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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 4, 2015 15:09:49 GMT
I don't think any blame can be pointed at Cameron. The ball in was decent, and Rondon only got to the ball first as he is lightening quick, does not matter what defender you put in that situation the outcome would of been the same. To say Geoff cannot read the ball is almost comical as the major part of Geoff's game is just that and intercepting the ball before the danger starts, unfortunately on this occasion he was beaten by a good ball and a fast strong player. As for Marc Wilson for 99% of a game he is a solid defender not spectacular but worthy of his place in the team, it's that other 1% where you can guarantee he will make a mistake, and most of the time the opposition capitalise on it making the mistake seem worse than it was He got caught the wrong side of him Marc. He can read the game to intercept but his positional sense is still a massive Achilles' Heel. Wilson makes fewer mistakes than GC in my opinion.
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Post by thestatusquo on Sept 4, 2015 15:11:11 GMT
I don't think any blame can be pointed at Cameron. The ball in was decent, and Rondon only got to the ball first as he is lightening quick, does not matter what defender you put in that situation the outcome would of been the same. To say Geoff cannot read the ball is almost comical as the major part of Geoff's game is just that and intercepting the ball before the danger starts, unfortunately on this occasion he was beaten by a good ball and a fast strong player. As for Marc Wilson for 99% of a game he is a solid defender not spectacular but worthy of his place in the team, it's that other 1% where you can guarantee he will make a mistake, and most of the time the opposition capitalise on it making the mistake seem worse than it was My issue is that they'd tried the same ball a number of times and we dealt with it. Geoff did seem a bit slow to react.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:20:39 GMT
What a fucking compliment that is! That's not what Mike Pejic said when he texted me just now! He text me saying squirrel hunting was cruel and could see why emphasised with Americans so much! We do both hate the country*. *This is a lie!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:22:39 GMT
I don't think any blame can be pointed at Cameron. The ball in was decent, and Rondon only got to the ball first as he is lightening quick, does not matter what defender you put in that situation the outcome would of been the same. To say Geoff cannot read the ball is almost comical as the major part of Geoff's game is just that and intercepting the ball before the danger starts, unfortunately on this occasion he was beaten by a good ball and a fast strong player. As for Marc Wilson for 99% of a game he is a solid defender not spectacular but worthy of his place in the team, it's that other 1% where you can guarantee he will make a mistake, and most of the time the opposition capitalise on it making the mistake seem worse than it was He switched off, the striker got the wrong side of him, a goal was scored. It was bad defending. Cameron and Wilson are very similar beasts. Both scare the shite out of me at centre back and neither are good enough for regular Premier League football there.
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Post by silverdollar on Sept 4, 2015 15:24:13 GMT
If a team is attacking with three men against one. The defender can go to the man on the ball and the ball gets passed to the other players who have a free run. West Brom had an attacking advantage. Cameron sticks skin tight to Rondon the ball is crossed elsewhere. Give the player some slack. If the game was 11 vs 11 different matter.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 4, 2015 15:26:35 GMT
If a team is attacking with three men against one. The defender can go to the man on the ball and the ball gets passed to the other players who have a free run. West Brom had an attacking advantage. Cameron sticks skin tight to Rondon the ball is crossed elsewhere. Give the player some slack. If the game was 11 vs 11 different matter. He was neither fish nor foul there though. He wasn't marking anybody. I did think he was terrific on Saturday apart from that though. It's just he does seem to have a fairly prominent role in a few of the goals we've conceded.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:26:57 GMT
I don't think any blame can be pointed at Cameron. The ball in was decent, and Rondon only got to the ball first as he is lightening quick, does not matter what defender you put in that situation the outcome would of been the same. To say Geoff cannot read the ball is almost comical as the major part of Geoff's game is just that and intercepting the ball before the danger starts, unfortunately on this occasion he was beaten by a good ball and a fast strong player. As for Marc Wilson for 99% of a game he is a solid defender not spectacular but worthy of his place in the team, it's that other 1% where you can guarantee he will make a mistake, and most of the time the opposition capitalise on it making the mistake seem worse than it was He switched off, the striker got the wrong side of him, a goal was scored. It was bad defending. Cameron and Wilson are very similar beasts. Both scare the shite out of me at centre back and neither are good enough for regular Premier League football there. The cross was delivered unchallenged. I assume you're going to hammer someone for not closing down right? It was 9vs11 and they were overloading us with bodies. Blaming Geoff for a goal that was somewhat inevitable (they'd certainly been pressing after the second red) is incredibly harsh. In hindsight, we all know that if we'd got to half time, then we'd have got a 0-0, but it wasn't to be. Blaming Geoff for a goal in a game where we had 9 fucking men is ridiculous and you know it!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:28:05 GMT
