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Post by butlerstbob on Aug 27, 2024 18:56:17 GMT
I think we all knew that NHS, education, prison system, defence etc etc was woefully short of finances. Taxes need to rise for sure but, imo, we must all pay our fair share. This should be from direct taxation by increasing rates of income tax. Increase the tax free Threshold to protect the lower paid, but counter this with increases to the basic rate and introduce more thresholds so the more you earn the more you pay. But I doubt this will happen and the burden will fall on IHT, CGT, stamp duty changes and I have a feeling there will be some form of property tax perhaps in the revamping of the council tax. Additionally pensioners may well lose triple lock and other schemes such as free bus travel and free prescription age may well rise in line with state pension age. Alternatively keep income tax unaffected and introduce an Ozzy style Medicare levy for which they pay 2% of taxable income with exemptions for lower paid. This levy is ring fenced for NHS releasing some of their annual £180b to be used elsewhere. Everyone paying their share doesn’t involve raising anything to do with PAYE first, your average tax payer is already paying their share right now. First and foremost the government can be going after big businesses paying the correct amount of corporation tax in the UK, windfall taxes on energy companies billion £ profits, council tax reform to get the rich paying more for their homes, scrapping the non dom status, electric vehicle tax, etc etc (I do agree with more tax thresholds btw). we need a level up so that the richest people in the country should be paying their fair share compared to the rest of us and the government need to stamp out tax loopholes and ways around the system. I’d be more than happy for my own income tax to go up if I knew all this was in place and it was fair, but it’s not So many things the government should be doing before coming after everyone else via income tax and NI Same greedy shit just a different colour and a different day! I despise the lot of them!!
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 27, 2024 19:02:33 GMT
I totally agree some of the most talented people in the world are British. But given recent behaviour of some of our twats, I would say it is a stretch to say we are the most talented people in the world! Our Olympians did well, but not as well as others as an example. Does that mean I hate our country? No. I hate racist unpatriotic twats who smash up their community because brexit hadn’t turned out like they wanted. Are we saying that brexit voters are racist unpatriotic violent twats Or Is is it more of your irrational hatred of the British people exercising there democratic choice of freeing this country form the yoke of European tyranny Some of them are racist unpatriotic twats, yes. Johnson and Farage are two of them. What does the “yoke of European tyranny” mean? Reducing our freedoms and reducing regulations and restrictions placed on big businesses which are there to ensure rights for workers and consumers?
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Post by salopstick on Aug 27, 2024 20:02:51 GMT
This fucker promised change but needs repeated calling out for the cunt he is
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Post by salopstick on Aug 27, 2024 20:05:43 GMT
Are we saying that brexit voters are racist unpatriotic violent twats Or Is is it more of your irrational hatred of the British people exercising there democratic choice of freeing this country form the yoke of European tyranny Some of them are racist unpatriotic twats, yes. Johnson and Farage are two of them. What does the “yoke of European tyranny” mean? Reducing our freedoms and reducing regulations and restrictions placed on big businesses which are there to ensure rights for workers and consumers? This is the slag off or defend kier starmer thread I’m struggling to believe any fucker can defend him
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Aug 27, 2024 20:32:55 GMT
This fucker promised change but needs repeated calling out for the cunt he is No worse than the Tories then eh mate? Don't say we didn't warn you.
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 27, 2024 21:31:55 GMT
Some of them are racist unpatriotic twats, yes. Johnson and Farage are two of them. What does the “yoke of European tyranny” mean? Reducing our freedoms and reducing regulations and restrictions placed on big businesses which are there to ensure rights for workers and consumers? This is the slag off or defend kier starmer thread I’m struggling to believe any fucker can defend him Sorry, I forgot there is absolutely no room for nuance. It is slag off or defend. Love or hate. Certainly we all need to absolutely hate (or love) his Autumn budget now before anything is even announced. No chance to give him time or to wait and see. Obviously the state of public services and our economy is down to him. There is no hangover from what came before. All decisions are easy. He can spend as much as he likes without increasing borrowing or taxes. Easy.
