|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Mar 17, 2013 0:30:20 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by sufolkstokie on Mar 17, 2013 0:34:23 GMT
Gary Neville - yes please
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 0:34:54 GMT
Yes....I wonder how much he is getting paid for this literary classic. Hardly ground breaking stuff is it.?
I'd have done it for half the price...
|
|
|
|
Post by stokemanusa on Mar 17, 2013 0:38:30 GMT
Spot on, love neville's articles wish we had more like him stateside giving opinions instead of the thumbsuckers and bandwagon big club whores on TV and everything else wearing man citeh jerseys not knowing where manchester is on a map of england...
|
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 17, 2013 0:40:04 GMT
He addresses Everton to a point but not very well and then mentions a sentence about hard work regarding us and then town halls and Manchester. Strange article.
|
|
|
|
Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 17, 2013 0:44:54 GMT
The comparisons with Everton are ludicrous. We've spent far less than them over the past 5 years. We're also in a relegation battle whilst they sit in 6th.
|
|
|
|
Post by whereami on Mar 17, 2013 0:46:16 GMT
Its not surpising with the one manager he had all his career that he sees the benefit of stability. Having said that, I'd love it if someone could present the genuine, rational concerns to him about our clubs degredation since at least december 2011 to see what he thought about it - at the very least you'd know there'd be some thought in the answer from a knowledgeable, passionate source.
|
|
|
|
Post by mightymike on Mar 17, 2013 0:46:59 GMT
He knows his stuff
|
|
|
|
Post by stokemanusa on Mar 17, 2013 0:48:11 GMT
He addresses Everton to a point but not very well and then mentions a sentence about hard work regarding us and then town halls and Manchester. Strange article. Yea but the point isn't about everton and us really he doesn't say it well the point is about" the moment fans "read it again bayern.  |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 17, 2013 0:51:21 GMT
He addresses Everton to a point but not very well and then mentions a sentence about hard work regarding us and then town halls and Manchester. Strange article. Yea but the point isn't about everton and us really he doesn't say it well the point is about" the moment fans "read it again bayern. He's missing our point by a mile though, that's why I think it's a bit shit. I want long term plans, I can't see how TP can do it. His way is not sustainable. EDIT- to expand upon this a bit I think Coates is trying to build a monumental townhall. He's bought the ground, he's bought the training ground and now we've built from the top down ie getting to the Premier League, he now wants to build from the bottom up. Which is fair enough because it's the cost effective way of doing it. Sign players from the academy and at a low price from abroad and add value. I don't think TP can do that, I know that's open up to debate but I don't think he can. And fundamentally I think Coates' vision for the future is poles apart from TP's. The academy development, Cartwright and words like sustainable make me believe that. The two just don't meet at a fundamental level. Coates is showing admirable loyalty to a point but in the long run unless TP changes (haha) the two visions just aren't comparable. |
|
|
|
Post by Mason_Stokie on Mar 17, 2013 1:10:19 GMT
Spot on, love neville's articles wish we had more like him stateside giving opinions instead of the thumbsuckers and bandwagon big club whores on TV and everything else wearing man citeh jerseys not knowing where manchester is on a map of england... Piers Morgan was on fox last week! Still, he's probably better than Steve Mcmanaman.... |
|
|
|
Post by stokemanusa on Mar 17, 2013 1:23:01 GMT
Yea but the point isn't about everton and us really he doesn't say it well the point is about" the moment fans "read it again bayern. He's missing our point by a mile though, that's why I think it's a bit shit. I want long term plans, I can't see how TP can do it. His way is not sustainable. EDIT- to expand upon this a bit I think Coates is trying to build a monumental townhall. He's bought the ground, he's bought the training ground and now we've built from the top down ie getting to the Premier League he wants to build from the bottom up. Which is fair enough because it's the cost effective of doing it. Sign players from the academy and at a low price and add value. I don't think TP can do that, I know that's open up to debate but I don't think he can. And fundamentally I think Coates' vision for the future is poles apart from TP's. The academy development, Cartwright and words like sustainable make me believe that. The two just don't meet at a fundamental level. Coates is showing admirable loyalty to a point but in the long run unless TP changes (haha) the two visions just aren't comparable.  Amazing summarizing of the plight of a stoke fan looking long term! |
|
|
|
Post by stokemanusa on Mar 17, 2013 1:24:26 GMT
Spot on, love neville's articles wish we had more like him stateside giving opinions instead of the thumbsuckers and bandwagon big club whores on TV and everything else wearing man citeh jerseys not knowing where manchester is on a map of england... Piers Morgan was on fox last week! Still, he's probably better than Steve Mcmanaman.... Umm your joking right? Piers morgan deserves to be left to rot on late night us tv imo a stupid twat who only had his fame from kissing monumental ass in london. |
|
|
|
Post by The man from Utch on Mar 17, 2013 1:29:32 GMT
Spot on, love neville's articles wish we had more like him stateside giving opinions instead of the thumbsuckers and bandwagon big club whores on TV and everything else wearing man citeh jerseys not knowing where manchester is on a map of england... Amen |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 17, 2013 1:29:56 GMT
He's missing our point by a mile though, that's why I think it's a bit shit. I want long term plans, I can't see how TP can do it. His way is not sustainable. EDIT- to expand upon this a bit I think Coates is trying to build a monumental townhall. He's bought the ground, he's bought the training ground and now we've built from the top down ie getting to the Premier League he wants to build from the bottom up. Which is fair enough because it's the cost effective of doing it. Sign players from the academy and at a low price and add value. I don't think TP can do that, I know that's open up to debate but I don't think he can. And fundamentally I think Coates' vision for the future is poles apart from TP's. The academy development, Cartwright and words like sustainable make me believe that. The two just don't meet at a fundamental level. Coates is showing admirable loyalty to a point but in the long run unless TP changes (haha) the two visions just aren't comparable. Amazing summarizing of the plight of a stoke fan looking long term! It genuinely worries me. Sad I know but it does. And for the past 18/24 months now I think the views of the two main parties at Stoke (PC and TP) are becoming further and further apart. I hope it ends well but I can't see it. |
|
|
|
Post by tybereusfirkz on Mar 17, 2013 7:10:24 GMT
It's a poor article.
