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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 14, 2018 21:30:20 GMT
If the leave vote was 100% and unquestionably to leave the single market, then they would not be able to even suggest the amendment because that issue would have been dealt with by the vote. In fact, if the leave vote knew what they voted for there wouldn't even be much of a negotiation, it would just be a case of sorting the specifics, dotting the i's and crossing the t's. As it is, we don't even know if we are leaving the single market! What do you think the EEA is by the way??? Honestly totally fucking deranged, the people voted for a Tory government so no opposition party can put any amendment or bill that goes against the wishes of that government, you don't really understand parliamentary democracy and many other things by the look of it, and seriously how many fucking times we don't leave the single market, we lose tariff free access to it unless we negotiate this as part of the deal, EVERY country in the world except North Korea has access to the single market........ I know exactly what the EEA is I actually looked into what I was voting for before I voted unlike Mr This Post is Hidden Excellent, so you admit you don't know even the very the major details of what the leave vote was for. Being part of the EEA, for example, is still on the table, so is leaving the single market for WTO trading rules and the customs union. Two massively different outcomes that were not part of the referendum question. I.e. it was not clear what the leave vote was for to anybody, as it has not yet been decided.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 15, 2018 11:00:46 GMT
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Post by followyoudown on Jan 15, 2018 11:12:58 GMT
Honestly totally fucking deranged, the people voted for a Tory government so no opposition party can put any amendment or bill that goes against the wishes of that government, you don't really understand parliamentary democracy and many other things by the look of it, and seriously how many fucking times we don't leave the single market, we lose tariff free access to it unless we negotiate this as part of the deal, EVERY country in the world except North Korea has access to the single market........ I know exactly what the EEA is I actually looked into what I was voting for before I voted unlike Mr This Post is Hidden Excellent, so you admit you don't know even the very the major details of what the leave vote was for. Being part of the EEA, for example, is still on the table, so is leaving the single market for WTO trading rules and the customs union. Two massively different outcomes that were not part of the referendum question. I.e. it was not clear what the leave vote was for to anybody, as it has not yet been decided. You are going full on bat shit crazy now, I notice you ignore the point re parliament as it doesn't fit with your straw man argument and go for another straw man argument, its like saying how can you vote for Labour in stoke on trent if you don't know what the council tax will be in Surrey, I'll leave you too it now as everyone else seems to be doing.
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 15, 2018 12:08:18 GMT
Excellent, so you admit you don't know even the very the major details of what the leave vote was for. Being part of the EEA, for example, is still on the table, so is leaving the single market for WTO trading rules and the customs union. Two massively different outcomes that were not part of the referendum question. I.e. it was not clear what the leave vote was for to anybody, as it has not yet been decided. You are going full on bat shit crazy now, I notice you ignore the point re parliament as it doesn't fit with your straw man argument and go for another straw man argument, its like saying how can you vote for Labour in stoke on trent if you don't know what the council tax will be in Surrey, I'll leave you too it now as everyone else seems to be doing. You do know an amendment that is accepted means the people who tabled the amendment are saying that with that amendment they can vote for the bill, right? So if the leave vote was unquestionably to leave the single market, one of the main purposes of this bill would be to do so and so you cannot amend the main purpose of a bill as that means the bill should not stand at all, you just vote against it. So your analogy does not match in the slightest which is why I had ignored it. A bring back capital punishment bill with an amendment that doesn't bring back capital punishment is a nothing bill. Do you see? I presume you will respond with more personal abuse as you cannot argue logically against the fact that the leave vote was for the great unknown. We will wait to see what it was for.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 16, 2018 12:32:35 GMT
The 43% to the EU is decreasing every year as the 57% to the RoW grows every year.
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Post by essexstokey on Jan 16, 2018 14:18:09 GMT
No-deal Brexit would cost EU economy £100bn, report claims link
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Post by capto on Jan 16, 2018 15:57:47 GMT
You are going full on bat shit crazy now, I notice you ignore the point re parliament as it doesn't fit with your straw man argument and go for another straw man argument, its like saying how can you vote for Labour in stoke on trent if you don't know what the council tax will be in Surrey, I'll leave you too it now as everyone else seems to be doing. You do know an amendment that is accepted means the people who tabled the amendment are saying that with that amendment they can vote for the bill, right? So if the leave vote was unquestionably to leave the single market, one of the main purposes of this bill would be to do so and so you cannot amend the main purpose of a bill as that means the bill should not stand at all, you just vote against it. So your analogy does not match in the slightest which is why I had ignored it. A bring back capital punishment bill with an amendment that doesn't bring back capital punishment is a nothing bill. Do you see? I presume you will respond with more personal abuse as you cannot argue logically against the fact that the leave vote was for the great unknown. We will wait to see what it was for. Are you saying the 27% who voted leave ALL knew the implications? Are you saying they would have voted the same way if they had been told the truth? If leave is bad for Britain as a whole, should it atill go ahead?
