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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 15:25:49 GMT
Whilst I totally understand what you're saying re Jones, we do also now subsequently know the bloke is certified mental I wouldn't let our bad experience of Jones put us off taking a promising rookie on. Look how Carrick and McKenna are thriving at Boro and Ipsiwch and Maresca seems to have taken to management extremely well also, albeit Leicester's squad is strong for this league. In fact you can add Corberan to the list who came from Leeds u23s and Steve Cooper who came from the England set up. There's enough evidence to suggest that the rookie, new wave of managers is actually the way to go. Rather than relying on the tried and trusted route. We're basing Alex Neil on a promotion he achieved nearly a decade ago, with someone else's squad. Football and the Championship are a lot different to the last time he won promotion out of it. Jones had a very poor support structure and was expected to run the club top to bottom as our managers always have been. The club was in no way suitable in hindsight. The structure is better now I’d probably prefer a different figure to RM and for that role to have more clout but I still think there are more people with a voice that would help a less experienced coach concentrate and focus on where his abilities lay. It’s about learning from your mistakes instead of being traumatised by them. Fully agree mate, we're a lot better set up now (at least I hope) for a rookie nu-wave manager.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 14:46:49 GMT
I shouted Carrick, Maresca & Corberan mate, makes me sick thinking about how we ended up with Neil Hindsight is a wonderful thing. At the time, I just saw Carrick as a massive risk given he had only managed a few caretaker games for Utd. Our squad was a mess and it just seemed too big a job for a newbie. Neil was absolutely nowhere near even my Top 3 preferences, but saying that would Carrick have made a good fist of what he had at the start of last season? Likewise Maresca, his only managerial experience was a failed stint at Parma. Leicester took a bit of a gamble with him, but so far it's paying off. Gambles are just that though, they can go horribly wrong to if the inexperience tells - especially in the cut and thrust of the Championship. Corberan was deffo in my Top 3, but he'd already gone to Olympiacos by the time we sacked MON. Michael Carrick made the play offs with Tommy Smith playing as a right sided centre half and got 30 goals out of Akpom after he'd barely scored that many in his career to date. He'd have been absolutely fine with the squad we had last season.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 14:35:29 GMT
that was one manager, who had experience of the Prem already too. You don't buy the cautious argument? Lambert Rowett Jones MON Neil All play turgid, safety first football. Don't think Jones was a cautious appointment tbf. Just a nutter with good patter. I think the problem is that once he'd been sussed it confirmed that they should never look beyond tried and tested again. Tried and tested doesn't get you promoted though, not anymore. It just gets you mid table mediocrity.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 14:07:08 GMT
Whilst I totally understand what you're saying re Jones, we do also now subsequently know the bloke is certified mental I wouldn't let our bad experience of Jones put us off taking a promising rookie on. Look how Carrick and McKenna are thriving at Boro and Ipsiwch and Maresca seems to have taken to management extremely well also, albeit Leicester's squad is strong for this league. In fact you can add Corberan to the list who came from Leeds u23s and Steve Cooper who came from the England set up. There's enough evidence to suggest that the rookie, new wave of managers is actually the way to go. Rather than relying on the tried and trusted route. We're basing Alex Neil on a promotion he achieved nearly a decade ago, with someone else's squad. Football and the Championship are a lot different to the last time he won promotion out of it. Yeah I agree he is certified mental. And would love a nu-wave manager coming in, but I just can’t help but think that we are not set up to support someone like that. I think we are a very different proposition to manage then most if not all other clubs in the league. I don’t know enough about Boro, but Ipswich and Leicester certainly set up much better behind the scenes then us. I’m sure we spoke about Corberan at the end of the MON reign and it’s beyond mental we went for AN over him. Yeah the Corberan one leaves a very bitter taste in my mouth.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 13:55:36 GMT
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 13:44:38 GMT
I still say AN will get the best out of the team in time for a top 6 punt. The top two places are gone anyway this season. We just can't keep swapping decent managers and need to let thinfs settle down after 5 or 6 years of turbulance starting with Hughes dismantling the heart of the team from Huth onwards so we had no backbone. Let AN rebuild what Pulis took a while to do and dare I say what Alex Ferguson did with Man Utd with a lot more money and talent at his disposal. He was given time lets do the same and have a bit of faith instead of bad mouthing the board, JC & AN etc - that will get us nowhere fast. he's won 18 of his 60 matches in charge, he's lost 15 of his last 26. He's only taking us one way mate and it's definitely not anywhere near the top 6.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 13:43:11 GMT
