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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 13, 2024 18:08:39 GMT
I won't lie to you, I'm enjoying this. What goes around around comes around...........
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Post by gawa on Feb 13, 2024 18:19:37 GMT
I won't lie to you, I'm enjoying this. What goes around around comes around........... What's hilarious is there's more evidence of "antisemitism" under Starmer in half a week than there was under Corbyns premiership 🤣. Obviously it's all a load of bollocks anyway but still. What goes around comes around...
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Post by adri2008 on Feb 13, 2024 18:35:06 GMT
Very much so. Antisemitism seems to cover all criticism of anything Israel gets up to. Like a free pass to do whatever they like with our media/government seemingly well on board with the idea. From the Spectator: What Starmer’s appalling handling of an obviously open-and-shut case of indefensible bigotry does offer though is a troubling glimpse into the likely course of his looming premiership.
He stood by Ali for the best part of three days despite the candidate’s peddling of the disgusting and false conspiracy theory that Israel deliberately facilitated the October 7 pogrom against its own citizens. He even sent a series of senior frontbenchers out to bat for Ali, including Pat McFadden, Lisa Nandy and Nick Thomas-Symonds.There's absolutely nothing open and shut about it but of course any questioning of Israeli motives is an absolute taboo. Is there any credible evidence to back up Ali’s comments? Did he point to any? If not, it is pretty outrageous and Starmer should have binned him immediately, or asked Ali to produce hard evidence to back up his claims, else Labour drop him. Done stand for a political party if you are going to completely undermine the party’s position on a really contentious issue before you’re even elected. Labour shouldn’t have picked him as the candidate and he shouldn’t be trying to be a labour MP. There's evidence that Israel had pre-warning that an attack was imminent at the very least. There'll be nothing that's black and white though of course so it's down to whether you feel it's beyond a government/politician like Netanyahu to sacrifice some of its citizens to further an agenda. Personally I don't trust a thing he says. Politically obviously it's stupid though as it seems everybody has to back Israel without question.
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Post by oggyoggy on Feb 13, 2024 18:44:58 GMT
Is there any credible evidence to back up Ali’s comments? Did he point to any? If not, it is pretty outrageous and Starmer should have binned him immediately, or asked Ali to produce hard evidence to back up his claims, else Labour drop him. Done stand for a political party if you are going to completely undermine the party’s position on a really contentious issue before you’re even elected. Labour shouldn’t have picked him as the candidate and he shouldn’t be trying to be a labour MP. There's evidence that Israel had pre-warning that an attack was imminent at the very least. There'll be nothing that's black and white though of course so it's down to whether you feel it's beyond a government/politician like Netanyahu to sacrifice some of its citizens to further an agenda. Personally I don't trust a thing he says. Politically obviously it's stupid though as it seems everybody has to back Israel without question. Rockets are fired into Israel on a daily basis and have been for years. Knowing about an attack is one thing. Knowing about Hamas killing loads of people and taking many hostages is completely different. Perhaps they expected a normal rocket attack. Nobody has to back Israel without question. Israel are becoming a global pariah for their disproportionate response.
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Post by gawa on Feb 13, 2024 19:00:05 GMT
This aged well.
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Post by gawa on Feb 13, 2024 19:05:57 GMT
There's evidence that Israel had pre-warning that an attack was imminent at the very least. There'll be nothing that's black and white though of course so it's down to whether you feel it's beyond a government/politician like Netanyahu to sacrifice some of its citizens to further an agenda. Personally I don't trust a thing he says. Politically obviously it's stupid though as it seems everybody has to back Israel without question. Rockets are fired into Israel on a daily basis and have been for years. Knowing about an attack is one thing. Knowing about Hamas killing loads of people and taking many hostages is completely different. Perhaps they expected a normal rocket attack. Nobody has to back Israel without question. Israel are becoming a global pariah for their disproportionate response. Unfortunately her 15 colleagues didn't survive to tell the story. Have a read about Jericho Wall a 40 page document Israel has a year before October 7th. www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html
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Post by iancransonsknees on Feb 13, 2024 19:09:11 GMT
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Post by iancransonsknees on Feb 13, 2024 19:16:03 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Feb 13, 2024 20:12:55 GMT
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 13, 2024 20:23:12 GMT
Don’t joke I wouldn’t put it past him…….
