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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2015 22:14:14 GMT
Nah I'll just ignore you instead.
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Post by mcf on Apr 30, 2015 15:11:03 GMT
Personally i'm really interested in hearing what the millionaire tax avoiding MP who has never had a real job outside politics had to say to a crap multi-millionaire tax avoiding actor and comedian at his 2 million pound house before returning to his own 3 million pound house, I mean if these guys don't understand what ordinary people need who can..... Laughable. It would be nice to see a working class man in charge of a major political party, however at the time he was made leader and ever since enough people must think Milliband is the right man for the job. If he wasn't he wouldn't be leader it's that simple. Do you want to go ahead and show me the evidence for tax avoiding? As for Brand he's clearly not to your personal taste, but the fact that he's got to where he has in life indicates that there must be a lot of people out there who like him. Get a fucking grip for crying out loud The unions put him there. His father set up some kind of inheritance dodging scheme. As for the not liking them because we don't share the same opinions - that is horse shit. I hate them because they say one thing and they do completely another.
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Post by bathstoke on Apr 30, 2015 17:31:33 GMT
Personally i'm really interested in hearing what the millionaire tax avoiding MP who has never had a real job outside politics had to say to a crap multi-millionaire tax avoiding actor and comedian at his 2 million pound house before returning to his own 3 million pound house, I mean if these guys don't understand what ordinary people need who can..... Laughable. It would be nice to see a working class man in charge of a major political party, however at the time he was made leader and ever since enough people must think Milliband is the right man for the job. If he wasn't he wouldn't be leader it's that simple. Do you want to go ahead and show me the evidence for tax avoiding? As for Brand he's clearly not to your personal taste, but the fact that he's got to where he has in life indicates that there must be a lot of people out there who like him. The thing is Edgy, Brand is obviously a sharp guy, who's lived off his wits, made a good living for himself & gets loads of top draw lady's, so he's bound to attract the ire of the green eyed monster
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Post by edgepotter on Apr 30, 2015 17:51:45 GMT
Laughable. It would be nice to see a working class man in charge of a major political party, however at the time he was made leader and ever since enough people must think Milliband is the right man for the job. If he wasn't he wouldn't be leader it's that simple. Do you want to go ahead and show me the evidence for tax avoiding? As for Brand he's clearly not to your personal taste, but the fact that he's got to where he has in life indicates that there must be a lot of people out there who like him. Get a fucking grip for crying out loud The unions put him there. His father set up some kind of inheritance dodging scheme. As for the not liking them because we don't share the same opinions - that is horse shit. I hate them because they say one thing and they do completely another. I asked for the evidence and you said 'his father set up some kind of inheritance dodging scheme' which is completely wrong so you've clearly got no idea what you're talking about. Embarrassing from you yet again. www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/did-ed-miliband-avoid-inheritance-tax-parents-home-deed-of-variationThe hypocrite stuff doesn't wash with me either, Ed and Russell are actually getting more and more popular probably much to yours and Rupert Murdochs despair. Out of interest who will you be supporting?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2015 18:02:07 GMT
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Post by bathstoke on Apr 30, 2015 18:39:44 GMT
Not only a Green eyed monster, but the man doth protest too much methinks
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Post by edgepotter on Apr 30, 2015 21:37:04 GMT
His popularity since then has gone up not down, people clearly don't think he's being hypocritical, because he isn't.