Didn't we want a foreign bloke as manager at one point in the last 5 years. Some Spanish bloke? ex-Watford manager (not that this will narrow it down any). I thought we were close and the foreign mgr pulled the pin late on? I don't recall much of the details so happy to be corrected. If we did try to sign him doesn't this put to bed that we are xenophobic and risk averse (see mad Nath for a better example). The fact is that the Coates' have admired AN for many years and were happy to push the boat out once they were sure they could get their man. I don't buy the cautious, xenophobic argument. that was one manager, who had experience of the Prem already too. You don't buy the cautious argument? Lambert Rowett Jones MON Neil All play turgid, safety first football.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 13:26:07 GMT
He's worked under some very good managers and like you say has done an ok job with Spurs under difficult circumstances a couple of times now. Was retired injured at a young age so did his badges early, is well regarded within the game as being a top coach and most importantly wants to play an attacking, high press style! I'd imagine it's only a matter of time before someone gives him a go at a full time job. This article in the Athletic is what put him on my radar as a potential manager for us. theathletic.com/4448529/2023/04/26/ryan-mason-tottenham-manager/ I can’t read it but fair enough. Im not sure it’s the right role for a such a green manager. As we saw with Jones who at least had some management experience the role absolutely consumed him. Whilst I totally understand what you're saying re Jones, we do also now subsequently know the bloke is certified mental I wouldn't let our bad experience of Jones put us off taking a promising rookie on. Look how Carrick and McKenna are thriving at Boro and Ipsiwch and Maresca seems to have taken to management extremely well also, albeit Leicester's squad is strong for this league. In fact you can add Corberan to the list who came from Leeds u23s and Steve Cooper who came from the England set up. There's enough evidence to suggest that the rookie, new wave of managers is actually the way to go. Rather than relying on the tried and trusted route. We're basing Alex Neil on a promotion he achieved nearly a decade ago, with someone else's squad. Football and the Championship are a lot different to the last time he won promotion out of it.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 12:58:28 GMT
That's not strictly true is it. Funny how everyone just conveniently forgets he spent £2.75m on his number one striker target, only to lose faith in him by October. All off the back of Collins money. He certainly didn't have 1 million to chuck at a 7th choice 19 year old I like the transfer team in general now. Infact I'd go all in on the moneyball approach and let Dublin have a big say on a coach who does well from an analysis perspective. I don't see the point of being Moneyball in the transfer team, then a dinosaur running it. If your going do it, do it properly That would be my hope now also, we go and get a head coach that first the profile of the players we're signing. I've put my shortlist on the next manager thread.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 12:51:13 GMT
My shortlist as it stands would be:- Ralph Hassenhutl Kevin Muscat Pep Ljinders Ryan Mason Not sure how attainable any of them would be but if you don't ask, you don't get. Mason is a left field shout. Not trying to be cantankerous but anything more then he’s caretaker’d Tottenham a few times and done ok? He's worked under some very good managers and like you say has done an ok job with Spurs under difficult circumstances a couple of times now. Was retired injured at a young age so did his badges early, is well regarded within the game as being a top coach and most importantly wants to play an attacking, high press style! I'd imagine it's only a matter of time before someone gives him a go at a full time job. This article in the Athletic is what put him on my radar as a potential manager for us. theathletic.com/4448529/2023/04/26/ryan-mason-tottenham-manager/
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 11:16:36 GMT
Apologies…who did he sign for £2.75M Think he's on about Mmaee here....... i haven't lost faith in him he's been class when he's been fit Surridge mate, my post was in response to the bit I'd highlighted about MON not spending any money.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 11:15:34 GMT
That's not strictly true is it. Funny how everyone just conveniently forgets he spent £2.75m on his number one striker target, only to lose faith in him by October. Apologies…who did he sign for £2.75M Sam Surridge
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 10:47:11 GMT
