|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 0:08:02 GMT
It is but we've gone backwards from last season and for that there's no excuse. And we weren't this sloppy at the back, the issues at the start of last season we down to the midfield. He tried everyone in that DM role until Whelan got the role then it changed. Something needs to change at the back again, I don't get the feeling he realises this though. He did with the midfield issue, it's why he tried every man and his dog there. Hughes this season has been pretty poor. Last season we conceded 1.37 goals per game. This season it's 1 goal per game.
We haven't regressed defensively.
We were massively open in the midfield and that exposed the defence, they weren't the reason we were conceding. That's why Hughes did his merry go round in the DM role, we had Fonz, Wilson, Whelan, Palacios and Adam all play there and it wasn't sorted until Whelan cemented his place. Hughes knew the problem and looked to address and it worked. Ace. The issues this season have been with Wilson being dozy, Shawcross today and Pieters going walk about too many teams. It's a much bigger problem without the options to fix it as you don't want to be pissing about with your centre halves and left back. The problem last season was simple...plug a gap. This season it's about concentration and a general lack of defensive nous, it can be solved but Hughes doesn't seem to see the problem and it is a problem
|
|
|
Post by prettything on Sept 21, 2014 0:16:46 GMT
I don't think it was, he didn't change it that much. Cameron needed dropping faster than a stone and Bardsley has been better. We need pace up front so Diouf had to come in, I know he's gone on to the wing a bit but it's like for like (in terms of pace) for Wingie and the rest is the same. We're bad at the basics, that's the issue. We were on and off all the way through until we beat Man United in January . Up to then we were average or below, at best.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 0:20:46 GMT
I don't think it was, he didn't change it that much. Cameron needed dropping faster than a stone and Bardsley has been better. We need pace up front so Diouf had to come in, I know he's gone on to the wing a bit but it's like for like (in terms of pace) for Wingie and the rest is the same. We're bad at the basics, that's the issue. We were on and off all the way through until we beat Man United in January . Up to then we were average or below, at best. We were but it was down to that one position and implementing the new style, there excuses. There are no excuses this season. The team has barely changed Bego, Shawcross, Wilson, Pieters, Whelan, Fonz, Ireland, Crouch remain in the manager's starting XI. Moses is on par (if not better) than Arnie at his best. Bardsley has been better and Diouf has been excellent too. The changes he's actually made have been good ones. There are issues though, they are fixable but I aren't convinced Hughes knows how/can see them this season. Whereas last season he did and he actively tried to sort it.
|
|
|
Post by ukcstokie on Sept 21, 2014 0:22:23 GMT
We're conceding 1 goal/game. We could be better - but that's not the problem.
Last season only two teams conceded less than 1 goals /game: Man City - 37 and Chelsea 27.
It's the other end where the problem is an that just needs time to click IMHO.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 0:25:45 GMT
We're conceding 1 goal/game. We could be better - but that's not the problem. Last season only two teams conceded less than 1 goals /game: Man City - 37 and Chelsea 27. It's the other end where the problem is an that just needs time to click IMHO. It's not THE problem and nobody is saying that it is but it sure as hell is part of the problem. If you can't take your chances and concede sloppy goals you're in trouble. Both ends of the pitch concern the shit out of me at the minute.
