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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Dec 19, 2016 22:24:08 GMT
Another thought on this: I am willing to bet you $100 that Stoke will never qualify for Europe with Mark Hughes at the helm. He is slightly younger than me so you are pretty safe because I will have to wait till he's dead to collect. QED etc. I'll raise your bet by a billion million and see you merrily in Europe next year to collect. Why keep casting aspertions when we're about to take on two of the sternist challenges of the season. We won't be scared. We've seen scintilating nogger, stoicism and some sloppiness in the run up. Two difficult fixtures and then we're at the top of the slope. Looking good for the slalom down. No need for so much negativity (and double posting for emphasis). My perception is that yr a reasonable poster who unfortunately reaches unreasonable conclusions. Smile. I was there too. See the whole journey differently to you though. We are nowhere near top of the slope , we are just in the right place having played everyone as will have all the others , wherever we are it will be where we deserve to be . I suspect three points above the drop zone with two six pointers to come Watford and Sunderland before Man Utd at home , by the end of those we could be back in mid table or deep in the shit . not to mention 2/3 of the way through a crucial window
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Post by kustokie on Dec 19, 2016 22:39:48 GMT
Another thought on this: I am willing to bet you $100 that Stoke will never qualify for Europe with Mark Hughes at the helm. He is slightly younger than me so you are pretty safe because I will have to wait till he's dead to collect. QED etc. I'll raise your bet by a billion million and see you merrily in Europe next year to collect. Why keep casting aspertions when we're about to take on two of the sternist challenges of the season. We won't be scared. We've seen scintilating nogger, stoicism and some sloppiness in the run up. Two difficult fixtures and then we're at the top of the slope. Looking good for the slalom down. No need for so much negativity (and double posting for emphasis). My perception is that yr a reasonable poster who unfortunately reaches unreasonable conclusions. Smile. I was there too. See the whole journey differently to you though. I don't view my opinion as negative. I just have very high expectations. I have experienced, first hand, what people can do if you challenge them to do their best and never give up. I used to work for a great company whose mantra was "performance, no excuses". That's what I expect from Hughes: performance, no excuses. Therefore, at half-time I expected us to score three or four more goals and BURY them. I did not expect them to sit deep and try to hang on. That gave Leicester hope and just invited them to get back into the game and they nearly beat us as a result. I definitely did not expect a bunch of excuses from Hughes and blame it on the players for being tired. What complete hogwash. Was Leicester more tired than Stoke after playing for 3/4 of the game with 10 man. Probably, but they never gave up, they seized their chance and, I repeat, they nearly beat us. If you tell someone they look tired, what do you expect in reply? "Oh, no, boss I am fine put me in". Or "Oh, yeah you're right, I'll sit this one out". Dreadful, personnel management. I don't think my missus will go for the increased bet, but I'll bring it up later this evening. I will buy you a drink in April when I'm back so we can continue this discussion. I do expect a good cup run and do expect us to finish higher than 9th, and do not expect bullshit excuses from the manager.
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Shaqiri
Dec 19, 2016 22:49:12 GMT
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Dec 19, 2016 22:49:12 GMT
QED etc. I'll raise your bet by a billion million and see you merrily in Europe next year to collect. Why keep casting aspertions when we're about to take on two of the sternist challenges of the season. We won't be scared. We've seen scintilating nogger, stoicism and some sloppiness in the run up. Two difficult fixtures and then we're at the top of the slope. Looking good for the slalom down. No need for so much negativity (and double posting for emphasis). My perception is that yr a reasonable poster who unfortunately reaches unreasonable conclusions. Smile. I was there too. See the whole journey differently to you though. I don't view my opinion as negative. I just have very high expectations. I have experienced, first hand, what people can do if you challenge them to do their best and never give up. I used to work for a great company whose mantra was "performance, no excuses". That's what I expect from Hughes: performance, no excuses. Therefore, at half-time I expected us to score three or four more goals and BURY them. I did not expect them to sit deep and try to hang on. That gave Leicester hope and just invited them to get back into the game and they nearly beat us as a result. I definitely did not expect a bunch of excuses from Hughes and blame it on the players for being tired. What complete hogwash. Was Leicester more tired than Stoke after playing for 3/4 of the game with 10 man. Probably, but they never gave up, they seized their chance and, I repeat, they nearly beat us. If you tell someone they look tired, what do you expect in reply? "Oh, no, boss I am fine put me in". Or "Oh, yeah you're right, I'll sit this one out". Dreadful, personnel management. I don't think my missus will go for the increased bet, but I'll bring it up later this evening. I will buy you a drink in April when I'm back so we can continue this discussion. I do expect a good cup run and do expect us to finish higher than 9th, and do not expect bullshit excuses from the manager. I nearly switched off as soon as you mentioned expectation and got yerself caught up with 'nearlys'. I'll take yr wife in part ex mate. ♡
