|
Post by Davef on Feb 10, 2015 12:24:36 GMT
The feature is more about how well Mark Hughes is doing than TP to be fair.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 12:34:31 GMT
The first half of 12/13 certainly saw us collect a decent points total but by god we were awful, just awful. I think we went 10 games unbeaten in that period and if you exclude the magnificent Liverpool game, managed to do it while only playing well for about 60 minutes in total, a truly bizarre little spell. Ultimately, over 38 games, we played well for 90 mins once. Once. The rest was just grind, grind, grind. Sometimes you have to grind, it's a key component of any decent team, but you can't just grind all the time, promising jam tomorrow, not at todays prices. Also, another nail in Pulis coffin was, i suspect, the rise of Swansea and Southampton who proved that you could get promoted, play nice football, stay up comfortably and not spend a fortune. Everything TP had been telling anyone who would listen was impossible. There's a small feature in tomorrow night's Oatcake about our record since we've been in the Premier League at this stage of the season (not written by me before anyone gets their knickers in a twist ) 33 points represents the best total we've had after 24 games since we came up, but did you know that in four of TP's five seasons as our manager in the Premier League, we were on 30 points after 24 games? Thereafter, from our final 14 games of the season, we picked up 17 points in 2009/10, 16 in 2010/11, 15 in 2011/12 and finally 12 in 2012/13. It's a pretty consistent record, but does it show that TP's teams didn't have enough in the bank to finish seasons strongly or was he, as some suspect, not truly 'going for it' to keep expectations in check? We're 8 points better off now compared to last season. Goal difference is also 12 better. Not bad, considering last season was a record breaking one in itself.
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Feb 10, 2015 12:39:41 GMT
There's a small feature in tomorrow night's Oatcake about our record since we've been in the Premier League at this stage of the season (not written by me before anyone gets their knickers in a twist ) 33 points represents the best total we've had after 24 games since we came up, but did you know that in four of TP's five seasons as our manager in the Premier League, we were on 30 points after 24 games? Thereafter, from our final 14 games of the season, we picked up 17 points in 2009/10, 16 in 2010/11, 15 in 2011/12 and finally 12 in 2012/13. It's a pretty consistent record, but does it show that TP's teams didn't have enough in the bank to finish seasons strongly or was he, as some suspect, not truly 'going for it' to keep expectations in check? We're 8 points better off now compared to last season. Goal difference is also 12 better. Not bad, considering last season was a record breaking one in itself.
And we've been decimated by injuries. Remarkable job by Hughes and his staff, truly remarkable.
|
|
|
Post by jstoke7 on Feb 10, 2015 12:43:50 GMT
This thread is something else.
When are people going to get it into their heads that the method in which Pulis achieved what he did at Stoke overshadowed the enjoyment of our success and alienated some of us fans from the club. Of course there were good moments, good games but for some of us it was negative, demoralising stuff for the majority of the time.
That's literally all there is to it, but people seem to struggle to accept that we feel this way.
|
|
|
Post by upthefud on Feb 10, 2015 12:46:43 GMT
This thread is something else. When are people going to get it into their heads that the method in which Pulis achieved what he did at Stoke overshadowed the enjoyment of our success and alienated some of us fans from the club. Of course there were good moments, good games but for some of us it was negative, demoralising stuff for the majority of the time. That's literally all there is too it, but people seem to struggle to accept that we feel this way. Because people like you keep belittling his achievements. A battling 1-0 defeat or getting ploughed at home by Bristol Rovers? You come across as very ungrateful
|
|
|
Post by geoff321 on Feb 10, 2015 12:49:00 GMT
For a simpleton like me jstoke7 perhaps you could explain how Pulis alienated some fans when our average attendances went from around 14,000 to an all time high of around 27,000?
|
|
|
Post by MarkWolstanton on Feb 10, 2015 13:05:46 GMT
For a simpleton like me jstoke7 perhaps you could explain how Pulis alienated some fans when our average attendances went from around 14,000 to an all time high of around 27,000? You are comparing our third division crowds with our attendances after promotion to the Premier League. What the fuck has a question about divided opinions on Pulis got to do with it for fucks sake?
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Feb 10, 2015 13:09:11 GMT
I wonder if Tony Pulis's Blue and White army is booming out at the Hawthorns...?
|
|
|
Post by Stretfordpotterer on Feb 10, 2015 13:09:59 GMT
For a simpleton like me jstoke7 perhaps you could explain how Pulis alienated some fans when our average attendances went from around 14,000 to an all time high of around 27,000? So, you're now trying to claim he wasn't devisive? TP took us a long way, he was on his way down, crowds were on their way down and from my own experience, it wasn't the johnny come lately premier league fans leaving or not renewing. There were an awful lot of people who'd watched us through some of the real thin years who were not renewing or seriously considering it. Premier League football was enough for some for a time, it was never enough for others, and it would always be enough for some. I place myself in the first camp, but after 3 years, just staying there and getting a max of 4 or 5 decent games a year was not remotely enough. also, just because there were 27k there, surely even you can't claim any more than 30% of those thought the sun shone out of his arse even at the very height of his popularity. In reality as always with tp, about a quarter loved him, about a quarter hated him, and the remaining 50 tolerated him based on results. As time moved on results stayed similar, entertainment got significantly worse, team selections got more negative and that 50% moved towards wanting him out than tolerating him.
