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Post by ColonelMustard on Apr 30, 2013 7:58:06 GMT
Done my best to check for you mustard but search says my last post was the first containing the word Newell. I don't like posting bollox and will own up when I get things wrong . sorry mate, I was being flippant and no have recollection of you saying Newell at the time either
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Post by Gods on Apr 30, 2013 8:00:15 GMT
You'd have to be massively risk averse if you were PC wouldn't you?
TP has just delivered on PC's door mat a share of the the new Premier League deal worth just over £3B with Sky Sports and BT, for three years starting in 2013, a cool 70% increase over the previous three year deal.
You might say to me, 'well he should have done after 5 years in the Prem and some significant investment'.
But it was something the collective might of Brian McDermott, Steve Bruce, Harry Redknapp and probably Roberto Martinez and if not someone else all failed to do for their clubs this season.
He has now done it 6 years running.
PC is smart enough to know that for all but the super-sized 'big 6' clubs that Premier League continuance is a ball-aching, tiresome, unforgiving, relentless treadmill of an activity. Take your eye of the ball as we did after xmas and don't get straight back on and you are history.
I can't see him risking it all and making a change on the premise that the new incumbent may deliver the rather nebulous goal of 'better football' whatever that means.
I just, honestly, truly, genuinely, can't see it.
I think there is more chance (but not much) that TP may walk stung by the critcism and perhaps wondering why he bothers.
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Post by Gods on Apr 30, 2013 8:03:31 GMT
Why is Benitez suddenly 40/1 to be the next manager to leave his post? He has always been odds on favourite until recently Perhaps beacuse we are staying up then the probability that there will be a new manager at all has gone down massively. Have the odds gone out for the other candidates or only Rafa?
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Post by boothenesque on Apr 30, 2013 8:03:41 GMT
Rafa, no chance, he will view us as not worthy and will only go to "big clubs". He would have had to have failed at a couple of big clubs and be struggling to find another job to come to Stoke.
Big Sam, unlikely, if he wasn't managing a London club about to move to the Olympic stadium. We'd have a good DNA match and he is a northern lad, but there is no compelling reason for him to leave West Ham.
Di Matteo, possibly. He managed West Brom with mixed results before and we're a similar size. Harshly treated at Chelsea considering they somehow won the Champions League and might want to prove a point. Having said that their league form was suffering and it was a team he inherited rather than built. It was like the players liked him enough to galvanise them to luckily win that tournament. Not sure he is in the low risk category though. What's he doing at the moment? - if he's out of work then for someone with reasonable credibility and if we're looking for a change in style/image, then that is one that might work, might be possible but is he less risk than one of Poyet or Zola?
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Post by blooter on Apr 30, 2013 8:04:14 GMT
For a Premier league club our scouting network is appalling. It basically consists of looking at established prem cast offs. After 7 years we have expanded into North America.
There is only one man to blame for our squad to be so pathetically threadbare in so many areas with many millions wasted.
Would I trust him to rebuild this aging squad with fresh young talent? Not a chance.
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Post by BigKahunaBurger on Apr 30, 2013 8:08:20 GMT
Why is Benitez suddenly 40/1 to be the next manager to leave his post? He has always been odds on favourite until recently Perhaps beacuse we are staying up then the probability that there will be a new manager at all has gone down massively. Have the odds gone out for the other candidates or only Rafa? Looking at the terms, the market closes at 3pm on the last day of the Premier League season and there is a martke for 'No manager to leave'. So if no manager leaves before then your bet on Benitez or whoever would lose. So the odds make more sense
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Post by alster on Apr 30, 2013 8:14:34 GMT
Done my best to check for you mustard but search says my last post was the first containing the word Newell. I don't like posting bollox and will own up when I get things wrong . sorry mate, I was being flippant and no have recollection of you saying Newell at the time either Not one I can remember ever wanting to be our manager. MON was my one to go for I would still take him over Pulis but would be nowhere near as pleased with him now.Nothing to do with Sunderland just me yearning for a bigger change in style.
