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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jun 2, 2023 20:25:55 GMT
There’s the first sign, resentment 😉 It's not resentment Badge but rather, more like exasperation and then he sticks his childish 'Einstein' remark at the end of each post. It's proper primary school stuff and I have no idea why he thinks by doing so, he's apparently being clever. I just want to debate the topic in hand. I think it’s cute. It’s bants, go with it😉
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 2, 2023 20:27:20 GMT
It's actually becoming quite tedious. I don't know what his issue is, it's rather pathetic and quite childish. But hey, nevermind. Issue? What issue? What's with the personal attack? Stop crying and grow up mate. Listen to yourself ... me, grow up? You're one of the most immature posters on this message board, who doesnt give the slightest shit about spamming threads for your own personal kicks.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jun 2, 2023 20:32:11 GMT
I think Paul and Fozzy need a little time to themselves.
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Post by foster on Jun 2, 2023 20:32:13 GMT
Issue? What issue? What's with the personal attack? Stop crying and grow up mate. Listen to yourself ... me, grow up? You're one of the most immature posters on this message board, who doesnt give the slightest shit about spamming threads for your own personal kicks. Isn't it about time you grew some pubes mate? Or got a sense of humour.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 2, 2023 20:36:32 GMT
Listen to yourself ... me, grow up? You're one of the most immature posters on this message board, who doesnt give the slightest shit about spamming threads for your own personal kicks. Isn't it about time you grew some pubes mate? Or got a sense of humour. I'd rather have a grown up conversation about the topic in hand, rather than being drawn into (yet another) spamming of a thread for everybody else but hey, if you actually have got something humorous to say, then I'm all ears.
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Post by foster on Jun 2, 2023 21:44:30 GMT
Isn't it about time you grew some pubes mate? Or got a sense of humour. I'd rather have a grown up conversation about the topic in hand, rather than being drawn into (yet another) spamming of a thread for everybody else but hey, if you actually have got something humorous to say, then I'm all ears. Well Paul, You did get drawn into it, but not by me. You got triggered and coaxed into a spam fest by Gawa and Badger, and then needlessly aimed abuse at me. I have no issue with them at all as its just a bit of fun. I'd do the same. The only problem with it being that no one could have possibly predicted the mini meltdown and immense knicker wetting you'd do over a couple of 'Einstein' comments. And lastly, I'd take being immature over being a miserable old fart any day of the week.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jun 2, 2023 21:52:49 GMT
I'd rather have a grown up conversation about the topic in hand, rather than being drawn into (yet another) spamming of a thread for everybody else but hey, if you actually have got something humorous to say, then I'm all ears. Well Paul, You did get drawn into it, but not by me. You got triggered and coaxed into a spam fest by Gawa and Badger, and then needlessly aimed abuse at me. I have no issue with them at all as its just a bit a bit of fun. I'd do the same. The only problem with it being that no one could have possibly predicted the mini meltdown and immense knicker wetting you'd do over a couple of 'Einstein' comments. And lastly, I'd take being immature over being a miserable old fart any day of the week. Hang on, I hate Spam. It’s for scrubbers. Gawa loves it though😉
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 2, 2023 22:28:54 GMT
I'd rather have a grown up conversation about the topic in hand, rather than being drawn into (yet another) spamming of a thread for everybody else but hey, if you actually have got something humorous to say, then I'm all ears. Well Paul, You did get drawn into it, but not by me. You got triggered and coaxed into a spam fest by Gawa and Badger, and then needlessly aimed abuse at me. I have no issue with them at all as its just a bit of fun. I'd do the same. The only problem with it being that no one could have possibly predicted the mini meltdown and immense knicker wetting you'd do over a couple of 'Einstein' comments. And lastly, I'd take being immature over being a miserable old fart any day of the week. So no humour from you then after all? And describing you as childish wasn't needlessly aimed abuse, it was a genuine observation. But hey, you carry on spamming the thread for everybody else, it's just soooooo funny. 🙄