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 16, 2018 19:12:56 GMT
Labour's Shadow Minister for Exiting the European Union
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 16, 2018 20:47:13 GMT
The 43% to the EU is decreasing every year as the 57% to the RoW grows every year. So if our exports to non EU countries are rising whilst we are still members of the EU why do we need to leave?why turn your back on your neighbours?
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 17, 2018 6:56:46 GMT
The 43% to the EU is decreasing every year as the 57% to the RoW grows every year. So if our exports to non EU countries are rising whilst we are still members of the EU why do we need to leave?why turn your back on your neighbours? We're not "turning our back". We will remain close neighbours. The figures show that the EU isn't the be all and end all when it comes to trade. Those figures have been diverging for years. When we joined the Common Market back in the 70's the bloc's economy represented about 38% of the world's economy. Now, the EU represents less than half that. 16% ish. And with more members. fullfact.org/europe/eu-has-shrunk-percentage-world-economy/
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 17, 2018 9:19:04 GMT
So if our exports to non EU countries are rising whilst we are still members of the EU why do we need to leave?why turn your back on your neighbours? We're not "turning our back". We will remain close neighbours. The figures show that the EU isn't the be all and end all when it comes to trade. Those figures have been diverging for years. When we joined the Common Market back in the 70's the bloc's economy represented about 38% of the world's economy. Now, the EU represents less than half that. 16% ish. And with more members. fullfact.org/europe/eu-has-shrunk-percentage-world-economy/Why slap tarrifs on half of our trading though? Makes no sense.
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 17, 2018 9:21:07 GMT
So if our exports to non EU countries are rising whilst we are still members of the EU why do we need to leave?why turn your back on your neighbours? We're not "turning our back". We will remain close neighbours. The figures show that the EU isn't the be all and end all when it comes to trade. Those figures have been diverging for years. When we joined the Common Market back in the 70's the bloc's economy represented about 38% of the world's economy. Now, the EU represents less than half that. 16% ish. And with more members. fullfact.org/europe/eu-has-shrunk-percentage-world-economy/ It is still the closest market and your figures DO NOT INCLUDE FINANCIAL SERVICES .
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2018 9:23:36 GMT
We're not "turning our back". We will remain close neighbours. The figures show that the EU isn't the be all and end all when it comes to trade. Those figures have been diverging for years. When we joined the Common Market back in the 70's the bloc's economy represented about 38% of the world's economy. Now, the EU represents less than half that. 16% ish. And with more members. fullfact.org/europe/eu-has-shrunk-percentage-world-economy/Why slap tarrifs on half of our trading though? Makes no sense. Makes sense when we can take back control of our borders, laws etc.
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Post by essexstokey on Jan 17, 2018 9:29:51 GMT
Why slap tarrifs on half of our trading though? Makes no sense. Makes sense when we can take back control of our borders, laws etc. Pity that the Tory's have cut our border forces to the bone then isn't it !!
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 17, 2018 10:50:12 GMT
Makes sense when we can take back control of our borders, laws etc. Pity that the Tory's have cut our border forces to the bone then isn't it !! Brexit will actually create hundreds and hundreds of jobs in the borders department. Rejoice comrade.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 17, 2018 11:04:59 GMT
We're not "turning our back". We will remain close neighbours. The figures show that the EU isn't the be all and end all when it comes to trade. Those figures have been diverging for years. When we joined the Common Market back in the 70's the bloc's economy represented about 38% of the world's economy. Now, the EU represents less than half that. 16% ish. And with more members. fullfact.org/europe/eu-has-shrunk-percentage-world-economy/ It is still the closest market and your figures DO NOT INCLUDE FINANCIAL SERVICES . Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 17, 2018 11:07:19 GMT
We're not "turning our back". We will remain close neighbours. The figures show that the EU isn't the be all and end all when it comes to trade. Those figures have been diverging for years. When we joined the Common Market back in the 70's the bloc's economy represented about 38% of the world's economy. Now, the EU represents less than half that. 16% ish. And with more members. fullfact.org/europe/eu-has-shrunk-percentage-world-economy/Why slap tarrifs on half of our trading though? Makes no sense. I'm not advocating 'slapping' any tariffs on. I'm quite in favour of unilateral imposing zero tariffs. As Digby Jones was saying the other day it would be the only trade deal in history where the two sides were trying to increase tariffs on trade.
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 17, 2018 11:18:42 GMT
It is still the closest market and your figures DO NOT INCLUDE FINANCIAL SERVICES . Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services. BIASED LEAVE CAMPAIGN CRAP,I WILL TAKE NOTICE OF INSTITUTE OF FISCAL STUDIES THANK YOU NOT YOUR LEAVE CRAP
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Post by Clayton Wood on Jan 17, 2018 11:20:14 GMT
Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services. BIASED LEAVE CAMPAIGN CRAP,I WILL TAKE NOTICE OF INSTITUTE OF FISCAL STUDIES THANK YOU NOT YOUR LEAVE CRAP CAPS LOCK broken?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2018 11:33:43 GMT
Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services. BIASED LEAVE CAMPAIGN CRAP,I WILL TAKE NOTICE OF INSTITUTE OF FISCAL STUDIES THANK YOU NOT YOUR LEAVE CRAP Oh yeh, they’re never wrong 🙄 🤣
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 17, 2018 11:55:30 GMT
Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services. BIASED LEAVE CAMPAIGN CRAP,I WILL TAKE NOTICE OF INSTITUTE OF FISCAL STUDIES THANK YOU NOT YOUR LEAVE CRAP Fine. Post a link to your figures. The figures used in the tweet I posted came from the Office of National Statistics (ONS).
