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Post by thanksjon on Apr 8, 2019 20:25:51 GMT
I've seen him play a good few times for Irish under age team and he does look a cut above the rest.We should have him tied down for 4 years.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 20:50:36 GMT
I would have Collins on the bench every game now ahead of Williams - he is our player, one for the future, earning rave reviews. Williams is not going to be here in a few weeks' time. Is he better playing u-23s? Dunno, but the odd 10/15 minutes of action with the big boys this season can do him no harm in preparing him for the future. Along with Sorensen, Verlinden, Campbell and even Souttar, we have a good bunch of kids to add to Edwards in being realistic first team players of the future. Totally don't agree. We lost Shawcross on Saturday and Williams like him or not came in and showed experience hanging onto the lead and keeping us steady. A 17 year old coming on to try and mark the experience of someone like Danny Graham is asking to lose the lead. We may not have much to play for but managers are judged on results and his duty to finish as high as possible. Plenty of time to bring youngsters in when he feels they're good enough Have you considered that Collins might enhance our defensive? Of course you haven't. Without even seeing the player you're convinced he's going to cost us.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 20:54:04 GMT
Can’t agree with this. As long as he’s managed carefully he should be given a chance to play. If he’s good enough he’s good enough and it also helps that we don’t have a lot to play for this season What are you basing the fact he's good enough on? Seems to me he is being managed carefully by someone who works with him every day You only have to look at the quotes in this thread, which is one of the shorter ones. You have both his daily manager and his senior manager saying he's good enough. That's probably good enough for everyone except the expertise of one kelw...
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Post by kelw on Apr 8, 2019 22:26:32 GMT
Totally don't agree. We lost Shawcross on Saturday and Williams like him or not came in and showed experience hanging onto the lead and keeping us steady. A 17 year old coming on to try and mark the experience of someone like Danny Graham is asking to lose the lead. We may not have much to play for but managers are judged on results and his duty to finish as high as possible. Plenty of time to bring youngsters in when he feels they're good enough Have you considered that Collins might enhance our defensive? Of course you haven't. Without even seeing the player you're convinced he's going to cost us. The manager sees him every day, I don't and neither do you. I said would be a wrong choice for me on Saturday to bring a rookie on against Danny Graham who was causing our Captain problems and his decision was correct.
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Post by kelw on Apr 8, 2019 22:35:49 GMT
Totally don't agree. We lost Shawcross on Saturday and Williams like him or not came in and showed experience hanging onto the lead and keeping us steady. A 17 year old coming on to try and mark the experience of someone like Danny Graham is asking to lose the lead. We may not have much to play for but managers are judged on results and his duty to finish as high as possible. Plenty of time to bring youngsters in when he feels they're good enough Have you considered that Collins might enhance our defensive? Of course you haven't. Without even seeing the player you're convinced he's going to cost us. And here was me thinking I've seen him play in the flesh for ROI including a game at Burton but you know better. Thanks for clearing that up. I wasn't convinced he would cost us at all, try reading what I actually wrote. I said would be a bad game to bring him in at that moment and experience was needed.
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Post by kelw on Apr 8, 2019 22:41:15 GMT
Apologies if already posted but did anyone see this Stoke youth player playing for Ireland U17 against the Netherlands? Absolutely outstanding, man of the match and a huge prospect. I was at a couple of games as Corcoran the keeper is a nephew of a friend.
