Sept 23, 2019 15:24:45 GMT
And if a new manager loses his first ten games and draws the next three, do we get rid of him as well? We have to sack Jones now - otherwise we won't be able to appoint our Lord and Saviour Chris The Infallible Hughton before the international break which in turn will mean not being able to sack the fraud Chris The Charlatan Hughton before Xmas in order to give the next saviour/fraud the chance to disappoint with their new year signings. Get with the program. PS I believe the club now include a P45 with every contract to save postage. Happy with relegation then? Sound.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 23, 2019 15:25:42 GMT
We have to sack Jones now - otherwise we won't be able to appoint our Lord and Saviour Chris The Infallible Hughton before the international break which in turn will mean not being able to sack the fraud Chris The Charlatan Hughton before Xmas in order to give the next saviour/fraud the chance to disappoint with their new year signings. Get with the program. PS I believe the club now include a P45 with every contract to save postage. So you don't want us to act like every other modern successful clubs of the last decade by making hard decisions when the manager just isn't performing and looking at the market for a better product. That's why we are where we are now by not modernising our structure, fishing in a small pool for our managers and sticking our head in the sand hoping for deliverance when everything is going pear-shaped around us. There isn't a program just a god awful mess, lack of any discernible progress and 2 points out of 24 and 3 wins since he arrived. No other forward looking club with ambition would tolerate such a situation. How many modern successful clubs have had 4 managers in 2 years? There are exceptions (eg Watford - but that currently isn't looking like a good example) but if a club is changing their manager every few months there is a bigger problem than the manager - and just sacking the manager isn't the answer - in fact if the underlying issues aren't addressed the chances are it will just make things worse. Those people calling for patience aren't denying there is a problem. All they are doing is pointing out the problem runs deeper and that changing the manger isn't necessarily the answer. Which given our trajectory since we really got a taste for scape goating the manager is sort of obvious. Jones was hailed as our saviour by many on here and now Hughton is getting the same bonkers adulation Jones got on his appointment. It's just wishful thinking wrapped up in a call for decisive action. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I'm not questioning the motivation - I'm questioning the blind faith in our next saviour.
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Post by silsdenstokie on Sept 23, 2019 15:35:36 GMT
Should have been 3 weeks ago, straight after the Brum game
The board are playing a very dangerous game
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