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Post by kustokie on Dec 19, 2016 23:04:29 GMT
I don't view my opinion as negative. I just have very high expectations. I have experienced, first hand, what people can do if you challenge them to do their best and never give up. I used to work for a great company whose mantra was "performance, no excuses". That's what I expect from Hughes: performance, no excuses. Therefore, at half-time I expected us to score three or four more goals and BURY them. I did not expect them to sit deep and try to hang on. That gave Leicester hope and just invited them to get back into the game and they nearly beat us as a result. I definitely did not expect a bunch of excuses from Hughes and blame it on the players for being tired. What complete hogwash. Was Leicester more tired than Stoke after playing for 3/4 of the game with 10 man. Probably, but they never gave up, they seized their chance and, I repeat, they nearly beat us. If you tell someone they look tired, what do you expect in reply? "Oh, no, boss I am fine put me in". Or "Oh, yeah you're right, I'll sit this one out". Dreadful, personnel management. I don't think my missus will go for the increased bet, but I'll bring it up later this evening. I will buy you a drink in April when I'm back so we can continue this discussion. I do expect a good cup run and do expect us to finish higher than 9th, and do not expect bullshit excuses from the manager. I nearly switched off as soon as you mentioned expectation and got yerself caught up with 'nearlys'. I'll take yr wife in part ex mate. ♡ Nah. She's a saint and a keeper. She has to be to put up my bullshit.
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Post by alster on Dec 20, 2016 8:33:58 GMT
He deserved dropping after 2 awful performances. Next we will be accusing Hughes of the JFK assassination. His handing of Shaqiri was spot on in my book. His performances have dropped off a cliff so he was rightly benched. The mystery is more about what Ramadam has to do to get a game. Im gonna defend Hughes here though. For his in-game management faults he does tend to drop players that are not on form regardless of their pricetag. Nobody is accusing Hughes of such things. Looking in from the outside though, this seems like a really dumb move. Obviously we are not resting him. With a 9-game break after this fixture, that explanation is obviously a fiction. Beating Leicester is also more important than getting something from Anfield. So the only reason he has missed this game is to punish him for his tantrum on Wednesday? We are punishing ourselves by failing to use one of our best players in a game where we needed him most. If Arnautovic was not suspended, maybe we could get away with it. But having neither of our two wingers available is really difficult, why impose that situation on yourself? Even if you felt it was a good idea to bench him as some form of punishment, you would surely bring him on in the second half, with Fuchs on a yellow and us struggling to get the third goal and kill the game off? I really don't think we are that good that we can avoid to have such talent on the bench. Perhaps his last two performances weren't great, but that is true of many other players who are in the side. Against Southampton we were playing with ten men and he was subbed in any case. I wouldn't judge him on the basis of Arsenal away. In the previous two games against Burnley and Watford he was playing well, so I'm not sure why you think his form has dropped off a cliff?. His overall contribution this season has been decent. It was his freekick that rescued a point at Middlesborough, and two goals out of nothing that won the game at Hull. We need that kind of quality on the pitch. Diouf and Walters cannot provide it. You don't drop one of your best players on the back of two poor performances. I agree with you on Ramadan, but that is two simple decisions he has got wrong. If those two were on the pitch in the second half we would have killed them off. That's not hindsight either, it was fairly obvious at the time. Perhaps there is something else going on we are unaware of but based on the facts we have this is just really strange decision-making that is costing us points. Correct absolutely stupid to drop your best creative player on the back of two games where you've been under the cosh for long periods for differing reasons and not seen a great deal of the ball in the opposition half. Its not logical its not meritocracy he has his main role in the team, if anything in those games we failed him by not getting on the front foot not vice versa. Shaq's form has been good this season we bought him in to be attacking and creative not to be Dean Whitehead. If we can't get on the front foot withdraw him by all means he's never going to be very effective playing backs to the wall football.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Dec 20, 2016 9:17:10 GMT
