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Post by gingerninja on Dec 31, 2017 23:36:15 GMT
If we sign him for big money, I will be down the bookies placing a sizeable wad on Brendan Rogers being our boss come the summer.
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Post by estp1863 on Dec 31, 2017 23:38:21 GMT
He won't score anymore than Berahino given the time he's had on the pitch since he's been fit & the service he gets, neither would aguero He’s mobile, he’s fast, he makes things happen for himself, that puts him streets ahead of the Berahino we’ve seen thus far. Give him 3 month with Hughes and let's see if he's the same. We've got a goalscorer what we should be doing is bolstering the midfield and defence to give the guy service. I reckon it's bullshit anyway I can hardly see the misers giving Hughes 20 mil on another striker when he's a gonner at the end of the season
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 31, 2017 23:41:07 GMT
He’s one of the most exciting strikers around. Comparisons with Berahino, whose career was dying a slow, painful death 12 months before we signed him, are laughable. Same rule applies mate, Berahino is proven in the Prem with good service. Tony Pulis seriously shafted him and as a consequence he’s only just got to an acceptable fitness level in combination with his personal issues. You could put the most gifted finisher in the world in our team and he still wouldn’t score goals. Bera isn’t a player who’s going to create chances for himself like Ricardo Fuller. If you’re a lone striker you have to some extent to make things happen for yourself and others. Also Bera has shown promise but isn’t ‘proven’. He has responsibility for himself as well, it can’t continually be every single different manager’s fault.
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Post by estp1863 on Dec 31, 2017 23:41:34 GMT
If the board had any sense anyway they would be telling him to sod off and sort the defence & midfield out first as it's blatantly obvious we are terrible
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 31, 2017 23:42:42 GMT
He’s mobile, he’s fast, he makes things happen for himself, that puts him streets ahead of the Berahino we’ve seen thus far. Give him 3 month with Hughes and let's see if he's the same. We've got a goalscorer what we should be doing is bolstering the midfield and defence to give the guy service. I reckon it's bullshit anyway I can hardly see the misers giving Hughes 20 mil on another striker when he's a gonner at the end of the season We’ve got a bloke who showed some promise, had one good goal scoring season and tailed off enormously long before we signed him. I agree I can’t see the board sanctioning that kind of spend either.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2017 23:46:12 GMT
Signing Dembele would make no difference whatsoever, even if he is good enough to crack this level.
Hughes has proven, ever since he's been our manager that he hadn't got the first clue how to get a tune out of a striker.
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Post by Jimm on Jan 1, 2018 0:06:11 GMT
Is Kevin Cruickshank not head scout anymore then?
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Post by andystokey on Jan 1, 2018 0:09:16 GMT
Signing Dembele would make no difference whatsoever, even if he is good enough to crack this level. Hughes has proven, ever since he's been our manager that he hadn't got the first clue how to get a tune out of a striker. No one has scored 15 or more goals in a season since 2001 in a Stoke shirt. It's nothing to do with Hughes or any other manager it's pretty much always been the level we've been at. 10-15 apart from one or two notable exceptions in the last 50 years
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2018 0:29:47 GMT
Signing Dembele would make no difference whatsoever, even if he is good enough to crack this level. Hughes has proven, ever since he's been our manager that he hadn't got the first clue how to get a tune out of a striker. No one has scored 15 or more goals in a season since 2001 in a Stoke shirt. It's nothing to do with Hughes or any other manager it's pretty much always been the level we've been at. 10-15 apart from one or two notable exceptions in the last 50 years I'm not even sure that is true but I'll take your word for it. 1. Because I'm not arsed if it is true or not. 2. Because it has no bearing on my point whatsoever, because I know that since Hughes has been our manager he has tried and failed to sign a goal scorer worthy of the name, and when he has had one at his disposal he hadn't had the first clue how to tactically get the best out of him, or even decided to flog him to death at right back. All this after chasing him for 12 months or so. In the meantime the useless twat has signed 3 other strikers who also have scored the best total of fuck all for us, so forgive me if I don't believe Hughes should be allowed to sign any other forwards.
