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Post by metalhead on Jul 5, 2024 6:48:32 GMT
Sensible government. Time to end it.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 5, 2024 7:26:37 GMT
Sensible government. Time to end it. I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere.
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Post by metalhead on Jul 5, 2024 18:03:21 GMT
Sensible government. Time to end it. I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere. I suspect Reform haven't even got a policy.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 5, 2024 18:43:19 GMT
I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere. I suspect Reform haven't even got a policy. The only bit I could find was this - 'Zero-tolerance policing – Modelled on the regime used to slash crime in New York, Reform UK would see prison sentences for all violent crimes and possessing a knife, while drug dealing would get mandatory life imprisonment.' inews.co.uk/news/politics/reform-uk-general-election-manifesto-pledges-3078221
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Jul 5, 2024 21:28:22 GMT
Back when Gulliani was the all American hero. Not so much nowadays because he was trumps mate 🤔
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Post by metalhead on Jul 6, 2024 7:50:24 GMT
So basically no policy. Full of hot air.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 6, 2024 10:07:40 GMT
So basically no policy. Full of hot air. Indeed, pretty much as expected. Interestingly one of the local Reform candidates to his credit took a polar opposite stance, in his personal view decriminalisation and legalising is the best way forward.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 6, 2024 14:28:30 GMT
This is the Hansard transcript of a parliamentary debate on drugs that took place in 2017. hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2017-07-18/debates/733C6229-49D0-4559-8F59-5F1244C2DE13/DrugsPolicyAnyone that has the patience to wade through it will notice that the vast majority involved are advocating a completely different approach than that which the government proposed and subsequently followed. Plenty of ministers talking common sense, unfortunately the one's talking nonsense, Sarah Newton and Victoria Atkins, were the one's wielding the power. One of the results being that around 30,000 have died needlessly in the intervening years, with the taxpayers paying around £140 billion for the privilege. So many excellent speeches, such a tragedy they were all ignored. 'Once we have started a war that we were never going to win, ending it becomes increasingly difficult. The onus is on us to justify the time, the cost in human lives, the misery and the taxpayers’ money involved, and to justify why we started the war in the first place. If we cannot do that, the only option seems to be to plough on, doggedly proclaiming that we were right all along and steadfastly refusing to listen to alternative strategies aimed at resolving the issue. That is where we are now in the war on drugs. Rather like the generals in the first world war ordering tens of thousands of conscripts over the top in a futile show of strength, we cannot see a way out that would justify the losses and sacrifices that have been made. We therefore continue to make the same mistakes over and over again. We should note that when prohibition ended in 1933, the crime rate and the addiction rate plummeted.' Just one of many absolute gems, reading this transcript has warmed my heart, so many people seeing the emperor naked with just a handful attempting to maintain the facade, hopefully, now that there are some grown ups in charge we can have an adult discussion and maybe even base our laws on science and evidence rather than the lies and whims of the (hopefully now irrelevant) Daily Mail. Fingers crossed.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Jul 6, 2024 16:21:27 GMT
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Post by elystokie on Jul 6, 2024 16:35:36 GMT
Even bollocksed he has the good sense not to drive. If he'd had a few pints and shots he may well have made a different decision 😉 Looks like a piss take to me tbh 🤔
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Jul 6, 2024 16:43:44 GMT
Even bollocksed he has the good sense not to drive. If he'd had a few pints and shots he may well have made a different decision 😉 Looks like a piss take to me tbh 🤔 I think 5th gear back in the day did something with stoned drivers and worked out some people drive better stoned 😆 And I'm pretty sure they didn't use cheech or chong for the test 😆 Which reminds me I need to watch one of their filums later 👍
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Post by elystokie on Jul 6, 2024 16:50:00 GMT
Even bollocksed he has the good sense not to drive. If he'd had a few pints and shots he may well have made a different decision 😉 Looks like a piss take to me tbh 🤔 I think 5th gear back in the day did something with stoned drivers and worked out some people drive better stoned 😆 And I'm pretty sure they didn't use cheech or chong for the test 😆 Which reminds me I need to watch one of their filums later 👍 I've seen a few studies that would seem to confirm it, if there was carnage on the roads in Canada since legalisation I'm pretty sure the prohibition grifters would've told us 😄 I might watch one myself 🙂 Have you watched 'Weeds'? One of my top 5 TV series ever 👍
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Jul 6, 2024 16:53:47 GMT
I think 5th gear back in the day did something with stoned drivers and worked out some people drive better stoned 😆 And I'm pretty sure they didn't use cheech or chong for the test 😆 Which reminds me I need to watch one of their filums later 👍 I've seen a few studies that would seem to confirm it, if there was carnage on the roads in Canada since legalisation I'm pretty sure the prohibition grifters would've told us 😄 I might watch one myself 🙂 Have you watched 'Weeds'? One of my top 5 TV series ever 👍 I looked on YouTube and you can find the 5th gear episode with stoners driving. Not seen weeds bit will have a looksie...