Nobody is accusing Hughes of such things. Looking in from the outside though, this seems like a really dumb move. Obviously we are not resting him. With a 9-game break after this fixture, that explanation is obviously a fiction. Beating Leicester is also more important than getting something from Anfield. So the only reason he has missed this game is to punish him for his tantrum on Wednesday? We are punishing ourselves by failing to use one of our best players in a game where we needed him most. If Arnautovic was not suspended, maybe we could get away with it. But having neither of our two wingers available is really difficult, why impose that situation on yourself? Even if you felt it was a good idea to bench him as some form of punishment, you would surely bring him on in the second half, with Fuchs on a yellow and us struggling to get the third goal and kill the game off? I really don't think we are that good that we can avoid to have such talent on the bench. Perhaps his last two performances weren't great, but that is true of many other players who are in the side. Against Southampton we were playing with ten men and he was subbed in any case. I wouldn't judge him on the basis of Arsenal away. In the previous two games against Burnley and Watford he was playing well, so I'm not sure why you think his form has dropped off a cliff?. His overall contribution this season has been decent. It was his freekick that rescued a point at Middlesborough, and two goals out of nothing that won the game at Hull. We need that kind of quality on the pitch. Diouf and Walters cannot provide it. You don't drop one of your best players on the back of two poor performances. I agree with you on Ramadan, but that is two simple decisions he has got wrong. If those two were on the pitch in the second half we would have killed them off. That's not hindsight either, it was fairly obvious at the time. Perhaps there is something else going on we are unaware of but based on the facts we have this is just really strange decision-making that is costing us points. Correct absolutely stupid to drop your best creative player on the back of two games where you've been under the cosh for long periods for differing reasons and not seen a great deal of the ball in the opposition half. Its not logical its not meritocracy he has his main role in the team, if anything in those games we failed him by not getting on the front foot not vice versa. Shaq's form has been good this season we bought him in to be attacking and creative not to be Dean Whitehead. If we can't get on the front foot withdraw him by all means he's never going to be very effective playing backs to the wall football. Shaq is nowhere near our best player other than on the odd occasion that it suits him to be so. My kids love him, especially the little one, but I don't quite get him. He's lightweight, lazy and invariably plays for himself rather than the team. He frustrates the life out of me and the only reason he would have changed the game on Saturday is because players who don't play are always better than those that did after a bad result.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 9:21:13 GMT
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Post by kjpt140v on Dec 20, 2016 9:21:13 GMT
I've read quite a few threads in the past 24 hours and I can't find anyone asking the obvious question. Where was he yesterday? When we have Arnautovic out, why on earth is he on the bench? It is complete madness. And why was he not brought on at half time with Fuchs on a yellow? I'm thinking it must be punishment for his tantrum on Wednesday? If so that is really not good news because he could have made the difference yesterday. LMH is leaving more just as perplexed as TP often did. Were you at the Southampton game?
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Post by alster on Dec 20, 2016 9:34:09 GMT
Correct absolutely stupid to drop your best creative player on the back of two games where you've been under the cosh for long periods for differing reasons and not seen a great deal of the ball in the opposition half. Its not logical its not meritocracy he has his main role in the team, if anything in those games we failed him by not getting on the front foot not vice versa. Shaq's form has been good this season we bought him in to be attacking and creative not to be Dean Whitehead. If we can't get on the front foot withdraw him by all means he's never going to be very effective playing backs to the wall football. Shaq is nowhere near our best player other than on the odd occasion that it suits him to be so. My kids love him, especially the little one, but I don't quite get him. He's lightweight, lazy and invariably plays for himself rather than the team. He frustrates the life out of me and the only reason he would have changed the game on Saturday is because players who don't play are always better than those that did after a bad result. You are watching something completely different to me then. We haven't been great this season by any stretch of the imagination even our good recent results have been far from impressive but Shaq has been the driving force behind most of what we have done well so far.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 9:37:51 GMT
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Post by davejohnno1 on Dec 20, 2016 9:37:51 GMT
Shaq is nowhere near our best player other than on the odd occasion that it suits him to be so. My kids love him, especially the little one, but I don't quite get him. He's lightweight, lazy and invariably plays for himself rather than the team. He frustrates the life out of me and the only reason he would have changed the game on Saturday is because players who don't play are always better than those that did after a bad result. You are watching something completely different to me then. We haven't been great this season by any stretch of the imagination even our good recent results have been far from impressive but Shaq has been the driving force behind most of what we have done well so far. You've proved my point then. He's been the driving force behind very few wins and a less than impressive first half of the season. Methinks we have relied on this inconsistent charlatan and the end result has been less than impressive inconsistency. Sums Shaq up quite nicely I would say.