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Post by wannabee on Aug 27, 2024 22:57:25 GMT
Just three of the things Reeves has signaled may occur in October Budget
1. Income Tax versus Capital Gains Tax: If you earn up to 50K from your employment after TFA you pay Income Tax at Basic Rate of 20%
If you earn up to 50k from gains on property, shares etc after TFA you pay Capital Gains Tax at Basic Rate of 10%
If you earn between 50K up to 125K from your employment after TFA you pay Income Tax at Higher Rate of 40%
If you earn between 50k and 125K from gains on property, shares etc after TFA you pay Capital Gains Tax at Higher Rate of 20%
Can anyone justify that you should pay twice as much Tax on earned Income versus unearned Income. Would anyone object if the rates were equalised
2. Inheritance Tax: less than 4% of people pay IHT on Estates which is essentially a transfer of wealth after Death
The problem with IHT is there are many loopholes some justified e.g. family home to spouse others not
I don't know what Reeves plans to do in this space but on the face of it widening the payers beyond 4% would seem justified
3. Pensions: those financially sound enough can afford to maximise their annual payments to reduce their Annual Tax Burden without it affecting their disposable income. When they retire they can take a lump sum from their Pension Pot of up to £268,275 without tax on which no Tax has ever been paid
All of the above measures are taxes on wealth which people have been calling for.
I don't think an assessment can be made until we see the full package on 30 October, currently its speculation and leaks
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Aug 27, 2024 23:26:04 GMT
I think most Tory contributors to this political threads on this board accept that we needed change Is there anyone on this board who doesn’t think that Kier Starmer is a massive melt It's quite amusing watching the same posters who spent 10 years slaughtering the hapless Tories on the government thread trying desperately to justify everything Starmer says. It's just a matter of time until this dire Labour Party do something completely indefensible. The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic. Is he going to spend the entirety of his tenure making unpopular decisions and blaming the Tories for them?
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Post by salopstick on Aug 28, 2024 3:51:11 GMT
This is the slag off or defend kier starmer thread I’m struggling to believe any fucker can defend him Sorry, I forgot there is absolutely no room for nuance. It is slag off or defend. Love or hate. Certainly we all need to absolutely hate (or love) his Autumn budget now before anything is even announced. No chance to give him time or to wait and see. Obviously the state of public services and our economy is down to him. There is no hangover from what came before. All decisions are easy. He can spend as much as he likes without increasing borrowing or taxes. Easy. I can accept this “hangover” but not his lies.
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Post by elystokie on Aug 28, 2024 5:28:27 GMT
I think most Tory contributors to this political threads on this board accept that we needed change Is there anyone on this board who doesn’t think that Kier Starmer is a massive melt It's quite amusing watching the same posters who spent 10 years slaughtering the hapless Tories on the government thread trying desperately to justify everything Starmer says. It's just a matter of time until this dire Labour Party do something completely indefensible. The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic. Is he going to spend the entirety of his tenure making unpopular decisions and blaming the Tories for them? 'The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic.' Not that I need to defend Starmer since I didn't vote for him. However, coming from the poster that backed the wet, corrupt lettuce, this is quite amusing 😂
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Post by iancransonsknees on Aug 28, 2024 5:55:17 GMT
"Thank goodness Sir Keir Starmer isn't a doctor.
His bedside manner is so morose – and his voice so funereal – that he could probably persuade his patients to switch off their own life support machines."
Best quote I've seen about him so far (The Daily Mail).
Just picked this up from the opposing side (The Guardian).
"So Starmer’s speech was as much for himself as it was for us. More so in fact. We would have been quite happy to do without it. He would have been devastated to miss out on the opportunity. For a man who is often so critical of performative politics, he is quite the performer. It rather goes with the job. Still at least he can stay in role. When you’re being told the country is dying on its feet, it’s reassuring that the messenger has the natural demeanour of a professional undertaker."
He really doesn't have much going for him at the moment does he?
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 28, 2024 6:26:12 GMT
Sorry, I forgot there is absolutely no room for nuance. It is slag off or defend. Love or hate. Certainly we all need to absolutely hate (or love) his Autumn budget now before anything is even announced. No chance to give him time or to wait and see. Obviously the state of public services and our economy is down to him. There is no hangover from what came before. All decisions are easy. He can spend as much as he likes without increasing borrowing or taxes. Easy. I can accept this “hangover” but not his lies. Such as?