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Post by foster on Jun 2, 2023 23:24:37 GMT
The thing is that if you're going to protest about something then it should have an impact and consequence for it to be successful. Otherwise you may as well not bother as you won't be noticed. The government certainly won't give a shit. When members of a union protest or strike they can afford to coordinate it with the police, as simply by protesting in an orderly way they will have an adverse impact on other peoples daily lives, through the removal of public services (transport, hospital care, policing, etc.). In order for smaller developing groups of activists to achieve the publicity they need they have to make an impact in other ways. It would be naïve to think that they can realistically achieve anything by following the same orderly protest and striking rules used by railway workers or nurses. As for laying down on motorways, I'm not condoning that as it only hurts motorists, blocks traffic and causes more pollution....But there are some other decent suggestions that Gawa made earlier that could be just as effective. I edited them below and removed the other 5 shitty suggestions he came up with. - Block oil tankers and depots. - Protest at the company / governmental premises and facilities. - Do demonstrations like 'led by donkeys' with huge screens hired out to educate passers by. - Target their digital online presence. Spot on. The entire point of the nature of these protests. In that regard, whether or not you agree with them is neither here nor there, the point is that writing strongly worded letters gets you nowhere. "You can protest, but just make sure it doesn't inconvenience us", seems to be familiar mantra when discussing these Stop Oil protesters. Which doesn't really fit in with the purpose of their protest. I do have some sympathy for oil and climate related protesters as conserving the planet is something I feel strongly about. However, patience may start to wain as these protests are only going to become larger, more commonplace and more extreme in the coming years. Which doesnt bode well as this just means something else for people to be massively divided on. Hopefully everyone will be over Brexit by then.
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Post by gawa on Jun 2, 2023 23:50:24 GMT
Wow don't drag me into your lovers tiff. Personally I'm a fan of looking deep within and recognising our own faults as that's all that we can control. We can't control others actions.
Maybe you should both review the last few pages and make an open apology to the rest of the forum in relation to your behaviour and how you could have done things differently.
Einstein
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 3, 2023 9:35:45 GMT
Very disappointed the different scientist every time thing didn't run a bit further. Up your game, Fozzie Bear!
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 3, 2023 12:37:04 GMT
The thing is that if you're going to protest about something then it should have an impact and consequence for it to be successful. Otherwise you may as well not bother as you won't be noticed. The government certainly won't give a shit. When members of a union protest or strike they can afford to coordinate it with the police, as simply by protesting in an orderly way they will have an adverse impact on other peoples daily lives, through the removal of public services (transport, hospital care, policing, etc.). In order for smaller developing groups of activists to achieve the publicity they need they have to make an impact in other ways. It would be naïve to think that they can realistically achieve anything by following the same orderly protest and striking rules used by railway workers or nurses. As for laying down on motorways, I'm not condoning that as it only hurts motorists, blocks traffic and causes more pollution....But there are some other decent suggestions that Gawa made earlier that could be just as effective. I edited them below and removed the other 5 shitty suggestions he came up with. - Block oil tankers and depots. - Protest at the company / governmental premises and facilities. - Do demonstrations like 'led by donkeys' with huge screens hired out to educate passers by. - Target their digital online presence. Spot on. The entire point of the nature of these protests. In that regard, whether or not you agree with them is neither here nor there, the point is that writing strongly worded letters gets you nowhere. So what are you suggesting, that you think that anybody who believes they have a legitimate cause to protest about, can lie down in the road, whenever they want, for as long as they want? Just so I'm sure I'm understanding your point correctly.