My shortlist as it stands would be:- Ralph Hassenhutl Kevin Muscat Pep Ljinders Ryan Mason Not sure how attainable any of them would be but if you don't ask, you don't get. I’m in a toss up between Ljinders and Hassenhutl tbh, that’s my two choices when people ask the famous Stoke question ‘well who the hell would you have instead of “insert current manager” like there are no other managers in world football available to SCFC The last time the question was being asked I said Carrick and remember getting laughed at on the boothen concourse as we stood lamenting being 2-0 down under O’Neil and on the brink. Only problem with those two though are I think RH would need a massive convincing along with a massive wage, and PL won’t leave Liverpool mid season. However he could be turned in the summer as per what Leicester did with their gaffer. I shouted Carrick, Maresca & Corberan mate, makes me sick thinking about how we ended up with Neil
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 10:37:50 GMT
My shortlist as it stands would be:-
Ralph Hassenhutl Kevin Muscat Pep Ljinders Ryan Mason
Not sure how attainable any of them would be but if you don't ask, you don't get.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 6, 2023 9:26:06 GMT
Spending 1 million on Jojic when we didn't rectify half the issues in the squad is one of the most baffling transfers ever. Especially when you consider O'Neil literally couldn't spend a penny for 3 years. The last thing we needed was a million quid winger for the Under 21s when we still didn't have enough strikers, center half's or a good enough keeper to call our own. We should have gone out and purchased the best young keeper we could for 1 million to be a proper number 2 to Travers. That's not strictly true is it. Funny how everyone just conveniently forgets he spent £2.75m on his number one striker target, only to lose faith in him by October.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 16:40:47 GMT
We'll miss a couple of decent chances early on, then we'll have a couple of times where the final ball/pass/decision is crap. We'll run out of ideas after 30 mins and start to lump it long.
Sheff Weds will have their first chance of the game either between 35-45 mins or 55-65 mins, Bonham will make a save and from the resulting corner, Wednesday will score.
That will be that, we'll huff and puff and get the ball in some decent areas without really creating a proper chance or seriously testing their keeper.
Full Time: Stoke 0-1 Sheff Weds
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 14:40:39 GMT
So, so far we've come up with people's defence of the way we're being run as being: 1) Well, we were in the Premiership once so therefore we should just accept how bad we've been for over half a decade since and just deal with it and certainly not criticise anyone and 2) Well, some other clubs are just as bad so just accept it Fuck me, here I was thinking the point of sport was to compete when apparently it's just to accept what you're given, be grateful we even exist and just smile and nod when they pat us on the head. It would appear that the complete and utter lack of ambition of the club to actually progress has really rubbed off on some of the fans, who seem to be lapping up the "just be grateful for what you have" bullshit. I'd hoped we'd got past all the "Well Nige, we're just happy to be playing the likes of Chelsea and Liverpool every week" after the capped one left and "the likes of Chelsea and Liverpool" turned into "The likes of Ipswich and QPR". As I've said repeatedly on a multitude of threads, their take is literally bizarre. It's like they're in a cult.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 14:19:01 GMT
Carsley, Linjnders,Muscat, Hoefkens woudl all be good choices if it was May we are in a relegation battle so think its the wrong time for them Eustace I think I keep asking the question on here and nobody replies because they can't answer it, what's eustace actually done to warrant being mentioned as our next boss? Alex's cv blows him out the water. I'm not convinced by him yet at all, albeit Rooney is doing well to make him look like Pep currently! Chances are though he ends up another middle of the road championship manager like Rowett & Neil.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 13:49:35 GMT
Carsley, Linjnders,Muscat, Hoefkens woudl all be good choices if it was May we are in a relegation battle so think its the wrong time for them Eustace I think I’m in the same camp to be honest. If he’s sacked then we are now in staying up mode. Get an interim in and research the new man ready for the last day of the season. Not going to be pretty by any means, but it hasn’t for 6 years so we are used to it. JC will never employ an interim as it doesn't work with letting the manager have sole control of the club. This is why it will be an out of work jobber like Dean Smith or Steve Bruce.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 13:43:05 GMT
