hotpot
Youth Player
Posts: 439
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Post by hotpot on Sept 19, 2024 7:04:00 GMT
A coupla of cigars and tequilas with Pep and maybe Narks can snag a few new players from an overloaded Man City. I say this, because of the poor team performance against Fleetwood. Except for Sidibe and Tezgel, the rest seemed pretty ordinary.
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Post by wuzza on Sept 19, 2024 7:22:19 GMT
It is a gamble but I don’t think it’s a blind panic. Let’s be honest we could have just trundled on with SS and probably finished a place or two higher in the league. Nothing to panic about there - easy life for all concerned. It doesn’t seem very well planned though, does it ? It was only a few short months ago that John Coates was telling us that SS was the main reason for supporters to have hope in the future! Decisions made in haste often are wrong ones but football is a funny game, it might work out 🤷♂️ if I was a betting man I’d say it won’t but my opinion is coloured by the fact Stoke seem absolutely incapable of appointing a competent manager/head coach. I would guess it’s been in the planning for a fair old while - the world of football is totally Machiavellian. SJW as a football man has probably watched SS at work for a while and rightly or wrongly doesn’t believe he’s the real deal to progress things significantly. With regard the change being a success only a mad man would expect it to be looking at our record ...... but we all have to be slightly mad following this lot. |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 19, 2024 7:32:45 GMT
It doesn’t seem very well planned though, does it ? It was only a few short months ago that John Coates was telling us that SS was the main reason for supporters to have hope in the future! Decisions made in haste often are wrong ones but football is a funny game, it might work out 🤷♂️ if I was a betting man I’d say it won’t but my opinion is coloured by the fact Stoke seem absolutely incapable of appointing a competent manager/head coach. I would guess it’s been in the planning for a fair old while - the world of football is totally Machiavellian. SJW as a football man has probably watched SS at work for a while and rightly or wrongly doesn’t believe he’s the real deal to progress things significantly. With regard the change being a success only a mad man would expect it to be looking at our record ...... but we all have to be slightly mad following this lot. Why would anyone plan to sack their Head Coach 5 games into a season? It would also be mad to sack him on a whim after a few poor performances so personally I hope something did kick off behind the scenes that made the sacking inevitable because the alternative explanations are far worse in terms of decision making. |
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Post by hotterpotter on Sept 19, 2024 7:42:11 GMT
I like the cut of his jib.
Exciting times ahead whatever your point of view 🙂
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Post by noustie on Sept 19, 2024 7:44:40 GMT
Speaking’s speaking - Doing’s doing
Let’s wait and see
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Post by onepara on Sept 19, 2024 7:48:12 GMT
Get behind the new manager or fuck off up the Vale. So much negativity on here it’s ridiculous It's hard to believe isn't it. Astounding really It's like someone on here has said. Typical of Stoke-on-Trent people, beaten before they start. No aspiration. Settle for what you've got. You'd think that they were still digging coal out, & thankful for it. Walking around with a cloud over their heads. When something good happens, all that you hear from most of them is "Oh my god, it won't work, it's doomed to failure". |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 19, 2024 7:52:08 GMT
It doesn’t seem very well planned though, does it ? It was only a few short months ago that John Coates was telling us that SS was the main reason for supporters to have hope in the future! Decisions made in haste often are wrong ones but football is a funny game, it might work out 🤷♂️ if I was a betting man I’d say it won’t but my opinion is coloured by the fact Stoke seem absolutely incapable of appointing a competent manager/head coach. I would guess it’s been in the planning for a fair old while - the world of football is totally Machiavellian. SJW as a football man has probably watched SS at work for a while and rightly or wrongly doesn’t believe he’s the real deal to progress things significantly. With regard the change being a success only a mad man would expect it to be looking at our record ...... but we all have to be slightly mad following this lot. 100%. Its how it works. Walters didn't fancy him from the outset in my opinion. So was viewing him through very critical eyes waiting for opportunities to confirm his opinion. Walters will also have wanted his own HC in there which will have made it hard for Schumacher to get anything right. So what bothers me is knowing Walters has effectively been hamstringing our own head coach with a medium term plan for him to be replaced. Walters problem is he's mistimed the firing to the point its obvious to all but the blind that it was intended and wanted. Walters has lost a lot of face with this duplicity. And should this manoeuvre back fire I will expect him to be packing his bags as well. My bigger concern is that even of it does fail he's got JC so brainwashed that he's allowed to just make another mad signing. Let's hope Pelach hits the ground running and turns out to be brilliant and slowly over time we can forget about how poorly Walters has dealt with this. |