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Post by alster on Dec 20, 2016 9:51:38 GMT
You are watching something completely different to me then. We haven't been great this season by any stretch of the imagination even our good recent results have been far from impressive but Shaq has been the driving force behind most of what we have done well so far. You've proved my point then. He's been the driving force behind very few wins and a less than impressive first half of the season. Methinks we have relied on this inconsistent charlatan and the end result has been less than impressive inconsistency. Sums Shaq up quite nicely I would say. Not the way I see it, I think he could become a major cog in a more dynamic and vibrant team that I'd like us to become. He's a luxury player I can't argue with that but I think he'd be really good if we could get more pace, energy, movement and physical presence into the side.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 9:59:18 GMT
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Post by davejohnno1 on Dec 20, 2016 9:59:18 GMT
You've proved my point then. He's been the driving force behind very few wins and a less than impressive first half of the season. Methinks we have relied on this inconsistent charlatan and the end result has been less than impressive inconsistency. Sums Shaq up quite nicely I would say. Not the way I see it, I think he could become a major cog in a more dynamic and vibrant team that I'd like us to become. He's a luxury player I can't argue with that but I think he'd be really good if we could get more pace, energy, movement and physical presence into the side. My kids would agree with you. I don't . They think I'm harsh on him.
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Post by alster on Dec 20, 2016 10:08:07 GMT
Not the way I see it, I think he could become a major cog in a more dynamic and vibrant team that I'd like us to become. He's a luxury player I can't argue with that but I think he'd be really good if we could get more pace, energy, movement and physical presence into the side. My kids would agree with you. I don't . They think I'm harsh on him. They usually don't but I think they can and should be vying for the same position and despite an improved showing first half I'd go with Shaq over Bojan everytime. I think the reason they don't often play together and when they do it doesn't work too well is that there is a limit on the amount if midgets you can get away with playing in this league.
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Post by wuzza on Dec 20, 2016 16:01:22 GMT
I would have a lot more time for Shaq if he stopped massaging his own ego in the press and concentrated on putting a run of 3 or 4 highly effective games together. At the moment we get glimpses of talent and the very occasional match winning impact but his inconsistency is exactly why he is having to ply his trade at little old Stoke rather than all the other clubs he is forever being quoted about!
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 16:03:04 GMT
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Post by Cast no shadow on Dec 20, 2016 16:03:04 GMT
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Post by jezzascfc on Dec 20, 2016 16:19:27 GMT
I do worry he thinks he is too good for little old Stoke, almost that playing for us is beneath him. A spell on the bench will do his precious ego no harm, although I do still think he should have come on around the hour mark at the weekend, and could well have made a difference.
If we go 3-4-3 with Diouf at wing back, with no Arnie making it easier to see the logic in that, there is a case for leaving him stewing on the bench these next two games. No man in bigger than the team, and he needs to dig in and be more consistent and play for the team, rather than himself. He is a huge talent, but there is a huge ego to go with it.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 16:30:50 GMT
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Post by adi on Dec 20, 2016 16:30:50 GMT
Have I read a thread that has differing opinions that has manefested itself as a discussion rather than childish bickering and name calling?! Well done all involved! 😁👍
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Post by jimmygscfc on Dec 20, 2016 16:33:47 GMT
My patience is wearing thin with Shaqiri. I'm not quite at DJ's level yet, but I might be in the New Year.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 16:39:45 GMT
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ysc1 likes this
Post by adi on Dec 20, 2016 16:39:45 GMT
My patience is wearing thin with Shaqiri. I'm not quite at DJ's level yet, but I might be in the New Year. I'm starting to go the same way. For a player of his hype he should be carving through fullbacks almost at will. Hardly recall seeing him take anyone on. Just not performing to the potential we were expecting.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 16:51:34 GMT
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Post by heworksardtho on Dec 20, 2016 16:51:34 GMT
The scousers will be in with a cheeky 5 million pound bid in January
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Post by mickmillslovechild on Dec 20, 2016 16:58:14 GMT
The scousers will be in with a cheeky 5 million pound bid in January no-one will be i wouldn't have thought. i'm not one of the "Fuck him off" brigade, but there's no doubt that if any of the big boys had been keeping tabs on him the last few years but wanted someone else to take the gamble first to see how well he'd adapt to the Prem, he certainly hasn't shown anyone that he's capable of taking teams apart at will has he? flashes of brilliance (which is why it's so frustrating as we know he has it in his locker) but nothing like consistently enough to attract any of the big teams. That combined with his injury record (build of Maradona but resilience of a late 50s Madonna) suggests he's not going anywhere. i'm happy with that though, if he REALLY wants his big move then he'll only get it by showing his quality week in, week out and that can only benefit us. just a case of that reality actually hitting home to him at some point.....and soon please Shaq!