|
|
|
Post by prettything on Sept 21, 2014 0:49:22 GMT
We were on and off all the way through until we beat Man United in January . Up to then we were average or below, at best. We were but it was down to that one position and implementing the new style, there excuses. There are no excuses this season. The team has barely changed Bego, Shawcross, Wilson, Pieters, Whelan, Fonz, Ireland, Crouch remain in the manager's starting XI. Moses is on par (if not better) than Arnie at his best. Bardsley has been better and Diouf has been excellent too. The changes he's actually made have been good ones. There are issues though, they are fixable but I aren't convinced Hughes knows how/can see them this season. Whereas last season he did and he actively tried to sort it. Come on. First game of the season,the team was changed?Boyan, Diouf, Bardesly. Should have started with the team that finished last season. Shame Arnies head was still in Ibiza.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 0:58:34 GMT
We were but it was down to that one position and implementing the new style, there excuses. There are no excuses this season. The team has barely changed Bego, Shawcross, Wilson, Pieters, Whelan, Fonz, Ireland, Crouch remain in the manager's starting XI. Moses is on par (if not better) than Arnie at his best. Bardsley has been better and Diouf has been excellent too. The changes he's actually made have been good ones. There are issues though, they are fixable but I aren't convinced Hughes knows how/can see them this season. Whereas last season he did and he actively tried to sort it. Come on. First game of the season,the team was changed?Boyan, Diouf, Bardesly. Should have started with the team that finished last season. Shame Arnies head was still in Ibiza. 3 changes is barely changed and the core of the team was the same and I'd say about on average for over the summer. Cameron needed dropping, that was a given. Wingie was never going to start because of the World Cup.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 1:29:00 GMT
Vs Bolton 2011/12 season
T Sorensen (G) 29 R Huth (D) 4 R Shawcross (D) 17 (64) M Upson (D) 20 A Wilkinson (D) 28 G Whelan (M) 6 D Whitehead (M) 18 M Etherington (M) 26 (52) R Fuller (F) 10 J Walters (F) 19 P Crouch (F) 25
Vs Reading 2012/13 season
A Begovic 4 (D) R Huth 12 (D) M Wilson 17 (D) R Shawcross 28 (D) A Wilkinson 6 (M) G Whelan (85) 18 (M) D Whitehead (s/o 88) 21 (M) M Kightly (75) 26 (M) M Etherington (80) 19 (F) J Walters 25 (F) P Crouch
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 6:33:35 GMT
We shouldn't be looking down or up. We've played 5 games for fuck sake and whilst we've only won one, I would say that the teams we haven't beat will all finish below us. The league table means nothing until at least 10 games in. The positives are that we played well and are creating chances. We should have won our last 2 games comfortably. The negative is that every shot on target is going in. We should have 3 clean sheets to our name with only 1 goal against from our 5 games. We need to be smarter in both boxes but the signs are that it will come. in 10 games time we will be playing, on a trot, Chelsea, manure, arsenal and Everton. How many points will we collect in a whole month eh. ? Who knows but we are capable of beating all of those teams just as we are capable of losing to them. I also believe we will have a good number of points on the board come the end of October. You worry yourself into an early grave if you like. I'm frustrated by our inability to win our last 2 games but more than comfortable with the fact that we will be just fine again this season and will be pushing for a top half finish. We might fall short, we might smash it but we won't be fighting a relegation battle.
|
|
|
Post by werrington on Sept 21, 2014 8:23:11 GMT
Some on here just can't cope with disappointment
It's truly unbelievable that a late goal has them full of vitriol but exactly the same performance would of been greeted with joy and praise if we'd hung on for a further few minutes in what was a very good match
Unbelievable
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 10:30:11 GMT
Some on here just can't cope with disappointment It's truly unbelievable that a late goal has them full of vitriol but exactly the same performance would of been greeted with joy and praise if we'd hung on for a further few minutes in what was a very good match Unbelievable And what is even more unbelievable is that if y0u can't handle disapp0intment then y0u sh0uldnt really supp0rt St0ke City. We are masters 0f disapp0intment.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 10:56:40 GMT
Thing is folks - 24 hours later -we should all STILL be somewhat annoyed. It is amazing where we have come from - its on the back of an ethic of hard work & endeavour and as much as anything else, ruthlessness. These days we are happy to play better football, so happy in fact that we dont mind chucking easy point away needlelssly early in the season.
Im not pressing any panic buttons either but,complacancy & arrongance are there to see - from the manager down. I just feel they need to do their bloody jobs for the entire match and, bring the points home a bit more often - seeing all the talent we are now blessed with.
Frustrated still ? - absolutely -and the cherry on top ? SKY are now 'bigging up' Leicester before their game today when ,we all know - last week, if it had been a boxing match it, would've been stopped.
AS it was last week yesterday - we looked 'pretty' gained many plaudits and yet again, we came away with virtually NOTHING.
SIX POINTS TO BE HAD - WE END UP WITH ONE (GRRRR)
We need to re-grow that hard fought ruthless streak and utterly BURY - the arrogance and complacancey it seemingly has been replaced with
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 11:28:27 GMT
Thing is folks - 24 hours later -we should all STILL be somewhat annoyed. It is amazing where we have come from - its on the back of an ethic of hard work & endeavour and as much as anything else, ruthlessness. These days we are happy to play better football, so happy in fact that we dont mind chucking easy point away needlelssly early in the season. Im not pressing any panic buttons either but,complacancy & arrongance are there to see - from the manager down. I just feel they need to do their bloody jobs for the entire match and, bring the points home a bit more often - seeing all the talent we are now blessed with. Frustrated still ? - absolutely -and the cherry on top ? SKY are now 'bigging up' Leicester before their game today when ,we all know - last week, if it had been a boxing match it, would've been stopped. AS it was last week yesterday - we looked 'pretty' gained many plaudits and yet again, we came away with virtually NOTHING. SIX POINTS TO BE HAD - WE END UP WITH ONE (GRRRR) We need to re-grow that hard fought ruthless streak and utterly BURY - the arrogance and complacancey it seemingly has been replaced with We are all frustrated but you seem in blind panic mode. Our failure had nothing at all to do with arrogance or complacency. We played well and should have won. The fact we didn't owed more to a lack of ability in key areas than complacency or any of the things that you seem to be saying. Had the free kick gone over the bar, would you be saying the same things? No you wouldn't. Its fine to be frustrated. I'm frustrated by you've gone massively overboard in my opinion.