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Post by onepara on Sept 19, 2024 7:54:43 GMT
I would guess it’s been in the planning for a fair old while - the world of football is totally Machiavellian. SJW as a football man has probably watched SS at work for a while and rightly or wrongly doesn’t believe he’s the real deal to progress things significantly. With regard the change being a success only a mad man would expect it to be looking at our record ...... but we all have to be slightly mad following this lot. 100%. Its how it works. Walters didn't fancy him from the outset in my opinion. So was viewing him through very critical eyes waiting for opportunities to confirm his opinion. Walters will also have wanted his own HC in there which will have made it hard for Schumacher to get anything right. So what bothers me is knowing Walters has effectively been hamstringing our own head coach with a medium term plan for him to be replaced. Walters problem is he's mistimed the firing to the point its obvious to all but the blind that it was intended and wanted. Walters has lost a lot of face with this duplicity. And should this manoeuvre back fire I will expect him to be packing his bags as well. My bigger concern is that even of it does fail he's got JC so brainwashed that he's allowed to just make another mad signing. Let's hope Pelach hits the ground running and turns out to be brilliant and slowly over time we can forget about how poorly Walters has dealt with this. There's a lot of supposition in there, don't you think? |
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Post by jhtstokie on Sept 19, 2024 7:57:55 GMT
Speaking’s speaking - Doing’s doing Let’s wait and see Exactly. Most of the previous managers talked well but didn’t do it, fingers crossed he does it👍 |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 19, 2024 8:01:51 GMT
100%. Its how it works. Walters didn't fancy him from the outset in my opinion. So was viewing him through very critical eyes waiting for opportunities to confirm his opinion. Walters will also have wanted his own HC in there which will have made it hard for Schumacher to get anything right. So what bothers me is knowing Walters has effectively been hamstringing our own head coach with a medium term plan for him to be replaced. Walters problem is he's mistimed the firing to the point its obvious to all but the blind that it was intended and wanted. Walters has lost a lot of face with this duplicity. And should this manoeuvre back fire I will expect him to be packing his bags as well. My bigger concern is that even of it does fail he's got JC so brainwashed that he's allowed to just make another mad signing. Let's hope Pelach hits the ground running and turns out to be brilliant and slowly over time we can forget about how poorly Walters has dealt with this. There's a lot of supposition in there, don't you think? Not really. Managers come in and dont fancy players. Put their own in all the time. Leave them on the bench, don't praise them in training etc etc. Its all about opinions after all. No different in a DOF and HC relationship. Walters wanted his pick and was viewing Schumacher quite harshly. Its pretty obvious from the fact we'd won 7 of the last 10 competitive games. Agreed we weren't that impressive overall on those 10 games. But there wasn't black and white type evidence for a sacking. Awful optics and poorly managed by Walters because he was so eager to get him out the door for his new man to come in. I don't think I'm far off the mark with that. Schumacher calling him a wanker possibly knocked the last nail in his own coffin 😆 |
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Post by premieraj on Sept 19, 2024 8:04:07 GMT
100%. Its how it works. Walters didn't fancy him from the outset in my opinion. So was viewing him through very critical eyes waiting for opportunities to confirm his opinion. Walters will also have wanted his own HC in there which will have made it hard for Schumacher to get anything right. So what bothers me is knowing Walters has effectively been hamstringing our own head coach with a medium term plan for him to be replaced. Walters problem is he's mistimed the firing to the point its obvious to all but the blind that it was intended and wanted. Walters has lost a lot of face with this duplicity. And should this manoeuvre back fire I will expect him to be packing his bags as well. My bigger concern is that even of it does fail he's got JC so brainwashed that he's allowed to just make another mad signing. Let's hope Pelach hits the ground running and turns out to be brilliant and slowly over time we can forget about how poorly Walters has dealt with this. There's a lot of supposition in there, don't you think? And the supposition turned to fact lol 😂 |