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Post by Gods on Jan 1, 2018 0:44:05 GMT
Signing Dembele would make no difference whatsoever, even if he is good enough to crack this level. Hughes has proven, ever since he's been our manager that he hadn't got the first clue how to get a tune out of a striker. No one has scored 15 or more goals in a season since 2001 in a Stoke shirt. It's nothing to do with Hughes or any other manager it's pretty much always been the level we've been at. 10-15 apart from one or two notable exceptions in the last 50 years Nice stat that, I've said it until I am blue in the face on here but we will never see a 20+ goals a season striker in what, at Premier League level anyway, is a 40 goals a season team. No one scores over half of any teams goals. Anyone getting 10+ for us is doing a stellar job.
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Jan 1, 2018 1:02:24 GMT
If we want Dembele we can get him.
This is a chance for some shrewd business. Basically we hold an advantage over the other teams.
I rate Berahino, I don't think he's been given a proper chance here, but I've no doubt celtic/rogers would take cash plus berahino. Rogers, like he did with Sinclair, will think he can turn around his career.
Also, Rogers is under pressure, he needs success in the europa, so needs to get past Zenit.
Celtic have dropped off, he wants to bring in a few new faces and will only have the dembele money.
Celtic will agree a deal worth 20 mill...dembele was touted at 30-40 mill not long ago.
Also, he's only 21.
Also, he can play as a lone striker.
It may even be that we pay up the 20 million and Chuck in a berahino loan to get the edge on our competitors. Everyone would be a winner there.
My only worry is...if we are interested...everton chucking silly money at it
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Post by Gods on Jan 1, 2018 1:16:21 GMT
If we want Dembele we can get him. This is a chance for some shrewd business. Basically we hold an advantage over the other teams. I rate Berahino, I don't think he's been given a proper chance here, but I've no doubt celtic/rogers would take cash plus berahino. Rogers, like he did with Sinclair, will think he can turn around his career. Also, Rogers is under pressure, he needs success in the europa, so needs to get past Zenit. Celtic have dropped off, he wants to bring in a few new faces and will only have the dembele money. Celtic will agree a deal worth 20 mill...dembele was touted at 30-40 mill not long ago. Also, he's only 21. Also, he can play as a lone striker. It may even be that we pay up the 20 million and Chuck in a berahino loan to get the edge on our competitors. Everyone would be a winner there. My only worry is...if we are interested...everton chucking silly money at it If we pay £20m and chuck in Berahino we are effectively paying £32m , I don't think we'd do that. Also Berahino himself would have to be keen to up sticks and head for Glasgow, he's only just escaped Smethwick for heavens sake and you know Scotland, the wind sure can blow cold way out there!
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Jan 1, 2018 1:20:12 GMT
If we want Dembele we can get him. This is a chance for some shrewd business. Basically we hold an advantage over the other teams. I rate Berahino, I don't think he's been given a proper chance here, but I've no doubt celtic/rogers would take cash plus berahino. Rogers, like he did with Sinclair, will think he can turn around his career. Also, Rogers is under pressure, he needs success in the europa, so needs to get past Zenit. Celtic have dropped off, he wants to bring in a few new faces and will only have the dembele money. Celtic will agree a deal worth 20 mill...dembele was touted at 30-40 mill not long ago. Also, he's only 21. Also, he can play as a lone striker. It may even be that we pay up the 20 million and Chuck in a berahino loan to get the edge on our competitors. Everyone would be a winner there. My only worry is...if we are interested...everton chucking silly money at it If we pay £20m and chuck in Berahino we are effectively paying £32m , I don't think we'd do that. Also Berahino himself would have to be keen to up sticks and head for Glasgow, he's only just escaped Smethwick for heavens sake and you know Scotland, the wind sure can blow cold way out there! He might be open to a loan though? He looked sharp yesterday, this would be a chance for him to get regular football and scoring goals against ross county etc... Rogers/celtic would have the cash they desperately need to bring in the 2-3 players he is after AND berahino. Berahino seems desperate to play, i'm guessing it could be sold to him. He'd be working with a highly rated manager. But yes, it is freezing up here compared to sunny stoke
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Post by Gary Hackett on Jan 1, 2018 1:21:07 GMT
I remember reading an article on the top championship players, about a year ago Antony knockhaert, will hughes, chris wood and moussa dembele were all tipped for the top I have lost count of how many times scholes and co, mention value for money But if they believe their own rhetoric? How come they never sign anyone from the championship? Because Pulis tried and failed on many occasions. Tonge Olifinjana Davies Soares
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Post by march4 on Jan 1, 2018 1:56:41 GMT
It seems to good to be true, getting rid of Berahino and replacing him with Dembele.
