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Post by citynickscfc on Jul 22, 2018 7:45:12 GMT
The flag is not the country, nor is the national anthem. Both mean absolutely nothing in today's multicultural and ever diverse society. They represent a place yes, do they represent a people? Or the people who reside? No, they certainly do not. You can choose to give it meaning but if someone disagrees that is ok. This isn't communism, he was not disrespectful to you personally, nor the country, he was disagreeing with a historic action that many agree with him and his opinion. We need to banish this custom of having to salute a flag, sing a song, stand up tall etc.... It's gone, done with, and follows the same expectations as created and administered by the oligarchy and powers that diminish our free will. People don't have to eat with the knife in their right hand, they don't have to marry the opposite sex, women can vote, wear trousers, they don't have to pray or sing hymns, they don't have to wave a flag to be patriotic, go to the match to be a supporter, men can do the dishes ffs and Gary couples can have kids etc etc etc. Best to do away with national anthems if this is all it brings, it is easy too political for sport anyway... In my opinion. Patriotism is archaic is it not? Those are your views, I respect them, but I disagree with a lot of them. I trust that's ok? As recently a the last World Cup, I saw people from a variety of cultural backgrounds celebrating England's success. I know plenty of people from all sorts of backgrounds who are proud to be "English" or "British". I am patriotic, I love my country with all it's diversity and multi cultural aspects. I do wish people would keep politics out of sport. But let's not forget who brought it in to this particular debate through his actions of the past. JM was it not? No, patriotism is not archaic. Nobody forces me to be patriotic. I choose to be patriotic, as do millions of others. I don't like religions of any sort, but I accept people's wishes to have one. I'm not quite sure how you get to all the valid points you make about women, gays, sexuality, etc. etc. unless you somehow think that because I choose to be patriotic, I may have some archaic views on those subjects too. Not so. Whichever way you look at it, like it or not, JM is dividing supporters at a time we need to come together. From a purely footballing perspective, I don't think he was worth the trouble. That he comes with additional "baggage" (for want of better words) just adds to the division. I have a suspicion that you and I will probably never quite see eye to eye on this one though I do see some shreds of common ground. I hope you do to. I do and I respect your opinion. I just don't think you should just a person because of his opinion on one particular subject in a world that is already overly subjective. He seems like a fantastic bloke and a true professional. Judge him for his football perhaps? I just think this is way out of proportion. He could be good, if so brilliant! He could be crap, if so let's hope he keeps the bench warm, either way his opinion and/or actions are of no consequence to our judgement of his person. If he does anything like Jese them you can say whatever you like about his person but until then it's best not to pre judge.
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Post by skemstokie on Jul 22, 2018 7:56:58 GMT
Those are your views, I respect them, but I disagree with a lot of them. I trust that's ok? As recently a the last World Cup, I saw people from a variety of cultural backgrounds celebrating England's success. I know plenty of people from all sorts of backgrounds who are proud to be "English" or "British". I am patriotic, I love my country with all it's diversity and multi cultural aspects. I do wish people would keep politics out of sport. But let's not forget who brought it in to this particular debate through his actions of the past. JM was it not? No, patriotism is not archaic. Nobody forces me to be patriotic. I choose to be patriotic, as do millions of others. I don't like religions of any sort, but I accept people's wishes to have one. I'm not quite sure how you get to all the valid points you make about women, gays, sexuality, etc. etc. unless you somehow think that because I choose to be patriotic, I may have some archaic views on those subjects too. Not so. Whichever way you look at it, like it or not, JM is dividing supporters at a time we need to come together. From a purely footballing perspective, I don't think he was worth the trouble. That he comes with additional "baggage" (for want of better words) just adds to the division. I have a suspicion that you and I will probably never quite see eye to eye on this one though I do see some shreds of common ground. I hope you do to. I do and I respect your opinion. I just don't think you should judge a person because of his opinion on one particular subject in a world that is already overly subjective. He seems like a fantastic bloke and a true professional. Judge him for his football perhaps? I just think this is way out of proportion. He could be good, if so brilliant! He could be crap, if so let's hope he keeps the bench warm, either way his opinion and/or actions are of no consequence to our judgement of his person. If he does anything like Jese them you can say whatever you like about his person but until then it's best not to pre judge. I agree,judge him on what we see not what others say
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Post by pyrus on Jul 22, 2018 8:00:33 GMT
Admin please lock this thread. The whole political debate was interesting for 5 pages. Now it’s taken over the whole thread. I made this point about 40 pages ago, but admin was clearly satisfied then that this was okay.