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Post by wakeypotter on Sept 19, 2024 8:12:01 GMT
Get behind the new manager or fuck off up the Vale. So much negativity on here it’s ridiculous It's hard to believe isn't it. Astounding really I really like coming on this board for a lot of reasons but god some have hit a new low in my eyes sometimes it’s been unbelievable. |
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Post by drippinggoatsnob on Sept 19, 2024 8:13:48 GMT
I've got a Basque mate who said Ch in Spanish is a Tch sound. Also there is a stress on the e. Chichurito Churos Pelatch Is it different in Catalan? I don't think so but with the Cat fan saying Pelack who knows. My friends speak Cat too. |
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Post by misterj on Sept 19, 2024 8:14:13 GMT
You want a manager who galvanises and inspires the players, and has no favourites so whoever is playing badly is benched. If this happens everything falls into place and the fans will get on board. Plenty of ppl on here moaning about Mmaee, Laurent, Johnson etc so what has SJW done? Got rid ….. yes it’s ruthless but we prob need a bit of stability now, I’m predicting a top half finish
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 19, 2024 8:18:42 GMT
There's a lot of supposition in there, don't you think? And the supposition turned to fact lol 😂 And you suppose none of that is true and have your own supposition on the matter in line with Walters HR scripted official announcement. Seems we can all suppose. I've been sacked plenty of times. I know the script. But its really not a stretch to believe Walters was just never keen on Schumacher and wanted his own man. It really isn't. It happens all the time in all industries every day everywhere. |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 19, 2024 8:19:16 GMT
There's a lot of supposition in there, don't you think? Not really. Managers come in and dont fancy players. Put their own in all the time. Leave them on the bench, don't praise them in training etc etc. Its all about opinions after all. No different in a DOF and HC relationship. Walters wanted his pick and was viewing Schumacher quite harshly. Its pretty obvious from the fact we'd won 7 of the last 10 competitive games. Agreed we weren't that impressive overall on those 10 games. But there wasn't black and white type evidence for a sacking. Awful optics and poorly managed by Walters because he was so eager to get him out the door for his new man to come in. I don't think I'm far off the mark with that. Schumacher calling him a wanker possibly knocked the last nail in his own coffin 😆 Well yes really. You have described a scenario that might have happened but you are leaping from "might have happened" to "this is how it happened" without offering a shred of evidence. As the man said - you are presenting pure supposition as fact. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 19, 2024 8:24:54 GMT
Not really. Managers come in and dont fancy players. Put their own in all the time. Leave them on the bench, don't praise them in training etc etc. Its all about opinions after all. No different in a DOF and HC relationship. Walters wanted his pick and was viewing Schumacher quite harshly. Its pretty obvious from the fact we'd won 7 of the last 10 competitive games. Agreed we weren't that impressive overall on those 10 games. But there wasn't black and white type evidence for a sacking. Awful optics and poorly managed by Walters because he was so eager to get him out the door for his new man to come in. I don't think I'm far off the mark with that. Schumacher calling him a wanker possibly knocked the last nail in his own coffin 😆 Well yes really. You have described a scenario that might have happened but you are leaping from "might have happened" to "this is how it happened" without offering a shred of evidence. As the man said - you are presenting pure supposition as fact. That's fair. But the evidence is pretty compelling when you look at a manager with a 70% win rate in his last 10 games getting sacked. I'm still waiting for someone to give me a recent example where a manager in this league has been canned off the back of that kind of record. Supposition it is indeed, but there's something to it.......in my opinion 😉 |
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Post by GeneralFaye on Sept 19, 2024 8:27:06 GMT
I'm not against the new gaffer at all, I'm well behind him and wish him the best. However, why do people get swayed so much by the post appointment interviews? We've had some shocking managers who came across well in these, it literally means nothing.