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Post by Miles Offside on Apr 30, 2013 9:09:07 GMT
You've just witnessed your manager take 6 crucial points from the last two games and virtually guarantee another season in the Premiership. You then switch on your TV tonight and see Aston Villa thrash Di Canio's boys 5-1 ..A man brought in to reverse their abysmal form which in fairness he has partially achieved. Pulis meantime continues to grovel to new depths of desperation to keep his job making sure that at every opportunity the whole 'Coates family' is praised to the hilt. Today he even stated that he would love to continue in his job. Hardly the attitude or words of a man about to retire or prepared to move aside willingly... So , If you were ST Peter , would you reward his loyalty after your man had just earned you another £90 million Premiership jackpot. Would you cast aside the dire football and lack of attacking prowess for another manager thus stabbing Tone in the back..? There's three types of manager essentially... High Risk ...Di Canio , Phil Brown , Gianfranco Zola , Gus Poyet..(Attacking free flowing exponents) Medium Risk ...Mad Mick McCarthy , Steve Bruce , Martin O'Neill Low Risk ...Benitez , Big Sam ,Di Matteo or similar high profile manager The Wild Card.....A FORIEGN manager....Never ...! Who would you put your £ 100 million jackpot on...? www.nicerodds.co.uk/odds-comparison-next-stoke-city-manager#.UX8BZaLU8kgInteresting way of putting it, mumf. As a man who's made a fortune from gambling, Coates is unlikey to play any high risk game with the club. The "medium risk" list has a journeyman feel to it. Hardly inspiring. It might be a case of sticking with Pulis or seeing whether any of the "low risk" group are available and willing to come here.
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Post by luke2u on Apr 30, 2013 9:17:06 GMT
The problem we'll get if we keep TP is to get the players we need.
With the reputation TP has, who would want to sign for us? I think a new manager will stand a much better chance of getting the full backs and wingers we need.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Apr 30, 2013 9:32:55 GMT
I would like Coates to make a change. Tone has only started to attack because he has shat himself due to the league position. Poyet would be a welcome change, but I would take anyone who wants to use more young players. We need someone with imagination tactically, someone who doesn't change a winning formula, and someone who utilizes the squad. Tone can't change; you are what you are.
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Post by pittshillplotter on Apr 30, 2013 10:09:50 GMT
I think the main concern for Peter Coates is Premiership membership ....the most important factor bar none regardless of the unappealing style of football. I'm pretty sure if that means hanging on to Pulis for another season , then he would be prepared to do it regardless of outside influences and pressures. You do have to consider the the great gulf between the manager and his chairman over the future of the academy though. Peter Coates sees it as a vital tool in the long term viability of this football club , whereas Pulis is less enthusiastic and prefers a more short term fix . It's difficult to see an amicable resolution to this issue and sooner rather than later Peter Coates will have address this issue with Pulis to make sure he gives the academy more importance.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 10:21:47 GMT
For a Premier league club our scouting network is appalling. It basically consists of looking at established prem cast offs. After 7 years we have expanded into North America. There is only one man to blame for our squad to be so pathetically threadbare in so many areas with many millions wasted. Would I trust him to rebuild this aging squad with fresh young talent? Not a chance. Wasnt there a link last season to one agent who seemed to have about 80% of the players we'd signed recently on his books?
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Post by Stokie Mcpot on Apr 30, 2013 10:22:12 GMT
I don't care who it is as long as I can actually enjoy watching football again, instead of the same god awful shit week in week out.
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Post by PerCyfilth ....Captains Log on Apr 30, 2013 10:41:57 GMT
I would be thinking "bloody hell Villa with a handfull of kids ..what football they played. Lets find that Manager to bring on the academy which is MY dream and get rid of the dross we have had for 18 months at no little cost. Get Steve Mclaren on the phone... Tony heres your train fare..
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Post by pittshillplotter on Apr 30, 2013 11:01:04 GMT
I would be thinking "bloody hell Villa with a handfull of kids ..what football they played. Lets find that Manager to bring on the academy which is MY dream and get rid of the dross we have had for 18 months at no little cost. Get Steve Mclaren on the phone... Tony heres your train fare.. Me too....Good idea.!
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Post by Kjones9 on Apr 30, 2013 11:09:47 GMT
Mcclaren's a good shout, I'm in.
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Post by MuddyWoody on Apr 30, 2013 11:22:07 GMT
You'd have to be massively risk averse if you were PC wouldn't you? TP has just delivered on PC's door mat a share of the the new Premier League deal worth just over £3B with Sky Sports and BT, for three years starting in 2013, a cool 70% increase over the previous three year deal. You might say to me, 'well he should have done after 5 years in the Prem and some significant investment'. But it was something the collective might of Brian McDermott, Steve Bruce, Harry Redknapp and probably Roberto Martinez and if not someone else all failed to do for their clubs this season. He has now done it 6 years running. PC is smart enough to know that for all but the super-sized 'big 6' clubs that Premier League continuance is a ball-aching, tiresome, unforgiving, relentless treadmill of an activity. Take your eye of the ball as we did after xmas and don't get straight back on and you are history. I can't see him risking it all and making a change on the premise that the new incumbent may deliver the rather nebulous goal of 'better football' whatever that means. I just, honestly, truly, genuinely, can't see it. I think there is more chance (but not much) that TP may walk stung by the critcism and perhaps wondering why he bothers. I think Gods is probably not wide of the mark. In PC's mind why should he get rid of TP and take a massive punt on an unproven manager, or even one with a slightly dodgy record? If he could get a name of the caliber of Benitez through the door we'd probably be seeing the back of TP, but what are the chances of that happening?
