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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 10:39:04 GMT
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Post by oggyoggy on Sept 29, 2024 10:39:04 GMT
You really don’t get it do you!? You don’t get that state in this context has two possible meanings and you refuse to accept a state can mean a nation or a country. It is basic English. Yet apparently I should be embarrassed!? Various posters have agreed with me, or latterly called me pedantic (which is true) but doesn’t make me wrong. State can mean a nation and I would say its most common meaning is a nation in this context. Where one meaning would at best be racist by smearing an entire nation based on their nationality, (and some may say antisemitic given the nation being referred to), I would want to ensure it was clear to everyone that I meant the other from the outset. In terms of lies: “ And besides, as soon as it became apparent that you didn't understand it's meaning, it was very quickly explained to you.” I was the one who said to you I think you mean the other meaning of the word state (i.e you meant the government and army, not the entire nation state). Not the other way around. So you are lying where you say the above in both parts of the sentence. There are other examples but I can’t be bothered to go back. So there we go. As I have been saying, I think it is better to be a bit more precise with the language you use in the circumstances. You seem to be passionately against that, and belligerently think the word state cannot refer to a nation, which is obviously wrong. I think we have bored enough people with our pointless back and forth. You really are being absolutely pathetic oggy, I can't believe that you've forced me into doing this.
This is the order of the exchange, chronologically as it happened (I haven't included the posts from other people attempting to make the same point to you)... I fundamentally disagree with the notion that a country is or can be a terrorist state Countries are therefore not terrorist states. As for your other point claiming that a country can't be a terrorist state, well I'm afraid you're just plain wrong.
Countries which are currently officially recognised as terrorist states are Cuba, Iran, North Korea and Syria. Countries in the past which have been officially recognised as terrorist states include Iraq, Libya, South Yemen, Sudan etc. You don’t see the difference between a country and its current government? There are countries that are and have been recognised as terrorist states, that doesn't mean that every person in those countries are a terrorist. Or, what I believe, and what I think you are really saying, is the current crop of politicians in power in Israel are terrorists. Well erm, yes, obviously, it is only you who has suggested anything differently. So after all this, you are agreeing with me. You are not calling the country of Israel a terrorist country. You are calling their government that. No I'm not agreeing with you, you're agreeing with YOURSELF because neither I nor anybody else have suggested what you've claimed.
It's just one great big straw man argument that you're wasting everybody's time with, to try and deflect from your original claim, that a country couldn't be a terrorist state.
Oggy, quite frankly it's bollocks. It's not my fault or anybody else's, that from the get go, you didn't understand that countries could (legitimately) be defined as terrorist states. oggy it's there in black and white and all dated and time stamped, if you want to have the good grace to apologise for calling me a liar, then I'll accept it but if not, then I'm not really interested in continuing this ridiculous charade of yours any longer. Oh and I'm pretty certain that Clare and Mick fully expected their readership to know what they meant when they referred to a terrorist state. Both tweeted since your original misunderstanding ... Thank you for confirming it was me that first said to you that you don’t mean the whole country, you just mean the government when you describe the state of Israel as terrorist (by calling it a terrorist state), rather than you saying it to me first. Which type of terrorist state are those tweets referring to? It doesn’t say. The country, or the government. They are very open to interpretation, as was your comment. You just refuse to acknowledge or accept that.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 10:48:32 GMT
You really are being absolutely pathetic oggy, I can't believe that you've forced me into doing this.
