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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 15, 2015 11:43:59 GMT
I think the massive variations involve the 'world class' players though Paul and with the best will in the world we aren't ever going to have any of them. Instead we are as normal 'speculating' but now it is with players demanding far higher rewards . We have always been a side where the whole has been greater than the sum of the parts but this can easily reverse as it has done at clubs such as West Ham, QPR etc etc in the past. There's no easy answer but I'm hoping that MH and the chaps have had enough experience of the problem not to let it arise here. Hmmm, I'm not really sure where you're going with this. How can you say that the massive variations only applies to world class players that we have no chance of signing, whilst at the same time claim that massive variations in wages could effect us? It doesn't make sense. I think there's been big wage variations here for a good while now. Both Crouch and KJ were on £70k a week at their previous clubs and they didn't take pay cuts to come here. Should the likes of Ryan and N'Zonzi be earning (at least) double what Walters earns? Of course they should, its's not even a discussion to be had.
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Post by mosquito on Jun 15, 2015 11:50:03 GMT
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Post by wuzza on Jun 15, 2015 12:13:32 GMT
I mean we really shouldn't be making wild salary offers to any of the players we have been linked with so far this summer - they haven't done enough to be paid more than our existing squad. (do you think Ryan is getting paid double Jon's salary ?)
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Post by foster on Jun 15, 2015 12:16:41 GMT
Keep him for a year then let him go. Ill be surprised if he's seen as a regular starter come August.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 15, 2015 12:19:09 GMT
I mean we really shouldn't be making wild salary offers to any of the players we have been linked with so far this summer - they haven't done enough to be paid more than our existing squad. (do you think Ryan is getting paid double Jon's salary ?) Eh? It doesn't work like that though. Crouch wouldn't have come here, if we hadn't matched his wage at Spurs, which in turn was massively bigger than the majority of players here at the time. You have to pay the players you want the going rate or else they'd never come here. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Ryan was earning about £60k a week and Jon was on £30k.
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Post by Pugsley on Jun 15, 2015 12:23:15 GMT
I mean we really shouldn't be making wild salary offers to any of the players we have been linked with so far this summer - they haven't done enough to be paid more than our existing squad. (do you think Ryan is getting paid double Jon's salary ?)
Really? Kono is an experienced CL player, an International and helped his team to a European final. What have our lads done?
I'm not belittling them as they have done great but if you're looking at players of this calibre then you'll have to pay.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Jun 15, 2015 12:26:18 GMT
Oh my god Jon Boy if this is your argument for higher pay "Stats wise, I'm also the fittest. I probably have the lowest body fat" Just sign the contract and be happy with the 20k-30k a week that you are currently on. Hes spent half his career in the lower leagues on a quarter of that salary. Nobody (apart from TP) is going to pay you any more I think scoring the most from the right is a pretty good stand point for him, but as the article says, it was just a standard journo twisting of words to make it sound something it wasn't.
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Post by foster on Jun 15, 2015 12:27:16 GMT
I mean we really shouldn't be making wild salary offers to any of the players we have been linked with so far this summer - they haven't done enough to be paid more than our existing squad. (do you think Ryan is getting paid double Jon's salary ?)
Really? Kono is an experienced CL player, an International and helped his team to a European final. What have our lads done?
Wouldn't offer Kono our joint top salary tbh. How much CL experience does he have? He got his team to the Europa League final didn't he? Also, Celtic play in the CL and I wouldn't want any of their players. ...and never heard of Kono before his name appeared on this site.
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Post by lawrieleslie on Jun 15, 2015 12:44:24 GMT
Isn't this a none-story though. SJW states at the end of the article that he has been misquoted by journalists to put a story together.
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Post by lordb on Jun 15, 2015 12:46:48 GMT
so he hasn't chucked a wobbler then
fine
next...
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Post by wuzza on Jun 15, 2015 12:48:28 GMT
As above Pugs, I had never heard of him (not that that means a lot). It's not him in particular I'm worried about its the general principle that we are going to end up paying a fortune in salaries simply because it is the only way we are going to get certain players to consider us as we have little or no profile in Europe. Are they worth it ? I have my doubts. Is it worth brassing off the rest of the playing staff. Again I have my doubts. It's bloody difficult.
