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Post by oggyoggy on Feb 13, 2011 22:04:07 GMT
Attacking open football which doesn’t guarantee survival, or Pulis football which gives us a very high chance of survival??
Currently we do not play the most exciting football in the league. We are 9thin the prem and are on target right now to improve our finishing position again under the current boss. The only team above us who do not spend significantly more on players than us are Bolton, but i would guess they pay much higher wages as they have been a fixture in this league for many years. We cannot compete in terms of finance with any of the other teams above us, including sunderland who get 40000 crowds.
Below us there are several teams who use pulis style tactics to worse effect than us based on current league position – eg Wolves, Birmingham, Blackburn. The majority of teams below us attempt to play more expansive football which some people on this board seem to prefer – eg blackpool, west ham, west brom, wigan.
Realistically we will be unlikely to ever break into the top 6 unless we have massive financial investment, or unless one of them slips up massively as Liverpool looked like doing for awhile.
We are a relatively small club for this league in terms of finance and attendances, regardless of the 70mill people haver quoted we have spent. Yet every year we have improved our position, to the extent where most pundits didn’t even consider us for relegation this season.
In an ideal world we would play excellent exciting football, but in reality that doesn’t get you very far in this league if you are one of the smaller clubs. Pulis is aware of this and so is very reluctant to change his style to perhaps finish 7th or 8th but risk going down. Right now we are 9th and play more boring football but it is bloody effective in keeping us in the prem.
What i cannot understand is the instant success that so many on this board seem to crave. Relegation could spell disaster, it could mean another 10 years before getting back to the prem, so i for one do not want to risk that by dramatically changing our style in a short space of time. Pulis and Coates are building the foundations of a club here. It is a project that takes years, and is a highly fragile thing which can easily break. Pulis CLEARLY is trying to bring in more quality – pennant, huth, ethers, carew. It is not easy, else everyone would be doing it.
Be patient everyone and get behind the team, including pulis. I wonder if any other manager in the football league has improved his sides finishing position every year for the past 5 seasons? Pulis will if we finish 10th or above this season and what a remarkable and unthinkable achievement that will be.
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Post by march4 on Feb 13, 2011 22:04:56 GMT
Pulisball pleae.
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jamesblock26
Youth Player
Block 26 resident Shikari fan
Posts: 308
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Post by jamesblock26 on Feb 13, 2011 22:05:34 GMT
When at a match, theres usually enough incident for me to enjoy the match, but i've never needed watch tippy tappy football to enjoy being at a match guess some people are hard to please Some people are west brom fans I'd say we're happier then them at the moment
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Post by staffordstokie999 on Feb 13, 2011 22:09:12 GMT
great post. If we had just survived the first season and finished 14th / 15th last season i dont think too many would be moaning about where we are now. We are progressing but how far can we progress? 6th / 7th in a few seasons possibly, then what?
I would love to see more passing, attacking football if it guaranteed success, but it doesnt. If it did Arsenal would win every trophy.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2011 22:10:37 GMT
WHO CARES WHAT THEY SAY - WE PLAY THE PULIS WAY (sounds like a song :
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Post by drevil on Feb 13, 2011 22:10:43 GMT
any football in the prem is better than good football in the championship
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Post by march4 on Feb 13, 2011 22:12:37 GMT
I see the tiny negative rump of our support are struggling to post on this thread.
Perhaps those nasty positive people are 'winding them up' again by supporting our football club.
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Post by mayf on Feb 13, 2011 22:13:10 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ?
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Post by stokemark on Feb 13, 2011 22:17:31 GMT
I think that fact that we are currently on less points than this time last season, havent got a point away this year and look pretty weak in terms of strength in depth is what most people are concerned about.
We are definately not guaranteed of staying up this year - Not by a long chalk
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Post by staffordstokie999 on Feb 13, 2011 22:17:54 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ? could you explain that please? It didnt happen to Allardyce's teams.