This is the order of the exchange, chronologically as it happened (I haven't included the posts from other people attempting to make the same point to you)... oggy it's there in black and white and all dated and time stamped, if you want to have the good grace to apologise for calling me a liar, then I'll accept it but if not, then I'm not really interested in continuing this ridiculous charade of yours any longer. Oh and I'm pretty certain that Clare and Mick fully expected their readership to know what they meant when they referred to a terrorist state. Both tweeted since your original misunderstanding ... Thank you for confirming it was me that first said to you that you don’t mean the whole country, you just mean the government when you describe the state of Israel as terrorist (by calling it a terrorist state), rather than you saying it to me first. Which type of terrorist state are those tweets referring to? It doesn’t say. The country, or the government. They are very open to interpretation, as was your comment. You just refuse to acknowledge or accept that. Christ alive! (In the interests of the thread not being continuously spammed) I'm done with you oggy.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 11:09:31 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 11:09:31 GMT
Well if they actually are, as you suggest, 'incredible in terms of performance' then they are complicit in October 7th, or they aren't anything like as incredible in terms of performance as you are implying. The first and most important role of a country's intelligence and security services, is to keep it's citizens safe. If Mossad and the IDF couldn't protect Israel from a bunch of guys in pick up trucks and homemade paragliders from crossing one of the most heavily monitored barriers in the world, consisting of a 20 foot wall, look out towers, wide spread video surveillance systems, remote control machine guns, anti-crossing sensors along it's entire length and constant monitoring from both land and air and then not actually begin to respond to that crossing for over an hour, then I would describe their performance as SPECTACULARLY BAD. I think if you're going to run with your suggestion that they are incredible in terms of their performance, then you're going to have to also go, with them being complicit on October 7th. You can't have it both ways. I did understand your point without the explanation but I would still like to have it both ways 😂 Ha ha, indeed! But joking aside, I do feel your original assertion, does raise an interesting question. If they are incredibly good at what they do (and the exploding pagers is certainly next level stuff) how could they be so incredibly bad, when it comes to bread and butter stuff? Egypitian intelligence have said that even they warned Israel that the attack was about to happen. It doesn't actually make much sense that the warning was ignored does it? Coupled that with the fact that Israel have a long history of documented false flag operations, does it then raise even the tiniest amount of suspicion?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 17:07:20 GMT
Post by Huddysleftfoot on Sept 29, 2024 17:07:20 GMT
Fucking hell...they are now bombing Yemen.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 17:20:34 GMT
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Post by Davef on Sept 29, 2024 17:20:34 GMT
Fucking hell...they are now bombing Yemen. And why are they doing that?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 17:23:44 GMT
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Post by scfcno1fan on Sept 29, 2024 17:23:44 GMT
The Houthi’s calling the strikes American British aggression.
We need to sever ties with Israel in my eyes.
They are going to far with all this.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Sept 29, 2024 17:28:33 GMT
Fucking hell...they are now bombing Yemen. And why are they doing that? Perhaps because they are war mongering psychopaths.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 17:38:00 GMT
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Post by adri2008 on Sept 29, 2024 17:38:00 GMT
Israel has clearly been given the green light to go after all 'undesirable' groups in the middle east hence seemingly unlimted Western support.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 17:39:46 GMT
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 29, 2024 17:39:46 GMT
Anyone watch “Surviving October 7th” in the week?
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Post by Davef on Sept 29, 2024 17:54:41 GMT
And why are they doing that? Perhaps because they are war mongering psychopaths. Right. It was probably not the best idea for the Houthis to spend almost a year firing rockets at war mongering Israel, warships and cargo ships then.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 18:44:11 GMT
Perhaps because they are war mongering psychopaths. Right. It was probably not the best idea for the Houthis to spend almost a year firing rockets at war mongering Israel, warships and cargo ships then. Which of course begs the question, why were the Houthi's doing this?
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Post by prestwichpotter on Sept 29, 2024 18:47:31 GMT
Perhaps because they are war mongering psychopaths. Right. It was probably not the best idea for the Houthis to spend almost a year firing rockets at war mongering Israel, warships and cargo ships then. Keep working backwards Dave…….
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 29, 2024 18:58:22 GMT
Who are the baddies here?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:00:02 GMT
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Post by numpty40 on Sept 29, 2024 19:00:02 GMT
Right. It was probably not the best idea for the Houthis to spend almost a year firing rockets at war mongering Israel, warships and cargo ships then. Which of course begs the question, why were the Houthi's doing this? To provoke the reaction we've seen?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:02:03 GMT
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 29, 2024 19:02:03 GMT
This thread is far more entertaining when Oggy is involved
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:13:20 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 19:13:20 GMT
Right. It was probably not the best idea for the Houthis to spend almost a year firing rockets at war mongering Israel, warships and cargo ships then. Keep working backwards Dave……. Exactly.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:25:15 GMT
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Post by gawa on Sept 29, 2024 19:25:15 GMT
Fucking hell...they are now bombing Yemen. And why are they doing that? Because its another country which ISIS and Al Qaeda have fought against 😁
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:27:20 GMT
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Post by emretezzy on Sept 29, 2024 19:27:20 GMT
Fucking hell...they are now bombing Yemen. Who isnt
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Post by emretezzy on Sept 29, 2024 19:27:57 GMT
This thread is far more entertaining when Oggy is involved Two lefties is never going to end in some one being right Badger
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Post by gawa on Sept 29, 2024 19:28:04 GMT
Anyone watch “Surviving October 7th” in the week? Nah doubt I will tbh. Does it cover the hannibal directive?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:29:12 GMT
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 29, 2024 19:29:12 GMT
This thread is far more entertaining when Oggy is involved Two lefties is never going to end in some one being right Badger Oggy is a centrist like Gawa😉
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:32:11 GMT
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Post by emretezzy on Sept 29, 2024 19:32:11 GMT
Two lefties is never going to end in some one being right Badger Oggy is a centrist like Gawa😉 I think the only thing that could separate Paul and Oggy is a good old Scoialsit Centrist.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:47:27 GMT
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Post by musik on Sept 29, 2024 19:47:27 GMT
Yemen??