It's all about on the pitch, I'm done with words.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Sept 19, 2024 8:46:08 GMT
Well yes really. You have described a scenario that might have happened but you are leaping from "might have happened" to "this is how it happened" without offering a shred of evidence. As the man said - you are presenting pure supposition as fact. That's fair. But the evidence is pretty compelling when you look at a manager with a 70% win rate in his last 10 games getting sacked. I'm still waiting for someone to give me a recent example where a manager in this league has been canned off the back of that kind of record. Supposition it is indeed, but there's something to it.......in my opinion 😉 I think when discussing managers there should be some rules set on here as it gets very confusing (this is in no way aimed at you by the way fella). Should the crossover between season be taken into account? Should cup games be counted? I only mention this as I remember the MON debate when several posters said his decent cup stats needed to be discounted for example. Anyway, there’s a couple of ways of looking at it. One is 7 wins and 3 defeats from 10 as you say. Another is 2 dead rubber wins at the end of last season and a couple of Mickey Mouse cup wins and 3 defeats from 5 in the league to date. My two penneth without knowing what may or may not have gone on behind close doors is that the Watford and Oxford defeats (as well as the 2nd half v West Brom) would have set alarm bells ringing due to the nature of the performances…… |
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Post by wakeypotter on Sept 19, 2024 8:50:56 GMT
And the supposition turned to fact lol 😂 And you suppose none of that is true and have your own supposition on the matter in line with Walters HR scripted official announcement. Seems we can all suppose. I've been sacked plenty of times. I know the script. But it’s really not a stretch to believe Walters was just never keen on Schumacher and wanted his own man. It really isn't. It happens all the time in all industries every day everywhere. We can all see you have a hatred for JW but what if it ends up where he’s done the right thing for the club going forward. How do you know it wasn’t shumacher who didn’t like Walters and make things difficult between them both. Just to add I don’t know either way |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 19, 2024 8:55:04 GMT
That's fair. But the evidence is pretty compelling when you look at a manager with a 70% win rate in his last 10 games getting sacked. I'm still waiting for someone to give me a recent example where a manager in this league has been canned off the back of that kind of record. Supposition it is indeed, but there's something to it.......in my opinion 😉 I think when discussing managers there should be some rules set on here as it gets very confusing (this is in no way aimed at you by the way fella). Should the crossover between season be taken into account? Should cup games be counted? I only mention this as I remember the MON debate when several posters said his decent cup stats needed to be discounted for example. Anyway, there’s a couple of ways of looking at it. One is 7 wins and 3 defeats from 10 as you say. Another is 2 dead rubber wins at the end of last season and a couple of Mickey Mouse cup wins and 3 defeats from 5 in the league to date. My two penneth without knowing what may or may not have gone on behind close doors is that the Watford and Oxford defeats (as well as the 2nd half v West Brom) would have set alarm bells ringing due to the nature of the performances…… Get your point. But as I've said to others making a similar point, 5 league games isn't a fair metric to judge anyone. But either way what's done is done. We've a new guy in now and we all should back him. And if he does well I'll slowly forget what a snake I(personally) think Walters is from my own suppositions. All said and done all us fans want is to see some decent footy on a Saturday afternoon and maybe the chance to dream about better things. |
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Post by vidigoals on Sept 19, 2024 8:56:07 GMT
I would guess it’s been in the planning for a fair old while - the world of football is totally Machiavellian. SJW as a football man has probably watched SS at work for a while and rightly or wrongly doesn’t believe he’s the real deal to progress things significantly. With regard the change being a success only a mad man would expect it to be looking at our record ...... but we all have to be slightly mad following this lot. 100%. Its how it works. Walters didn't fancy him from the outset in my opinion. So was viewing him through very critical eyes waiting for opportunities to confirm his opinion. Walters will also have wanted his own HC in there which will have made it hard for Schumacher to get anything right. So what bothers me is knowing Walters has effectively been hamstringing our own head coach with a medium term plan for him to be replaced. Walters problem is he's mistimed the firing to the point its obvious to all but the blind that it was intended and wanted. Walters has lost a lot of face with this duplicity. And should this manoeuvre back fire I will expect him to be packing his bags as well. My bigger concern is that even of it does fail he's got JC so brainwashed that he's allowed to just make another mad signing. Let's hope Pelach hits the ground running and turns out to be brilliant and slowly over time we can forget about how poorly Walters has dealt with this. If Pelach does hit the ground running and is brilliant then there would be no need to forget how poorly it's been dealt with, because it won't have been poor, it will have been right. |
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Post by silsdenstokie on Sept 19, 2024 8:58:56 GMT
