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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 9:17:06 GMT
FAir enough. You prefer spineless mercenaries like Afobe, Ince et al. To each his own.
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Post by thevoid on Apr 29, 2019 15:32:11 GMT
FAir enough. You prefer spineless mercenaries like Afobe, Ince et al. To each his own. Quite the opposite. I just think soundbites like 'Stoke DNA' and 'Dog's home' a bit cringey, that's all.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 19:50:10 GMT
FAir enough. You prefer spineless mercenaries like Afobe, Ince et al. To each his own. Quite the opposite. I just think soundbites like 'Stoke DNA' and 'Dog's home' a bit cringey, that's all. Oh I get it...sort of like thevoid?
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Post by Widget123 on Apr 29, 2019 20:39:18 GMT
Jones is here for the foreseeable to say the very least - at least next season if not two seasons in my opinion. I actually think Rowett would have been given to the end of the season (reading between the lines) if he hadn't started a spat with the fans. That was largely his undoing rather than the performances, which were utter shite certainly, but his days were numbered once he opened his mouth and started saying stuff without thinking it through first.
For what its worth I'll give Jones credit for sorting out our defence but that's been at the utter cost of any forward momentum. That 9 game run from the 13th of Feb to the 6th of April saw us amount 2 wins and 7 draws and if nothing else stabilised a season of complete parallel performances where we swung from winning to losing with nothing inbetween.
The scariest stat of the Rowett era is that we conceded 20% of our goals against in the 41st to 50th minute and 18% of our goals against 81st to 90th+ minutes. It was clear to most supporters that we didn't have the fitness or mental application to play to the end of the half/game and that coupled with bizarre subs in the closing stages of games meant that we threw away points in nine games prior to Jones' arrival on the 9th of Jan. On only two occasions did we administer that sort of kick in the bollocks to the opposition.
Whether that lack of fitness/mental application was wholly down to Rowett's coaching or former premier league players assuming all they'd have to do is turn up and walk around the opposition (who were all more fired up, willing to work hard and chase down their opposition) is a discussion for another thread perhaps?
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Apr 29, 2019 21:10:51 GMT
Jones is here for the foreseeable to say the very least - at least next season if not two seasons in my opinion. I actually think Rowett would have been given to the end of the season (reading between the lines) if he hadn't started a spat with the fans. That was largely his undoing rather than the performances, which were utter shite certainly, but his days were numbered once he opened his mouth and started saying stuff without thinking it through first. For what its worth I'll give Jones credit for sorting out our defence but that's been at the utter cost of any forward momentum. That 9 game run from the 13th of Feb to the 6th of April saw us amount 2 wins and 7 draws and if nothing else stabilised a season of complete parallel performances where we swung from winning to losing with nothing inbetween. The scariest stat of the Rowett era is that we conceded 20% of our goals against in the 41st to 50th minute and 18% of our goals against 81st to 90th+ minutes. It was clear to most supporters that we didn't have the fitness or mental application to play to the end of the half/game and that coupled with bizarre subs in the closing stages of games meant that we threw away points in nine games prior to Jones' arrival on the 9th of Jan. On only two occasions did we administer that sort of kick in the bollocks to the opposition. Whether that lack of fitness/mental application was wholly down to Rowett's coaching or former premier league players assuming all they'd have to do is turn up and walk around the opposition (who were all more fired up, willing to work hard and chase down their opposition) is a discussion for another thread perhaps? I think you're right - Jones is going to get 2 maybe 3 seasons to sort it out. Only a serious threat of relegation will see him removed next season. Anyone thinking he's got a handful of games needs their head examining - how stupid would it be to give Jones his way in the transfer market to build a side with a very particular style of play and then oust him before its bedded in. If the club were to do that we really are going down the toilet. Jones made a very interesting observation the other day when he pointed out that the Premiership squad may have got tuned to eeking out 40 points a season - which means working hard on the winnable games and accepting defeat in others. The mentality in the Championship - especially if your aim is promotion - is that every game is winnable (which it is) and may account for the application issue. As well as the personnel the attitude of the players is going to have to change out of all recognition - and to be fair there has been one or two glimpses of this already, I find it incredible that some posters think it's just a matter of changing the manager or getting a new striker or whatever their pet simple fix might be. The problems run far deeper and will require a significant amount of time and patience to sort out.