He switched off, the striker got the wrong side of him, a goal was scored. It was bad defending. Cameron and Wilson are very similar beasts. Both scare the shite out of me at centre back and neither are good enough for regular Premier League football there. The cross was delivered unchallenged. I assume you're going to hammer someone for not closing down right? It was 9vs11 and they were overloading us with bodies. Blaming Geoff for a goal that was somewhat inevitable (they'd certainly been pressing after the second red) is incredibly harsh. In hindsight, we all know that if we'd got to half time, then we'd have got a 0-0, but it wasn't to be. Blaming Geoff for a goal in a game where we had 9 fucking men is ridiculous and you know it! No it's not. He was at fault for it simple as. The defence of him is getting pretty laughable now.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:28:47 GMT
If a team is attacking with three men against one. The defender can go to the man on the ball and the ball gets passed to the other players who have a free run. West Brom had an attacking advantage. Cameron sticks skin tight to Rondon the ball is crossed elsewhere. Give the player some slack. If the game was 11 vs 11 different matter. He was neither fish nor foul there though. He wasn't marking anybody. I did think he was terrific on Saturday apart from that though. It's just he does seem to have a fairly prominent role in a few of the goals we've conceded. Liverpool? Not to blame. Norwich? Not to blame. Tottenham? Hardly to blame, although if you want to blame him you should be blaming about 4 or 5 others too. Luton? Not really to blame. Yes, lost the ball in midfield but Bardsley was nowhere and Wilson was incredibly flat footed. West Brom? 9 men, was defending loosely because they were getting bodies in the box. Slow to react maybe. Stop over egging the pudding mate.
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Post by thebet365 on Sept 4, 2015 15:28:37 GMT
He got caught the wrong side of him Marc. He can read the game to intercept but his positional sense is still a massive Achilles' Heel. Hang on, he was goal side of Rondon where you expect him to be, he got done by a great ball in and a good header. Maybe he could have been a yard or 2 closer to Rondon but he certainly wasn't the wrong side of him.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:30:33 GMT
The cross was delivered unchallenged. I assume you're going to hammer someone for not closing down right? It was 9vs11 and they were overloading us with bodies. Blaming Geoff for a goal that was somewhat inevitable (they'd certainly been pressing after the second red) is incredibly harsh. In hindsight, we all know that if we'd got to half time, then we'd have got a 0-0, but it wasn't to be. Blaming Geoff for a goal in a game where we had 9 fucking men is ridiculous and you know it! No it's not. He was at fault for it simple as. The defence of him is getting pretty laughable now. Not as laughable as the lynch mob spearheaded by you and a few others. You literally will shoehorn any of the blame onto him, regardless of how he plays. He could have a man of the match performance, and you'd blame him because you were late getting back from your half time pint. What's embarrassing, is the fact that you can somehow analyse our goals on a different level to reality and come out with the conclusion that Geoff is always to blame.
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Post by thebet365 on Sept 4, 2015 15:32:32 GMT
I don't think any blame can be pointed at Cameron. The ball in was decent, and Rondon only got to the ball first as he is lightening quick, does not matter what defender you put in that situation the outcome would of been the same. To say Geoff cannot read the ball is almost comical as the major part of Geoff's game is just that and intercepting the ball before the danger starts, unfortunately on this occasion he was beaten by a good ball and a fast strong player. As for Marc Wilson for 99% of a game he is a solid defender not spectacular but worthy of his place in the team, it's that other 1% where you can guarantee he will make a mistake, and most of the time the opposition capitalise on it making the mistake seem worse than it was He switched off, the striker got the wrong side of him, a goal was scored. It was bad defending. Cameron and Wilson are very similar beasts. Both scare the shite out of me at centre back and neither are good enough for regular Premier League football there. He doesn't switch off He looks where Rondon is, then sees the player go for the cross and makes the run back, Just gets done by the quality of it. There's no standing about, no losing a few yards for being slow, the ball just out does him. If it had been last season he would have just run into Rondon and given a penalty away. I don't think Butland covers himself in glory, looks like he goes to come out for it but stops, again that could be how good the ball in was tho.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:32:52 GMT
No it's not. He was at fault for it simple as. The defence of him is getting pretty laughable now. Not as laughable as the lynch mob spearheaded by you and a few others. You literally will shoehorn any of the blame onto him, regardless of how he plays. He could have a man of the match performance, and you'd blame him because you were late getting back from your half time pint. What's embarrassing, is the fact that you can somehow analyse our goals on a different level to reality and come out with the conclusion that Geoff is always to blame. It was an error, we pointed out, nothing more, nothing less. He's not always to blame is he? You're just making stuff up now.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:33:23 GMT