Just home again and I saw on the news, it said: Israel have attacked the Huthi terrorists in Yemen.
🤔
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 19:56:58 GMT
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Post by serpico on Sept 29, 2024 19:56:58 GMT
The Houthis, like Hamas and Hezbollah are seen as Iranian proxies, Israel is attempting to eliminate Iran’s sphere of influence, they won’t destroy them from the air though, at some point if they want to actually defeat these groups you have to put boots on the ground, which is when things become tricky… and bloody, as we’ve seen in Iraq and Afghanistan.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 20:19:17 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 20:19:17 GMT
The Houthis, like Hamas and Hezbollah are seen as Iranian proxies, Israel is attempting to eliminate Iran’s sphere of influence, they won’t destroy them from the air though, at some point if they want to actually defeat these groups you have to put boots on the ground, which is when things become tricky… and bloody, as we’ve seen in Iraq and Afghanistan. I don't think Israel is attempting to eliminate anything (they've just spent 12 months bombing Gaza back to the Stoneage and achieved what exactly?). Netanyahu is attempting to set the entire region on fire, in an attempt to draw the US (and ultimately the UK) into an all out war with Iran. I posted this at the top of the previous page, apologies for posting it again but what Hearst is saying here, is extremely important ...
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 20:26:47 GMT
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Post by numpty40 on Sept 29, 2024 20:26:47 GMT
The Houthis, like Hamas and Hezbollah are seen as Iranian proxies, Israel is attempting to eliminate Iran’s sphere of influence, they won’t destroy them from the air though, at some point if they want to actually defeat these groups you have to put boots on the ground, which is when things become tricky… and bloody, as we’ve seen in Iraq and Afghanistan. I don't think Israel is attempting to eliminate anything (they've just spent 12 months bombing Gaza back to the Stoneage and achieved what exactly?). Netanyahu is attempting to set the entire region on fire, in an attempt to draw the US (and ultimately the UK) into an all out war with Iran. I posted this at the top of the previous page, apologies for posting it again but what Hearst is saying here, is extremely important ... I see it the other way, it seems to be an orchestrated attempt by Hezbollah, Hamas and Houthies to provoke a war to eliminate Israel as a state. Who knows?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 20:43:37 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 20:43:37 GMT
I don't think Israel is attempting to eliminate anything (they've just spent 12 months bombing Gaza back to the Stoneage and achieved what exactly?). Netanyahu is attempting to set the entire region on fire, in an attempt to draw the US (and ultimately the UK) into an all out war with Iran. I posted this at the top of the previous page, apologies for posting it again but what Hearst is saying here, is extremely important ... I see it the other way, it seems to be an orchestrated attempt by Hezbollah, Hamas and Houthies to provoke a war to eliminate Israel as a state. Who knows? What do you mean who knows? How can you have such a defined opinion on something and the immediately say, who knows? What are you basing your opinion actually on?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 20:48:23 GMT
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Post by numpty40 on Sept 29, 2024 20:48:23 GMT
I see it the other way, it seems to be an orchestrated attempt by Hezbollah, Hamas and Houthies to provoke a war to eliminate Israel as a state. Who knows? What do you mean who knows? How can you have such a defined opinion on something and the immediately say, who knows? What are you basing your opinion actually on? For someone who loves a good conspiracy theory you now seem to know for certain that Israel is trying to drag America into a war.
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 20:52:28 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 29, 2024 20:52:28 GMT
What do you mean who knows? How can you have such a defined opinion on something and the immediately say, who knows? What are you basing your opinion actually on? For someone who loves a good conspiracy theory you now seem to know for certain that Israel is trying to drag America into a war. Eh? Are you going to actually answer the question(s) or not? Why bother completely challenging the point(s) Hearst is making, if you're not prepared to?
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Israel
Sept 29, 2024 21:02:50 GMT
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Post by numpty40 on Sept 29, 2024 21:02:50 GMT
For someone who loves a good conspiracy theory you now seem to know for certain that Israel is trying to drag America into a war. Eh? Are you going to actually answer the question(s) or not? Why bother completely challenging the point(s) Hearst is making, if you're not prepared to? What question do you want me to answer? Hearst is a British journalist, he has an opinion. I've already said I think Hezbollah and Hamas are provoking Israel hoping to set the 'region on fire'?
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