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Post by gawa on Jul 6, 2024 17:49:38 GMT
Sensible government. Time to end it. I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere. KS wants to clamp down on the smell of cannabis destroying families homes. He said it himself. Anyone who voted Labour expecting drug reform is daft.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 6, 2024 17:58:37 GMT
I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere. KS wants to clamp down on the smell of cannabis destroying families homes. He said it himself. Anyone who voted Labour expecting drug reform is daft. That was the quote I heard from Starmer and was one of the main things that put me off voting Labour 🙂
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Post by elystokie on Jul 6, 2024 21:33:28 GMT
I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere. KS wants to clamp down on the smell of cannabis destroying families homes. He said it himself. Anyone who voted Labour expecting drug reform is daft. There's more on Kier Starmer's views on the link, from 2022, the signs aren't good from that report either. Perhaps he'll listen to his new Foreign Secretary tho, he was definitely keen on legalising cannabis, same link. bylinetimes.com/2022/01/05/a-total-waste-of-police-time-labour-rows-over-drugs-policy-as-cannabis-offences-surge/
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Post by elystokie on Jul 7, 2024 7:06:27 GMT
I've seen a few studies that would seem to confirm it, if there was carnage on the roads in Canada since legalisation I'm pretty sure the prohibition grifters would've told us 😄 I might watch one myself 🙂 Have you watched 'Weeds'? One of my top 5 TV series ever 👍 I looked on YouTube and you can find the 5th gear episode with stoners driving. Not seen weeds bit will have a looksie... Just watched it, absolute pisser
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 7, 2024 11:54:54 GMT
I looked on YouTube and you can find the 5th gear episode with stoners driving. Not seen weeds bit will have a looksie... Just watched it, absolute pisser Have you been watching Ibiza Narcos? Just watching the first episode really good documentary.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 7, 2024 11:58:28 GMT
Just watched it, absolute pisser Have you been watching Ibiza Narcos? Just watching the first episode really good documentary. No, first I've heard of it, I'll try and remember to check it out later, cheers.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 7, 2024 12:00:22 GMT
Have you been watching Ibiza Narcos? Just watching the first episode really good documentary. No, first I've heard of it, I'll try and remember to check it out later, cheers. It’s on sky documentaries in 3 parts. Traces it from the late 60s to current day. Really interesting tale of how the hippies got taken over by the gangs.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 7, 2024 12:04:38 GMT
No, first I've heard of it, I'll try and remember to check it out later, cheers. It’s on sky documentaries in 3 parts. Traces it from the late 60s to current day. Really interesting tale of how the hippies got taken over by the gangs. It'll probably mention Howard Marks (Mr Nice) at some point, brilliant bloke, saw him do a talk/Q nd A in Cambridge years ago, there's a good film dramatising his life.
