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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 22, 2024 21:35:57 GMT
Mate, it is waaay more effective if you post the actual image, rather than simply a line of html. Indeed, it's pretty arrogant, to expect people to have to open a link, just to see a piss poor image that's been used many tines before ... I’m really disappointed in you Cobs One of the most pathetic things I’ve read in a long while😊infact embarrassing from a grown man Send him to his room,ground him for a few days FFS I'm dissapointed in him because ordinarily I think he's a cracking poster. Nowt wrong with that. He's set a high bar to be fair but on this occasion I thought he let himself down a bit. Obviously, the same can't be said of the present company but I'm sure the feeling is mutual.
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Post by desman2 on Jul 22, 2024 21:36:45 GMT
Can you highlight who's posters words make them racist ? Surely people know if they are racists without me pointing it out? Gaslighting at it's finest
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jul 22, 2024 21:37:04 GMT
I’m really disappointed in you Cobs One of the most pathetic things I’ve read in a long while😊infact embarrassing from a grown man Send him to his room,ground him for a few days FFS I'm dissapointed in him because ordinarily I think he's a cracking poster. Nowt wrong with that. He's set a high bar to be fair but on this occasion I thought he let himself down a bit. Obviously, the same can't be said of the present company but I'm sure the feeling is mutual. It sure is😊
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jul 22, 2024 21:40:38 GMT
. Myself I grew up in Fenton, and attended two schools which had mixed classes, native English, Polish, Romanian, Pakistani and African, so I was exposed to different cultures, different ways of life and behaviours from a relatively formative age, my parents did their best to prepare me for this but I don’t think they could possibly have foreseen me and my best mate being chased for being on a street that apparently “belonged” to the Pakistani kids who were in year 11 at the time, we were fresh faced 11 year olds in year 7 who simply wanted to get home withoutany fuss, which shouldn’t have been an issue in Longton as a native but evidently it was, or they couldn’t possibly have foreseen another friend of mine being ragged off his bike in Fenton by Romanians when he was 13, he had a knife pulled on him and everything, we just weren’t exposed to this way of life as kids because that’s not how we live. This also happened to me growing up in Chesterton. If you were from Waterhayes Village (the new build estate at the time) and you walked through Crackley, you'd get a smack in the mouth. Not by some evil foreign invader, but by a British born reprobate who'd decided you deserved it because you had a garden rather than a yard. Some humans are dickheads, irrespective of their nationality. I also had a knife pulled on me by a British born Jehovah's Witness for questioning why he claimed to have had sex before marriage. In my 39 years on this planet, I've had more bad encounters with British morons than foreign born ones (in both absolute and percentage terms). You will do, the country is made up of 82% white British
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Post by chamberlain on Jul 22, 2024 21:43:38 GMT
This also happened to me growing up in Chesterton. If you were from Waterhayes Village (the new build estate at the time) and you walked through Crackley, you'd get a smack in the mouth. Not by some evil foreign invader, but by a British born reprobate who'd decided you deserved it because you had a garden rather than a yard. Some humans are dickheads, irrespective of their nationality. I also had a knife pulled on me by a British born Jehovah's Witness for questioning why he claimed to have had sex before marriage. In my 39 years on this planet, I've had more bad encounters with British morons than foreign born ones (in both absolute and percentage terms). You will do, the country is made up of 82% white British But changing rapidly
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 22, 2024 21:55:36 GMT
Starkiller 2 RWB 0 Really dissapointed in you with this type of post Cobs. I thought you were one of the more sensible ones. I know that there's a regular cabal of you lot, each egging each other on via PM but you are the ones who regularly accuse (wrongly imo) other people of posting to point score, yet here you are celebrating that very fact, as if it's some sort of perverted sport. People have different opinions, that is all. Oh Paul it was just a joke nothing meant by it though Starkillers post was a good one in my opinion. To be fair I don’t really agree with much of what RWB says but to his credit he’s quite a good sport and does a fair amount of winding up himself so I thought he could handle a bit of banter. No malice intended and with all the brown stuff flying around it was meant in a lighthearted manner and in some ways a doft of the cap to RWB as I know he can take it as well as dish it out. In relation to egging people on I never ever talk to Cranny, Badger or Foster outside the main room as I’m sure they’ll confirm. I appreciate the “sensible” comment though as my wife often refers to me as a big kid. I’ll tell her she’s got it wrong all these years and put her your way so you can have a debate with her On a serious note this is the unfortunate issue with social media you can’t always tell the true meaning of what’s meant when it’s typed. edit a “cracking poster” cheers for that.