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Post by oggyoggy on Feb 13, 2011 22:19:18 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ? You are right, who is to say more expansive football would get us less points. Football in general favours defensive teams, if you don't concede, you don't lose. It is almost impossible to establish yourself as a prem team coming from the championship playing attacking football. If you attack when you go up, unless you have huge funding behind you (north east clubs), you have a slimmer chance of survival, i think most would agree with that statement. I agree we need to adapt, but not if it is going to risk our safety in the league. And that is why it has to be a slow process. we just have to be patient. And i live in london so go to far more away games than home nowadays. I just feel that some supporters do not appreciate how lucky we are to have a stable club owner and such an effective, if not pretty, manager in charge.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 13, 2011 22:20:09 GMT
If the season were to finish now, 9th position would be tantamount to us winning the league and as I see it, is really the best that we can hope for this season.
I would have expected us to finish above Bolton and think we will but I would also expect Everton, Aston Villa and maybe even Blackburn and West Ham to have been above us in the pecking order at the start of the season.
That said the last 3 away league games have been abysmal even by our standards but it is the continued omission of Fuller from the starting 11 together with our apparent willingness to sell him, that is the main reason for much of the current discontent.
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Post by march4 on Feb 13, 2011 22:21:27 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ? Teams are NOT getting used to us. We are higher than our last finish in the Prem and still in the FA Cup. Look over our 147 year history. This is one of our best seasons ever.
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Post by drevil on Feb 13, 2011 22:26:46 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ? Teams are NOT getting used to us. We are higher than our last finish in the Prem and still in the FA Cup. Look over our 147 year history. This is one of our best seasons ever. thank you....finally. ive kept my mouth shut on here, but so many people are pissing me off. some fans need to get a grip. so fickle its untrue. after every loss nob heads on here post negative tosh, and they all disappear after a win. stoke have been for most of this season in the top half of the table and we are two games away from wembley.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2011 22:28:34 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ? Teams are NOT getting used to us. We are higher than our last finish in the Prem and still in the FA Cup. Look over our 147 year history. This is one of our best seasons ever. this is a thread in itself
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Post by greyman on Feb 13, 2011 22:29:29 GMT
So now the argument is:
Tony Pulis is the only manager in the entire world that can keep us up. Except Alan Curbishley. If we sign a left back and a midfielder who can pass the ball, we'll be relegated by Christmas.
I know we always have this polarised nonsense after any result, but for God's sake.
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Post by march4 on Feb 13, 2011 22:32:34 GMT
Teams are NOT getting used to us. We are higher than our last finish in the Prem and still in the FA Cup. Look over our 147 year history. This is one of our best seasons ever. this is a thread in itself It is the truth though. Look through the record books.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2011 22:32:45 GMT
The longer we play Pulisball the more chance we have of getting drawn into a relegation battle in my opinion. Teams are getting wise to us,there's absolutely no guarantees of survival whichever way we play.Who's to say a more expansive attacking style would get us less points anyway ? Stokelad ? March ? Tazi ? You ? could you explain that please? It didnt happen to Allardyce's teams. Allardyce evolved his Bolton team. We are manifestly not evolving - we're becoming more one-dimensional if anything.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 13, 2011 22:32:58 GMT
To be fair, it is impossible to describe a season as anything (best, worst or most mediocre) until it has finished.
This season has the potential to be one of our best seasons in a very very long time but it also has the potential to go horribly wrong. Lose our next 3 league fixtures (OK...not likely with WBA being our next league fixture ;D) and it really will be squeeky bum time.
The time to describe a season is when it is over!
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Post by drevil on Feb 13, 2011 22:34:10 GMT
To be fair, it is impossible to describe a season as anything (best, worst or most mediocre) until it has finished. This season has the potential to be one of our best seasons in a very very long time but it also has the potential to go horribly wrong. Lose our next 3 league fixtures (OK...not likely with WBA being our next league fixture ;D) and it really will be squeeky bum time. The time to describe a season is when it is over! +1
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Post by BraveSirRobin on Feb 13, 2011 22:34:38 GMT
Football is an entertainment industry.....I gurantee we wont sell as many Season tickets next year.