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Post by wagsastokie on Feb 13, 2024 20:38:13 GMT
At this rate I might nip down the bookies and put a couple of Bob on Sunak winning the election
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Post by backintheday on Feb 13, 2024 21:30:57 GMT
At this rate I might nip down the bookies and put a couple of Bob on Sunak winning the election Stranger things have happened mate
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Feb 13, 2024 21:42:48 GMT
It's so sad that with a British election just around the corner there's a bunch of people who don't give a fuck about what impact it will have on the British people, they only care about Jews/Muslims on the other side of the world.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Feb 13, 2024 21:51:26 GMT
It's so sad that with a British election just around the corner there's a bunch of people who don't give a fuck about what impact it will have on the British people, they only care about Jews/Muslims on the other side of the world. What are you referring to DC?
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Post by gawa on Feb 13, 2024 22:23:42 GMT
It's so sad that with a British election just around the corner there's a bunch of people who don't give a fuck about what impact it will have on the British people, they only care about Jews/Muslims on the other side of the world. What are you referring to DC? Nah think he just means that while foreign affairs are important, local and national issues are also very important or more so. Your voting position shouldn't just be based on foreign affairs alone. So like in 2019 when corbyn had a smear campaign as if he was some antisemetic gangster and thst dominated debate. When in reality we should have been focusing on him as a whole and his policies.
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Post by roylandstoke on Feb 14, 2024 0:34:59 GMT
Israel is an apartheid, terrorist state.
The Labour Party should condemn it.
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Post by wannabee on Feb 14, 2024 1:26:02 GMT
Hobson's Choice
We can have 5 more years of the Tory Psychodrama. Lies and mismanagement and decisions taken which overwhelmingly favour a relative few. Public Services futher disintegrating.
Alternatively we can choose a new group that have demonstrated a lack of morals and integrity in the pursuit of Power. We can only take it upon trust that Domestic decisions will be made for the common good and not for self enrichment of themselves or their donors.
Meanwhile the Economy is Flatlining and Isolated and neither of the two Tribes have put forward any credible proposals to exit out of the malaise
This depressing scenario is the backdrop to selecting the next Ruling Party, the first since we apparently regained our Sovereignty
What an appalling vista
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Post by Paul Spencer on Feb 14, 2024 3:09:15 GMT
It would clearly be completely unrealistic to think that Feinstein could overturn a 28k majority but if he does run, I could certainly see him giving Starmer a bloody nose ...
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Post by desman2 on Feb 14, 2024 4:29:11 GMT
Israel is an apartheid, terrorist state. The Labour Party should condemn it. The problem with that is they will then be seen as supporting or at least sympathising with a terrorist act. It's one of the problems of trying to get votes from demographics .
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Post by knype on Feb 14, 2024 6:51:25 GMT
Israel is an apartheid, terrorist state. The Labour Party should condemn it. And continue supporting Hamas!
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Post by iancransonsknees on Feb 14, 2024 6:55:43 GMT
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 14, 2024 7:42:02 GMT
It would clearly be completely unrealistic to think that Feinstein could overturn a 28k majority but if he does run, I could certainly see him giving Starmer a bloody nose ... I’ve met Feinstein and he’s a really decent principled man. It’s hard for Starmer to peddle the usual “I’ve ripped antisemitism out from its roots” narrative when you have a Jewish South African campaigner against apartheid challenging it. He’ll certainly make it uncomfortable for Starmer without overturning the huge majority as you rightly say……
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Post by roylandstoke on Feb 14, 2024 7:54:54 GMT
Israel is an apartheid, terrorist state. The Labour Party should condemn it. And continue supporting Hamas! It is possible to condemn a government that is committing genocide, without supporting a barbaric terrorist organisation.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 14, 2024 8:16:01 GMT
And continue supporting Hamas! It is possible to condemn a government that is committing genocide, without supporting a barbaric terrorist organisation. Knype doesn’t do nuance, just 4 word sound bites……
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Post by oggyoggy on Feb 14, 2024 9:29:26 GMT
Rockets are fired into Israel on a daily basis and have been for years. Knowing about an attack is one thing. Knowing about Hamas killing loads of people and taking many hostages is completely different. Perhaps they expected a normal rocket attack. Nobody has to back Israel without question. Israel are becoming a global pariah for their disproportionate response. Unfortunately her 15 colleagues didn't survive to tell the story. Have a read about Jericho Wall a 40 page document Israel has a year before October 7th. www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.htmlThe article talks about a 40 page document and based on the information Israeli security made a fatal error in disregarding it. But if you have attacks daily, and intelligence of daily attacks, some of which happen and others don’t, how do you know which ones are real and which ones aren’t? To therefore jump to the conclusion that Israel knew about the attack and did nothing to prevent it is a radical leap. They certainly had intelligence about an attack, probably something they have to deal with daily to decide whether or not it is real and whether or not to act. This time, they got it horribly wrong, and their wildly disproportionate response is turning them into a global pariah which they know will make the lives of ordinary Jewish people across the world harder. For a potential politician to say it as if there is proof they knew their civilians would be murdered and kidnapped is disgraceful and Starmer should have distanced Labour from him immediately.