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Post by Kpsje on Jul 22, 2024 22:01:45 GMT
If that is the conclusion, and since the UK, and England specifically, is one of the most diverse and welcoming countries in the world, what does that say about other countries and people? In fact, it's an absolute damning indictment on the rest of the world. You know what people are sick of the most in this country? They are absolutely sick of being told what utter shit people they are by those that scramble over each other in a race to proclaim themselves 'on message'. Who jump on any discussion of race, immigration, and those who mention it as the new Hitler. It's no wonder that some people attach themselves to profile figures who don't care what they are called. And therefore little sensible discussion can ever take place. Flick through TV channels in most countries and regions in the world and you will not see any other race than the indigenous. And neither will you see self-loathing discussions about how terrible they are, or inviting a white immigrant to tell them how terrible it is to live there, and questioning why there isn't more white representation. Most of the world doesn't give a fuck and would simply laugh at phrases like 'institutional racism'. Indigenous bias is to be expected in a country. That's why it's, well, ... a country in the first place. And when I am a guest in another country, that's exactly what I expect. Numbers in a community does have an effect. And you know what, different cultures, and ideologies, have an effect too. Which is why most of the world doesn't do what the UK does. So if you want to preach at people about their 'unwillingness to accept' how shit they are, then maybe the UK isn't your best target. Because no matter how bad you think the people of this country are, in general they are better than most of the rest of the world at the issues you are concerned with. Including the countries we welcome people from. Starkiller 2 RWB 0 really disappointed in you with this type of post, cobs. this is a football forum ffs! (smiley face)
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Post by gawa on Jul 22, 2024 22:41:04 GMT
Posting race hate is not "expressing an opinion" mate. It's divisive and dangerous and needs challenging every time it appears. I agree they there should be no place for hate anywhere. But how actually do the working classes raise concerns, when these concerns have been glossed over for decades?
The working classes and the poor are the ones most affected by mass influx, with a direct impact on services, housing, jobs, healthcare, environment, traffic, pollution, social cohesion, crime, and even access to foodbanks. The middle and above classes are rarely impacted, and I don't mean cuisine at fancy restaurants, and service at swanky hotels. Things that the poorest have little use for. It's a case of blame the immigration, not the immigrants (unless the behaviour warrants it of course). No-one dare put a number on it, but that has to be done. How many per year - one million, two million, 500,000? What should be the number? How many can this country sustain? 80 million, 100 million, 150 million? Where do they go? What does it do to the quality of life, especially for those who have little quality of life? How does it impact those things mentioned - services, housing, healthcare, jobs, environment, traffic, pollution, crime, and social cohesion? Of course there is far more to it than just immigration, but it does play a part. Again, what is the number? What should the burden be on the taxpayer, especially when you consider the number of recent immigrants out of work, and even more telling, the number that have never even worked in the UK? And who can blame them if they don't need to? Again, this is the fault of immigration policy. Very few other countries have such liberal policies of immigration. You are usually required to have job and private healthcare, and if illegal then detained and removed. Is most of the world far right and racist? If so, then we should be even more concerned about who we are welcoming to these shores?Was the Tory 'far right' government right to bring in over a million per year? What number should it be, and when should we consider England specifically to be full? And how exactly are the voiceless working classes meant to have the discussion about the impacts on their country and neighbourhoods, without being labelled the usual? I think peoples assemblies are the direction which we need to move towards to give working class people, and other classes too, a voice. A form of direct democracy where the decisions made by local MPs are based on the feelings from local people given their voices at assemblies. A more grass roots bottom up form of politics where policy is driven from the bottom up rather than the other way round. To be fair 95% (based on a 2019 stat may be different now) of our immigrants are legal immigrants who meet the visa requirements set be