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Post by mallorcanstokie on Jul 22, 2018 8:23:47 GMT
Admin please lock this thread. The whole political debate was interesting for 5 pages. Now it’s taken over the whole thread. FFS admin, read your own rules about this message board , this thread is now nothing to do with football, fuck it off....
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Post by hammercricket on Jul 22, 2018 8:39:06 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2018 8:52:06 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. That’s just your opinion, I’ll trust the opinion of our manager.
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Post by RAF on Jul 22, 2018 8:52:23 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. It doesn't matter for a lot of the idiots on here. As long as he puts a shift in and gives 100% that's good enough for them. Talent always has been secondary to them. H
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Post by themistocles on Jul 22, 2018 8:54:02 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. That’s just your opinion, I’ll trust the opinion of our manager. So your not going to have an opinion on any player we sign?
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Post by elgreco on Jul 22, 2018 8:55:53 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. It doesn't matter for a lot of the idiots on here. As long as he puts a shift in and gives 100% that's good enough for them. Talent always has been secondary to them. H See also Diouf!! Appalling, shocking footballer who is praised by many because he runs around a lot and punches the ground when he misses.
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Post by WhyDelilah on Jul 22, 2018 9:01:49 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. He's played 158 premier league games. He's played zero in league 1. Perhaps the world of football is missing a trick? Get yourself into management.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2018 9:02:23 GMT
That’s just your opinion, I’ll trust the opinion of our manager. So your not going to have an opinion on any player we sign? Yes, but will give him an actual few games playing for us before writing him off as being shit.
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Post by lordb on Jul 22, 2018 9:03:17 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. He's played 158 premier league games. He's played zero in league 1. Perhaps the world of football is missing a trick? Get yourself into management. And he's not 30. I'm not excited by this signing however can see he's at least competent.
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Post by RAF on Jul 22, 2018 9:10:51 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. He's played 158 premier league games. He's played zero in league 1. Perhaps the world of football is missing a trick? Get yourself into management. Strange why no new Prem club has not snapped him up then with that pedigree? H
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Post by WhyDelilah on Jul 22, 2018 9:15:34 GMT
He's played 158 premier league games. He's played zero in league 1. Perhaps the world of football is missing a trick? Get yourself into management. Strange why no new Prem club has not snapped him up then with that pedigree? H Yeah. Joe Allen is shit too. And Martins Indi. And Bauer. Everybody in the championship is garbage. Nobody has snapped them up. It's a black and white situation. He's definitely league 1 standard. Despite none of the evidence backing that up.
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Post by colinroberts1 on Jul 22, 2018 9:20:30 GMT
I'm hoping he'll be our Liam Lawrence in this division, takes games by scruff of the neck and dragging play up field. Haven't had it since moses left really.
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Post by ursemboys on Jul 22, 2018 9:22:11 GMT
He's played 158 premier league games. He's played zero in league 1. Perhaps the world of football is missing a trick? Get yourself into management. Strange why no new Prem club has not snapped him up then with that pedigree? H RAF have you not thought they might have enquired and he turned them down because he wants to come Stoke ,just a thought mate
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Post by crapslinger on Jul 22, 2018 9:25:46 GMT
Strange why no new Prem club has not snapped him up then with that pedigree? H RAF have you not thought they might have enquired and he turned them down because he wants to come Stoke ,just a thought mate
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Post by danceswithclams on Jul 22, 2018 9:35:40 GMT
Can't be arsed to read the whole thread so can somebody summarize for me please?
Who's the most indignant/outraged about the signing?
On what page is Brexit first mentioned?
Have Muslims and or Tommy Robinson somehow been associated with the issue?
Has anybody who used to be in the Navy (seemingly every Stoke fan of a certain age on here was in the Royal Navy at some point) offered an opinion, possibly relating it to the Falklands in some tenuous way?
I also require an accurate snowflake mention tally.
Thanks,
Clams
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Post by WhyDelilah on Jul 22, 2018 9:36:59 GMT
Can't be arsed to read the whole thread so can somebody summarize for me please? Who's the most indignant/outraged about the signing? On what page is Brexit first mentioned? Have Muslims and or Tommy Robinson somehow been associated with the issue? Has anybody who used to be in the Navy (seemingly every Stoke fan of a certain age on here was in the Royal Navy at some point) offered an opinion, possibly relating it to the Falklands in some tenuous way? I also require an accurate snowflake mention tally. Thanks, Clams Full house.