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Post by upthefud on Apr 9, 2019 3:39:46 GMT
What are you basing the fact he's good enough on? Seems to me he is being managed carefully by someone who works with him every day You only have to look at the quotes in this thread, which is one of the shorter ones. You have both his daily manager and his senior manager saying he's good enough. That's probably good enough for everyone except the expertise of one kelw... There’s a mentality on this board that we should just throw players out there to “see what they can do.” The amount of players that the experts on the oatcake have said DESERVE a chance (Berahino, Imbula to name but a couple of examples) is freightening. I know youth players are different but at the end of the day you deserve a chance through hard work on the training field. If Williams is a better player than Collins then Williams is in and Collins is out. We should be looking to loan him out and get competitive games under his belt.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 8:38:41 GMT
You only have to look at the quotes in this thread, which is one of the shorter ones. You have both his daily manager and his senior manager saying he's good enough. That's probably good enough for everyone except the expertise of one kelw... There’s a mentality on this board that we should just throw players out there to “see what they can do.” The amount of players that the experts on the oatcake have said DESERVE a chance (Berahino, Imbula to name but a couple of examples) is freightening. I know youth players are different but at the end of the day you deserve a chance through hard work on the training field. If Williams is a better player than Collins then Williams is in and Collins is out. We should be looking to loan him out and get competitive games under his belt. Going out on loan has done very few Stoke lads any favours. When they come back they find that while they were out of sight the manager went and bought someone else in their position, and then they were offered no further chances to even get into the team. The other model, to stay and fight for his place has worked very well for Tom Edwards, and it's the one we should pursue, for probably the best set of youth players we have had since the 60-70s. Your theory is very shortsighted. "If Williams is a better player" - which he is. But he - unless Jones prolongs his contract for next season - is soon to be an ex-Stoke player. Collins on the hand has a very bright future ahead of him and in the manager's words is good enough to play in the first team. So play him, now that there is a "vacancy"!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 8:40:51 GMT
Have you considered that Collins might enhance our defensive? Of course you haven't. Without even seeing the player you're convinced he's going to cost us. And here was me thinking I've seen him play in the flesh for ROI including a game at Burton but you know better. Thanks for clearing that up. I wasn't convinced he would cost us at all, try reading what I actually wrote. I said would be a bad game to bring him in at that moment and experience was needed. Try reading what you wrote and just repeated.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 8:43:56 GMT
Have you considered that Collins might enhance our defensive? Of course you haven't. Without even seeing the player you're convinced he's going to cost us. The manager sees him every day, I don't and neither do you. I said would be a wrong choice for me on Saturday to bring a rookie on against Danny Graham who was causing our Captain problems and his decision was correct. That doesn't change the fact that you questioned whether he is good enough, and in doing so, questioned the judgement of his academy manager and his senior manager, Russell and Jones, both of whom have stated that he is good enough.
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Post by kelw on Apr 9, 2019 8:58:00 GMT
The manager sees him every day, I don't and neither do you. I said would be a wrong choice for me on Saturday to bring a rookie on against Danny Graham who was causing our Captain problems and his decision was correct. That doesn't change the fact that you questioned whether he is good enough, and in doing so, questioned the judgement of his academy manager and his senior manager, Russell and Jones, both of whom have stated that he is good enough. He's 17 and we have a pre season coming up. Sticking a young player in on Saturday would have been stupidity. You were the one claiming I'd never seen the lad play. Looks a prospect all right but a time and all place to introduce him as we are rightly doing by gradually bringing him in.
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Post by jimmygscfc on Apr 9, 2019 9:09:19 GMT
He's 18 at the end of April, but not too many centre backs play in the First Team at that age. If we're saying the right things to him so that he can see a way forward and have him on a decent contract, then we have to hope he'll be around for a while yet. The biggest danger is a big boy coming in and throwing silly money at us. It wouldn't mean he'd get First Team action any quicker (probably quite the opposite), but we'd get a fat fee and he'd be on a massive wedge at a Premiership club. Hopefully this isn't a scenario that will play out, but while we argue whether or not he should be getting a sniff with us, there's always something far worse lurking around the corner. Happy Tuesday
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 10:20:20 GMT
That doesn't change the fact that you questioned whether he is good enough, and in doing so, questioned the judgement of his academy manager and his senior manager, Russell and Jones, both of whom have stated that he is good enough. He's 17 and we have a pre season coming up. Sticking a young player in on Saturday would have been stupidity. You were the one claiming I'd never seen the lad play. Looks a prospect all right but a time and all place to introduce him as we are rightly doing by gradually bringing him in. So you agree he should at the very least be on the bench tonight? And if we are coasting - not much chance of us doing that under Jones' tactics, I admit - he can get some choice minutes in the latter part of the second half.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 10:37:22 GMT
He's 17 and we have a pre season coming up. Sticking a young player in on Saturday would have been stupidity. You were the one claiming I'd never seen the lad play. Looks a prospect all right but a time and all place to introduce him as we are rightly doing by gradually bringing him in. So you agree he should at the very least be on the bench tonight? And if we are coasting - not much chance of us doing that under Jones' tactics, I admit - he can get some choice minutes in the latter part of the second half. Another little dig at Jones, he’s doing a good job and will continue to do so.