He switched off, the striker got the wrong side of him, a goal was scored. It was bad defending. Cameron and Wilson are very similar beasts. Both scare the shite out of me at centre back and neither are good enough for regular Premier League football there. He doesn't switch off He looks where Rondon is, then sees the player go for the cross and makes the run back, Just gets done by the quality of it. There's no standing about, no losing a few yards for being slow, the ball just out does him. If it had been last season he would have just run into Rondon and given a penalty away. I don't think Butland covers himself in glory, looks like he goes to come out for it but stops, again that could be how good the ball in was tho. He reacts too slowly. If he's where he should he heads it. *Watches the video* he barely looks at him and runs in the opposite direction.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:34:50 GMT
Not as laughable as the lynch mob spearheaded by you and a few others. You literally will shoehorn any of the blame onto him, regardless of how he plays. He could have a man of the match performance, and you'd blame him because you were late getting back from your half time pint. What's embarrassing, is the fact that you can somehow analyse our goals on a different level to reality and come out with the conclusion that Geoff is always to blame. It was an error, we pointed out, nothing more, nothing less. He's not always to blame is he? You're just making stuff up now. No he's not, but as far as I can tell you've blamed him in all but one game. For me Cameron has been one of our stand out performers this season. Nothing spectacular, but seemingly filled in for Ryan as best he could.
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Post by thebet365 on Sept 4, 2015 15:35:18 GMT
That still captures it perfectly. He's goalside, half a yard ahead. Just gets done by A) the ball in and B) the speed of Rondon.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:36:38 GMT
He switched off, the striker got the wrong side of him, a goal was scored. It was bad defending. Cameron and Wilson are very similar beasts. Both scare the shite out of me at centre back and neither are good enough for regular Premier League football there. He doesn't switch off He looks where Rondon is, then sees the player go for the cross and makes the run back, Just gets done by the quality of it. There's no standing about, no losing a few yards for being slow, the ball just out does him. If it had been last season he would have just run into Rondon and given a penalty away. I don't think Butland covers himself in glory, looks like he goes to come out for it but stops, again that could be how good the ball in was tho. Totally agree. It's a cracking ball and it's a very good run by Rondon. Jack doesn't cover himself in glory, but that's perhaps the lack of communication between the two.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:36:35 GMT
It was an error, we pointed out, nothing more, nothing less. He's not always to blame is he? You're just making stuff up now. No he's not, but as far as I can tell you've blamed him in all but one game. For me Cameron has been one of our stand out performers this season. Nothing spectacular, but seemingly filled in for Ryan as best he could. Well that's because he's made basic errors that have played parts in goals in all bar one. 2 of them I didn't even point out first!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:38:17 GMT
That still captures it perfectly. He's goalside, half a yard ahead. Just gets done by A) the ball in and B) the speed of Rondon. The attacker gets the wrong side of him and Geoff actually runs away from where Rondon is going meaning he gets caught under the ball. It's only for a fraction of a second but it's enough to mean he's made an error.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:40:18 GMT
No he's not, but as far as I can tell you've blamed him in all but one game. For me Cameron has been one of our stand out performers this season. Nothing spectacular, but seemingly filled in for Ryan as best he could. Well that's because he's made basic errors that have played parts in goals in all bar one. 2 of them I didn't even point out first! Yeah but he hasn't made basic errors has he. I pointed out above that he's not to blame in all but the goal against West Brom and even that's shakey at best. Muniesa has been involved in as many goals, and I don't see you slaughtering him Bayern? Where's the consistency mate... after all, it's nothing to do with an agenda. You told me as much.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:43:49 GMT
Well that's because he's made basic errors that have played parts in goals in all bar one. 2 of them I didn't even point out first! Yeah but he hasn't made basic errors has he. I pointed out above that he's not to blame in all but the goal against West Brom and even that's shakey at best. Muniesa has been involved in as many goals, and I don't see you slaughtering him Bayern? Where's the consistency mate... after all, it's nothing to do with an agenda. You told me as much. Ah you pointed it out, I will change my mind! He is, he made a basic error, you could even say he should try to play him offside (and could have done if him and Johnson step up) now that would be being harsh. He has? Like the Norwich one where he wins a towering header and those left don't cover him quick enough and erm....erm....erm.....