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Post by gawa on Jul 7, 2024 23:06:32 GMT
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Post by musik on Jul 7, 2024 23:13:31 GMT
That would never happen in Sweden! If you just tried it once, you would be stoned to death literally. And then buried in human poo - when it comes to your chances on the job market. We see it again and again here ... You're only given one chance. 🤠 And dealing on top of that!? Don't make me laugh.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 8, 2024 6:34:16 GMT
That would never happen in Sweden! If you just tried it once, you would be stoned to death literally. And then buried in human poo - when it comes to your chances on the job market. We see it again and again here ... You're only given one chance. 🤠 And dealing on top of that!? Don't make me laugh. It's going to be quite amusing when the majority of Swedes realise the Emperor is actually naked, they're bound to eventually 😂
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Post by elystokie on Jul 8, 2024 7:45:31 GMT
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Post by musik on Jul 8, 2024 10:22:01 GMT
I'm hopeful there'll at least be a conversation about it but the limited amount I've heard from KS on the matter doesn't fill me with confidence tbh. The Lib-Dems have done well tho and they're the only major party with a remotely sensible drugs policy proposal, with any luck they'll push the issue as soon as possible. Against that Reform's intention would be to 'double down' according to what I've read, which obviously just makes things worse as we're seeing elsewhere. I suspect Reform haven't even got a policy. Like the majority of the Swedish established parties then. If they do have one it's possibly a hand written one put at the bottom in the last drawer. It's never mentioned, mainly because "it doesn't concern many people". I remember they said that during an election tour, not the latest one though. I sincerely believe many put it - when it comes to importance - just behind the issue "regulations on what colour people should be wearing on their hat on a golf course". They do however have an alcohol policy. On the other hand, they don't see it as a drug. 🤠
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Post by elystokie on Jul 8, 2024 11:10:02 GMT
I suspect Reform haven't even got a policy. Like the majority of the Swedish established parties then. If they do have one it's possibly a hand written one put at the bottom in the last drawer. It's never mentioned, mainly because "it doesn't concern many people". I remember they said that during an election tour, not the latest one though. I sincerely believe many put it - when it comes to importance - just behind the issue "regulations on what colour people should be wearing on their hat on a golf course". They do however have an alcohol policy. On the other hand, they don't see it as a drug. 🤠 Your media appears to be extremely concerned about the bombings, stabbings, shootings and general gang violence. Surely people have connected the dots? 🤷
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Post by musik on Jul 8, 2024 13:53:58 GMT
Like the majority of the Swedish established parties then. If they do have one it's possibly a hand written one put at the bottom in the last drawer. It's never mentioned, mainly because "it doesn't concern many people". I remember they said that during an election tour, not the latest one though. I sincerely believe many put it - when it comes to importance - just behind the issue "regulations on what colour people should be wearing on their hat on a golf course". They do however have an alcohol policy. On the other hand, they don't see it as a drug. 🤠 Your media appears to be extremely concerned about the bombings, stabbings, shootings and general gang violence. Surely people have connected the dots? 🤷 Yes, they are, they absolutely are concerned. Latest last week was, "we have six times(!) more shootings in Sweden alone compared to the other nordic countries together". Before they said "more than the other nordic countries together", now it's more than six times - compared to them together. What was really an eye opener was the police report. It said they have stopped more than 200 shootings and bombings in a year. Meaning, instead of having double figures, it could have been hundreds or even thousands of dead bodies due to that sort of activity. I also read 3 new gang members are recruited each day. We have 30.000+ violent gang members. But more than 100.000 people as well floating around, that noone of the authority people has any control over. Since 1st of July landlords can easily by the law get rid of tennants if they've used the flat for criminal activities, like smoking pot. About the connecting the dots part, definitely the most common view among ordinary hard working people is kill those bastards. The former Social Democratic Prime Minister mentioned the drugs problem and blamed the users 100%. The current Conservative Prime Minister mentioned the drugs problem and blamed the users 100%. "To get recruting and gang violence down, it's up to the users to stop using. It's as simple as that. Someone has to be the grown up in the room." The last sentence btw, is a kind of often used phrase by him. He puts it in here and there, whenever he thinks it's suitable. The current government think it's a police matter and not really something for politicians to handle obviously, there is not really something like a "drug policy", more than to let the police get far more resources to stop it and hunt the users, instead of letting people get together in small armed citizen guards killing whoever they see uses or dealing. They have expressed a fear of that. So yes, they connect the violence with using.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 8, 2024 14:24:19 GMT