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Post by desman2 on Apr 30, 2015 21:54:33 GMT
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Post by edgepotter on Apr 30, 2015 22:01:10 GMT
He said re-elect Caroline Lucas for her Brighton seat which is completely different to saying vote Green everywhere. Why do so many people not understand context.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2015 22:01:58 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2015 22:44:28 GMT
Yes we were promised the debt would be gone but by 2017 I think, but considering the EU and the states carried on with a recession we have done very well. It was the deficit not the debt that was promised to be gone by 2017, the deficit that runs at 100 billion a year +, of course Luke believes tax receipts don't affect the debt and nor does the deficit, so it must be magic beans the government pays staff in otherwise i'm not sure how spending 100 billion+ more than you get in tax receipts could be paid for as we're assured it's definitely not through borrowing unless of course Luke is wrong. This of course also explains why he doesn't get debt going up even when the deficit is coming down. Ah bless, that's sweet of you to help out a thoroughly confused right winger in Northwich! Strange that you didn't take him to task over it though! I wonder why not!! No, I fully get the links between tax, spend, deficit, borrowing and debt, but as Northwich just neatly proved, and you realised by having to embarrassingly bail him out, and mcf has shown many times before, you lot on the right simply don't understand it. Mcf is even twittering on about some inheritance dodging scheme Miliband is supposed to have benefited from? Who wants to dodge their own inheritance? You're even more confused than normal, mcf! Thanks, Northy, job done I think!!
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Post by mcf on May 1, 2015 0:18:42 GMT
'a well written will'
say no more
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 0:25:59 GMT
Dont tell me you are ignoring me ?
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 6:11:56 GMT
Finally, you're wising up
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Post by followyoudown on May 1, 2015 12:51:13 GMT
It was the deficit not the debt that was promised to be gone by 2017, the deficit that runs at 100 billion a year +, of course Luke believes tax receipts don't affect the debt and nor does the deficit, so it must be magic beans the government pays staff in otherwise i'm not sure how spending 100 billion+ more than you get in tax receipts could be paid for as we're assured it's definitely not through borrowing unless of course Luke is wrong. This of course also explains why he doesn't get debt going up even when the deficit is coming down. Ah bless, that's sweet of you to help out a thoroughly confused right winger in Northwich! Strange that you didn't take him to task over it though! I wonder why not!! No, I fully get the links between tax, spend, deficit, borrowing and debt, but as Northwich just neatly proved, and you realised by having to embarrassingly bail him out, and mcf has shown many times before, you lot on the right simply don't understand it. Mcf is even twittering on about some inheritance dodging scheme Miliband is supposed to have benefited from? Who wants to dodge their own inheritance? You're even more confused than normal, mcf! Thanks, Northy, job done I think!! Of course you fully get the links who was that other guy using your log on around the time of Southampton away, he seemed to be struggling a bit more.
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Post by followyoudown on May 1, 2015 13:03:46 GMT
Get a fucking grip for crying out loud The unions put him there. His father set up some kind of inheritance dodging scheme. As for the not liking them because we don't share the same opinions - that is horse shit. I hate them because they say one thing and they do completely another. I asked for the evidence and you said 'his father set up some kind of inheritance dodging scheme' which is completely wrong so you've clearly got no idea what you're talking about. Embarrassing from you yet again. www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/did-ed-miliband-avoid-inheritance-tax-parents-home-deed-of-variationThe hypocrite stuff doesn't wash with me either, Ed and Russell are actually getting more and more popular probably much to yours and Rupert Murdochs despair. Out of interest who will you be supporting? Maybe you should go back and read your link again, his father died in 1994 this deed of variation was put in place within 2 years the sole aim was to reduce tax paid which was done, the fact more wasn't saved later when his mother died is due to changes in tax law 11 years later and nothing to do with anything else. There are also questions over Ed and the love of his electoral life's actions when selling their flats to buy their 3 million mansion, despite living together both claimed their own flats were their main residences making another nice saving.
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Post by mcf on May 1, 2015 14:25:55 GMT
you know the rules FYD
when its Labour its just tax efficieny
when its a Tory its tax avoidance
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Post by edgepotter on May 1, 2015 18:11:30 GMT
you know the rules FYD when its Labour its just tax efficieny when its a Tory its tax avoidance You've got a really bizarre way of debating, in that you make claims you can't possibly substantiate. Here's an interesting quote from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31438865'Mr Miliband reacted to Lord Fink's comments by saying: "I think this is a defining moment in David Cameron's leadership of the Conservative Party because it is now revealed that he appointed a treasurer of the Conservative Party who says everyone engages in tax avoidance. I don't think that is the view of most people, I don't think it's the view of the country, and I think it does say something about the Conservative Party and where it has reached.