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Post by thebet365 on Sept 4, 2015 15:47:58 GMT
I'm amazed you've not criticised Whelan or Shaq for allowing the ball to come in.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:52:31 GMT
I'm amazed you've not criticised Whelan or Shaq for allowing the ball to come in. We never stop crosses, I gave up on that happening 10 years ago. And irrespective of that it should be dealt with. It is a good cross but it is one that if Cameron read correctly and fully knew where Rondon was he get his head on it and flicks it out for a corner. But it is just me and my agenda.
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Post by metalhead on Sept 4, 2015 15:53:46 GMT
I'm amazed you've not criticised Whelan or Shaq for allowing the ball to come in. I pointed this out. The cross is completely unchallenged. That said, why criticize? It's 9vs11, cracks were everywhere because we had less men, which is why blaming Geoff is just as insane. Yeah but he hasn't made basic errors has he. I pointed out above that he's not to blame in all but the goal against West Brom and even that's shakey at best. Muniesa has been involved in as many goals, and I don't see you slaughtering him Bayern? Where's the consistency mate... after all, it's nothing to do with an agenda. You told me as much. Ah you pointed it out, I will change my mind! He is, he made a basic error, you could even say he should try to play him offside (and could have done if him and Johnson step up) now that would be being harsh. He has? Like the Norwich one where he wins a towering header and those left don't cover him quick enough and erm....erm....erm..... I never said he tried to play him offside, he's caught by a superb cross, but to blame him considering the context of the game is harsh. As for Norwich, bollocks. Where's Muniesa? He's all over the place. Where's a number of players in fact. Simply not to blame for Norwich, but we all know you'll find a way.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 4, 2015 15:55:55 GMT
That still captures it perfectly. He's goalside, half a yard ahead. Just gets done by A) the ball in and B) the speed of Rondon. He has no awareness of where Rondon is.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 15:57:39 GMT
I'm amazed you've not criticised Whelan or Shaq for allowing the ball to come in. I pointed this out. The cross is completely unchallenged. That said, why criticize? It's 9vs11, cracks were everywhere because we had less men, which is why blaming Geoff is just as insane. Ah you pointed it out, I will change my mind! He is, he made a basic error, you could even say he should try to play him offside (and could have done if him and Johnson step up) now that would be being harsh. He has? Like the Norwich one where he wins a towering header and those left don't cover him quick enough and erm....erm....erm..... I never said he tried to play him offside, he's caught by a superb cross, but to blame him considering the context of the game is harsh. As for Norwich, bollocks. Where's Muniesa? He's all over the place. Where's a number of players in fact. Simply not to blame for Norwich, but we all know you'll find a way. I never said you did, I was using the royal "you" sorry. He could and maybe should step up (with Johnson) but that is harsh. Winning a header!
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Post by march4 on Sept 4, 2015 16:05:22 GMT
I don't know what we do with Geoff.
He works hard and tries hard but whatever position we try him, he isn't quite good enough.
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Post by wembley4372 on Sept 4, 2015 16:08:50 GMT
I don't think any blame can be pointed at Cameron. The ball in was decent, and Rondon only got to the ball first as he is lightening quick, does not matter what defender you put in that situation the outcome would of been the same. To say Geoff cannot read the ball is almost comical as the major part of Geoff's game is just that and intercepting the ball before the danger starts, unfortunately on this occasion he was beaten by a good ball and a fast strong player. As for Marc Wilson for 99% of a game he is a solid defender not spectacular but worthy of his place in the team, it's that other 1% where you can guarantee he will make a mistake, and most of the time the opposition capitalise on it making the mistake seem worse than it was No blame? How does that work, I should stick to hiding in bushes - oh and buy a fucking camera! I can just hear TP last words in the dressing room:- 'Just remember lads Gcam will be ball watching and won't have a clue what's going on behind him so just stick it over his head. I should know i've broken my toe twice kicking water bottles because he just can't learn. You can use the same technique to drag him out of defence thinking he can get to the ball and you'll leave the other CB exposed, he thinks he's reading the game but he's just getting suckered. It won't work every time but it will work at some point.'
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Post by hartzchoco on Sept 4, 2015 16:18:17 GMT
We were down to 9 men. Geoff fought incredibly hard and did himself proud. Boggles the mind how he can be singled out for the goal, especially in a hard fought 9 v 11 scenario, but such is the nature of a handful of sadly biased posters on here. It really is a shame.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 4, 2015 16:20:38 GMT
We were down to 9 men. Geoff fought incredibly hard and did himself proud. Boggles the mind how he can be singled out for the goal, especially in a hard fought 9 v 11 scenario, but such is the nature of a handful of sadly biased posters on here. It really is a shame. And an ex England international defender.....
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