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Post by alster on Apr 30, 2013 12:13:04 GMT
I would be thinking "bloody hell Villa with a handfull of kids ..what football they played. Lets find that Manager to bring on the academy which is MY dream and get rid of the dross we have had for 18 months at no little cost. Get Steve Mclaren on the phone... Tony heres your train fare.. I know Mclaren has a good rep as a coach, I don't really remember what he was like at Middlesboro for introducing young homegrown players and have even less idea about what he's been up to in Holland. I don't even remember whether he plays attractive football but one things for sure it couldn't be worse than Pulis produces(cue some clever sod to bring up Alex Mcleish). Fill me in about what Mclaren is really like (really ignorant on my behalf not really remembering anything about an ex England manager I know, apologies), fact is I'd probably buy into it just because he isn't Tony Pulis but thats dangerous.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 12:29:44 GMT
You'd have to be massively risk averse if you were PC wouldn't you? TP has just delivered on PC's door mat a share of the the new Premier League deal worth just over £3B with Sky Sports and BT, for three years starting in 2013, a cool 70% increase over the previous three year deal. You might say to me, 'well he should have done after 5 years in the Prem and some significant investment'. But it was something the collective might of Brian McDermott, Steve Bruce, Harry Redknapp and probably Roberto Martinez and if not someone else all failed to do for their clubs this season. He has now done it 6 years running. PC is smart enough to know that for all but the super-sized 'big 6' clubs that Premier League continuance is a ball-aching, tiresome, unforgiving, relentless treadmill of an activity. Take your eye of the ball as we did after xmas and don't get straight back on and you are history. I can't see him risking it all and making a change on the premise that the new incumbent may deliver the rather nebulous goal of 'better football' whatever that means. I just, honestly, truly, genuinely, can't see it. I think there is more chance (but not much) that TP may walk stung by the critcism and perhaps wondering why he bothers. I think Gods is probably not wide of the mark. In PC's mind why should he get rid of TP and take a massive punt on an unproven manager, or even one with a slightly dodgy record? If he could get a name of the caliber of Benitez through the door we'd probably be seeing the back of TP, but what are the chances of that happening? I think Peter Coates has two goals for Stoke City - to see the club in the Premier League and to see the club get closer to self-sufficiency. The day Tony Pulis becomes a barrier to those goals, he'll get rid. And he's not far away from becoming just that. hence, I think he'll move him on in the summer.
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Post by mermaidsal on Apr 30, 2013 12:31:36 GMT
6 more points or the high jump... if I was in PC's mind, anyway.
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Post by mermaidsal on Apr 30, 2013 12:32:32 GMT
6 more points or the high jump... if I was in PC's mind, anyway.
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Post by cheadlestokie on Apr 30, 2013 12:36:51 GMT
Seems to me that next season the transfer policy will change and be taken out of the manager's hands,whoever the manager will be. For this reason I think there will be a change as TP would not allow anyone else to make a decision. The Club will be looking at younger players with a view to a reasonble sell on value if need be.As we know TP would not like "kiddies" in his side.I doubt he would be prepared to stay on,on that basis.
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Post by Bombus on Apr 30, 2013 12:38:00 GMT
If I was Coats I wouldn't take the risk and would keep TP in the job, considering that he's kept stoke in the league quite comfortably (maybe not this one but if we win another couple the table will look that way) every season. +1 Spot on mate!
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Post by jstoke7 on Apr 30, 2013 14:00:32 GMT
If I was Coats I wouldn't take the risk and would keep TP in the job, considering that he's kept stoke in the league quite comfortably (maybe not this one but if we win another couple the table will look that way) every season. +1 Spot on mate! What about the aims for self-sufficiency, producing our own talent that Coates wants, we're hardly going to do that playing the kind of football we do and with a manager like Pulis in charge. We need to be progressive.
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Post by alster on Apr 30, 2013 14:09:11 GMT
If I was Coats I wouldn't take the risk and would keep TP in the job, considering that he's kept stoke in the league quite comfortably (maybe not this one but if we win another couple the table will look that way) every season. If I was coats I'd be wondering when it was going to warm up so I could take the summer off. Just a thought.