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Post by Gods on Apr 29, 2019 23:13:57 GMT
Do some people seriously think he'll be sacked? I mean, seriously believe the Coates family is considering removing him? His immediate predecessor was hauled in to a room and summarily fired with a far better record over a similar duration. Having said that I don't think it's likely but that's only because we can't keep sacking managers and he seems like a good bloke.
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Post by Fegg 'Ayes Observer on Apr 30, 2019 6:44:16 GMT
Sack the fecker along with all the other useless feckers!
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Post by TheProletarian on Apr 30, 2019 7:07:27 GMT
Quite the opposite. I just think soundbites like 'Stoke DNA' and 'Dog's home' a bit cringey, that's all. Oh I get it...sort of like thevoid? this is the worst kind of fan, he probably wants us to go down to league two and have 6k fans just so he can say he’s a ‘true fan’ with ‘stoke DNA’. Cringe. As. Fuck.
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Post by TheProletarian on Apr 30, 2019 7:08:11 GMT
Sack the fecker along with all the other useless feckers! all the other useless feckers sure but I’d give him another transfer window
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 7:12:25 GMT
Do some people seriously think he'll be sacked? I mean, seriously believe the Coates family is considering removing him? His immediate predecessor was hauled in to a room and summarily fired with a far better record over a similar duration. Having said that I don't think it's likely but that's only because we can't keep sacking managers and he seems like a good bloke. AND BECAUSE HE HASN'T HAD A FULL SUMMER AND A FORTUNE TO SPEND LIKE HIS IMMEDIATE PREDECESSOR JESUS FUCKING CHRIST
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Post by SCFC92 on Apr 30, 2019 7:24:51 GMT
He isn't going anywhere.
This is a project, which will take time.
Get used to it and have patience.
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Post by senojbor on Apr 30, 2019 7:33:20 GMT
He was a poor appointment in the first place. We needed a manager that was use to managing at a higher level. It hasn't worked out, anyone can see that. A radical rethink is needed by the idiots who run the club before we cement ourselves in this dogshit league.
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Post by potterpaul on Apr 30, 2019 7:37:44 GMT
His work this season is totally irrelevant to the long term project. The first review point comes in 12 months. So why sack Rowett mid term. They brought him in to start the change, yes he had a half season free hit as far as results go as long as the massive rebuild and the future plan was seen to take shape. It hasn't, we are no nearer to seeing Jones grand scheme now than when he arrived. The last 4 months have been totally wasted by NJ a massive wasted opportunity to get 20% of this massive job underway, instead the whole process won't get started now until half way through preseason, when he starts trying to get a good portion of this seasons shit to work with a handful of his type of players in his system.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 7:42:45 GMT
His work this season is totally irrelevant to the long term project. The first review point comes in 12 months. So why sack Rowett mid term. They brought him in to start the change, yes he had a half season free hit as far as results go as long as the massive rebuild and the future plan was seen to take shape. It hasn't, we are no nearer to seeing Jones grand scheme now than when he arrived. The last 4 months have been totally wasted by NJ a massive wasted opportunity to get 20% of this massive job underway, instead the whole process won't get started now until half way through preseason, when he starts trying to get a good portion of this seasons shit to work with a handful of his type of players in his system. Because things weren't going to get any better under Rowett. He'd actually created an even bigger task to get back to where we were with his appalling transfer business. And the job is underway, it's just a slow process, as it was always going to have to be.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2019 7:43:23 GMT
His work this season is totally irrelevant to the long term project. The first review point comes in 12 months. So why sack Rowett mid term. They brought him in to start the change, yes he had a half season free hit as far as results go as long as the massive rebuild and the future plan was seen to take shape. It hasn't, we are no nearer to seeing Jones grand scheme now than when he arrived. The last 4 months have been totally wasted by NJ a massive wasted opportunity to get 20% of this massive job underway, instead the whole process won't get started now until half way through preseason, when he starts trying to get a good portion of this seasons shit to work with a handful of his type of players in his system. In what way has it been wasted in terms of starting to get the "massive job underway"?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 7:45:17 GMT
He was a poor appointment in the first place. We needed a manager that was use to managing at a higher level. It hasn't worked out, anyone can see that. Why did we need a manager used to managing at a higher level? That only applies to two of the top 8 in this league as things stand, and one of those had never managed in England before.