100%. Its how it works. Walters didn't fancy him from the outset in my opinion. So was viewing him through very critical eyes waiting for opportunities to confirm his opinion. Walters will also have wanted his own HC in there which will have made it hard for Schumacher to get anything right. So what bothers me is knowing Walters has effectively been hamstringing our own head coach with a medium term plan for him to be replaced. Walters problem is he's mistimed the firing to the point its obvious to all but the blind that it was intended and wanted. Walters has lost a lot of face with this duplicity. And should this manoeuvre back fire I will expect him to be packing his bags as well. My bigger concern is that even of it does fail he's got JC so brainwashed that he's allowed to just make another mad signing. Let's hope Pelach hits the ground running and turns out to be brilliant and slowly over time we can forget about how poorly Walters has dealt with this. If Pelach does hit the ground running and is brilliant then there would be no need to forget how poorly it's been dealt with, because it won't have been poor, it will have been right. Very true By all means slate him if it goes tits up, but by the same token give the man due credit if it works out |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 19, 2024 8:59:23 GMT
Well yes really. You have described a scenario that might have happened but you are leaping from "might have happened" to "this is how it happened" without offering a shred of evidence. As the man said - you are presenting pure supposition as fact. That's fair. But the evidence is pretty compelling when you look at a manager with a 70% win rate in his last 10 games getting sacked. I'm still waiting for someone to give me a recent example where a manager in this league has been canned off the back of that kind of record. Supposition it is indeed, but there's something to it.......in my opinion 😉 Another poster suggested there was a bust up between Walters and Schumacher 3 weeks ago and they haven't spoken since and then there was a bust up in the dressing room with the players at half time in the Oxford game and Schumacher didn't return on the team coach. I've no idea whether that actually happened but if it did that would explain what happened to a tee. You are clearly jumping to conclusions based on your opinion of Walters. As an opinion that's fine but presenting it as fact or even the most likely explanation simply doesn't stack up. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 19, 2024 9:01:04 GMT
And you suppose none of that is true and have your own supposition on the matter in line with Walters HR scripted official announcement. Seems we can all suppose. I've been sacked plenty of times. I know the script. But it’s really not a stretch to believe Walters was just never keen on Schumacher and wanted his own man. It really isn't. It happens all the time in all industries every day everywhere. We can all see you have a hatred for JW but what if it ends up where he’s done the right thing for the club going forward. How do you know it wasn’t shumacher who didn’t like Walters and make things difficult between them both. Just to add I don’t know either way Aye, we obviously don't know. I'm just looking at time lines and how events unfolded and where the power lies. If its a genius move and we succeed I'm happy of course and as I've said I'll begin to forget what I personally think was an engineered move by Walters. Until I hear a full account to the contrary it is what I'll be thinking. I might be being unfair but I guess that's how bias etc works. So in a way I'm kind of doing exactly what I'm accusing Walters of. We're all hypocrites at some point 😆 |
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Post by suck_the_mop. on Sept 19, 2024 9:02:58 GMT
I said on another thread that was locked that the way he speaks he is full of self confidence and talking about the things he wants to do and implement, the players will either run through brick walls for him or down tools, I think we will find out pretty quickly imho, I hope he succeeds it would be nice.
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Post by silsdenstokie on Sept 19, 2024 9:04:17 GMT
I dont agree with the decision taken this week but sone of the shit getting thrown at JW is way over the top IMO
As Ive said on another thread theres 2 DOFs that schu clearly coukdnt work with
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Post by clarkeda on Sept 19, 2024 9:05:47 GMT
What’s the thinking on where we need to finnish to keep his job (surely we can’t sack another one) are we looking at mid table as a minimum? Or are JW and JC expecting playoffs Has to be top half doesn’t it? |
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Post by clarkeda on Sept 19, 2024 9:06:53 GMT
30 min interview now on youtube I challenge anyone to watch that & not fall in love with the bloke. We're going piss this league! Something I couldn't help thinking while watching it is just what a monumental change we've seen at the club. Could you imagine if two years ago I sat here & told you that in two years time we'd be running the club with a DoF model, we'd have players from the Netherlands, France, South Korea & Japan, a shed load of exciting youngsters in the team from both Premier League loans & our own academy, and our manager would be a 36 year old bloke from Spain?! You'd have laughed me out the building as a mental case, yet here we are! My concern is it’s another MASSIVE lurch in culture and style. |
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Post by spitthedog on Sept 19, 2024 9:09:55 GMT
I would guess it’s been in the planning for a fair old while - the world of football is totally Machiavellian. SJW as a football man has probably watched SS at work for a while and rightly or wrongly doesn’t believe he’s the real deal to progress things significantly. With regard the change being a success only a mad man would expect it to be looking at our record ...... but we all have to be slightly mad following this lot. Why would anyone plan to sack their Head Coach 5 games into a season? It would also be mad to sack him on a whim after a few poor performances so personally I hope something did kick off behind the scenes that made the sacking inevitable because the alternative explanations are far worse in terms of decision making. I think I’m right in saying 7 or 8 Championship clubs had sacked their managers by the beginning of October last a few seasons back. |
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