No mention of our net spending behind man city & Chelsea. Entirely missed the point that our squad isn't being used to its maximum and the club still being stuck in first gear football from day one of the premiership with no improvement on the pitch despite paying out massive massive amounts for players.
I mean Jesus Christ we start Owen jones and Adam on the bench for fun when mediocre championship players like Walters whelan and sadly crouch start. And worse crouch is a far far better player than our tactics allow him to be.
It's a massive waste of resources, personnel and fans times travelling to games now.
|
|
|
|
Post by Trouserdog on Mar 17, 2013 7:24:14 GMT
Neville is very knowledgeable about many aspects of football but, like the rest of the national media, knows little about the finer details of Stoke's situation.
What is annoying is that he and others like him have a national platform from which to air their ill-informed views, while the people who know exactly what the situation is (i.e. us mere mortals) are not heard at all.
|
|
|
|
Post by robwahlmann on Mar 17, 2013 7:34:02 GMT
Always thought Gary was a moron (on the pitch) when playing for united, but I must say that he after his playing career has impressed me with his level headed comments. To me he really speaks sense and I must also say that he really should know what he is talking about too when it comes to football!  |
|
|
|
Post by Linx on Mar 17, 2013 7:55:08 GMT
Hang on, guys - apply some critical thinking skills here and take off your Stokecentric hats:
It's actually a good article. His main argument is about stability and how there is an increasing trend in society to undervalue that compared to 'get-rich-quick' style success. He employs Everton and Stoke as examples of stability, and makes a couple of interim conclusions about fans' impatience with Moyes and Pulis, and that's all. He's not pretending nor intending to analyse in any detail our recent histories. The article's editor, not Neville, has decided to narrow the focus on Stoke and Everton, through the headings and the pictures, to give the story a hook that might get somebody to read it.
|
|
|
|
Post by stokeramblers on Mar 17, 2013 8:08:40 GMT
I'm a little surprised that the Oatcake massive haven't turned on Neville in a more vicious and rabid fashion.
I mean you only have to look at the way many posters savaged Danny Higginbotham for a similar article not so long ago.
The love is clearly strong for Gary Neville.
|
|
|
|
Post by tonyzicokelly on Mar 17, 2013 8:17:16 GMT
Fine article from Gareth. Puts into perspective how ridiculous the Pulis knockers truly are. #iftheycanreadthatfar #Pulisin
|
|
|
|
Post by AlanHansen on Mar 17, 2013 8:18:04 GMT
Valid point from someone vey well respected in the game. Well said Gary.
Unfortunately your wise words will mean little to the wrist slashers who frequent this once fine message board, it just doesn't fit with their agenda.
On the other hand had you said Pulis and Moyes were Clowns then you'd have been the new Mesiah... fickle bunch that they are.
|
|
|
|
Post by sufolkstokie on Mar 17, 2013 8:24:04 GMT
I'm a little surprised that the Oatcake massive haven't turned on Neville in a more vicious and rabid fashion. I mean you only have to look at the way many posters savaged Danny Higginbotham for a similar article not so long ago. The love is clearly strong for Gary Neville. I think you will find Mr Higgy has changed his mind and now believes we are in a relegation fight |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 8:28:21 GMT
Pish.