government. Even if we sorted the 5% which are asylum seekers/illegal immigrants, the 95% cause most of the issues in terms of extra demand on housing and services. Who benefits from it though? Cheaper Labour - business owners. Higher rent due to demand = landlords. Failing public services due to demand = the private sector whether that be health, housing, energy or other. Legal immigrants make the wealthiest wealthier, they're the gift who keep on giving. I'm not even sure I'd say our policies are necessarily more or less liberal than other countries. Italy has what some would call a "further right" government and their immigration has went up. Macron is right of centre (in my opinion) and their immigration has went up. Is there any examples of leaders in todays modern world who have reduced immigration marginally? And has the quality of life improved for residents after doing so? Ending Immigration is waved around as the magic pill which will fix all our problems but the very people who promise it time and time again tend to keep increasing it when in power. I'm of the mind now it's a distraction personally. I don't doubt it's a problem - it is. But a bigger problem are those who enable it and exploit it for the benefit of the wealthiest while leaving the working class to fight with the immigrants over the crumbs. Your last point I bolded I agree with completely. For far too long we throw around the "racist" label when it comes to immigration which I feel is counter-intuitive as it silences discussion and creates division. I think it suits the political class for this to happen because the less progressive discussion the better. As long as people are divided and not looking at the elite then they feel they're doing their job. Keep the peasants fighting each other. It's not just immigration where it happens either in my opinion. We have many single issue groups nowadays whether it's LGBT, feminists, climate activists or whatever else. And through those come the transphobic, homophobic, misogynist, climate change denier and the many more labels which these groups can attach to others to silence discussion. Then of course through immigration you have your muslims, sikhs, jews, albanians, romanians, polish and whatever else of which some of them are very much focused on single issues and you become islamaphobic or antisemetic or whatever else. The only unity you'll find is at the very top of society where they're very happy to shaft the rest of us and keep us divided and distracted fighting amongst eachother. And this is where many of us fall down by listening to those born into privileged cushty lifestyles telling us our problems are everyone's fault bar their property tycoon mates making a killing who worked hard by spunking their inheritance on a load of properties which they then paid a property management company to look after with their profits. The part that gets me is the grovelling to them and that really winds me up. "BUT THEY'LL TAKE ALL OUR JOBS AWAY AND LEAVE IF WE RAISE TAXES". What taxes made James Dyson move most of his production away? The richest people in society are the least loyal and least patriotic you will find. While Netanyahu is enlisting Israelis into mandatory military service his son is tanning himself in Miami. Where was Donald Trump during Vietnam? Draft dodging. Where was Joe Biden? Draft dodging. Where was Churchills son during WW2, sent to the arsehole of nowhere similar to the type of military service our "prince's" do. The elite will be the first to employ an immigrant if it makes them money. They'll be the first to bribe their way out of dodging drafts for any wars. Those who do fight will be given the safest tours and come back most decorated with medals. They'll be the first to get citizenship for another country if it benefits them. They'll be the first swanning off to any tax haven to pay as little as possible to the state. They're the real enemy.
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Post by henry on Jul 23, 2024 6:08:18 GMT
These lefties don’t have much of a sense of humour. Is that what watching Stewart Lee does to you?
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 23, 2024 6:56:30 GMT
Blimey, is this still going?
It's gone on longer than the civil war in Leeds itself 😂
Have we concluded that it's always the foreigners who are at the root of society's problems, yet? I mean, there are plenty of fairly recent examples from history where such an approach hasn't ended well and it was nearly always an entirely separate actual root cause (usually economic) but, you know, those bloody foreigners, eh...
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Post by emretezzy on Jul 23, 2024 7:35:37 GMT
Do you not see the irony in left leaning Posters generalising a large part of the population under one large racist banner. The hyporicacy of some posts on this thread is beyond laughable. Large part of the population or just a few on a Stoke messageboard. Get a grip...... Go read above.