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Post by yeswilko on Jun 3, 2023 13:28:11 GMT
It is quite interesting that collectively we didnt kick off about the energy bills that we've been handed and the obscene profits being made. I'd imagine there's a significant number of excessive deaths this year.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 3, 2023 14:50:49 GMT
Spot on. The entire point of the nature of these protests. In that regard, whether or not you agree with them is neither here nor there, the point is that writing strongly worded letters gets you nowhere. So what are you suggesting, that you think that anybody who believes they have a legitimate cause to protest about, can lie down in the road, whenever they want, for as long as they want? Just so I'm sure I'm understanding your point correctly. I'm not suggesting anything. I was agreeing with Fozzie Bear that the point of the nature of these protests is to draw attention to them.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 3, 2023 15:05:36 GMT
So what are you suggesting, that you think that anybody who believes they have a legitimate cause to protest about, can lie down in the road, whenever they want, for as long as they want? Just so I'm sure I'm understanding your point correctly. I'm not suggesting anything. I was agreeing with Fozzie Bear that the point of the nature of these protests is to draw attention to them. Well of course it is that is obvious but your suggestion that you don't achieve that by writing letters, suggests you were developing the discussion into HOW you protest.
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Post by franklin on Jun 3, 2023 17:57:10 GMT
Just give them the same protection as cats on the road in that you do not need to stop and report running one of the fuckers over.
😁
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jun 3, 2023 18:11:28 GMT
Just give them the same protection as cats on the road in that you do not need to stop and report running one of the fuckers over. 😁 Comparing a cat to a Stop Oil Self Entitled Dork is like comparing your nan to a nonce
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Jun 3, 2023 18:24:32 GMT
Looking back a lot of the stunts undertaken by Fathers 4 Justice (chaining to gantries, stopping the London Eye, disrupting the Snooker, delaying traffic, chucking coloured powder around) were not dissimilar to those of Just Stop Oil now - however I do not recall anything like the oporobrium or threats of violence towards F4J.
Seem to me that a lot of people's tolerance - or otherwise - to protesters tactics is very much conditioned by the extent of their sympathy to the cause.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 4, 2023 0:04:40 GMT
Seems to me that a lot of people's tolerance - or otherwise - to protesters tactics is very much conditioned by the extent of their sympathy to the cause.
I think that there are many, many people (including those people who are sympathetic to the Stop Oil cause) who do not believe that they should have a right to block public highways, at a random time of their choosing.
If everybody else, who believed that they too, had a legitimate grievance, also did the same, the country would grind to a halt, permanently.
I just fail to see how any rational person, exercising logic, in a democracy, can believe that people should be afforded that right (and I'm specifically talking about the right to indiscriminately, lay down or sit down on public highways, not other forms of direct action).
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Post by andystokey on Jun 4, 2023 6:56:26 GMT
Seems to me that a lot of people's tolerance - or otherwise - to protesters tactics is very much conditioned by the extent of their sympathy to the cause. I think that there are many, many people (including those people who are sympathetic to the Stop Oil cause) who do not believe that they should have a right to block public highways, at a random time of their choosing.
If everybody else, who believed that they too, had a legitimate grievance, also did the same, the country would grind to a halt, permanently.
I just fail to see how any rational person, exercising logic, in a democracy, can believe that people should be afforded that right (and I'm specifically talking about the right to indiscriminately, lay down or sit down on public highways, not other forms of direct action).
The current law affords the protection you reasonably expect Paul. Its also now is an actionable offence with a max sentence of 6 months. If any protestor breaks the law they need to accept the consequences. This now includes offences regarding noise as has been well reported. However if a protest group or individual break the law they should expect the nominated authorities to enforce the law. The public have no such powers to do so. The police can already arrest these individuals and have been able for many years. informeddissent.info/obstruction-of-the-highway#:~:text=The%20offence%20is%20committed%20if,used%20as%20a%20public%20thoroughfare. There has been a history of breaking the law to protest an issue in the UK that is nothing new. Leaking documents, sit ins, occupations and road blocks are all illegal. I think Seymour and myself have contested this issue before, during Covid. I would break the law to protest without question as I did during lockdown along with millions of others. I'm sure there would be others who believed my law breaking was unjustified and that is their right to disagree. If one knowingly breaks the law to protest one must be happy to take the medicine. The American philosopher John Rawls defined civil disobedience as a “public, nonviolent, conscientious yet political act contrary to law usually done with the aim of bringing about a change in the law or policies of the government”. With the term “public”, Rawls meant that protestors should identify themselves and take responsibility for their actions. Their acceptance of the personal consequences demonstrates their commitment to the social cause. To reiterate - the law you require Paul is in place to protect free movement and those protesting are breaking the law. Some will agree and some disagree if the cause justifies that action.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 4, 2023 7:43:54 GMT
Just give them the same protection as cats on the road in that you do not need to stop and report running one of the fuckers over. 😁 Comparing a cat to a Stop Oil Self Entitled Dork is like comparing your nan to a nonce What you don't know is that his nan is a nonce so the analogy is fair enough 😃
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 4, 2023 9:26:54 GMT
I think that there are many, many people (including those people who are sympathetic to the Stop Oil cause) who do not believe that they should have a right to block public highways, at a random time of their choosing.