"The question today that David Cameron has to answer is does he agree with Lord Fink about this? Does he sanction his attitude or does he not?"' There's two really simple ways to show your assertion that he 'avoided' tax is false. 1) The Tory party have been desperate to try and smear Miliband in order to win this election, and they've failed badly. Funnily enough this hasn't been bought up during the election campaign and, David Cameron, when challenged directly by Miliband hasn't come out and attacked Miliband for it. 2) The Sun have also used some pretty lame stories to try and smear Miliband (like Miliband's dad hated Britain), and even they haven't used this supposed 'avoidance' as a stick to beat Miliband with. By all means carry on with these straw man arguments because they are so, so easy to discredit.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 18:32:48 GMT
Ah bless, that's sweet of you to help out a thoroughly confused right winger in Northwich! Strange that you didn't take him to task over it though! I wonder why not!! No, I fully get the links between tax, spend, deficit, borrowing and debt, but as Northwich just neatly proved, and you realised by having to embarrassingly bail him out, and mcf has shown many times before, you lot on the right simply don't understand it. Mcf is even twittering on about some inheritance dodging scheme Miliband is supposed to have benefited from? Who wants to dodge their own inheritance? You're even more confused than normal, mcf! Thanks, Northy, job done I think!! Of course you fully get the links who was that other guy using your log on around the time of Southampton away, he seemed to be struggling a bit more. LOL, maybe Northwich or mcf nicked my log on details back then, eh!! You won't be able to bring yourself to admit it here I'm sure, but you must have rolled your eyes when you read Northy's nonsense! Still, debt, deficit what's a little confusion over details among rightwing friends, the main thing is they know what's good for the country ???
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Post by harryburrows on May 1, 2015 18:36:31 GMT
you know the rules FYD when its Labour its just tax efficieny when its a Tory its tax avoidance You've got a really bizarre way of debating, in that you make claims you can't possibly substantiate. Here's an interesting quote from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31438865'Mr Miliband reacted to Lord Fink's comments by saying: "I think this is a defining moment in David Cameron's leadership of the Conservative Party because it is now revealed that he appointed a treasurer of the Conservative Party who says everyone engages in tax avoidance. I don't think that is the view of most people, I don't think it's the view of the country, and I think it does say something about the Conservative Party and where it has reached.
"The question today that David Cameron has to answer is does he agree with Lord Fink about this? Does he sanction his attitude or does he not?"' There's two really simple ways to show your assertion that he 'avoided' tax is false. 1) The Tory party have been desperate to try and smear Miliband in order to win this election, and they've failed badly. Funnily enough this hasn't been bought up during the election campaign and, David Cameron, when challenged directly by Miliband hasn't come out and attacked Miliband for it. 2) The Sun have also used some pretty lame stories to try and smear Miliband (like Miliband's dad hated Britain), and even they haven't used this supposed 'avoidance' as a stick to beat Miliband with. By all means carry on with these straw man arguments because they are so, so easy to discredit. Milliband like everyone else tries to pay as little tax as possible within the law , nothing wrong with that principle , whatever your politics
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 18:37:30 GMT
you know the rules FYD when its Labour its just tax efficieny when its a Tory its tax avoidance You've got a really bizarre way of debating, in that you make claims you can't possibly substantiate. Here's an interesting quote from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31438865'Mr Miliband reacted to Lord Fink's comments by saying: "I think this is a defining moment in David Cameron's leadership of the Conservative Party because it is now revealed that he appointed a treasurer of the Conservative Party who says everyone engages in tax avoidance. I don't think that is the view of most people, I don't think it's the view of the country, and I think it does say something about the Conservative Party and where it has reached.