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 17, 2018 12:16:19 GMT
It is still the closest market and your figures DO NOT INCLUDE FINANCIAL SERVICES . Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services. i think i am inclined to think your "FACT`S are in line with your leave slogan of £365 million for the N.H.S. lies!!!!!!
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 17, 2018 12:17:46 GMT
BIASED LEAVE CAMPAIGN CRAP,I WILL TAKE NOTICE OF INSTITUTE OF FISCAL STUDIES THANK YOU NOT YOUR LEAVE CRAP Oh yeh, they’re never wrong 🙄 🤣 Wad 365 million for the N.H.S. CORRECT?
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 17, 2018 12:19:04 GMT
BIASED LEAVE CAMPAIGN CRAP,I WILL TAKE NOTICE OF INSTITUTE OF FISCAL STUDIES THANK YOU NOT YOUR LEAVE CRAP CAPS LOCK broken? no just like shouting.
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Post by essexstokey on Jan 17, 2018 12:29:07 GMT
Oh yeh, they’re never wrong 🙄 🤣 Wad 365 million for the N.H.S. CORRECT? well according to Boris no it was a lot more even though everyone has said this figure was a lie !!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2018 12:40:45 GMT
Geographically close but world markets are 'shrinking' in distance. I'm not saying we abandon the EU for trade but it isn't and won't be the only major market out there. The figures (43% etc) in my original re-tweet post DO include services. i think i am inclined to think your "FACT`S are in line with your leave slogan of £365 million for the N.H.S. lies!!!!!! My leave slogan? I didn’t vote leave the European Union because a Tory told me that £350 could be better spent on the nhs I made my decision years before both sides started their bullshit campaigns
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Post by stayingupfor GermanStokie on Jan 17, 2018 12:52:04 GMT
i think i am inclined to think your "FACT`S are in line with your leave slogan of £365 million for the N.H.S. lies!!!!!! My leave slogan? I didn’t vote leave the European Union because a Tory told me that £350 could be better spent on the nhs I made my decision years before both sides started their bullshit campaigns And I made my decision based on my own research, looking at both sides of the argument. A red bus with some words on it did not influence my decision at all. It clearly stated what we would happen if we voted leave, including leaving the Single Market. On a basic level, it was in the booklet that the Government sent to all households and was clear that the Conservative Government wanted to remain.
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Post by followyoudown on Jan 17, 2018 13:40:05 GMT
i think i am inclined to think your "FACT`S are in line with your leave slogan of £365 million for the N.H.S. lies!!!!!! My leave slogan? I didn’t vote leave the European Union because a Tory told me that £350 could be better spent on the nhs I made my decision years before both sides started their bullshit campaigns It's not the catchiest slogan I've ever heard mate
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 17, 2018 13:42:21 GMT
For the first and last time the £350m is not a lie. Is our gross contribution £350m a week, yes. In fact for the last full year, 2016 it was actually £375m a week. Leave campaigns slogan was based on the forecast for 2016, which turns out to be too low. Now. Do we 'send' £350m a week to the EU, no. Our rebate, thanks to Maggie, and other regional and seasonal financial commitments continually adjust figures but we do send a net figure. Boris actually said we would "take back control" of the £350m which is indeed correct. "And yes – once we have settled our accounts, we will take back control of roughly £350 million per week. It would be a fine thing, as many of us have pointed out, if a lot of that money went on the NHS, provided we use that cash injection to modernise and make the most of new technology." - Boris Johnson. FACTS The bus slogan was "We send the EU £350 million a week - let's fund our NHS instead. Lets take back control"
The word 'send' is incorrect. Maybe 'earmark' would be more accurate. Apart from that it just an electioneering slogan.
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Post by skemstokie on Jan 17, 2018 15:21:05 GMT
i think i am inclined to think your "FACT`S are in line with your leave slogan of £365 million for the N.H.S. lies!!!!!! My leave slogan? I didn’t vote leave the European Union because a Tory told me that £350 could be better spent on the nhs I made my decision years before both sides started their bullshit campaigns You might have but loads believed that LIE, i have still got a vote remain on the back of my car and you would not believe how many people come up to me and say that was the reason they voted out. My local market had canvasser`s asking people if they would vote remain in a second referendum and there was a majority of those asked that would (mainly under 50 years of age ) the younger generation 18-30 group had a large number who had not voted but would vote remain if given another referendum.
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