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Post by silverdollar on Apr 9, 2019 11:46:22 GMT
So you agree he should at the very least be on the bench tonight? And if we are coasting - not much chance of us doing that under Jones' tactics, I admit - he can get some choice minutes in the latter part of the second half. Another little dig at Jones, he’s doing a good job and will continue to do so. I have 100% confidence in Nathan Jones to make the correct decision about any player in a Stoke shirt. We are blessed to have a fantastic manager for the future of our club.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 12:51:21 GMT
So you agree he should at the very least be on the bench tonight? And if we are coasting - not much chance of us doing that under Jones' tactics, I admit - he can get some choice minutes in the latter part of the second half. Another little dig at Jones, he’s doing a good job and will continue to do so. That's what I am worried about I'd like a manager who does a great job, and Jones isn't - yet!
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Post by silverdollar on Apr 9, 2019 12:55:30 GMT
Another little dig at Jones, he’s doing a good job and will continue to do so. That's what I am worried about I'd like a manager who does a great job, and Jones isn't - yet! I am a little concerned about your short term memory! Do you have Dementia in your family history?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 13:20:33 GMT
That's what I am worried about I'd like a manager who does a great job, and Jones isn't - yet! I am a little concerned about your short term memory! Do you have Dementia in your family history? Explain yourself and leave my family out of it.
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Post by bertiestan on Apr 9, 2019 13:21:37 GMT
That's what I am worried about I'd like a manager who does a great job, and Jones isn't - yet! I am a little concerned about your short term memory! Do you have Dementia in your family history? Bit of a wank comment that youth
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Post by block27row27 on Apr 9, 2019 13:39:13 GMT
Have you considered that Collins might enhance our defensive? Of course you haven't. Without even seeing the player you're convinced he's going to cost us. And here was me thinking I've seen him play in the flesh for ROI including a game at Burton but you know better. Thanks for clearing that up. I wasn't convinced he would cost us at all, try reading what I actually wrote. I said would be a bad game to bring him in at that moment and experience was needed. Wow, you're an angry man
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Post by kelw on Apr 9, 2019 14:31:51 GMT
And here was me thinking I've seen him play in the flesh for ROI including a game at Burton but you know better. Thanks for clearing that up. I wasn't convinced he would cost us at all, try reading what I actually wrote. I said would be a bad game to bring him in at that moment and experience was needed. Wow, you're an angry man Not angry or a man. Simply pointing out someone's inability to read what's in front of them.
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Post by stokeson on Apr 9, 2019 14:40:09 GMT
Another little dig at Jones, he’s doing a good job and will continue to do so. I have 100% confidence in Nathan Jones to make the correct decision about any player in a Stoke shirt. We are blessed to have a fantastic manager for the future of our club. Just like you had in Berahino eh Dollar?
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Apr 9, 2019 14:52:39 GMT
There’s a mentality on this board that we should just throw players out there to “see what they can do.” The amount of players that the experts on the oatcake have said DESERVE a chance (Berahino, Imbula to name but a couple of examples) is freightening. We have a long tradition to uphold of crucifying any youngster thrown into the team to "see what they can do", who isn't brilliant and makes no mistakes! Give the wolves their lamb!
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Post by kelw on Apr 9, 2019 15:04:58 GMT
He's in the team tonight!! Apparently not - although it's a trialist who may or may not also be called Collins! Is a young Austrian lad over on trial- could well be him
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 16:56:57 GMT
Not angry or a man. Simply pointing out someone's inability to read what's in front of them. Aaah now I know why you were speaking nonsense
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Apr 9, 2019 18:15:30 GMT
On the bench tonight.
Hopefully he comes on when we are winning comfortably and has a decent debut
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Post by FullerMagic on Apr 9, 2019 18:16:04 GMT
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Post by onefatcopper on Apr 9, 2019 20:00:57 GMT
I am a little concerned about your short term memory! Do you have Dementia in your family history? Explain yourself and leave my family out of it. In a earlier post you state that Collins readiness for first team action should be down to the manager of the senior team (Jones) and that it’s his opinion that counts to the vast majority of fans Then in your later posts you attempt to assassinate Jones as a manager, questioning his tactics and opinions. And so if you don’t rate Jones, how can it be safe to trust his judgment of Edwards who seems to have secured the R/Back slot or giving Verdlinden his debut ?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 20:09:45 GMT
What a time to make your debut!!
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Post by clarkeda on Apr 9, 2019 20:11:44 GMT
What a time to make your debut!! Collins to score our winner😂
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