|
|
|
Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 10, 2015 13:14:34 GMT
The atmosphere was rather spiffing back then as well. You'd have thought it would be flat as a witches tit week after week with all this soporific, life sapping football knocking about. Very confusing.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 13:28:31 GMT
The atmosphere was rather spiffing back then as well. You'd have thought it would be flat as a witches tit week after week with all this soporific, life sapping football knocking about. Very confusing. Correct. But most people's patience, and tolerance levels weren't tested until seasons four and five...at which point the atmosphere was on the wane. Initially, we'd made it to the promised land - thanks Tony. I remember Bolton away, first game, thinking 'holy shit!!' as we got trounced, men vs boys. Moving on, the 'novelty factor' was absolutely fantastic - we were mixing it with the big boys and giving them a bloody nose - superb. The Bear Pit was alive with expectation. The problem with expectation is - you have to manage it. And it's the way that Tony did that, that did for him in the end. In the final season, the 'football' was dirge, Tony had spent all of his credit (and some) with many, and the atmosphere was, as you phrased, flat as a witches tit. Terrible. A complete shame given the position he'd put us in.
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Feb 10, 2015 13:33:36 GMT
For a simpleton like me jstoke7 perhaps you could explain how Pulis alienated some fans when our average attendances went from around 14,000 to an all time high of around 27,000? Could you explain why there was a massive drop in season ticket renewals just before he was sacked seeing as he hadn't alienated any fans? I have asked you something similar earlier in the thread but you conveniently ignored it as you do pretty much all the difficult questions, I'm beginning to think you have me on block.
|
|
|
Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 10, 2015 13:36:37 GMT
The atmosphere was rather spiffing back then as well. You'd have thought it would be flat as a witches tit week after week with all this soporific, life sapping football knocking about. Very confusing. Correct. But most people's patience, and tolerance levels weren't tested until seasons four and five...at which point the atmosphere was on the wane. Initially, we'd made it to the promised land - thanks Tony. I remember Bolton away, first game, thinking 'holy shit!!' as we got trounced, men vs boys. Moving on, the 'novelty factor' was absolutely fantastic - we were mixing it with the big boys and giving them a bloody nose - superb. The Bear Pit was alive with expectation. The problem with expectation is - you have to manage it. And it's the way that Tony did that, that did for him in the end. In the final season, the 'football' was dirge, Tony had spent all of his credit (and some) with many, and the atmosphere was, as you phrased, flat as a witches tit. Terrible. A complete shame given the position he'd put us in. So we can at least agree that for a large proportion of his second tenure, the ground went from half full to full to bursting, with an ear blistering atmosphere and they were terrific times to be a Stoke fan and not the tragic, soul destroying stream of constant misery some would have you believe.
|
|
|
Post by Stretfordpotterer on Feb 10, 2015 13:52:01 GMT
The atmosphere was rather spiffing back then as well. You'd have thought it would be flat as a witches tit week after week with all this soporific, life sapping football knocking about. Very confusing. The first two PL season the atmosphere was great, built on a completely justifiable backs to the wall mentality. the third season, it was indifferent, big opposition brought a decent atmosphere but there was a definite slip, 11/12 was worse again, only the European run distracted from the awful football and subsequently flat atmosphere. By the end of 12/13 the atmosphere was positively woeful. What frustrates me about this argument is that the likes of yourself will go back to 08/09 and 09/10 and try to make at as though people are saying something was wrong then, when thats simply not the case. Almost everyone was very very happy with what was being delivered by players and manager. Pretty much everyone gives TP the credit he very much deserves for those years and the 10/11 season as well. But you can't help but compare what West Broms fans are saying now and many of the arguments which were had at even at that time. The CB's at full back debate was a perrennial talking point, still no idea why he was such a fan of it because whenever he had a CB at FB we were pretty much nailed on to be awful, yet as soon as higginbotham got back in the team we would string results together and fly up the table.
|
|
|
Post by Paddypotter on Feb 10, 2015 14:02:10 GMT
Every club promoted has had an increase in attendance's. Nobody is arguing that Pulis got us promoted. There were a few of you though that thought the only way we could go without Pulis, was down. Not your fault, being told we can't compete and punching above our weight every pre match interview wears you down. Now, we approach matches as if we can win them, we won't win them all but at least we'll try to.
|
|
|
Post by jarhead on Feb 10, 2015 14:10:30 GMT
I wonder if Tony Pulis's Blue and White army is booming out at the Hawthorns...? Haha Remember 'Pulis Day' at our place a bit ago! Only 3 people Wore his mask at the match! Tazi March and Stafford-dopey EMBARRASSING.
|
|
|
Post by salopstick on Feb 10, 2015 14:20:03 GMT
For a simpleton like me jstoke7 perhaps you could explain how Pulis alienated some fans when our average attendances went from around 14,000 to an all time high of around 27,000? You are comparing our third division crowds with our attendances after promotion to the Premier League. What the fuck has a question about divided opinions on Pulis got to do with it for fucks sake? Kempy will defend him to the death.
|
|
|
Post by WorkingclassHero on Feb 10, 2015 14:30:00 GMT
So 4 centrehalves in the back 8. Dropping of star player for two huge big forwards up top. Signing off mediocre uk hard-working right sided midfielder. Signing of busted flush panini 2000 sticker player.