"The question today that David Cameron has to answer is does he agree with Lord Fink about this? Does he sanction his attitude or does he not?"' There's two really simple ways to show your assertion that he 'avoided' tax is false. 1) The Tory party have been desperate to try and smear Miliband in order to win this election, and they've failed badly. Funnily enough this hasn't been bought up during the election campaign and, David Cameron, when challenged directly by Miliband hasn't come out and attacked Miliband for it. 2) The Sun have also used some pretty lame stories to try and smear Miliband (like Miliband's dad hated Britain), and even they haven't used this supposed 'avoidance' as a stick to beat Miliband with. By all means carry on with these straw man arguments because they are so, so easy to discredit. Yes, edge, mcf has a very odd way with claims he believes to be facts, but you'll get used to it eventually. The bottom line is, and these are two direct quotes from him, "I am biased in my thinking [against the left]" and "I have a limited understanding of financial matters". Credit where it's due he's pretty open about it. So, don't expect too much by way of reasoned debate
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Post by edgepotter on May 1, 2015 18:49:31 GMT
You've got a really bizarre way of debating, in that you make claims you can't possibly substantiate. Here's an interesting quote from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31438865'Mr Miliband reacted to Lord Fink's comments by saying: "I think this is a defining moment in David Cameron's leadership of the Conservative Party because it is now revealed that he appointed a treasurer of the Conservative Party who says everyone engages in tax avoidance. I don't think that is the view of most people, I don't think it's the view of the country, and I think it does say something about the Conservative Party and where it has reached.
"The question today that David Cameron has to answer is does he agree with Lord Fink about this? Does he sanction his attitude or does he not?"' There's two really simple ways to show your assertion that he 'avoided' tax is false. 1) The Tory party have been desperate to try and smear Miliband in order to win this election, and they've failed badly. Funnily enough this hasn't been bought up during the election campaign and, David Cameron, when challenged directly by Miliband hasn't come out and attacked Miliband for it. 2) The Sun have also used some pretty lame stories to try and smear Miliband (like Miliband's dad hated Britain), and even they haven't used this supposed 'avoidance' as a stick to beat Miliband with. By all means carry on with these straw man arguments because they are so, so easy to discredit. Yes, edge, mcf has a very odd way with claims he believes to be facts, but you'll get used to it eventually. The bottom line is, and these are two direct quotes from him, "I am biased in my thinking [against the left]" and "I have a limited understanding of financial matters". Credit where it's due he's pretty open about it. So, don't expect too much by way of reasoned debate Yeah there's a pretty big difference between having an opinion, and having an informed opinion but it seems some people on this board haven't quite grasped this concept yet.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 18:58:56 GMT
You've got a really bizarre way of debating, in that you make claims you can't possibly substantiate. Here's an interesting quote from www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31438865'Mr Miliband reacted to Lord Fink's comments by saying: "I think this is a defining moment in David Cameron's leadership of the Conservative Party because it is now revealed that he appointed a treasurer of the Conservative Party who says everyone engages in tax avoidance. I don't think that is the view of most people, I don't think it's the view of the country, and I think it does say something about the Conservative Party and where it has reached.
"The question today that David Cameron has to answer is does he agree with Lord Fink about this? Does he sanction his attitude or does he not?"' There's two really simple ways to show your assertion that he 'avoided' tax is false. 1) The Tory party have been desperate to try and smear Miliband in order to win this election, and they've failed badly. Funnily enough this hasn't been bought up during the election campaign and, David Cameron, when challenged directly by Miliband hasn't come out and attacked Miliband for it. 2) The Sun have also used some pretty lame stories to try and smear Miliband (like Miliband's dad hated Britain), and even they haven't used this supposed 'avoidance' as a stick to beat Miliband with. By all means carry on with these straw man arguments because they are so, so easy to discredit. Milliband like everyone else tries to pay as little tax as possible within the law , nothing wrong with that principle , whatever your politics I find it wrong in principle, harry! Taxes are what provide the funds to run decent public services, strong defence, the judiciary, you name it. It's only because the last 30 odd years have seen both main parties try to claim that you can still have fantastic services while not really paying for them through general taxation (the savings and efficiencies con) that tax dodging is tacitly condoned by both governments and everyone thinks it's ok. It's nuts if you believe in having anything beyond mid 20th century levels of public services.