|
|
|
Post by werrington on Sept 21, 2014 11:32:04 GMT
Thing is folks - 24 hours later -we should all STILL be somewhat annoyed. It is amazing where we have come from - its on the back of an ethic of hard work & endeavour and as much as anything else, ruthlessness. These days we are happy to play better football, so happy in fact that we dont mind chucking easy point away needlelssly early in the season. Im not pressing any panic buttons either but,complacancy & arrongance are there to see - from the manager down. I just feel they need to do their bloody jobs for the entire match and, bring the points home a bit more often - seeing all the talent we are now blessed with. Frustrated still ? - absolutely -and the cherry on top ? SKY are now 'bigging up' Leicester before their game today when ,we all know - last week, if it had been a boxing match it, would've been stopped. AS it was last week yesterday - we looked 'pretty' gained many plaudits and yet again, we came away with virtually NOTHING. SIX POINTS TO BE HAD - WE END UP WITH ONE (GRRRR) We need to re-grow that hard fought ruthless streak and utterly BURY - the arrogance and complacancey it seemingly has been replaced with We are all frustrated but you seem in blind panic mode. Our failure had nothing at all to do with arrogance or complacency. We played well and should have won. The fact we didn't owed more to a lack of ability in key areas than complacency or any of the things that you seem to be saying. Had the free kick gone over the bar, would you be saying the same things? No you wouldn't. Its fine to be frustrated. I'm frustrated by you've gone massively overboard in my opinion. I think Chelsea is the team for Tony mate
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 11:41:48 GMT
Sorry Dave but I can't agree. Bayern is talking a lot of sense in his posts on here IMHO. I am sat here this morning still totally frustrated after another 2 points wasted. There are too many silly mistakes being made, and bad decisions all over the place. As I keep on banging on about, we give the ball away far too easily. A complete lack of professionalism IMHO. Bloody big gaps all over the place when we do lose it, and stupid free kicks given away! Not good enough at all. They need to get their act together!
|
|
|
Post by vahl on Sept 21, 2014 11:51:28 GMT
Sorry Dave but I can't agree. Bayern is talking a lot of sense in his posts on here IMHO. I am sat here this morning still totally frustrated after another 2 points wasted. There are too many silly mistakes being made, and bad decisions all over the place. As I keep on banging on about, we give the ball away far too easily. A complete lack of professionalism IMHO. Bloody big gaps all over the place when we do lose it, and stupid free kicks given away! Not good enough at all. They need to get their act together! You do realise this is Stoke City and not Real Madrid, right? We were absolutely fantastic for the most part yesterday. On another day we're looking at anything from 4-5 goals in our favour - bearing in mind this is away from home. A strikers 'clearance' (which Adam was about to smash away btw) and a last minute free-kick even David Beckham would of been proud of, and we're full of mistakes? I can't believe some of the tripe I see on here at times.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 11:56:30 GMT
Dave johnno 'feeling the same way if that free kick had gone over the bar' ?
absolutely ! - against such a poor shower of shyte - we should've been out of sight at half time !
not arrogance by me either - it was there for all to see (even the pundits that still utterly despise us being where we are)
easy points pissed up a wall - again ! Im still not happy
makes wating until a week on bloody monday
a 'killer' - Im not being arrogant - we should be fucking burying these teams now !