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Post by PerCyfilth ....Captains Log on Apr 30, 2013 14:13:01 GMT
I would be thinking "bloody hell Villa with a handfull of kids ..what football they played. Lets find that Manager to bring on the academy which is MY dream and get rid of the dross we have had for 18 months at no little cost. Get Steve Mclaren on the phone... Tony heres your train fare.. I know Mclaren has a good rep as a coach, I don't really remember what he was like at Middlesboro for introducing young homegrown players and have even less idea about what he's been up to in Holland. I don't even remember whether he plays attractive football but one things for sure it couldn't be worse than Pulis produces(cue some clever sod to bring up Alex Mcleish). Fill me in about what Mclaren is really like (really ignorant on my behalf not really remembering anything about an ex England manager I know, apologies), fact is I'd probably buy into it just because he isn't Tony Pulis but thats dangerous. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_McClarenIn early 1999, McClaren moved to Manchester United as assistant to Alex Ferguson, replacing Brian Kidd. At the time he was so unknown he was introduced by United chairman Martin Edwards as "Steve McClaridge".[11] His first half-season was distinguished by United winning the Treble, consisting of the Premier League title, FA Cup and UEFA Champions League. He developed the reputation as one of the most tactically astute coaches in the country,[12] using modern methods such as video analysis and sports psychologists.[11] United later won the League titles in 2000 and 2001, thus ensuring they won every title contested while McClaren was at the club.Whichever way you dice it he would definitley be an asset to the club either as academy supremo or Manager.
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Post by geoff321 on Apr 30, 2013 14:21:43 GMT
People talk about producing young players as if all you need is a good coaching and scouting structure. Although that will help it is not as simple as that. In the 1950's Man. United produced great young players, the average age of the team that won two Division 1 titles was 22. In the 60's, 70's and 80's they produced few young players and were mainly a buying club. Then in the 90's came a batch of talented youngsters and United went from strength to strength. Over the last few years though they have again been a buying club in the main.
For me the message here is that even the best clubs cannot produce top class youngsters on a regular basis and so clubs like Stoke would find that even harder to do. Tony Pulis is right in my view that you shouldn't throw money at the Academy, at the expense of the first team squad.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 14:29:50 GMT
I know Mclaren has a good rep as a coach, I don't really remember what he was like at Middlesboro for introducing young homegrown players and have even less idea about what he's been up to in Holland. I don't even remember whether he plays attractive football but one things for sure it couldn't be worse than Pulis produces(cue some clever sod to bring up Alex Mcleish). Fill me in about what Mclaren is really like (really ignorant on my behalf not really remembering anything about an ex England manager I know, apologies), fact is I'd probably buy into it just because he isn't Tony Pulis but thats dangerous. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_McClarenIn early 1999, McClaren moved to Manchester United as assistant to Alex Ferguson, replacing Brian Kidd. At the time he was so unknown he was introduced by United chairman Martin Edwards as "Steve McClaridge".[11] His first half-season was distinguished by United winning the Treble, consisting of the Premier League title, FA Cup and UEFA Champions League. He developed the reputation as one of the most tactically astute coaches in the country,[12] using modern methods such as video analysis and sports psychologists.[11] United later won the League titles in 2000 and 2001, thus ensuring they won every title contested while McClaren was at the club.Whichever way you dice it he would definitley be an asset to the club either as academy supremo or Manager. could he pull off the accent though?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 14:32:11 GMT
People talk about producing young players as if all you need is a good coaching and scouting structure. Although that will help it is not as simple as that. In the 1950's Man. United produced great young players, the average age of the team that won two Division 1 titles was 22. In the 60's, 70's and 80's they produced few young players and were mainly a buying club. Then in the 90's came a batch of talented youngsters and United went from strength to strength. Over the last few years though they have again been a buying club in the main. For me the message here is that even the best clubs cannot produce top class youngsters on a regular basis and so clubs like Stoke would find that even harder to do. Tony Pulis is right in my view that you shouldn't throw money at the Academy, at the expense of the first team squad. i totally agree, it's just a waste....especially when there's players like Edu, Arismendi, Cuvelier, Gudjonnsen, Shea, Owen etc. that we can just spend fees/ wages on instead eh?
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Post by jstoke7 on Apr 30, 2013 14:34:52 GMT
People talk about producing young players as if all you need is a good coaching and scouting structure. Although that will help it is not as simple as that. In the 1950's Man. United produced great young players, the average age of the team that won two Division 1 titles was 22. In the 60's, 70's and 80's they produced few young players and were mainly a buying club. Then in the 90's came a batch of talented youngsters and United went from strength to strength. Over the last few years though they have again been a buying club in the main. For me the message here is that even the best clubs cannot produce top class youngsters on a regular basis and so clubs like Stoke would find that even harder to do. Tony Pulis is right in my view that you shouldn't throw money at the Academy, at the expense of the first team squad. i totally agree, it's just a waste....especially when there's players like Edu, Arismendi, Cuvelier, Gudjonnsen, Shea, Owen etc. that we can just spend fees/ wages on instead eh? They were gambles TP made to try and improve us as a team. Unfortunately, as things go, it just didn't work out, it can't be TP's fault...
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