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Post by manchesterpotter on Apr 30, 2019 7:46:36 GMT
His work this season is totally irrelevant to the long term project. The first review point comes in 12 months. So why sack Rowett mid term. They brought him in to start the change, yes he had a half season free hit as far as results go as long as the massive rebuild and the future plan was seen to take shape. It hasn't, we are no nearer to seeing Jones grand scheme now than when he arrived. The last 4 months have been totally wasted by NJ a massive wasted opportunity to get 20% of this massive job underway, instead the whole process won't get started now until half way through preseason, when he starts trying to get a good portion of this seasons shit to work with a handful of his type of players in his system. To be fair to Jones, what exactly was he supposed to do in the last four months? He's said that he doesn't have players who fit his preferred system and he hasn't had a transfer window to address that. Surely that only leaves him with working out which players in the squad he wants to keep and which ones he doesn't?
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Post by Gods on Apr 30, 2019 7:46:42 GMT
His immediate predecessor was hauled in to a room and summarily fired with a far better record over a similar duration. Having said that I don't think it's likely but that's only because we can't keep sacking managers and he seems like a good bloke. AND BECAUSE HE HASN'T HAD A FULL SUMMER AND A FORTUNE TO SPEND LIKE HIS IMMEDIATE PREDECESSOR JESUS FUCKING CHRIST That didn't stop Lambert getting sacked 10 short months ago ! As for 'Jesus Fucking Christ' now that would be a good appointment :-)
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Post by potterpaul on Apr 30, 2019 7:49:50 GMT
So why sack Rowett mid term. They brought him in to start the change, yes he had a half season free hit as far as results go as long as the massive rebuild and the future plan was seen to take shape. It hasn't, we are no nearer to seeing Jones grand scheme now than when he arrived. The last 4 months have been totally wasted by NJ a massive wasted opportunity to get 20% of this massive job underway, instead the whole process won't get started now until half way through preseason, when he starts trying to get a good portion of this seasons shit to work with a handful of his type of players in his system. In what way has it been wasted in terms of starting to get the "massive job underway"? I explained why in my post I'm not going to repeat it
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 7:58:01 GMT
AND BECAUSE HE HASN'T HAD A FULL SUMMER AND A FORTUNE TO SPEND LIKE HIS IMMEDIATE PREDECESSOR JESUS FUCKING CHRIST That didn't stop Lambert getting sacked 10 short months ago ! As for 'Jesus Fucking Christ' now that would be a good appointment :-) Apples and oranges though isn’t it? One was brought in as a firefighter, the other as part of a rebuilding job. You don’t bring in a young manager with a remit to build a younger, hungrier side and then bin him before he has the tools to do that just because he hasn’t walked in and instantly turned water into wine.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 7:59:26 GMT
In what way has it been wasted in terms of starting to get the "massive job underway"? I explained why in my post I'm not going to repeat it But he has got the massive job underway? He’s started blooding the youngsters, he’s got the team fitter and better organised, he’s found a place for Etebo, who the previous fraud couldn’t, he’s injected a bit more discipline about the place?
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Post by potterpaul on Apr 30, 2019 8:01:13 GMT
So why sack Rowett mid term. They brought him in to start the change, yes he had a half season free hit as far as results go as long as the massive rebuild and the future plan was seen to take shape. It hasn't, we are no nearer to seeing Jones grand scheme now than when he arrived. The last 4 months have been totally wasted by NJ a massive wasted opportunity to get 20% of this massive job underway, instead the whole process won't get started now until half way through preseason, when he starts trying to get a good portion of this seasons shit to work with a handful of his type of players in his system. Because things weren't going to get any better under Rowett. He'd actually created an even bigger task to get back to where we were with his appalling transfer business. And the job is underway, it's just a slow process, as it was always going to have to be. I'm not arguing the point of Rowett being sacked it was a response that Jones work is irrelevant, Do you not read the post that is being replied to. He's achieved fuck all in the grand scheme of things Rob, he bottled out of using the diamond because apparently he didn't have the players, well guess what, we haven't the players for any system so not returning to his trusted plan with a core group he could work with was a opportunity missed and will only heap more unnecessary pressure on him come the start of next season. I'm not anti Jones I want him to succeed, he's the best type of manager in our situation that doesn't mean I can't be critical with the way he as gone about his business so far.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2019 8:02:42 GMT
Where has this 20% figure come from?