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 8:31:26 GMT
Fine article from Gareth. Puts into perspective how ridiculous the Pulis knockers truly are. #iftheycanreadthatfar #Pulisin Yeah, things are going brilliantly aren't they. We've made real progress this season  |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 8:34:25 GMT
I like Neville on Sky, he's very knowledgeable and can appreciate all the fine margins and details. But, he is also missing the point. Stability does not necessarily need to involve TP in my honest opinion. Part of being stable is to have back-up plans for if/when things go wrong. It comes down to nothing more than risk management. I'd started writing an analogy about a City Trader with stocks that had increased but had started going down, but it was starting to drag on so I wont bother But, sometimes in life, you have to change in order to achieve longer term stability. We are now in a position where a new manager could come in and have the nucleus of a good, strong squad. A few signings would be needed, but a full pre-season would be necessary. However, another year and we risk losing those players more able to suit a different style. I know we're lauded for working hard, but genuinely, how many teams dont? Are there any teams which you could accuse of being lazy? If Neville and others want to draw comparisons between us and Everton when the chips are down and following focal disapproval, then let us look at our comparative attitudes yesterday shall we? Everton played Man City at home. They showed their intent from the first whistle, defended and attacked well and with purpose and were well up for it. Having had a goal disallowed in the first half for offside (which was the wrong call), the scored from a shanked effort. Having gone down to 10 men, and could have gone down to 9 (although Dzeko could have himself been sent off too), they bought on Naismith for Mareilles (sp) to ensure they kept an attacking outlet. They then bought Jelavic on at the end who made it 2-0 in injury time for a well deserved win. Stoke, well, what could we say? The best I've seen is that its an improvement on recent performances. We had more of the ball than usual, but didnt know how to use it. Very few telling chances, and our most positive substitution was bringing on a striker for a striker. BBC writeup as a matter of interest described it as a feeble goalless draw. The conclusion I've come to, admittedly as somebody who didnt go, is that it was a great away performance by us - just at home. For the last 20 months, we have rarely performed better than 'hard fought' or 'laboured' and a precious few 'well deserved'. A good defensive display does not have to come at the expense of a positive attacking one too. So Gary, I would invite you to spend the next 8 games sitting in with the Stoke fans and experiencing games like Stoke fans do. Then factor that over the last two seasons and then see if you still think folk are pissed off at the prospect of finishing mid table. Right now, sitting in 10th place, I would snap your hand off at 12-14th position. I'd also like him to analyse our last 10 games, yes, over a quarter of the season, and tell us where our next victory is coming from. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 8:42:44 GMT
Thanks for the link, Joe. An article mirrored by the future-supporters one, on here (and maybe 1,000,000 others over the last few months  ) Intestinal Fortitude: being willing suck it up now, in anticipation of what is (hopefully) to come. Sadly, not a characteristic that has survived the Age of Spazbook. I thought the Town Hall analogy was well done ... I drive past one of those 6p modern-churches, most mornings and am always thinking, they dunner build em like they used to(We'd never win a war now ... I remember when it was all fields rind 'ere ... and so forth  ) |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 8:49:58 GMT
Thanks for the link, Joe. An article mirrored by the future-supporters one, on here (and maybe 1,000,000 others over the last few months ) Intestinal Fortitude: being willing suck it up now, in anticipation of what is (hopefully) to come. Sadly, not a characteristic that has survived the Age of Spazbook. I thought the Town Hall analogy was well done ... I drive past one of those 6p modern-churches, most mornings and am always thinking, they dunner build em like they used to(We'd never win a war now ... I remember when it was all fields rind 'ere ... and so forth ) Andy, why are we in a position to even need to 'suck it up' and what evidence is there to suggest there's better to come? |
|
|
|
Post by chiswickpotter on Mar 17, 2013 8:50:05 GMT
It's a poor article. No mention of our net spending behind man city & Chelsea. Entirely missed the point that our squad isn't being used to its maximum and the club still being stuck in first gear football from day one of the premiership with no improvement on the pitch despite paying out massive massive amounts for players. I mean Jesus Christ we start Owen jones and Adam on the bench for fun when mediocre championship players like Walters whelan and sadly crouch start. And worse crouch is a far far better player than our tactics allow him to be. It's a massive waste of resources, personnel and fans times travelling to games now. But your comment is lazy too, net spending requires that you factor in wages, wages matter much, much more than transfer fees in driving league position and we have relatively low wages in all the surveys. We continue to perform above our economic level. It is not pretty but where is the example of a team surviving in the Premiership with a reliance on home grown talent since the Man Utd Golden generation moved on. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2013 9:01:36 GMT
It's a poor article. No mention of our net spending behind man city & Chelsea. Entirely missed the point that our squad isn't being used to its maximum and the club still being stuck in first gear football from day one of the premiership with no improvement on the pitch despite paying out massive massive amounts for players. I mean Jesus Christ we start Owen jones and Adam on the bench for fun when mediocre championship players like Walters whelan and sadly crouch start. And worse crouch is a far far better player than our tactics allow him to be. It's a massive waste of resources, personnel and fans times travelling to games now. But your comment is lazy too, net spending requires that you factor in wages, wages matter much, much more than transfer fees in driving league position and we have relatively low wages in all the surveys. We continue to perform above our economic level. It is not pretty but where is the example of a team surviving in the Premiership with a reliance on home grown talent since the Man Utd Golden generation moved on. That misses the point though that we've actually wasted a lot of that money. Look at the players we have, look at the money spent since the cup final when we had a platform to 'push on' and it's not been very well spent has it? We were in a position to go forwards and instead we're going backwards. |
|
Amazing summarizing of the plight of a stoke fan looking long term!
)