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Post by emretezzy on Jul 23, 2024 7:36:34 GMT
Blimey, is this still going? It's gone on longer than the civil war in Leeds itself 😂 Have we concluded that it's always the foreigners who are at the root of society's problems, yet? I mean, there are plenty of fairly recent examples from history where such an approach hasn't ended well and it was nearly always an entirely separate actual root cause (usually economic) but, you know, those bloody foreigners, eh... No the riots were in fact the fault of mass racism according to you and you polls! Whistle...
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Post by str8outtahampton on Jul 23, 2024 7:44:57 GMT
These lefties don’t have much of a sense of humour. Is that what watching Stewart Lee does to you? Very true. There are barely any "leftie" professional comedians. On the other hand we have those from the "right" coming out of our ears. Geoff Norcutt is one, I think he's been on Live at the Apollo. Then there's Jim "nick-nick" Davidson - he's an absolute scream. Is Bernard Manning still with us? I genuinely don't know. The list is endless.
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Post by andystokey on Jul 23, 2024 7:50:21 GMT
I'm not on Twitter for a reason but it's now impossible to avoid it's surrogate sites like this. I think this site would be so much healthier if embedding X wasn't allowed on both sides. Retweeting anything from various no marks on both sides is just annoying. I think it's time for a rest from here Twitter lite isnt what I want, which is a shame.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 23, 2024 8:47:30 GMT
Blimey, is this still going? It's gone on longer than the civil war in Leeds itself 😂 Have we concluded that it's always the foreigners who are at the root of society's problems, yet? I mean, there are plenty of fairly recent examples from history where such an approach hasn't ended well and it was nearly always an entirely separate actual root cause (usually economic) but, you know, those bloody foreigners, eh... No the riots were in fact the fault of mass racism according to you and you polls! Whistle... Said nobody, ever...😂
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 23, 2024 8:59:35 GMT
Given that the survey was carried out on behalf of BSA, it was done on a representative basis and will therefore have been overwhelmingly white (about 86% given the demographic at the time). So, while it is fair to say that other ethnicities will have been included in the survey and may well have described themselves as prejudiced, it's also entirely legitimate to conclude that because the representative sample of 2000 was 86% white, the majority of pejudice will have been towards, as I said, those not in the "white/"Christian"/straight" section of society. It surprises me that so many people on here seem so unwilling to accept this, especially when there are so many examples of both individual and institutional racism in this country over many years. I think it's probably just denial and a simple unwillingness to accept a fairly obvious truth, that a decent number of people don't like others who don't conform to their group ideals. If that is the conclusion, and since the UK, and England specifically, is one of the most diverse and welcoming countries in the world, what does that say about other countries and people? In fact, it's an absolute damning indictment on the rest of the world. You know what people are sick of the most in this country? They are absolutely sick of being told what utter shit people they are by those that scramble over each other in a race to proclaim themselves 'on message'. Who jump on any discussion of race, immigration, and those who mention it as the new Hitler. It's no wonder that some people attach themselves to profile figures who don't care what they are called. And therefore little sensible discussion can ever take place. Flick through TV channels in most countries and regions in the world and you will not see any other race than the indigenous. And neither will you see self-loathing discussions about how terrible they are, or inviting a white immigrant to tell them how terrible it is to live there, and questioning why there isn't more white representation. Most of the world doesn't give a fuck and would simply laugh at phrases like 'institutional racism'. Indigenous bias is to be expected in a country. That's why it's, well, ... a country in the first place. And when I am a guest in another country, that's exactly what I expect. Numbers in a community does have an effect. And you know what, different cultures, and ideologies, have an effect too. Which is why most of the world doesn't do what the UK does. So if you want to preach at people about their 'unwillingness to accept' how shit they are, then maybe the UK isn't your best target. Because no matter how bad you think the people of this country are, in general they are better than most of the rest of the world at the issues you are concerned with. Including the countries we welcome people from. Oh, I'm sure there are far worse places to live than the UK, but that wasn't the point under discussion. Whereas lots of people seem to refuse to accept that there is a sizeable proportion of the UK that reacts/thinks in a somewhat prejudicial or racist way, clearly there is, as that British Social Attitudes survey demonstrated. Of course people don't like to think of themselves as prejudiced. And they don't respond well to having it pointed out, as this thread has demonstrated only too well! But, if you're going to have a more sensible, less febrile discussion about it, at least start from the basis of reliable, independently veriable data. If anyone has any which shows that the UK is much more tolerant than that BSA analysis showed, I'll happily see it. My suspicion would be that things have gone the other way since Brexit, but happy to be enlightened otherwise...