Hmmm. It literally is like going back in time.
Talk of bonus games and Burnley have a great history...
Brilliant
|
|
|
Post by crownmeking on Feb 10, 2015 14:48:32 GMT
Can't we just SHIT BIN this pointless thread!!!
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 15:08:02 GMT
Correct. But most people's patience, and tolerance levels weren't tested until seasons four and five...at which point the atmosphere was on the wane. Initially, we'd made it to the promised land - thanks Tony. I remember Bolton away, first game, thinking 'holy shit!!' as we got trounced, men vs boys. Moving on, the 'novelty factor' was absolutely fantastic - we were mixing it with the big boys and giving them a bloody nose - superb. The Bear Pit was alive with expectation. The problem with expectation is - you have to manage it. And it's the way that Tony did that, that did for him in the end. In the final season, the 'football' was dirge, Tony had spent all of his credit (and some) with many, and the atmosphere was, as you phrased, flat as a witches tit. Terrible. A complete shame given the position he'd put us in. So we can at least agree that for a large proportion of his second tenure, the ground went from half full to full to bursting, with an ear blistering atmosphere and they were terrific times to be a Stoke fan and not the tragic, soul destroying stream of constant misery some would have you believe. No question. Even I'll admit that, and I was one of those driven closest to despair by the end.
|
|
|
Post by jstoke7 on Feb 10, 2015 15:40:58 GMT
This thread is something else. When are people going to get it into their heads that the method in which Pulis achieved what he did at Stoke overshadowed the enjoyment of our success and alienated some of us fans from the club. Of course there were good moments, good games but for some of us it was negative, demoralising stuff for the majority of the time. That's literally all there is too it, but people seem to struggle to accept that we feel this way. Because people like you keep belittling his achievements. A battling 1-0 defeat or getting ploughed at home by Bristol Rovers? You come across as very ungrateful You're missing the point again, I purposely said 'the method overshadowed...for some of us'. I can understand why 'x' number of Stoke fans rate and love him so much, his achievements and charity work tell me that, but the way in which he achieved it just wasn't for me. What is wrong with that? Why should I be grateful to a manager who made me feel the most disillusioned I've ever been with my own club through the way he approached the game? PS: Whether you agree with the reasoning of why I felt disillusioned is besides the point. It's how I felt, end of. Oh and that's not to say there weren't moments where I was happy/we did play well and I enjoyed it, but on balance the negatives outweigh the positives for me.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 19:38:10 GMT
Like I said back down on Page 1, you have not got a clue what you have started here Mr Albion. This thread will be happily roaring on into the summer, unless Admin get fed up and delete it.
<hint, hint>
|
|
|
Post by penkvillepotter on Feb 10, 2015 20:57:05 GMT
I just checked. I asked on page 3 of it was possible to neck this thread but even I didn't expect this to drone on so long.
Can I ask, why is this board in open warfare YET again when Pulis actually left this club some 21 months ago. I dread to think how it will be in the run up to the Brazil game.
|
|
|
Post by WorkingclassHero on Feb 10, 2015 21:03:57 GMT
Just grab a beer and enjoy the ride
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 21:05:24 GMT
Like I said back down on Page 1, you have not got a clue what you have started here Mr Albion. This thread will be happily roaring on into the summer, unless Admin get fed up and delete it. <hint, hint> Admin are excitedly posting on it....its a runner
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 21:05:57 GMT
Like I said back down on Page 1, you have not got a clue what you have started here Mr Albion. This thread will be happily roaring on into the summer, unless Admin get fed up and delete it. <hint, hint> Admin are excitedly posting on it....its a runner Ok, I'm taking the advice above. Got beer in hand.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 21:11:44 GMT
I just checked. I asked on page 3 of it was possible to neck this thread but even I didn't expect this to drone on so long. Can I ask, why is this board in open warfare YET again when Pulis actually left this club some 21 months ago. I dread to think how it will be in the run up to the Brazil game. It's all the Rimmers' fault ;-)
|
|
|
Post by Davef on Feb 10, 2015 21:13:28 GMT
Like I said back down on Page 1, you have not got a clue what you have started here Mr Albion. This thread will be happily roaring on into the summer, unless Admin get fed up and delete it. <hint, hint> Admin are excitedly posting on it....its a runner Mark is excitedly posting on it. I'm offering sensible, rational opinion.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 21:20:30 GMT
Admin are excitedly posting on it....its a runner Mark is excitedly posting on it. I'm offering sensible, rational opinion. No such thing with a debate about Mr Him.
|
|
|
Post by Sergeant Muttley on Feb 10, 2015 21:21:58 GMT
Mark is excitedly posting on it. I'm offering sensible, rational opinion. No such thing with a debate about Mr Him. Not a nice way to talk about Mark
|
|