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Post by loosestools on Dec 20, 2016 17:03:47 GMT
Another thought on this: I am willing to bet you $100 that Stoke will never qualify for Europe with Mark Hughes at the helm. He is slightly younger than me so you are pretty safe because I will have to wait till he's dead to collect. QED etc. I'll raise your bet by a billion million and see you merrily in Europe next year to collect. Why keep casting aspertions when we're about to take on two of the sternist challenges of the season. We won't be scared. We've seen scintilating nogger, stoicism and some sloppiness in the run up. Two difficult fixtures and then we're at the top of the slope. Looking good for the slalom down. No need for so much negativity (and double posting for emphasis). My perception is that yr a reasonable poster who unfortunately reaches unreasonable conclusions. Smile. I was there too. See the whole journey differently to you though. It will not be LMH who will stop us getting into Europe - try looking in different boxes ie the ones containg a striker, the ones containing pacey players, the ones containing players under 30 etc.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 20:56:43 GMT
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Post by stantheman on Dec 20, 2016 20:56:43 GMT
Shaq is nowhere near our best player other than on the odd occasion that it suits him to be so. My kids love him, especially the little one, but I don't quite get him. He's lightweight, lazy and invariably plays for himself rather than the team. He frustrates the life out of me and the only reason he would have changed the game on Saturday is because players who don't play are always better than those that did after a bad result. You are watching something completely different to me then. We haven't been great this season by any stretch of the imagination even our good recent results have been far from impressive but Shaq has been the driving force behind most of what we have done well so far. Shaq only plays well against the poorer teams in the league and goes completely missing against the better teams. He believes his own hype and next time he drops to the floor, having barely been touched, I want Hughes to take him off the pitch.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 21:23:48 GMT
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Dec 20, 2016 21:23:48 GMT
QED etc. I'll raise your bet by a billion million and see you merrily in Europe next year to collect. Why keep casting aspertions when we're about to take on two of the sternist challenges of the season. We won't be scared. We've seen scintilating nogger, stoicism and some sloppiness in the run up. Two difficult fixtures and then we're at the top of the slope. Looking good for the slalom down. No need for so much negativity (and double posting for emphasis). My perception is that yr a reasonable poster who unfortunately reaches unreasonable conclusions. Smile. I was there too. See the whole journey differently to you though. It will not be LMH who will stop us getting into Europe - try looking in different boxes ie the ones containg a striker, the ones containing pacey players, the ones containing players under 30 etc. It's a transition though ain't it. I reckon we're on a pretty good course for it to happen.
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Post by kustokie on Dec 20, 2016 21:25:25 GMT
The scousers will be in with a cheeky 5 million pound bid in January I seriously doubt there will be much interest from any of the top Premier League now they have had a good chance to see how inconsistent he is at this level. He is capable of great flashes of brilliance but he doesn't do it anywhere near enough.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 21:32:14 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2016 21:32:14 GMT
He'd get nowhere near being a regular for Liverpool. We did him a favour, he just can't see it.
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smithypotter
Academy Starlet
"Damn you people, go back to your shanties".
Posts: 234
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Post by smithypotter on Dec 20, 2016 21:35:21 GMT
Considering the high work rate Klopp expects of his players I highly doubt you could put Shaqiri into that ethic. I'd rather he actually stopped talking so much, knuckled down and release his full potential on a consistent basis. Give us a few cracking seasons to watch him play then sell him for good money and he'll gets his big move. Sadly with how it's going right now, can't see it happening.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2016 22:14:08 GMT
Very interesting timing of these articles. I reckon he's after a move.
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Shaqiri
Dec 20, 2016 22:17:25 GMT
via mobile
Post by terryconroysmagic on Dec 20, 2016 22:17:25 GMT
Watching Shaq is like a dinner date with a hot dumb blonde, you've to put yourself through a frustrating and exasperating boring meal before she'll hopefully dazzle and excite you!
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Post by Will_75 on Dec 20, 2016 22:22:38 GMT
Wouldn't be to disappointed to be honest.He has been massively underwhelming in my opinion. It pisses me off because he has got loads of talent, but is very hit and miss. I keep waiting for him to get a level of consistency where he torments defenders week after week. It never happens, though. if he was consistently as good as he can be, he would be playing at champions league club, not us...
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Post by petecampbell on Dec 21, 2016 4:05:27 GMT
Lets be honest he has been mostly sub-standard for us. Its disappointing but thats the reality. Maybe he thinks he is too good for us, but if that were the case than surely turning up for a whole season (not just an odd game here and there) would be his best ticket back to a champions league club. Hopefully an extended spell on the bench lights a fire within him rather than the possible outcome of him stropping and moaning for a move.
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