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 28, 2024 6:53:13 GMT
I think most Tory contributors to this political threads on this board accept that we needed change Is there anyone on this board who doesn’t think that Kier Starmer is a massive melt It's quite amusing watching the same posters who spent 10 years slaughtering the hapless Tories on the government thread trying desperately to justify everything Starmer says. It's just a matter of time until this dire Labour Party do something completely indefensible. The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic. Is he going to spend the entirety of his tenure making unpopular decisions and blaming the Tories for them? If he can undo the damage caused to this nation over the last 15 years in just 1 term as PM then he should be considered one of the greatest leaders our country has ever seen. I doubt that will be possible because idiots expect him to turn things around immediately and even if he makes progress towards undoing the damage then I think he may still lose the next election. I think he needs to be far more radical than he seemingly is prepared to be.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Aug 28, 2024 7:09:56 GMT
It's quite amusing watching the same posters who spent 10 years slaughtering the hapless Tories on the government thread trying desperately to justify everything Starmer says. It's just a matter of time until this dire Labour Party do something completely indefensible. The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic. Is he going to spend the entirety of his tenure making unpopular decisions and blaming the Tories for them? If he can undo the damage caused to this nation over the last 15 years in just 1 term as PM then he should be considered one of the greatest leaders our country has ever seen. I doubt that will be possible because idiots expect him to turn things around immediately and even if he makes progress towards undoing the damage then I think he may still lose the next election. I think he needs to be far more radical than he seemingly is prepared to be. What radical measures should he implement?
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Aug 28, 2024 7:24:04 GMT
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Post by salopstick on Aug 28, 2024 7:29:45 GMT
I can accept this “hangover” but not his lies. Such as? The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Aug 28, 2024 7:33:53 GMT
It's quite amusing watching the same posters who spent 10 years slaughtering the hapless Tories on the government thread trying desperately to justify everything Starmer says. It's just a matter of time until this dire Labour Party do something completely indefensible. The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic. Is he going to spend the entirety of his tenure making unpopular decisions and blaming the Tories for them? 'The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic.' Not that I need to defend Starmer since I didn't vote for him. However, coming from the poster that backed the wet, corrupt lettuce, this is quite amusing 😂 I didn't vote Tory during the Boris, Truss or Rishi era. Again, classic Ely. Can't formulate an opinion on anything but frequently just opts for the outright lie. "You don't like Starmer and you're not as left wing as me so you must have voted Tory!" You must have more arse splinters than Keir.🥱
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Post by iancransonsknees on Aug 28, 2024 7:52:50 GMT
The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard Working for Davos, not the working class.
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Post by elystokie on Aug 28, 2024 8:03:36 GMT
'The fact that a wet, corrupt, useless melt like Starmer is running this great nation solely due to incompetence of the other major party is beyond tragic.' Not that I need to defend Starmer since I didn't vote for him. However, coming from the poster that backed the wet, corrupt lettuce, this is quite amusing 😂 I didn't vote Tory during the Boris, Truss or Rishi era. Again, classic Ely. Can't formulate an opinion on anything but frequently just opts for the outright lie. "You don't like Starmer and you're not as left wing as me so you must have voted Tory!" You must have more arse splinters than Keir.🥱 I never said you voted Tory, why do you keep making things up when the evidence shows otherwise? I said you backed Truss, which you did, fair play, you were pretty much alone, unsurprisingly. Not quite as crackers as supporting the rapist across the pond, but getting there 😉
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Post by wannabee on Aug 28, 2024 8:09:37 GMT
The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard Labour explicitly said they would not raise Taxes on Working people e.g. Income Tax, NI and VAT. They did not rule out a proper Non Doms Tax, CGT equalisation, IHT or changes to Pension Rules, that was very clear to most people that were actually listening Labour explicitly ruled out a return to Austerity which would be spending cuts, we shall see in October if they keep that pledge although that doesn't rule out making different choices of where money is spent So whose telling lies now You or Labour? You're making up a promise Labour never made www.independent.co.uk/business/fact-check-labour-s-pledge-to-cap-energy-bills-expired-in-april-2023-b2600997.htmlGB Energy has been announced and the exact details will be revealed in October Budget. It will be funded by a proper Windfall Tax on Oil and Gas Companies
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Aug 28, 2024 8:15:30 GMT