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 23, 2024 10:03:42 GMT
Some posters on here are making perfectly reasonable points about some of the issues around multiculturalism, immigration and the makeup of our town/cities these days, and people's lived experiences should absolutely always be listened to and respected. I've highlighted recently how it's unfair that poorer working class (predominantly Northern) towns and cities have a disproportionate amount of asylum seekers foisted upon them when local authorities are already bursting at the seams. This creates not only economic challenges but helps build a narrative that these people are here "to take our jobs, our houses, put pressure on our services locally"
But my lived experience is generally positive, and that counts as well doesn't it? I was born and raised on the mean streets of Tunstall, have lived in Glasgow and Croydon and now reside in an area with one of "Europe's roughest estates" on the doorstep so I'm not naive to the issues that people talk about. But I've also seen Pakistani taxi drivers turn off their meters during the Manchester bombing and not charge fares for days on end, those same drivers delivered food and medicine to people stuck in the house during Covid at their own cost, I've seen Mosques and Synagogues in really deprived parts of Manchester do some brilliant work in the community for people of all faiths. I've seen Romanian and Albanian men live in some of the worst conditions you'll ever see, 6 of them sharing 3 beds 3 on days and 3 on nights, picking fruit and doing the jobs that no one else wants to to do in this country, all in pursuit of a better life for themselves. I don't see these people as the enemy, there are good and bad people in all communities.
For every horror story there's a good news story if you go looking for it. I just don't subscribe to this "British shared values" narrative that people talk about, I just don't really know what it means? People are inherently good the world over, there's plenty that unites us rather than divides us. And for those that talk about the concerns of the working class I say join a union, register to vote, get involved in your community if you have the time and health to do so. Cutting the inequality gap and improving living standards from the bottom up is how a lot of these local issues get resolved.
We need to find a solution as the genie is already out of the bottle, this issue isn't going away whether we like it or not. Our foreign policy has helped create the world we live in today, global conflicts and the environmental crisis some of the world's poorer countries will are facing/face will make the problem greater..........
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 23, 2024 11:07:07 GMT
Some posters on here are making perfectly reasonable points about some of the issues around multiculturalism, immigration and the makeup of our town/cities these days, and people's lived experiences should absolutely always be listened to and respected. I've highlighted recently how it's unfair that poorer working class (predominantly Northern) towns and cities have a disproportionate amount of asylum seekers foisted upon them when local authorities are already bursting at the seams. This creates not only economic challenges but helps build a narrative that these people are here "to take our jobs, our houses, put pressure on our services locally" But my lived experience is generally positive, and that counts as well doesn't it? I was born and raised on the mean streets of Tunstall, have lived in Glasgow and Croydon and now reside in an area with one of "Europe's roughest estates" on the doorstep so I'm not naive to the issues that people talk about. But I've also seen Pakistani taxi drivers turn off their meters during the Manchester bombing and not charge fares for days on end, those same drivers delivered food and medicine to people stuck in the house during Covid at their own cost, I've seen Mosques and Synagogues in really deprived parts of Manchester do some brilliant work in the community for people of all faiths. I've seen Romanian and Albanian men live in some of the worst conditions you'll ever see, 6 of them sharing 3 beds 3 on days and 3 on nights, picking fruit and doing the jobs that no one else wants to to do in this country, all in pursuit of a better life for themselves. I don't see these people as the enemy, there are good and bad people in all communities. For every horror story there's a good news story if you go looking for it. I just don't subscribe to this "British shared values" narrative that people talk about, I just don't really know what it means? People are inherently good the world over, there's plenty that unites us rather than divides us. And for those that talk about the concerns of the working class I say join a union, register to vote, get involved in your community if you have the time and health to do so. Cutting the inequality gap and improving living standards from the bottom up is how a lot of these local issues get resolved. We need to find a solution as the genie is already out of the bottle, this issue isn't going away whether we like it or not. Our foreign policy has helped create the world we live in today, global conflicts and the environmental crisis some of the world's poorer countries will are facing/face will make the problem greater.......... Excellent post PP. In response to your point about British culture, I'd like to hope that this is a positive example of modern British culture, although I appreciate that others might not feel the same ...