Do they want Imbula, Fletcher and Wimmer as well?
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Post by FullerMagic on Jan 1, 2018 8:44:52 GMT
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/scottish-premiership/top-scorersNever know what to make of Scottish form - but hasn't played that much or scored much this season, has he? I remember people were saying he was the real deal when he was at Fulham though. £20m in today's market is probably still fine when you look at his age and the fact he scored 17 in the Championship as a 19-year-old. Whether the board will put that down this month though, who knows?
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Post by scfc75 on Jan 1, 2018 8:53:15 GMT
We're one of the few clubs of our size that made a profit in August aren't we? If it's down to finance you would imagine us finding the money won't be a problem. Brighton have already spent £43m this season.
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Post by estp1863 on Jan 1, 2018 9:14:49 GMT
It seems to good to be true, getting rid of Berahino and replacing him with Dembele. Do they want Imbula, Fletcher and Wimmer as well? What it seems like is a sodding waste of money and further evidence we are absolutely clueless both in the boardroom & management. A team who let's in two goals a game and has a midfield like ours gets to January and thinks we need a striker?!?! Seriously WTF
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Post by ashleyscfc on Jan 1, 2018 9:21:19 GMT
Is Kevin Cruickshank not head scout anymore then? No, he’s still head scout
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Post by sportsman on Jan 1, 2018 9:23:55 GMT
It seems to good to be true, getting rid of Berahino and replacing him with Dembele. Do they want Imbula, Fletcher and Wimmer as well? What it seems like is a sodding waste of money and further evidence we are absolutely clueless both in the boardroom & management. A team who let's in two goals a game and has a midfield like ours gets to January and thinks we need a striker?!?! Seriously WTF Do you seriously think we don't? Are you mad? Are you seriously thick enough to think we are only looking at one position. I really worry about how some fans get by in life.
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Post by Dresden_scfc on Jan 1, 2018 9:28:01 GMT
He's got cut it in the premier league first, how good is he I mean Scott Sinclair is a standout player in that league
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Post by estp1863 on Jan 1, 2018 9:30:35 GMT
What it seems like is a sodding waste of money and further evidence we are absolutely clueless both in the boardroom & management. A team who let's in two goals a game and has a midfield like ours gets to January and thinks we need a striker?!?! Seriously WTF Do you seriously think we don't? Are you mad? Are you seriously thick enough to think we are only looking at one position. I really worry about how some fans get by in life. Yeah right, what 20 mil on a striker and 6 mil on 3 players for defence & midfield?! How much do you think the misers are going to give him in a January window when he's gone in May? Sign this guy and we go down we deserve it, no doubt about it
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Post by FullerMagic on Jan 1, 2018 9:34:12 GMT
He's got cut it in the premier league first, how good is he I mean Scott Sinclair is a standout player in that league He scored 17 in 38 in the Championship as a teenager. So that's encouraging if you're looking for some non-SPL evidence. I doubt we'll pay the kind of money they're looking for - although it's definitely time for the board to make a statement of some kind.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Jan 1, 2018 9:35:32 GMT
He's got cut it in the premier league first, how good is he I mean Scott Sinclair is a standout player in that league He scored 17 in 38 in the Championship as a teenager. So that's encouraging if you're looking for some non-SPL evidence. I doubt we'll pay the kind of money they're looking for - although it's definitely time for the board to make a statement of some kind. I'd prefer that kind of money spent on a midfield player than a striker who will be feeding off scraps.