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Post by march4 on Feb 13, 2011 22:35:18 GMT
could you explain that please? It didnt happen to Allardyce's teams. Allardyce evolved his Bolton team. We are manifestly not evolving - we're becoming more one-dimensional if anything. Is Carew not a step forwards?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2011 22:35:34 GMT
this is a thread in itself It is the truth though. Look through the record books. i agree - some people need a reality check
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2011 22:37:36 GMT
Allardyce evolved his Bolton team. We are manifestly not evolving - we're becoming more one-dimensional if anything. Is Carew not a step forwards? No. He's a good player, but he's more of the same. We have replaced a creative player with another target man. I like Carew - he's an excellent player, but we need more creators and the transfer window has left us with fewer. Carew isn't going to be able to score a bagful of goals without service. Instead of adding more strings to our bow, we've got less - we've dropped Ric, sold Tuncay, and seem to be having second thoughts about playing both wingers.
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Post by staffordstokie999 on Feb 13, 2011 22:38:02 GMT
could you explain that please? It didnt happen to Allardyce's teams. Allardyce evolved his Bolton team. We are manifestly not evolving - we're becoming more one-dimensional if anything. how long was Allardyce at Bolton? Pulis has been back here 5 years, we havent evolved in that time? You really think that?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 13, 2011 22:38:08 GMT
Out of interest...If we were to get relegated from our current position of strength, how would youd desribe the season then?
If we got sucked into a relegation fight but survived, how would you describe the season then?
If we finish between our current position and 12th with similar or slightly more points than last season, having beat Brighton but lost in the next round of the FA Cup, how you would describe the season then?
If we finish 9th and lose in FA Cup after beating Brighton, what then?
Lo and behold, what if we play shit for the rest of the season, drop like a stone, stay up, but win the FA Cup. What then?
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Post by oggyoggy on Feb 13, 2011 22:41:56 GMT
So now the argument is: Tony Pulis is the only manager in the entire world that can keep us up. Except Alan Curbishley. If we sign a left back and a midfielder who can pass the ball, we'll be relegated by Christmas. I know we always have this polarised nonsense after any result, but for God's sake. no nobody is saying pulis is the only one. But usually when a small club in the premier league gets a new manager they go downhill - unless there is huge funding so they can stamp their authority over the team quickly. pulis is a safe option at the moment that gives us a strong chance of survival and has an impeccable record. If we only wanted entertainment from football we would all be barcelona fans. Have faith in pulis, he has not done badly for us so far.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2011 22:43:39 GMT
Allardyce evolved his Bolton team. We are manifestly not evolving - we're becoming more one-dimensional if anything. how long was Allardyce at Bolton? Pulis has been back here 5 years, we havent evolved in that time? You really think that? I think we have, but not really enough to justify the money spent. Allardyce kept Bolton up playing shite football, long throw etc, then he brought in Okocha, Djorkaeff, Stelios, etc and added a bi of flair to the physical, direct stuff, I'd be happy with that. We showed signs of trying to evolve and wanting to evolve and we seem to have abandoned that in favour of being as one-dimensional as ever. And I don't understand why.
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Post by march4 on Feb 13, 2011 22:43:53 GMT
Is Carew not a step forwards? No. He's a good player, but he's more of the same. We have replaced a creative player with another target man. I like Carew - he's an excellent player, but we need more creators and the transfer window has left us with fewer. Carew isn't going to be able to score a bagful of goals without service. Instead of adding more strings to our bow, we've got less - we've dropped Ric, sold Tuncay, and seem to be having second thoughts about playing both wingers. We have got rid of a creative misfit. Yes, we should have kept him until a replacement was found, but we didn't and Carew looks a class act. The Carew/KJ partnership looks promising to me, especially with Ric as backup. Ethers was injured yesterday and JP had a pulled back muscle a few weeks ago. I think TP will play both when he gets the chance with the two big guys up front. Wilson at full back was the main interest for me. I think he can make that position his own.
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Post by oggyoggy on Feb 13, 2011 22:44:53 GMT
Out of interest...If we were to get relegated from our current position of strength, how would youd desribe the season then? If we got sucked into a relegation fight but survived, how would you describe the season then? If we finish between our current position and 12th with similar or slightly more points than last season, having beat Brighton but lost in the next round of the FA Cup, how you would describe the season then? If we finish 9th and lose in FA Cup after beating Brighton, what then? Lo and behold, what if we play shit for the rest of the season, drop like a stone, stay up, but win the FA Cup. What then? Anything other than relegation is a good season in my opinion. Improvement from last season would be fantastic. 17th - 12th would be good. Winning the fa cup and finishing 17th would be the best season in our history.
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