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Post by samba :) on Jul 22, 2018 9:42:45 GMT
Saddest thing for you guys about all this is that he’s a shocking footballer. You’re signing an appallingly bad player for £5m??? What is your board doing by allowing this to happen? Forget his politics, that’s the easy part to get your head round, your bigger problem is spending all that cash and giving a 30 yr old league 1 standard at best a 3 year deal. Doesn’t make sense. I think he'd be premier league if there wasnt all this hoo ha around him
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banx10
Academy Starlet
Posts: 197
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Post by banx10 on Jul 22, 2018 11:00:58 GMT
Some stupid comments on here. Like some saying 'I don't wear a poppy, because you tell me to' etc. Lame! That's what's wrong with people in this country today, God help us if we had another World War.
Anyway, McClean is scum & also shite, so we shouldn't be signing him.
Also Club know the controversy it will cause & still go ahead.
Why don't we go further & sign Evans as well!
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Post by roylandstoke on Jul 22, 2018 11:07:08 GMT
I'm hoping he'll be our Liam Lawrence in this division, takes games by scruff of the neck and dragging play up field. Haven't had it since moses left really. I share your hope that a player we have just spent £5M on will turn out to be an asset, however I don't really get the comparison with lawrence. Lawrence was a talented, creative, skillful player with the vision to see a pass and the creativity to make and score a goal. McClean is a strong runnerwhose record shows that he neither scores nor creates goals. A better comparison for me is with a bankrupt man's Jon Walters, only without the touch and the goals.
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Post by RAF on Jul 22, 2018 11:08:51 GMT
Strange why no new Prem club has not snapped him up then with that pedigree? H Yeah. Joe Allen is shit too. And Martins Indi. And Bauer. Everybody in the championship is garbage. Nobody has snapped them up. It's a black and white situation. He's definitely league 1 standard. Despite none of the evidence backing that up. I've not said he's shit, but Joe Allen at least has been given Prem wages to stay with us and there were Prem clubs after him and I'm pretty certain it's the same for the other two. H
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Post by RAF on Jul 22, 2018 11:10:00 GMT
Strange why no new Prem club has not snapped him up then with that pedigree? H RAF have you not thought they might have enquired and he turned them down because he wants to come Stoke ,just a thought mate True that might have happened. Unlikely but I can't write it off. H
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Post by roylandstoke on Jul 22, 2018 11:11:41 GMT
Some stupid comments on here. Like some saying 'I don't wear a poppy, because you tell me to' etc. Lame! That's what's wrong with people in this country today, God help us if we had another World War. Anyway, McClean is scum & also shite, so we shouldn't be signing him. Also Club know the controversy it will cause & still go ahead. Why don't we go further & sign Evans as well! If you're referring to Jonny Evans, he is a bloody good player which is why Leicester City (recent Premier League Champions) signed him.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Jul 22, 2018 11:11:49 GMT
Some stupid comments on here. Like some saying 'I don't wear a poppy, because you tell me to' etc. Lame! That's what's wrong with people in this country today, God help us if we had another World War. Anyway, McClean is scum & also shite, so we shouldn't be signing him. Also Club know the controversy it will cause & still go ahead. Why don't we go further & sign Evans as well! Ray Evans? I don't think he'd be much use now mate. He's 68.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2018 11:12:08 GMT
Can't be arsed to read the whole thread so can somebody summarize for me please? Who's the most indignant/outraged about the signing? On what page is Brexit first mentioned? Have Muslims and or Tommy Robinson somehow been associated with the issue? Has anybody who used to be in the Navy (seemingly every Stoke fan of a certain age on here was in the Royal Navy at some point) offered an opinion, possibly relating it to the Falklands in some tenuous way? I also require an accurate snowflake mention tally. Thanks, Clams Full house. Does stopping at the YMCA count ?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Jul 22, 2018 11:18:08 GMT
Forest away the 'poppy game'. Purple tops 'nall. That's all it should be about.
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Post by werrington on Jul 22, 2018 11:21:27 GMT
Some stupid comments on here. Like some saying 'I don't wear a poppy, because you tell me to' etc. Lame! That's what's wrong with people in this country today, God help us if we had another World War. Anyway, McClean is scum & also shite, so we shouldn't be signing him. Also Club know the controversy it will cause & still go ahead. Why don't we go further & sign Evans as well! You mean Ched Evans who was cleared of the crime he was accused of ? Of course you do
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2018 11:26:31 GMT
Some stupid comments on here. Like some saying 'I don't wear a poppy, because you tell me to' etc. Lame! That's what's wrong with people in this country today, God help us if we had another World War. Anyway, McClean is scum & also shite, so we shouldn't be signing him. Also Club know the controversy it will cause & still go ahead. Why don't we go further & sign Evans as well! You mean Ched Evans who was cleared of the crime he was accused of ? Of course you do He means Chris Evans who should be charged for daily crimes against humanity.
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