I didn't vote Tory during the Boris, Truss or Rishi era. Again, classic Ely. Can't formulate an opinion on anything but frequently just opts for the outright lie. "You don't like Starmer and you're not as left wing as me so you must have voted Tory!" You must have more arse splinters than Keir.🥱 I never said you voted Tory, why do you keep making things up when the evidence shows otherwise? I said you backed Truss, which you did, fair play, you were pretty much alone, unsurprisingly. Not quite as crackers as supporting the rapist across the pond, but getting there 😉 So how exactly did you come to the conclusion I backed Truss when I didn't vote for her and openly called it a "scam" on here that she was allegedly the best the Tories had to offer in the leadership election? You could argue I supported Kwatang's budget speech but to suggest I supported her as a politician is a total lie. Right, onto your next lie of the morning session. So the rapist across the pond? I assume you mean Trump? Firstly, who did he rape? Secondly, I don't support Trump. I've supported a number of things he's said and done over the years but to suggest I support a guy who in the past two elections I've called the Republicans "stupid" for electing as their leader is again, some pretty emphatic BS. I literally started a thread on here supporting DeSantis 😂 You're on a hatrick, what's your third lie of the day? May as well go for it. Honestly, the shit you're coming out with this morning is significant, even by your standards! 😃
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 28, 2024 8:25:48 GMT
If he can undo the damage caused to this nation over the last 15 years in just 1 term as PM then he should be considered one of the greatest leaders our country has ever seen. I doubt that will be possible because idiots expect him to turn things around immediately and even if he makes progress towards undoing the damage then I think he may still lose the next election. I think he needs to be far more radical than he seemingly is prepared to be. What radical measures should he implement? A complete rewrite of our tax code. Make it far simpler. Ours is about the longest and most complex in the world, which means loads of loopholes. A shift to higher taxes on wealth. Regulate social media companies Regulate MPs Electoral reform Clawback dividends from water company shareholders to pay for sorting out the infrastructure I like the sound of what he is planning for green state owned energy, nationalising railways and more devolution to local areas. But that will all take time so we will see if it works. There’re some ideas anyway.
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 28, 2024 8:28:56 GMT
The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard Oh, so you are the one lying! He never said he wouldn’t raise taxes! He said he won’t raise very specific taxes. If he breaks that, he has lied. But even if you are right (which you aren’t) and he did say absolutely no taxes would he raised (VAT on private school fees completely knocks your point out of the stadium and shows you are wrong), then isn’t it better to actually wait and see what his budget does rather than accuse him of lying because of rumours!? He needs to stop talking and let his actions be judged because his words aren’t helping anyone.
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Post by farfromhere on Aug 28, 2024 8:29:08 GMT
The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard Regarding working hard we actually have comparatively low levels of productivity since 2008. This comment sums it up better than I could: The biggest issue in the UK is not that our tax rates are not high enough, but that our productivity sucks compared to other EU15 countries limiting our ability to raise enough revenue per capita for quality public services. Raising taxes won't increase productivity, but likely reduce it making this issue worse if I'm correct about our primary challenge here. "Investment" isn't likely to result in significant productivity improvements in a country where 80% of the economy is services – we're not China so reduced energy costs and improving transportation are unlikely to translate well to productivity. We clearly have extreme waste in various parts of the public sector. This drags on productivity and puts into question our ability to fund services like the NHS long-term. The painful decisions are very obviously needed is spending reform in an effort to reduce the size of the state in relation to our GDP. While some targeted tax increases might make sense it would be very hard to raise the amounts of tax required without also increasing taxes on "working people". Businesses and the rich have too many options to limit their tax liabilities in a global economy therefore we should assume any increased taxes on these groups will be short lived at best. My doomer take is that Labour implements broad tax reforms which will target a significant percentage of the middle-class to raise the additional tax needed to patch our spending problems for another few years. This will continue to weigh on our productivity and long-term economic outlook. This is basically a continuation of the Tory play book. Another possibility is that they increase borrowing to patch the holes, but this basically just offsets the problems and would be hard to do without eroding market confidence in our ability to service our national debts. The optimistic take would be that Labour announce significant reforms of the NHS, state pension and welfare. This would be extremely unpopular and not play well with Labour's core voters so would be far less likely. It does give us more hope long-term though if this translates to improved productivity while retaining the quality of our public services near-term.
