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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 17:03:19 GMT
So somebody suggesting that a black woman needs to be shot is merely 'inappropriate' and we now need to move on from it but when it comes to people marching for peace, they are actually 'hate' marchers that need to be stopped? Righto ... This is an example of a Labour MP using similar rhetoric when talking about someone of the same ethnicity. www.politicshome.com/news/article/esther-mcvey-claims-john-mcdonnell-lynching-comments-put-her-in-dangerItβs quite possible that it has little to do with skin color and everything to do with party tribalism and our βgood men with great mindsβ generally just being pieces of shit. What PL said. It was entirely to do with her skin colour. At least Badenoch is being honest about his racism.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 16:03:39 GMT
So somebody suggesting that a black woman needs to be shot is merely 'inappropriate' and we now need to move on from it but when it comes to people marching for peace, they are actually 'hate' marchers that need to be stopped?
Righto ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 15:35:32 GMT
Have you really got nothing better to do, than open, read and comment on threads that are boring you to tears? π Who says I bother to read them? You said PLIBT, what are you hoping is true? π€¦ββοΈ
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 12:47:13 GMT
Pretty much disagree with all of that Oggy but I'm done discussing it. I'm sure you'll reply to this post but I'll apologise in advance, for not replying to yours, as I said, I'm done with this one now. PLIBT. Have we got to the bottom of which one of you is the most right then? Have you really got nothing better to do, than open, read and comment on threads that are boring you to tears? π
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 12:34:15 GMT
Blimey Oggy, you are doing it yet again and if you can't be bothered to do a little research because you (mistakenly) believe that your own logic will see you through instead, when both wannabee and myself have attempted to give you a steer in the right direction, so that you can actually learn a little bit about the history of apartheid, then unfortunately, you are destined to continue embarrassing yourself. I don't know why but I decided to do the research I suggested, on your behalf and it's incredible just how easy and quickly it was to do. The Afrikana Nationalists attempted to force their language onto the black South African youth, it was the very definition of an apartheid action. If they could force the children of South Africa to speak the language of their choosing, ultimately resulting in it becoming the national language, then it would (they believed) further increase their hold on apartheid power. Forcing the black South Africans to speak their language, was another tool of their oppression. No doubt you will now try and use obfuscation and a moving of the goal posts once again but we can but try. Some links ... southafrica-info.com/history/16-june-1976-soweto-students-uprising-as-it-happened/By 1976 young black peopleβs frustration with their education, and the bleak future it offered, was ready to explode. The fuse was lit when the government proposed to introduce Afrikaans as the language of teaching. Black South Africans spoke their own languages. These had already been ignored in their education. English had long been the medium of instruction β their second language β and was a language most urban young black people were at least familiar with. But almost none of them knew Afrikaans well enough to be taught in it, let alone write exams in the language. Afrikaans was also the language of the oppressor. Today most of the people who speak Afrikaans arenβt white, but in the 1970s the language was still associated with Afrikaner nationalism, the ideology of the National Party, the nationalism of white Afrikaans-speaking people. www.zinnedproject.org/news/tdih/soweto-uprising/High school student-led protests in South Africa began on the morning of June 16, 1976 in response to the introduction of Afrikaans as the medium of instruction in local schools. Known as the Soweto uprising, an estimated 20,000 students took part in the protests. The police fired teargas and live ammunition on demonstrating students. The official count is that 176 protesters were killed, but actual estimates are much higher. We recommend reading the detailed description at South Africa History Online www.sahistory.org.za/article/june-16-soweto-youth-uprisingThe June 16 1976 Uprising that began in Soweto and spread countrywide profoundly changed the socio-political landscape in South Africa. Events that triggered the uprising can be traced back to policies of the Apartheid government that resulted in the introduction of the Bantu Education Act in 1953. When the language of Afrikaans alongside English was made compulsory as a medium of instruction in schools in 1974, black students began mobilizing themselves. The aftermath of the events of June 16 1976 had dire consequences for the Apartheid government. www.btselem.org/publications/fulltext/202101_this_is_apartheidA regime that uses laws, practices and organized violence to cement the supremacy of one group over another is an apartheid regime. Israeli apartheid, which promotes the supremacy of Jews over Palestinians, was not born in one day or of a single speech. It is a process that has gradually grown more institutionalized and explicit, with mechanisms introduced over time in law and practice to promote Jewish supremacy. The Nation State basic law, enacted in 2018, enshrines the Jewish peopleβs right to self-determination to the exclusion of all others. It establishes that distinguishing Jews in Israel (and throughout the world) from non-Jews is fundamental and legitimate. Based on this distinction, the law permits institutionalized discrimination in favor of Jews in settlement, housing, land development, citizenship, language and culture. www.vox.com/world/2018/7/31/17623978/israel-jewish-nation-state-law-bill-explained-apartheid-netanyahu-democracyFor 70 years, both Hebrew and Arabic were designated as official languages in Israel. This new law has just changed that. Arabic is widely spoken by Palestinians in Israel, as well as by some Jewish Israelis with roots in Arab countries. Arabicβs βspecial statusβ under the new law ensures that some things, like road signs, will remain in both languages. But Arab Israelis say that stripping Arabic of its official status is meant to erase their identities and histories. They also say it will put them at an economic disadvantage, because Hebrew is often not taught well in schools in Arab Israeli communities. And finally, if you read the following article, and still can't hold your hands up and accept that maybe the above statement that you made might need reevaluating a little, then maybe we need to reevaluate who the actual 'idiot' is? I haven't quoted any of it because every line in it, is actually as succinct as the next ... mondoweiss.net/2020/04/hebrew-arab-and-apartheid/Thank you Paul, that was illuminating reading. You have actually addressed my point and provided evidence of why I am (at the very least partially) wrong about the language point. Until your above post, nobody had pointed out that the law change is recent. A quote from the article says: β Less than two years ago, the quasi-constitutional βNation Stateβ law was passed in Israel, reducing Arabic from being an official language to merely having a nebulous βspecial statusβ. This was yet another milestone in the Zionist project of elimination, which again demonstrates how language is used as a means of identity and domination.