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Post by realstokebloke on Jan 1, 2018 10:02:01 GMT
If we want Dembele we can get him. This is a chance for some shrewd business. Basically we hold an advantage over the other teams. I rate Berahino, I don't think he's been given a proper chance here, but I've no doubt celtic/rogers would take cash plus berahino. Rogers, like he did with Sinclair, will think he can turn around his career. Also, Rogers is under pressure, he needs success in the europa, so needs to get past Zenit. Celtic have dropped off, he wants to bring in a few new faces and will only have the dembele money. Celtic will agree a deal worth 20 mill...dembele was touted at 30-40 mill not long ago. Also, he's only 21. Also, he can play as a lone striker. It may even be that we pay up the 20 million and Chuck in a berahino loan to get the edge on our competitors. Everyone would be a winner there. My only worry is...if we are interested...everton chucking silly money at it If we pay £20m and chuck in Berahino we are effectively paying £32m , I don't think we'd do that. Also Berahino himself would have to be keen to up sticks and head for Glasgow, he's only just escaped Smethwick for heavens sake and you know Scotland, the wind sure can blow cold way out there! Gods: as a deluded bean counter, that's the maths TS is working on also - in real life meanwhile, if SB was ever worth £12m (which he patently wasn't), we have certainly confirmed any doubts anyone had and pissed any resale value up a wall to spectacular effect.
If we pay £20m for Dembele and chuck in SB, let's face it, we have paid £20m and a bag of Wotsits.
SB aside, £20m should either tell us:
that he is not actually, nor ever will be the real deal
or that it is a ludicrously low starting bid like 99p on eBay for a pukka Maserati that will end up nowhere near
or that we have a shout at a genuine bargain buy (like the many, many others we have ... oh, wait ...)
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Post by estp1863 on Jan 1, 2018 10:02:55 GMT
Build from the back and your weaknesses in the team become more obvious as you go forward. It not only highlights what you lack it allows you to buy players to suit the ones behind them to build a unit.
All good managers start with a sound defence and then move forward.
If we built from the back we might get to Berahino and think, oh fuck yeah he's actually quite good.
Rocket science it is not.
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Post by estp1863 on Jan 1, 2018 10:07:10 GMT
Squad & team building by SCFC & Mark Hughes.
"Throw some mud at the wall and see what sticks"
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Post by lordb on Jan 1, 2018 10:07:46 GMT
If we pay £20m and chuck in Berahino we are effectively paying £32m , I don't think we'd do that. Also Berahino himself would have to be keen to up sticks and head for Glasgow, he's only just escaped Smethwick for heavens sake and you know Scotland, the wind sure can blow cold way out there! He might be open to a loan though? He looked sharp yesterday, this would be a chance for him to get regular football and scoring goals against ross county etc... Rogers/celtic would have the cash they desperately need to bring in the 2-3 players he is after AND berahino. Berahino seems desperate to play, i'm guessing it could be sold to him. He'd be working with a highly rated manager. But yes, it is freezing up here compared to sunny stoke £20m + Saido on loan (with no loan fee and Stoke paying all the wages). That sounds like a deal that suits everyone. Also it would signal that there are significant funds for the midfielder and fullback we need too.
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Post by lordb on Jan 1, 2018 10:08:29 GMT
Squad & team building by SCFC & Mark Hughes. "Throw some mud at the wall and see what sticks" To a degree that's what most managers do.
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Jan 1, 2018 10:08:44 GMT
He's got cut it in the premier league first, how good is he I mean Scott Sinclair is a standout player in that league He scored 17 in 38 in the Championship as a teenager. So that's encouraging if you're looking for some non-SPL evidence. I doubt we'll pay the kind of money they're looking for - although it's definitely time for the board to make a statement of some kind. Dembele scored over 30 goals last season too. The SPL has been far too easy for him. He looked the part in European games too. This season he has had a couple of injuries and only recently has been getting back in the team. Celtic have been protecting him as an asset because Griffiths has been on superb form. Griffiths is also now an accomplished striker who would do well in the premier league. Dembele though is 21, 6ft, lightning quick, with a great shot and is a superb finisher. 20 million seems a good deal to me. Midfield has to be stokes priority of course, and I'd be happy for berahino to be given a proper chance
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