In terms of foreign options, it may be worth copying Sunderland's homework. But in trms of ones known to an English audience, maybe looking at: Beale Bruce Carsley Eustace Hasenhuttl Heckingbottom Jokanovic Lampard Lijnders Marsch Mowbray Muscat Parker Schumacher Smith Terry Tomasson Warnock plus: Rosenior (apparently on the cusp of signing a new long-term deal at Hull within days) Robins (signed a 4-yr deal at Cov a few months ago) Hoefkens (signed a 3-yr deal at Standard Liege a few months ago) Cooper (should he get axed from Forest shortly) Sanchez Flores (out of work since April after being chopped at Getafe) Carsley, Linjnders,Muscat, Hoefkens woudl all be good choices if it was May we are in a relegation battle so think its the wrong time for them Eustace I think There's plenty of the season left, we don't need a fire fighter just yet. We just need a good manager.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 12:40:34 GMT
I wonder what our "managerial succession planning" consists of ? JC nipping down to the pub to have a word with his mate ? Must have a British passport, sets teams up not to lose and has previous promotion on CV.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 12:17:05 GMT
Not a chance in hell he'd leave Ipswich in 2nd to join Stoke in 20th. He's destined for the Prem next season either with Ipswich or with someone already there.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 12:07:05 GMT
Could we get Jon Dahl Tomasson? Blackburn in a mess financially Blackburn in a financial mess and yet some posters want to get rid of the Coates family. Add it to the pile marked Wigan, Bolton and Reading.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 11:11:09 GMT
I've been in pain with my lower back since Saturday, did it lifting the pram up some steps on my own. Stupidly mustn't have bent my knees enough and now I'm walking round hunched over or like I've shat my pants.
Hurts most in the mornings when I get out of bed or if I've sat for a long spell at my desk at work. The best it's felt was when i walked home from work last night.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 7:54:32 GMT
Interestingly Chris Davies the Spurs assistant manager is 7/4 2nd fav behind mad Nath. Was at Swansea over ten years ago with Brendan Rodgers. Ahhh ok, I knew they worked together at Leicester, didn't realise it stretched that far back. Market's won't mean a lot yet anyway, with the Sunderland market being a good example with the betting starting around 5s/6s for Eustace as fav. Definitely think Sunderland will go for someone a bit more left field this time.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 7:44:22 GMT
Interestingly Chris Davies the Spurs assistant manager is 7/4 2nd fav behind mad Nath.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 5, 2023 7:33:23 GMT
I’m reasonably confident that given the rest of the season to work on this Neil and his team will make significant progress. The constant desperation to get rid of managers is frankly tiresome and (as we have demonstrated) non productive. Not a view that’s going to win many friends I know but I think people have to recognise that the difference between success and failure in this league is paper thin. One thing that has been massively missing this season and a few previously is the merest hint of good fortune. Things could turn very quickly if and when a few things start dropping our way. Spot on. I’m far from happy with few end results but I don’t want to see a new manager yet, especially after the overhaul this summer. Pick up a few wins and the mood on here will quickly change. AN is proven at this level and we have done decent business this summer, we are still lacking a few key players, hopefully we can sign Travers in January. You say he's proven at this level but all he has proven is that he's a middle of the road manager. He averages a win % of less than 35%. One promotion from this league with a ready made squad does not count for much. Take that promotion off his CV and his record is worse than Rowett's.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 4, 2023 21:00:43 GMT
Swansea have sacked Duff. New manager bounce right in time for Stoke. We’re going to lose these two home games aren’t we and that should be that
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 4, 2023 15:46:22 GMT
Nathan Jones pulled out at the last minute of becoming the new Rotherham manager John Coates probably saw that he got Luton to the play offs after going back and think's why can't he do that here
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 4, 2023 15:37:25 GMT
Brentford, Bournemouth, Fulham, Burnley, Wolves, Forest, Ipswich, Sunderland to name a few. I must have missed the 10 years they have all spent in the Prem. You want to risk the very existence of our club just to be like one of those. In life, the only 2 certainties are death and taxes. A 3rd near certainty is the continued existence of SCFC so long as the Coates family own us. How long will you dine out on the 10 years in the Prem for? We've been out of it for six now with no sign of getting back there any time soon. Christ, we don't even look like getting near to a top ten finish in this league let alone get promoted. Sunderland reached the play offs in their first season back at this level after being in League One, Ipswich may very well go up automatically. You keep on happy clapping because we were in the Prem for a while, over half a decade ago
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