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Post by edgepotter on May 1, 2015 19:40:19 GMT
I challenge anyone who thinks Brand isn't funny to watch this and not laugh once.
The depressing thing is it's funny because it's true.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 19:57:11 GMT
I did laugh at the Sieg Heil bit! Unfortunate!
A portrait of Ed Miliband was just as cringeworthy though!
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Post by Beardy200 on May 1, 2015 20:05:48 GMT
I challenge anyone who thinks Brand isn't funny to watch this and not laugh once. The depressing thing is it's funny because it's true. I managed.
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Post by mcf on May 1, 2015 20:08:42 GMT
Milliband like everyone else tries to pay as little tax as possible within the law , nothing wrong with that principle , whatever your politics I find it wrong in principle, harry! Taxes are what provide the funds to run decent public services, strong defence, the judiciary, you name it. It's only because the last 30 odd years have seen both main parties try to claim that you can still have fantastic services while not really paying for them through general taxation (the savings and efficiencies con) that tax dodging is tacitly condoned by both governments and everyone thinks it's ok. It's nuts if you believe in having anything beyond mid 20th century levels of public services. why don't you and edge take Miliband to task then? Edge's link says it was a 'well written will' What do you think he meant by that? That is was full of lovely words and a pretty font?
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Post by edgepotter on May 1, 2015 21:18:22 GMT
I find it wrong in principle, harry! Taxes are what provide the funds to run decent public services, strong defence, the judiciary, you name it. It's only because the last 30 odd years have seen both main parties try to claim that you can still have fantastic services while not really paying for them through general taxation (the savings and efficiencies con) that tax dodging is tacitly condoned by both governments and everyone thinks it's ok. It's nuts if you believe in having anything beyond mid 20th century levels of public services. why don't you and edge take Miliband to task then? Edge's link says it was a 'well written will' What do you think he meant by that? That is was full of lovely words and a pretty font? Our society is full of well written legal loopholes that are open to exploitation and are in desperate need of changing and you want to take one of the few people who seems like he wants to do anything about tax avoidance to task over a will written by his dad? "but he's a hypocrite" you say. You're wrong but even if you were right I'd rather have a hypocrite who is prepared to do something about it rather than others who are simply ignoring the topic, I've heard nothing out of Cameron or Farage about challenging these big companies who are willfully avoiding tax, I haven't heard a peep out of them about challenging the influence the likes of Rupert Murdoch have and it's an absolute disgrace. My biggest disappointment with the older right-wing generation is that so many of you are eager to criticise Brand for what he's doing. Whenever I ask people to tell me 'what it is about what he's saying that isn't true' no-one can answer me, so instead the arguments turn to 'it's not what he says it's the way he says it' and 'what he's saying is nothing new, Tony Benn, Noam Chomsky etc have been saying this for years'. Well if that's the case and you're all clever and wise enough to know what's been going on then why on earth have you not done anything about it?
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 7:23:33 GMT
I find it wrong in principle, harry! Taxes are what provide the funds to run decent public services, strong defence, the judiciary, you name it. It's only because the last 30 odd years have seen both main parties try to claim that you can still have fantastic services while not really paying for them through general taxation (the savings and efficiencies con) that tax dodging is tacitly condoned by both governments and everyone thinks it's ok. It's nuts if you believe in having anything beyond mid 20th century levels of public services. why don't you and edge take Miliband to task then? Edge's link says it was a 'well written will' What do you think he meant by that? That is was full of lovely words and a pretty font? Erm, because it's a million times funnier seeing your ill-informed, spittle-flecked invective turn into increasingly childish nonsense as it gets picked apart once again!? ??? But for the record one more time, all tax avoidance loopholes should be closed as they just damage the country as a whole.
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