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Post by elystokie on Aug 28, 2024 8:32:19 GMT
I never said you voted Tory, why do you keep making things up when the evidence shows otherwise? I said you backed Truss, which you did, fair play, you were pretty much alone, unsurprisingly. Not quite as crackers as supporting the rapist across the pond, but getting there 😉 So how exactly did you come to the conclusion I backed Truss when I didn't vote for her and openly called it a "scam" on here that she was allegedly the best the Tories had to offer in the leadership election? You could argue I supported Kwatang's budget speech but to suggest I supported her as a politician is a total lie. Right, onto your next lie of the morning session. So the rapist across the pond? I assume you mean Trump? Firstly, who did he rape? Secondly, I don't support Trump. I've supported a number of things he's said and done over the years but to suggest I support a guy who in the past two elections I've called the Republicans "stupid" for electing as their leader is again, some pretty emphatic BS. I literally started a thread on here supporting DeSantis 😂 You're on a hatrick, what's your third lie of the day? May as well go for it. Honestly, the shit you're coming out with this morning is significant, even by your standards! 😃 Oh come on 😄 You even briefly tried to defend her after she was booted, muttering something about 'the markets not understanding'. No surprise you're distancing yourself from her and Trump, where are you on the Argentinian fella nowadays? Wasn't he another hero? And Desantis? Wasn't he the new great hope when you'd gone off Trump a bit?
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Post by gawa on Aug 28, 2024 9:52:23 GMT
The only positive thing Starmer has down is Unite the left and right wing in opposition against the government.
This is a risk Starmer took by lying his way to be leader and taking the left wing for granted by pandering towards the right at every opportunity.
The right wing and the left wing have no interest in giving him the benefit of the doubt. He's very much made his bed and now he has to lie in it.
He has no chance of winning left wing voters round. The question is how much further to the right he panders to try and garner support.
After imposing his parachute regiment of pricks like Luke Akehurst on communities where their Labour CLP don't want them, I see he also now wants to change the rules for how leaders are chosen in Labour. Were the MPs his clique imposed make the decisions rather than the members. Which seems to be him preparing for continuity without him in the future. Where his spineless sheep can elect another centrist who panders to the right.
Basically the Labour party is dead as a left wing working class party. The left wing will be stronger off the back of this and can finally Unite under a new banner which isn't filled with wolves in sheep's clothing.
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Post by phileetin on Aug 28, 2024 9:59:12 GMT
"Thank goodness Sir Keir Starmer isn't a doctor. His bedside manner is so morose – and his voice so funereal – that he could probably persuade his patients to switch off their own life support machines." Best quote I've seen about him so far (The Daily Mail). Just picked this up from the opposing side (The Guardian). "So Starmer’s speech was as much for himself as it was for us. More so in fact. We would have been quite happy to do without it. He would have been devastated to miss out on the opportunity. For a man who is often so critical of performative politics, he is quite the performer. It rather goes with the job. Still at least he can stay in role. When you’re being told the country is dying on its feet, it’s reassuring that the messenger has the natural demeanour of a professional undertaker." He really doesn't have much going for him at the moment does he? i agree.
if this stupid dolt doesn't start bigging up the country soon instead of denigrating it , all the international businesses will do a runner.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Aug 28, 2024 10:07:52 GMT
The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard Regarding working hard we actually have comparatively low levels of productivity since 2008. This comment sums it up better than I could: The biggest issue in the UK is not that our tax rates are not high enough, but that our productivity sucks compared to other EU15 countries limiting our ability to raise enough revenue per capita for quality public services. Raising taxes won't increase productivity, but likely reduce it making this issue worse if I'm correct about our primary challenge here. "Investment" isn't likely to result in significant productivity improvements in a country where 80% of the economy is services – we're not China so reduced energy costs and improving transportation are unlikely to translate well to productivity. We clearly have extreme waste in various parts of the public sector. This drags on productivity and puts into question our ability to fund services like the NHS long-term. The painful decisions are very obviously needed is spending reform in an effort to reduce the size of the state in relation to our GDP. While some targeted tax increases might make sense it would be very hard to raise the amounts of tax required without also increasing taxes on "working people". Businesses and the rich have too many options to limit their tax liabilities in a global economy therefore we should assume any increased taxes on these groups will be short lived at best. My doomer take is that Labour implements broad tax reforms which will target a significant percentage of the middle-class to raise the additional tax needed to patch our spending problems for another few years. This will continue to weigh on our productivity and long-term economic outlook. This is basically a continuation of the Tory play book. Another possibility is that they increase borrowing to patch the holes, but this basically just offsets the problems and would be hard to do without eroding market confidence in our ability to service our national debts. The optimistic take would be that Labour announce significant reforms of the NHS, state pension and welfare. This would be extremely unpopular and not play well with Labour's core voters so would be far less likely. It does give us more hope long-term though if this translates to improved productivity while retaining the quality of our public services near-term. Does that mean reorganising in work benefits too, stop subsidising the employer etc?