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Post by wuzza on Jun 15, 2015 12:53:37 GMT
I've always thought we had quite a flat salary structure Paul (by footballs standards) but I could be wrong. If we need to pay a disproportionate salary for a player we are, in my opinion, shopping in the wrong market. (. NZonzi is a good example of doing it right)
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 15, 2015 13:00:06 GMT
I've always thought we had quite a flat salary structure Paul (by footballs standards) but I could be wrong. If we need to pay a disproportionate salary for a player we are, in my opinion, shopping in the wrong market. (. NZonzi is a good example of doing it right) I don't know what would make you think that because we don't (have a flat salary structure). Using your logic we would never have signed Crouch, Jones or Diouf. Ryan would have left us by now and we wouldn't have a chance in hell of keeping N'Zonzi. If we do manage to keep hold of N'Zonzi, you can be absolutely certain that he will be earning far, far more than players like Walters, Cameron or Bardsley etc.
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Post by wuzza on Jun 15, 2015 13:23:15 GMT
I think that because we dont have any particular superstars, most of the players have been with the club similar lengths of time and we havent had to make any daft offers to keep players because other clubs havent been queuing up to sign them....NZonzi and Bego being the first real testers on that front.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 15, 2015 13:33:14 GMT
I think that because we dont have any particular superstars, most of the players have been with the club similar lengths of time and we havent had to make any daft offers to keep players because other clubs havent been queuing up to sign them....NZonzi and Bego being the first real testers on that front. What about Crouch, Jones and Diouf? Ryan's new contract would have put him right at the top of the pay scale. Since we've been in the Prem the difference in individual players' salaries has been increasing all the time. It's not something that is just about to start happening for us, as you seem to be implying.
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Post by lawrieleslie on Jun 15, 2015 14:06:12 GMT
So chasing out of contract players seems a good idea because a large signing on fee can be offered in lieu of breaking the wage structure. To be honest though, it isn't rocket science this premier league. The more money it gets from TV and other media contracts the more players and agents demand. This will continue ad infinitum until somebody up top thinks it's a good idea to bring in wages and transfer fee cap. That'll be a long wait then
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Post by foster on Jun 15, 2015 14:28:00 GMT
I think that because we dont have any particular superstars, most of the players have been with the club similar lengths of time and we havent had to make any daft offers to keep players because other clubs havent been queuing up to sign them....NZonzi and Bego being the first real testers on that front. What about Crouch, Jones and Diouf? Ryan's new contract would have put him right at the top of the pay scale. Since we've been in the Prem the difference in individual players' salaries has been increasing all the time. It's not something that is just about to start happening for us, as you seem to be implying. Let's see what happens if Bojan has a good full season. I can see us having to go significantly beyond 60k per week to keep him happy. Not that's he'll be playing up but other clubs would pay that.... Theoretically.
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Post by roylandstoke on Jun 15, 2015 15:19:48 GMT
As above Pugs, I had never heard of him (not that that means a lot). It's not him in particular I'm worried about its the general principle that we are going to end up paying a fortune in salaries simply because it is the only way we are going to get certain players to consider us as we have little or no profile in Europe. Are they worth it ? I have my doubts. Is it worth brassing off the rest of the playing staff. Again I have my doubts. It's bloody difficult. Getting and keeping the wage structure of the club is a hugely important task and is massively complicated by the Bosman players who will feel they should get higher wages as their initial cost to the club is that much lower than those who we have forked out transfer fees for. If new arrivals get better deals than those who are already here then a sense of dissatisfaction will inevitably grow. Management is then left with the problem of which players they want to keep here so much that they are prepared to offer them improved deals. Sadly for SJW I don't see him in that situation. Hughes will probably want to keep him here to see out his contract rather than sell him for £1-2M we would probably get for him but I don't think he will want to raise his wages to the level of the highest earners who he desperately wants to keep here. As far as I am concerned the clubs priority this year should be to tie Steven N'Zonzi to a very long term deal. We have two players who we will find it incredibly difficult to replace; they are Ryan and Zonz. Anyone coming to the club expecting to be paid better than these two had better be absolute world class. As yet I don't think we have been linked to anyone of that class this year, that includes Konoplyanka. If he is expecting more than Zonz he should get himself off to Spain and enjoy the sunshine.
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Post by march4 on Jun 15, 2015 18:46:27 GMT
One of the main reasons we beat Liverpool so easily was because SJW battered them physically in the first 10mins.