β I still believe from reading the above that Israel has a right to determine a national language supreme to others: Hebrew as it turns out, but that of course should only apply in Israel and not on the West Bank or in Gaza, which under international law is not part of their country. The attempt to enforce Afrikaans as the national language in South Africa was on the local population within South Africa. Israel are enforcing their language on people in territories that extend beyond their own. That is an important difference. Another difference between South Africa and Israel is that Israel was a country supposedly for Jews who had been forced out of their homes elsewhere. A safe place for them to live. Choosing Hebrew, a language obviously associated with their religion, matches the reason the country was set up. Obviously the people who moved to Israel were from all over and they need a common language. The rights and wrongs of forming the nation where it is is a completely different discussion. In South Africa, colonialists came there and enforced a language on the native locals. It is different. In Israel, if they try to enforce Hebrew as the public language of discourse on the West Bank or in Gaza, areas in which Israel should have no legal jurisdiction, it could help enforce apartheid there. I stand by the point that in Israel (not the territories they are seizing/have seized) having a national language of Hebrew is not in itself a sign of apartheid. I cannot ever accept that the concept of a national language should be abandoned because it would be bedlam for every public authority and utterly impossible to administer a government. But I see your point of view and admit that I am partially wrong about the language point, and I do so because you have provided me with proper evidence and explanation. Pretty much disagree with all of that Oggy but I'm done discussing it. I'm sure you'll reply to this post but I'll apologise in advance, for not replying to yours, as I said, I'm done with this one now.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 10:53:34 GMT
Whatever people think of the Royal Family, William and Kate have been nigh on flawless over the years and as a minimum, deserve respect and their privacy for a short period while the Princess recovers from illness. To be fair, this whole level of attention wouldn't be happening if THEY hadn't released the picture. I saw the picture when it was first started doing the rounds on Sunday morning and I didn't give it a second thought (I certainly couldn't have named any of the children in it) but by the end of the day, I'd started a thread about it on the Oatcake! There must be 100's of thousands of people in this country alone, in a similar position, there'd be a very similar reaction if (say) Sunak's wife had had an operation and then they too had released a dodgy family picture. As LGH says above, I didn't even realise (or care) that she hadn't been seen in public for months until Sunday evening. There's no chicken or egg situation here, this whole furore is entirely of their own making.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 2:20:44 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 2:16:47 GMT
Beautiful man, beautiful lyrics ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 2:09:55 GMT
Karl's lyrics just (maybe more so) as relevant today as they were in the 80's.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 2:00:44 GMT
So incredibly sad, one of the most underrated British songwriters, 66 is absolutely no age at all.
RIP Karl
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 1:42:02 GMT
What's the betting the money will miraculously appear on Monday? Orban? Putin? Musk? The Saudis? And we're to believe that a man running for Presidency of the USA isn't going to be compromised? Absolutely nothing to see here folks ... www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68533351Donald Trump will not fund Ukraine's fight against Russia's invasion if he is elected US president again, Hungarian PM Viktor Orban has said. "He will not give a penny in the Ukraine-Russia war. That is why the war will end," the conservative premier said after meeting Mr Trump in Florida. The former US president has pledged to end the war "within 24 hours" if elected.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 1:07:11 GMT
My wife is furious that our next door neighbour sunbathes topless in her backgarden. Personally ... Iβm on the fence.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2024 0:52:48 GMT
Nothing suspicious here at all! π
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 22:49:44 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 21:42:06 GMT
According to the TV news channels they have. The Pap said last week that they wouldn't be taking any photos of them during her recovery. And you believe them of course? Tbf who knows what to believe these days but I wouldnβt imagine the royal family have sent that snap out to the public And you believe that if there were paps around, they wouldn't be also on the other side of the car? π€£ Listen, I'm just chuckling watching the mainstream media reporting it - don't blame the messenger ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 21:34:08 GMT
So this is the new picture the Palace has elected to release to quell all the conspiracy theories. π€¦ββοΈ Jesus, they don't help themselves, do they! π The Palace didnβt release this photo did they? Thought it was taken by a pap. According to the TV news channels they have. The Pap said last week that they wouldn't be taking any photos of them during her recovery.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 20:45:46 GMT
Fair play to the Geordies at Stamford Bridge, out in huge numbers on a Monday night and making a right racket!