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Jul 23, 2024 11:13:46 GMT
Some posters on here are making perfectly reasonable points about some of the issues around multiculturalism, immigration and the makeup of our town/cities these days, and people's lived experiences should absolutely always be listened to and respected. I've highlighted recently how it's unfair that poorer working class (predominantly Northern) towns and cities have a disproportionate amount of asylum seekers foisted upon them when local authorities are already bursting at the seams. This creates not only economic challenges but helps build a narrative that these people are here "to take our jobs, our houses, put pressure on our services locally" But my lived experience is generally positive, and that counts as well doesn't it? I was born and raised on the mean streets of Tunstall, have lived in Glasgow and Croydon and now reside in an area with one of "Europe's roughest estates" on the doorstep so I'm not naive to the issues that people talk about. But I've also seen Pakistani taxi drivers turn off their meters during the Manchester bombing and not charge fares for days on end, those same drivers delivered food and medicine to people stuck in the house during Covid at their own cost, I've seen Mosques and Synagogues in really deprived parts of Manchester do some brilliant work in the community for people of all faiths. I've seen Romanian and Albanian men live in some of the worst conditions you'll ever see, 6 of them sharing 3 beds 3 on days and 3 on nights, picking fruit and doing the jobs that no one else wants to to do in this country, all in pursuit of a better life for themselves. I don't see these people as the enemy, there are good and bad people in all communities. For every horror story there's a good news story if you go looking for it. I just don't subscribe to this "British shared values" narrative that people talk about, I just don't really know what it means? People are inherently good the world over, there's plenty that unites us rather than divides us. And for those that talk about the concerns of the working class I say join a union, register to vote, get involved in your community if you have the time and health to do so. Cutting the inequality gap and improving living standards from the bottom up is how a lot of these local issues get resolved. We need to find a solution as the genie is already out of the bottle, this issue isn't going away whether we like it or not. Our foreign policy has helped create the world we live in today, global conflicts and the environmental crisis some of the world's poorer countries will are facing/face will make the problem greater.......... Excellent post PP. In response to your point about British culture, I'd like to hope that this is a positive example of modern British culture, although I appreciate that others might not feel the same ... Great to see.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jul 23, 2024 11:18:12 GMT
Some posters on here are making perfectly reasonable points about some of the issues around multiculturalism, immigration and the makeup of our town/cities these days, and people's lived experiences should absolutely always be listened to and respected. I've highlighted recently how it's unfair that poorer working class (predominantly Northern) towns and cities have a disproportionate amount of asylum seekers foisted upon them when local authorities are already bursting at the seams. This creates not only economic challenges but helps build a narrative that these people are here "to take our jobs, our houses, put pressure on our services locally" But my lived experience is generally positive, and that counts as well doesn't it? I was born and raised on the mean streets of Tunstall, have lived in Glasgow and Croydon and now reside in an area with one of "Europe's roughest estates" on the doorstep so I'm not naive to the issues that people talk about. But I've also seen Pakistani taxi drivers turn off their meters during the Manchester bombing and not charge fares for days on end, those same drivers delivered food and medicine to people stuck in the house during Covid at their own cost, I've seen Mosques and Synagogues in really deprived parts of Manchester do some brilliant work in the community for people of all faiths. I've seen Romanian and Albanian men live in some of the worst conditions you'll ever see, 6 of them sharing 3 beds 3 on days and 3 on nights, picking fruit and doing the jobs that no one else wants to to do in this country, all in pursuit of a better life for themselves. I don't see these people as the enemy, there are good and bad people in all communities. For every horror story there's a good news story if you go looking for it. I just don't subscribe to this "British shared values" narrative that people talk about, I just don't really know what it means? People are inherently good the world over, there's plenty that unites us rather than divides us. And for those that talk about the concerns of the working class I say join a union, register to vote, get involved in your community if you have the time and health to do so. Cutting the inequality gap and improving living standards from the bottom up is how a lot of these local issues get resolved. We need to find a solution as the genie is already out of the bottle, this issue isn't going away whether we like it or not. Our foreign policy has helped create the world we live in today, global conflicts and the environmental crisis some of the world's poorer countries will are facing/face will make the problem greater.......... Excellent post.