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 12:06:38 GMT
Sorry Dave but I can't agree. Bayern is talking a lot of sense in his posts on here IMHO. I am sat here this morning still totally frustrated after another 2 points wasted. There are too many silly mistakes being made, and bad decisions all over the place. As I keep on banging on about, we give the ball away far too easily. A complete lack of professionalism IMHO. Bloody big gaps all over the place when we do lose it, and stupid free kicks given away! Not good enough at all. They need to get their act together! The crazy thing is that y0u d0 agree with me. I'm frustrated, lamenting mistakes at b0th ends 0f the pitch which are c0sting us p0ints. What I aren't d0ing is using excuses that aren't true. We made p00r decisi0ns. We missed chances we sh0uld have taken. We gave away 0ne t00 many free kicks in danger0us areas. I accept all that but it has n0thing t0 d0 with arr0gance 0r c0mplacency and everything t0 d0 with a lack 0f ability and c0mp0sure at b0th ends 0f the pitch.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 12:11:09 GMT
When DECENT players cant make straight passes to feet - are too lazy to cover the obvious - cant hit the target from 12- 15 yards with their entire goal at their mercy - there is complacancey
walking off the pitch after the work they put in - they should be gutted to a man
and the manager slamming the door and holding them back saying - 'six points - six fucking points' - 'you lot come back with one'
NOT good enough for where we want to go
Where could we be now with another 5 points ?
I never boo my team - never will but - ONE THING I TRULY FIND FRUSTRATING THOUGH IS, WASTED EFFORT
WHEN OH WHEN, ARE WE TRULY GOING TO TRULY BURY SOMEONE PROPERLY, NOW WE HAVE THE OBVIOUS TALENT TO DO IT ?
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 12:27:41 GMT
When DECENT players cant make straight passes to feet - are too lazy to cover the obvious - cant hit the target from 12- 15 yards with their entire goal at their mercy - there is complacancey walking off the pitch after the work they put in - they should be gutted to a man and the manager slamming the door and holding them back saying - 'six points - six fucking points' - 'you lot come back with one' NOT good enough for where we want to go Where could we be now with another 5 points ? I never boo my team - never will but - ONE THING I TRULY FIND FRUSTRATING THOUGH IS, WASTED EFFORT WHEN OH WHEN, ARE WE TRULY GOING TO TRULY BURY SOMEONE PROPERLY, NOW WE HAVE THE OBVIOUS TALENT TO DO IT ? We are St0ke City in the Premier League. This is 0ur 6th 0r 7th seas0n at this level. H0w many teams have we buried in the last 6 seas0ns? 3? As f0r being gutted t0 a man, they all l00ked gutted t0 me, n0ne m0re s0 than the manager himself. Their frustrati0n was s0 0bvi0us even the F1 bl0ke n0w d0ing BT Sp0rt c0mmented ab0ut it.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 12:28:33 GMT
When DECENT players cant make straight passes to feet - are too lazy to cover the obvious - cant hit the target from 12- 15 yards with their entire goal at their mercy - there is complacancey walking off the pitch after the work they put in - they should be gutted to a man and the manager slamming the door and holding them back saying - 'six points - six fucking points' - 'you lot come back with one' NOT good enough for where we want to go Where could we be now with another 5 points ? I never boo my team - never will but - ONE THING I TRULY FIND FRUSTRATING THOUGH IS, WASTED EFFORT WHEN OH WHEN, ARE WE TRULY GOING TO TRULY BURY SOMEONE PROPERLY, NOW WE HAVE THE OBVIOUS TALENT TO DO IT ? We are St0ke City in the Premier League. This is 0ur 6th 0r 7th seas0n at this level. H0w many teams have we buried in the last 6 seas0ns? 3? As f0r being gutted t0 a man, they all l00ked gutted t0 me, n0ne m0re s0 than the manager himself. Their frustrati0n was s0 0bvi0us even the F1 bl0ke n0w d0ing BT Sp0rt c0mmented ab0ut it. Dave what's going on with your 'o' key? ;D
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 12:30:27 GMT
We are St0ke City in the Premier League. This is 0ur 6th 0r 7th seas0n at this level. H0w many teams have we buried in the last 6 seas0ns? 3? As f0r being gutted t0 a man, they all l00ked gutted t0 me, n0ne m0re s0 than the manager himself. Their frustrati0n was s0 0bvi0us even the F1 bl0ke n0w d0ing BT Sp0rt c0mmented ab0ut it. Dave what's going on with your 'o' key? ;D Its br0ken 0n my ph0ne mate s0 I'm having t0 use the "zer0" butt0n instead. S0rry. New ph0ne arrives t0m0rr0w.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 12:32:48 GMT
Dave what's going on with your 'o' key? ;D Its br0ken 0n my ph0ne mate s0 I'm having t0 use the "zer0" butt0n instead. S0rry. New ph0ne arrives t0m0rr0w. Ha ha. Shouldn't laugh but that's the type of thing that normally happens to yours truly. ;D
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 12:35:46 GMT
Its br0ken 0n my ph0ne mate s0 I'm having t0 use the "zer0" butt0n instead. S0rry. New ph0ne arrives t0m0rr0w. Ha ha. Shouldn't laugh but that's the type of thing that normally happens to yours truly. ;D Its hard trying t0 write with0ut use 0f the damn letter! :-)