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Aug 28, 2024 10:58:38 GMT
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Post by wannabee on Aug 28, 2024 11:08:29 GMT
The Labour leader told Sky's Beth Rigby there will not be a return to austerity if he wins the election - and he will fund public services properly without raising taxes or making spending cuts. Tell that to the pensioners and the working classes who will be getting hit. Never mind failing to tackle energy companies as promised as bills rise again. This new Labour Party with him at the helm has nothing for the millions of families working hard Regarding working hard we actually have comparatively low levels of productivity since 2008. This comment sums it up better than I could: The biggest issue in the UK is not that our tax rates are not high enough, but that our productivity sucks compared to other EU15 countries limiting our ability to raise enough revenue per capita for quality public services. Raising taxes won't increase productivity, but likely reduce it making this issue worse if I'm correct about our primary challenge here. "Investment" isn't likely to result in significant productivity improvements in a country where 80% of the economy is services – we're not China so reduced energy costs and improving transportation are unlikely to translate well to productivity. We clearly have extreme waste in various parts of the public sector. This drags on productivity and puts into question our ability to fund services like the NHS long-term. The painful decisions are very obviously needed is spending reform in an effort to reduce the size of the state in relation to our GDP. While some targeted tax increases might make sense it would be very hard to raise the amounts of tax required without also increasing taxes on "working people". Businesses and the rich have too many options to limit their tax liabilities in a global economy therefore we should assume any increased taxes on these groups will be short lived at best. My doomer take is that Labour implements broad tax reforms which will target a significant percentage of the middle-class to raise the additional tax needed to patch our spending problems for another few years. This will continue to weigh on our productivity and long-term economic outlook. This is basically a continuation of the Tory play book. Another possibility is that they increase borrowing to patch the holes, but this basically just offsets the problems and would be hard to do without eroding market confidence in our ability to service our national debts. The optimistic take would be that Labour announce significant reforms of the NHS, state pension and welfare. This would be extremely unpopular and not play well with Labour's core voters so would be far less likely. It does give us more hope long-term though if this translates to improved productivity while retaining the quality of our public services near-term. Good post I agree with a lot of it Traditional Manufacturing began to be killed off in the 1980s by Offshoring and neutering the Unions UK hasn't been a good place for investment for quite some time so productivity has remained static or gone down, its like the chicken and the egg as to which came first. Its too late to reverse that trend in older Industries Steel has gone Car Industry will soon follow as EV Batteries are not planned to be built in any reasonable amount. New Industries, new technologies and new Energy Sources are the right direction and Labour are attempting to do that albeit in a modest way. UK as a Market in isolation is too small and it doesn't have easy access to the large trading blocks US EU and China. I don't doubt UKs ability to innovate but with US IRA and EU Green Deal offering hundreds of billions of incentives the likelihood is those start up Industries won't remain in UK Yes Service Industries especially Financial have been a success and have propped up the Economy but it has also created a North South divide. Brexit to some was deregulation, but it hasn't really happened other than uncapping Bankers Bonuses. There is also uncertainty about future arrangements with EU clearing etc and many large UK Companies have moved from LSE to NYSE or NASDAQ. At date of Brexit Vote LSE was double CAC 40 they are now equal size vying for No 1 position. The main problem with NHS is that it is underfunded compared to peer Countries, Staff retention due to poor pay and conditions comparable to other Countries and an aging population. It is too reliant on overseas staff rather than growing our own and there is little integration with Social Care. Studies have shown that NHS compares favourably with Peer Countries on Administration costs but poorly for Medical Staff per head of population. Capital Investment has also been poor which adds to the problem of poor working conditions. The Bulldog Spirit of WW11 of making do and mend doesn't chime with a modern society with expectations of things getting better not worse. For a period during Covid there was an element of togetherness but that quickly faded with revelations of the Party Culture at No 10 I'm hopeful, not confident that Labour may steer a better course but I think it's ludicrous to judge them after 7 weeks. I expect there is a temptation for Labour to get as much of the bad shit out of the way early so that it will be forgotten in 5 years. At the end of the day if Labour don't create the conditions which allows the Economy to grow for extra expenditure on Public Services they will be out on their ear.
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