If everybody else, who believed that they too, had a legitimate grievance, also did the same, the country would grind to a halt, permanently.
I just fail to see how any rational person, exercising logic, in a democracy, can believe that people should be afforded that right (and I'm specifically talking about the right to indiscriminately, lay down or sit down on public highways, not other forms of direct action).
The current law affords the protection you reasonably expect Paul. Its also now is an actionable offence with a max sentence of 6 months. If any protestor breaks the law they need to accept the consequences. This now includes offences regarding noise as has been well reported. However if a protest group or individual break the law they should expect the nominated authorities to enforce the law. The public have no such powers to do so. The police can already arrest these individuals and have been able for many years. informeddissent.info/obstruction-of-the-highway#:~:text=The%20offence%20is%20committed%20if,used%20as%20a%20public%20thoroughfare. There has been a history of breaking the law to protest an issue in the UK that is nothing new. Leaking documents, sit ins, occupations and road blocks are all illegal. I think Seymour and myself have contested this issue before, during Covid. I would break the law to protest without question as I did during lockdown along with millions of others. I'm sure there would be others who believed my law breaking was unjustified and that is their right to disagree. If one knowingly breaks the law to protest one must be happy to take the medicine. The American philosopher John Rawls defined civil disobedience as a “public, nonviolent, conscientious yet political act contrary to law usually done with the aim of bringing about a change in the law or policies of the government”. With the term “public”, Rawls meant that protestors should identify themselves and take responsibility for their actions. Their acceptance of the personal consequences demonstrates their commitment to the social cause. To reiterate - the law you require Paul is in place to protect free movement and those protesting are breaking the law. Some will agree and some disagree if the cause justifies that action. Agree with all of that Andy (indeed I've already said that the law exists further back in the thread), the issue for me is two fold 1) people believing they have a 'right' to do it and 2) the police actually letting them do it.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 4, 2023 10:39:16 GMT
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Post by dutchstokie on Jun 4, 2023 11:38:39 GMT
Wouldn’t it fun to fill some water canons with diesel and ‘persuade’ them to move on….. That for me would be a vote winner !
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 4, 2023 13:08:34 GMT
Wouldn’t it fun to fill some water canons with diesel and ‘persuade’ them to move on….. That for me would be a vote winner ! Think the Daily Mash has bugged your phone, Dutch!
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Post by hotterpotter on Jun 6, 2023 6:48:13 GMT
Finally some sense in the MSM!
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Post by Northy on Jun 6, 2023 9:48:10 GMT
He calls them a dirty hippie rabble, but the picture of the protesters doesn't have anyone like that on it, just normal looking folk.
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Post by Northy on Jun 6, 2023 9:49:54 GMT
Finally some sense in the MSM! MSM ?
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Post by hotterpotter on Jun 6, 2023 10:05:57 GMT
Finally some sense in the MSM! MSM ? Mainstream Media
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Post by Northy on Jun 6, 2023 13:34:00 GMT
OK, I didn't think the Daily Mash was mainstream media, albeit I don't see much of the media these days
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