And its not the first time he has done it this season. He sets the tone for the game, particularly at home.
The front 3 of Arnie, Mame and SJW presents an uncomfortable set of options few defences fancy facing.
He is also our 'out' ball when we are looking to turn defence into attack, because Mame isn't as good in the air.
I think LMH likes a flying winger on one side of the front 3 and a more physical player on the other side.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2015 21:13:55 GMT
Isn't it a piece of piss Jon? Just find a new club that will pay you what you're worth.
What's that?? We're only offering you £30k per week? If you can better that, then good luck to you.
If you're expecting to be anywhere near the top earners - dream on. Why should you? Should Chris Smalling be on £300k like Wayne Rooney?? Should he balls. And like I said, if there's £50k per week out there, all the best and thanks for everything you've done for Stoke.
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Post by Birchesheadpotter on Jun 15, 2015 21:21:55 GMT
One of the main reasons we beat Liverpool so easily was because SJW battered them physically in the first 10mins. Nah, good try though
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Jun 15, 2015 21:48:53 GMT
Fuck him off. Someone had to say it
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Post by boskampsflaps on Jun 15, 2015 22:05:09 GMT
Isn't it a piece of piss Jon? Just find a new club that will pay you what you're worth. What's that?? We're only offering you £30k per week? If you can better that, then good luck to you. If you're expecting to be anywhere near the top earners - dream on. Why should you? Should Chris Smalling be on £300k like Wayne Rooney?? Should he balls. And like I said, if there's £50k per week out there, all the best and thanks for everything you've done for Stoke. Did you not read what he said?
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Post by parttimelurker on Jun 15, 2015 22:28:19 GMT
Definitely an utter bollocks story. I think that the body fat quote was a reply to someone on twitter a while back, it's exactly as he says different quotes strung together to make a story.
I don't doubt that he's trying to get the best possible deal for himself though, don't we all?
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Post by djduncanjames on Jun 15, 2015 22:43:16 GMT
Definitely an utter bollocks story. I think that the body fat quote was a reply to someone on twitter a while back, it's exactly as he says different quotes strung together to make a story. I don't doubt that he's trying to get the best possible deal for himself though, don't we all? He loves playing for us, and is IMO a massive player for us. Hope he hangs his boots here and stays on for years to come. Tough as nails our Jon Ron.
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Post by stokemanusa on Jun 16, 2015 8:47:14 GMT
After reading this thread one song came to mind... "Why did ye run from me and the child Oh Johnny, I hardly knew ye." "Indeed your dancing days are done Oh Johnny, I hardly knew ye." "You'll have to be left with a bowl out to beg Oh Johnny I hardly knew ye." Working his way out of Stoke aaard. I like his on the field attitude and he seems to be happy during his time here... I think he deserves another year, but if it has to be less money... He should be glad Hughes is contemplating another year at the same or slightly lower wage for a 32 year old forward/ winger who will be 33 at they end of the contract if this jabberwocky is true.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2015 9:24:07 GMT
As huge a fan of John that I am, I think we should consider letting him go. Big signing on fee somewhere for him. I'd love to see him in the MLS, he'd be a massive hit out there. I'd hate to see him go to another Prem Club.
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Post by manchesterpotter on Jun 16, 2015 14:50:31 GMT
I find it very strange that he could expect to be on a higher wage, especially when's he coming towards the end of his career and will likely be a bit part player next season. Where's his perspective?
If my boss hired some people who were better than me, I wouldn't be banging on his door and saying I want my hours dropped and my salary increased. It just wouldnt happen.
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Post by FullerMagic on Jun 18, 2015 21:36:23 GMT
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jun 18, 2015 21:47:28 GMT
I think that because we dont have any particular superstars, most of the players have been with the club similar lengths of time and we havent had to make any daft offers to keep players because other clubs havent been queuing up to sign them....NZonzi and Bego being the first real testers on that front. What about Crouch, Jones and Diouf? Ryan's new contract would have put him right at the top of the pay scale. Since we've been in the Prem the difference in individual players' salaries has been increasing all the time. It's not something that is just about to start happening for us, as you seem to be implying. Ryan is the joint highest earner at the club and his new contract ensured that would be so for the duration of it. If kono, or anyone else, comes in on a higher wage, shawcross will get a nice pay rise on the back of it.
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