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Post by potterpaul on Apr 30, 2019 8:03:16 GMT
I explained why in my post I'm not going to repeat it But he has got the massive job underway? He’s started blooding the youngsters, he’s got the team fitter and better organised, he’s found a place for Etebo, who the previous fraud couldn’t, he’s injected a bit more discipline about the place? He's found a place for Etebo? Where? In his diamond?
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Post by manchesterpotter on Apr 30, 2019 8:05:25 GMT
But he has got the massive job underway? He’s started blooding the youngsters, he’s got the team fitter and better organised, he’s found a place for Etebo, who the previous fraud couldn’t, he’s injected a bit more discipline about the place? He's found a place for Etebo? Where? In his diamond? Think he just means actually in the starting eleven, which the previous manager failed to do regardless of formation. Same goes for Edwards.
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Post by potterpaul on Apr 30, 2019 8:07:06 GMT
He's found a place for Etebo? Where? In his diamond? Think he just means actually in the starting eleven, which the previous manager failed to do regardless of formation. Same goes for Edwards. Well whoopy fucking Doo
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 8:18:29 GMT
Because things weren't going to get any better under Rowett. He'd actually created an even bigger task to get back to where we were with his appalling transfer business. And the job is underway, it's just a slow process, as it was always going to have to be. I'm not arguing the point of Rowett being sacked it was a response that Jones work is irrelevant, Do you not read the post that is being replied to. He's achieved fuck all in the grand scheme of things Rob, he bottled out of using the diamond because apparently he didn't have the players, well guess what, we haven't the players for any system so not returning to his trusted plan with a core group he could work with was a opportunity missed and will only heap more unnecessary pressure on him come the start of next season. I'm not anti Jones I want him to succeed, he's the best type of manager in our situation that doesn't mean I can't be critical with the way he as gone about his business so far. Why mention Rowett at all, it’s not the same thing? There’s plenty to be critical of I just don’t agree he’s achieved fuck all. It seems to be there’s a lot of toy throwing because he hasn’t instantly solved the myriad problems we’ve got, but that was never going to happen given the kind of change we need and the kind of change this manager’s looking to bring.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 30, 2019 8:19:25 GMT
Think he just means actually in the starting eleven, which the previous manager failed to do regardless of formation. Same goes for Edwards. Well whoopy fucking Doo Well the last manager didn’t, did he? For a bloke who ‘isn’t anti-Jones’, you’re certainly at pains to write off all the good stuff and accentuate all the bad.
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Post by chigstoke on Apr 30, 2019 8:20:40 GMT
AND BECAUSE HE HASN'T HAD A FULL SUMMER AND A FORTUNE TO SPEND LIKE HIS IMMEDIATE PREDECESSOR JESUS FUCKING CHRIST That didn't stop Lambert getting sacked 10 short months ago ! As for 'Jesus Fucking Christ' now that would be a good appointment :-) Lambert was brought in to stop us getting relegated and then to 'leave by mutual consent' more than likely. He didn't save us so he got sacked.
There is a huge difference between the job Jones has been tasked and the one Lambert was tasked with.
As for Gary Rowett, the fucker had a whole summer to sort the squad out and get us at least Top 6. He failed, he got sacked. When you can't beat a team as royally shit as Bolton, and then gob off to the fans, you have some explaining to do. Him and the squad.
Jones is now in for a complete rebuild and a brand new project. Potentially, the most exciting project we'll have seen in years if it all goes according to plan.
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Post by thevoid on Apr 30, 2019 9:05:53 GMT
Quite the opposite. I just think soundbites like 'Stoke DNA' and 'Dog's home' a bit cringey, that's all. Oh I get it...sort of like thevoid? 😯
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