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Post by gawa on Jul 23, 2024 11:31:15 GMT
Some posters on here are making perfectly reasonable points about some of the issues around multiculturalism, immigration and the makeup of our town/cities these days, and people's lived experiences should absolutely always be listened to and respected. I've highlighted recently how it's unfair that poorer working class (predominantly Northern) towns and cities have a disproportionate amount of asylum seekers foisted upon them when local authorities are already bursting at the seams. This creates not only economic challenges but helps build a narrative that these people are here "to take our jobs, our houses, put pressure on our services locally" But my lived experience is generally positive, and that counts as well doesn't it? I was born and raised on the mean streets of Tunstall, have lived in Glasgow and Croydon and now reside in an area with one of "Europe's roughest estates" on the doorstep so I'm not naive to the issues that people talk about. But I've also seen Pakistani taxi drivers turn off their meters during the Manchester bombing and not charge fares for days on end, those same drivers delivered food and medicine to people stuck in the house during Covid at their own cost, I've seen Mosques and Synagogues in really deprived parts of Manchester do some brilliant work in the community for people of all faiths. I've seen Romanian and Albanian men live in some of the worst conditions you'll ever see, 6 of them sharing 3 beds 3 on days and 3 on nights, picking fruit and doing the jobs that no one else wants to to do in this country, all in pursuit of a better life for themselves. I don't see these people as the enemy, there are good and bad people in all communities. For every horror story there's a good news story if you go looking for it. I just don't subscribe to this "British shared values" narrative that people talk about, I just don't really know what it means? People are inherently good the world over, there's plenty that unites us rather than divides us. And for those that talk about the concerns of the working class I say join a union, register to vote, get involved in your community if you have the time and health to do so. Cutting the inequality gap and improving living standards from the bottom up is how a lot of these local issues get resolved. We need to find a solution as the genie is already out of the bottle, this issue isn't going away whether we like it or not. Our foreign policy has helped create the world we live in today, global conflicts and the environmental crisis some of the world's poorer countries will are facing/face will make the problem greater.......... Excellent post. Thanks mate. Think you hit quote on prestwich by mistake.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jul 23, 2024 11:31:32 GMT
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 23, 2024 11:31:44 GMT
While looking for some more recent data on racism and prejudice in the UK, to see if that British Social Attitudes survey back in 2014 was reasonable or, instead, something of an outlier, I came across this interesting summary from a website called The Conversation, which contained some more recent survey info: "Racist beliefs Let’s look at racist beliefs first. Through the European Social Survey, [2018] we asked a representative sample of the British public two questions on “biological racism” – that is, the belief that there are innate differences between racial or ethnic groups. A belief that innate differences make some groups inherently superior to others is generally taken to be the core idea of racism. We asked whether interviewees agreed that “some races or ethnic groups are born less intelligent than others” and found that 18% of the British public agreed with the statement. We also asked whether “some races or ethnic groups are born harder working than others”, to which a substantially larger percentage – 44% – said yes. Perhaps the difference between these two percentages is due to political correctness. The claim that there are innate group differences in intelligence would widely be recognised as a racist statement, whereas innate differences in work ethic may not have the same blatant connotations. But whether we go for the lower or the higher figure, on this evidence a substantial minority of the British public subscribe to some form of racist belief. We repeated these questions on biological racism in a more recent (2019) nationally representative online survey. The findings were very similar – 19% agreed that some groups were born less intelligent, and 38% agreed that some groups were born less hard working. We also found that people who subscribed to these racist beliefs were more likely to be opposed to immigration and to express other “nativist” views, such as that one needs to have English ancestry to be truly English. People who express agreement with these racist statements in an interview may not necessarily