Your media appears to be extremely concerned about the bombings, stabbings, shootings and general gang violence. Surely people have connected the dots? 🤷 Yes, they are, they absolutely are concerned. Latest last week was, "we have six times(!) more shootings in Sweden alone compared to the other nordic countries together". Before they said "more than the other nordic countries together", now it's more than six times - compared to them together. What was really an eye opener was the police report. It said they have stopped more than 200 shootings and bombings in a year. Meaning, instead of having double figures, it could have been hundreds or even thousands of dead bodies due to that sort of activity. I also read 3 new gang members are recruited each day. We have 30.000+ violent gang members. But more than 100.000 people as well floating around, that noone of the authority people has any control over. Since 1st of July landlords can easily by the law get rid of tennants if they've used the flat for criminal activities, like smoking pot. About the connecting the dots part, definitely the most common view among ordinary hard working people is kill those bastards. The former Social Democratic Prime Minister mentioned the drugs problem and blamed the users 100%. The current Conservative Prime Minister mentioned the drugs problem and blamed the users 100%. "To get recruting and gang violence down, it's up to the users to stop using. It's as simple as that. Someone has to be the grown up in the room." The last sentence btw, is a kind of often used phrase by him. He puts it in here and there, whenever he thinks it's suitable. The current government think it's a police matter and not really something for politicians to handle obviously, there is not really something like a "drug policy", more than to let the police get far more resources to stop it and hunt the users, instead of letting people get together in small armed citizen guards killing whoever they see uses or dealing. They have expressed a fear of that. So yes, they connect the violence with using. There must be quite the market in Sweden for the gangs to make enough money to make it all worthwhile. I don't see how that sits with the golf course comment? It's weird 🤷 "The Netherlands has had a pragmatic, intelligent policy of drug decriminalisation for 50 years. It now has a serious prison problem, because there are not enough prisoners to fill its prisons. Is that not a problem we would like to have here?" hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2017-07-18/debates/733C6229-49D0-4559-8F59-5F1244C2DE13/details
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Post by musik on Jul 8, 2024 17:40:03 GMT
Yes, they are, they absolutely are concerned. Latest last week was, "we have six times(!) more shootings in Sweden alone compared to the other nordic countries together". Before they said "more than the other nordic countries together", now it's more than six times - compared to them together. What was really an eye opener was the police report. It said they have stopped more than 200 shootings and bombings in a year. Meaning, instead of having double figures, it could have been hundreds or even thousands of dead bodies due to that sort of activity. I also read 3 new gang members are recruited each day. We have 30.000+ violent gang members. But more than 100.000 people as well floating around, that noone of the authority people has any control over. Since 1st of July landlords can easily by the law get rid of tennants if they've used the flat for criminal activities, like smoking pot. About the connecting the dots part, definitely the most common view among ordinary hard working people is kill those bastards. The former Social Democratic Prime Minister mentioned the drugs problem and blamed the users 100%. The current Conservative Prime Minister mentioned the drugs problem and blamed the users 100%. "To get recruting and gang violence down, it's up to the users to stop using. It's as simple as that. Someone has to be the grown up in the room." The last sentence btw, is a kind of often used phrase by him. He puts it in here and there, whenever he thinks it's suitable. The current government think it's a police matter and not really something for politicians to handle obviously, there is not really something like a "drug policy", more than to let the police get far more resources to stop it and hunt the users, instead of letting people get together in small armed citizen guards killing whoever they see uses or dealing. They have expressed a fear of that. So yes, they connect the violence with using. There must be quite the market in Sweden for the gangs to make enough money to make it all worthwhile. I don't see how that sits with the golf course comment? It's weird 🤷 "The Netherlands has had a pragmatic, intelligent policy of drug decriminalisation for 50 years. It now has a serious prison problem, because there are not enough prisoners to fill its prisons. Is that not a problem we would like to have here?" hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2017-07-18/debates/733C6229-49D0-4559-8F59-5F1244C2DE13/detailsWell, we have the super rich who uses them and according to the politicians also the gang members themselves. I think their first thought was when it was "only" gang members who shot each other, why bother? Now when ordinary people get in their way, "We have to act, we have to start a war against drugs", it sounded then. Lots of new apartments then! Sweden have the opposite problem, they say, no room for any type of criminals. Sweden is a weird country, I saw a program about prisons on tv and the communication between the prisoner plus staff in prison and the outer world when the prisoner were about to leave was almost non-existing. I think he could make ONE phone call to sort everything. Eeh? Almost noone could get a flat of course, some place to stay. No wonder they did what they could to get back again. Pathetic care. And now the government and Riksdag (Parliament) recently have decided if you commit a crime several times, over and over again, they have the possibility to never let such a person out! Assault is enough. A bit like China. 🤠
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