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 12:50:25 GMT
Some on here just can't cope with disappointment It's truly unbelievable that a late goal has them full of vitriol but exactly the same performance would of been greeted with joy and praise if we'd hung on for a further few minutes in what was a very good match Unbelievable If being the word. We didn't, we look very ordinary and the way games are going has to be a worry.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2014 12:53:49 GMT
I think we can all agree on a few things
1) We all Want stoke city to do well
2) its been an amazing journey almost unique in modern day football
3) We will have our ups and downs
4) We can now aspire to be a top half premier league side
5) We should have more points than we have presently got
6) its a highly competitive league where only the very best can afford to be even slightly complacement
7) and lastly and debatable - I think we aren't good enough to have such complacancey as yet therefore - they (the team and manager) arent above criticsm for 'doing nicely' but failing to close out the result
lastely
8) True supporters, stick with them and help them through the bad times
|
|
|
Post by stokie25 on Sept 21, 2014 12:56:08 GMT
Ithink we can all agree on a few things 1) We all Want stoke city to do well 2) its been an amazing journey almost unique in modern day football 3) We will have our ups and downs 4) We can now aspire to be a top half premier league side 5) We should have more points than we have presently got 6) its ahighly competitive league where only the very best can afford to be complacement 7) and lastly and debatable - I think we aren't good enough to have such complacancey as yet therefore - they (the team and manager) arent above criticsm for 'doing nicely' but failing to close out the result You had me until point 7 Tony
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 21, 2014 12:58:02 GMT
Ithink we can all agree on a few things 1) We all Want stoke city to do well 2) its been an amazing journey almost unique in modern day football 3) We will have our ups and downs 4) We can now aspire to be a top half premier league side 5) We should have more points than we have presently got 6) its ahighly competitive league where only the very best can afford to be complacement 7) and lastly and debatable - I think we aren't good enough to have such complacancey as yet therefore - they (the team and manager) arent above criticsm for 'doing nicely' but failing to close out the result You had me until point 7 Tony Why? We can't do the basics at the minute and Hughes has got his tactics wrong in 4 of the 5 games we've played. Questions are quite rightly being asked. It's nothing sinister but something soon needs to change and we need to start winning these games where we dominate.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 13:02:28 GMT
I think we can all agree on a few things 1) We all Want stoke city to do well 2) its been an amazing journey almost unique in modern day football 3) We will have our ups and downs 4) We can now aspire to be a top half premier league side 5) We should have more points than we have presently got 6) its a highly competitive league where only the very best can afford to be even slightly complacement 7) and lastly and debatable - I think we aren't good enough to have such complacancey as yet therefore - they (the team and manager) arent above criticsm for 'doing nicely' but failing to close out the result lastely 8) True supporters, stick with them and help them through the bad times We aren't c0mplacent though. Cr0uch has never been a regular g0alscr0rer and has always missed m0re chances than he's taken. M0ses is a very g00d player but has always been guilty f ch00sing the wr0ng 0pti0n fr0m g00d p0siti0ns. Adam can be a creative genius 0ne game and barely able t0 pass t0 his 0wn players the next. He's 0ften sh0wed th0se traits in the very same game. Di0uf has l0ng been a raw talent capable 0f getting s0me g0als and als0 missing s0me. N'z0nzi is a fine f00tballer wh0 kn0ws his way ar0und a f00tball pitch yet c0uldnt even draw y0u the r0ute t0wards g0al. That isn't c0mplacency. It is b0rne fr0m the fact that whilst 0ur players may well be g00d, they clearly aren't as g00d as y0u think they are. We aren't paying 50m plus f0r players that are the finished article.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 21, 2014 13:05:20 GMT
You had me until point 7 Tony Why? We can't do the basics at the minute and Hughes has got his tactics wrong in 4 of the 5 games we've played. Questions are quite rightly being asked. It's nothing sinister but something soon needs to change and we need to start winning these games where we dominate. His tactics weren't wr0ng yesterday. We d0minated the game and sh0uld have w0n easily. Hughes was t0 blame v Leicester as his starting 11 was all wrong. I'm n0t s0 sure y0u can level that at him f0r the 0ther games. We l00ked a decent side yesterday in my 0pini0n.
|
|