act on them in practice. But the finding is in line with minorities’ own reports that they experience racial hostility and harassment in their daily lives".These two later findings appear to support the earlier BSA study, and confirm my statement that there is a sizeable rump of the UK population that holds these views. I have to say it doesn't come as a surprise to me to find additional support for such a statement, and that that figure of around a fifth or a quarter of the population sounds broadly right. It also doesn't shock me, and presumably nor does it anyone else, that there appears to be a correlation between racist beliefs and opposition to immigration. Unpalatable truths, but truths, nonetheless. Of course, as I've highlighted above, having those views doesn't mean you do anything about it, other than perhaps going online to highlight negative stories about ethnic minorities on a regular basis It also doesn't undermine what others have pointed out that minorities tend to be 'dumped' on poorer parts of the UK, with largely predictable results.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Jul 23, 2024 11:34:52 GMT
It's all a bit toxic on here. This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned.
Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride, firm leadership and to reignite and repair the broken mindset of the British people.
Big Vik, get him involved.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 23, 2024 11:47:40 GMT
It's all a bit toxic on here. This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned.Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride, firm leadership and to reignite and repair the broken mindset of the British people. Big Vik, get him involved. Or of people just didn't act like absolute weapons when having a rational debate. Viktor would appreciate the nod to censorship though I'm sure.......
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Post by gawa on Jul 23, 2024 11:53:25 GMT
It's all a bit toxic on here. This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned. Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride, firm leadership and to reignite and repair the broken mindset of the British people. Big Vik, get him involved. A sub forum section for Politics/Current Events/Serious Discussion would be good in my opinion. Would probably encourage a wider array of topics on here and maybe be more appealing to those who post on the football side of the board. While similarly keeping more serious discussions in a separate area which people can avoid if they aren't interested in them.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 23, 2024 12:07:31 GMT
It's all a bit toxic on here. This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned. Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride, firm leadership and to reignite and repair the broken mindset of the British people. Big Vik, get him involved. Hmmm, highlights apparent 'toxicity' of Oatcake. Next paragraph expresses support for authoritarian leader who endorses Putin, has vowed to end "race-mixing" in Europe and is very anti-LGBT issues.... Interesting juxtaposition 😂
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 23, 2024 12:10:02 GMT
It's all a bit toxic on here. This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned. Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride, firm leadership and to reignite and repair the broken mindset of the British people. Big Vik, get him involved. A sub forum section for Politics/Current Events/Serious Discussion would be good in my opinion. Would probably encourage a wider array of topics on here and maybe be more appealing to those who post on the football side of the board. While similarly keeping more serious discussions in a separate area which people can avoid if they aren't interested in them. Not anti it by any means, but it's easy enough to avoid political threads if you want to as it is. The better solution would be for people just to lighten up a bit and take the place way less to heart. Nowt changes from shooting the breeze on here!
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Post by str8outtahampton on Jul 23, 2024 12:19:47 GMT
It's all a bit toxic on here. This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned. Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride, firm leadership and to reignite and repair the broken mindset of the British people. Big Vik, get him involved. If that's a joke then I admire the irony. Genuinely. If it's not, I wonder if you know (m)any Hungarians, or even speak to them?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 23, 2024 12:40:13 GMT
This board would be so much more pleasant if political/state of affair threads were banned. Our once great nation is in urgent need of a Viktor Orban to restore some national pride That's quite a bizarre run of 30 or so continuous words their Nick, or am I being whooshed? 😁
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