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 20:04:56 GMT
So he says that when he sees Dianne Abbot's face it makes him want to hate all black women and that she should be shot and then today he claims he isn't racist! Jesus wept ... π€¦ββοΈ
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:54:03 GMT
I think that's a very fair way of looking at it and your 'Where are you from'? test is particularly on point. Just to come back to this, doesn't that contradict what you said on the first page though? (Sorry late to this thread): I just don't understand how you cam be proud or ashamed over something you had absolutely no say in. In foster's circumstance I absolutely think nobody should be proud or ashamed of their nationality, just as nobody should judge them for it. I think the way I would see it is that nobody should be truly proud or ashamed of the fact that they, by accident of birth, are [English, Czech, Mexican etc], but taking pride in *the place* you come from can be healthy. As long as you're taking pride in the right elements I'm open to being convinced and I thought that Foster's reply was the first one that I had seen that was possibly capable of doing that.
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English
Mar 11, 2024 19:50:15 GMT
via mobile
Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:50:15 GMT
Okay then, rather than? Why would those values be an example of British values rather than being an example of European values? I didn't say they would be... some could be both, or indeed two countries could have a tradition of valuing the same thing that *isn't* necessarily "European". I don't think it's a competition.. But for the sake of argument if you take my example of self-sufficiency and stoicism, I think there is much more value placed in that in Britain than there is in Spain or Italy, for example. Conversely they have much stronger values rooted in the family than we do in northern Europe. I just don't think there is enough substance there to define them as being 'British' values. European values I can get on board with.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:46:02 GMT
So this is the new picture the Palace has elected to release to quell all the conspiracy theories. π€¦ββοΈ
Jesus, they don't help themselves, do they! π
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:23:55 GMT
As opposed to which other European nations mate? Why "as opposed to"? Okay then, rather than? Why would those values be an example of British values rather than being an example of European values?
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English
Mar 11, 2024 19:18:18 GMT
via mobile
Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:18:18 GMT
As opposed to which other European nations mate? The pesky Belgians, grrr π
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English
Mar 11, 2024 19:15:30 GMT
via mobile
Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:15:30 GMT
It's not something I ever give much thought too. I often see the phrase "English/British values" and I honestly have no idea what it means? Most people have shared values the world over, the majority of people are kind and decent and just want to work hard and provide for their family. We could take British values to mean, let's say: tolerance, self-reliance, stoicism, democracy, freedom of (and from) religion. As opposed to which other European nations mate?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 19:07:35 GMT
Not sure why this is being over complicated. If you're in a group of let's say 20 foreigners of various nationalities and they ask.. 'Where are you from?'. How do you feel about saying you're English, or from England? To be honest I feel a tiny bit embarrassed. I agree that I shouldn't be, but what we do as a nation reflects on us whether we like it or not. English football fans acting like nobs, English people on holiday acting like chavs, Brexit, Boris, being the US lapdog with regards to politics, etc. Aside from the football, what is there to be proud of recently? Saying that, even though I've only lived in England for a quarter of my life and am by blood less English than other nationalities, I feel fully English and promote breakfast, football, etc. At every opportunity. I think that's a very fair way of looking at it and your 'Where are you from'? test is particularly on point.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 16:15:49 GMT
I am completely and utterly mystified as to what the news is supposed to be here.. how is it a story that a photo has been digitally edited after being taken? Surely most of us do that to some extent every single day? I'd have been infinitely more surprised if it had come out that photos of the royals are *not* altered after being taken. That said the apology (apology?? wtf?) now makes it seem like there *is* more to it than I realised. Maybe my expectations are out of whack or something Probably like me PL, you weren't aware that the Internet has been awash with conspiracy stories over the last few weeks about the whereabouts of Kate because she (despite her operation) hasn't been seen in public since Christmas. The official release of this photograph yesterday was supposed to quell those conspiracy theories. Obviously, now that the world's biggest photo agencies have called out the authenticity of an officially released Royal picture FOR THE FIRST TIME EVER, it has had the complete opposite effect of that intended. Looking around, some quite credible commentators are suggesting that it has been phtoshopped from a pic in November, whilst others are suggesting that it is completely AI generated from scratch. AP have asked the Palace to provide them with either the original picture or the meta data but they have refused on both counts, which of course adds to the intrigue. Nothing to see here ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 15:31:18 GMT
Bear in mind that Blakeley is very much of the left, when she says this ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 15:04:26 GMT
Pity that Schlosberg isn't invited onto our own news channels, I think this is fair commentary ...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 14:40:00 GMT
Christ alive!π
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 11, 2024 14:34:01 GMT
All the things going on in the world,yet we have all this fuss over a fucking photo. Yes, that's one perspective. But on the other hand, if a seemingly innocuous photo of a family can be doctored (for whatever purpose) to hide/alter something, then can you trust an image of something more serious - like from a war zone, where opinions and sides are taken? Exactly. There is far more to consider here, than a single photograph of the Royal Family. This could be a watershed moment for a lot of the public.
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