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Post by Eggybread on Feb 14, 2024 9:43:43 GMT
You just cannot say or criticise Israel period without it being called anti semitic.Its a new law passed by the media,Tories and Starmer and thats that. And no Im not saying the recent sacking was not justified ok before anyone starts.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Feb 14, 2024 9:45:07 GMT
It is possible to condemn a government that is committing genocide, without supporting a barbaric terrorist organisation. Knype doesn’t do nuance, just 4 word sound bites…… Careful....he'll be calling you a left wing wanker if you don't watch out.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 14, 2024 9:52:12 GMT
"He's my mate so he's ok"
Ed Balls seems to be downplaying "antisemitism" here, he should have his Labour membership suspended immediately........
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Post by wannabee on Feb 14, 2024 10:29:10 GMT
The article talks about a 40 page document and based on the information Israeli security made a fatal error in disregarding it. But if you have attacks daily, and intelligence of daily attacks, some of which happen and others don’t, how do you know which ones are real and which ones aren’t? To therefore jump to the conclusion that Israel knew about the attack and did nothing to prevent it is a radical leap. They certainly had intelligence about an attack, probably something they have to deal with daily to decide whether or not it is real and whether or not to act. This time, they got it horribly wrong, and their wildly disproportionate response is turning them into a global pariah which they know will make the lives of ordinary Jewish people across the world harder. For a potential politician to say it as if there is proof they knew their civilians would be murdered and kidnapped is disgraceful and Starmer should have distanced Labour from him immediately. Israeli Intelligence had obtained a 40 page Battle Plan of a Hamas Attack which exactly corresponded to how the Attack took place, ONE YEAR before 7th October Israeli Intelligence dismissed the Report as being aspirational and beyond the capability of Hamas Weeks before 7th October the IDF Female Soldier Observers reported intensive military training in Northern Gaza including Paragliding. Their reports were dismissed, one senior IDF Observer broke Military Protocol and sent a strongly worded objection up the line that the warnings were being overlooked The 7th October was a holiday weekend in Israel and many IDF Soldiers were on leave Just prior to 7th October 2 Battalions of IDF were redeployed from the South to the West Bank to support the Settlers taking over Palestinians land which was causing increased unrest Questions will be asked and have already been asked within Israeli Intelligence, it will not be shared The narrative of the Israeli Intelligence and Defence Forces being one if not the most skilled in the World doesn't tally with events of 7th October Given that narrative and in the absence of ever receiving an honest answer from Israel it is obvious people will speculate A person seeking Public Office doesn't need to speculate in such a crass way but it doesn't stop speculation as to why there was such a catastrophic breakdown of ignoring Intelligence, observed Military Training and Weakening Defence Forces of Manpower www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html
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Post by noustie on Feb 14, 2024 11:39:21 GMT
The article talks about a 40 page document and based on the information Israeli security made a fatal error in disregarding it. But if you have attacks daily, and intelligence of daily attacks, some of which happen and others don’t, how do you know which ones are real and which ones aren’t? To therefore jump to the conclusion that Israel knew about the attack and did nothing to prevent it is a radical leap. They certainly had intelligence about an attack, probably something they have to deal with daily to decide whether or not it is real and whether or not to act. This time, they got it horribly wrong, and their wildly disproportionate response is turning them into a global pariah which they know will make the lives of ordinary Jewish people across the world harder. For a potential politician to say it as if there is proof they knew their civilians would be murdered and kidnapped is disgraceful and Starmer should have distanced Labour from him immediately. Israeli Intelligence had obtained a 40 page Battle Plan of a Hamas Attack which exactly corresponded to how the Attack took place, ONE YEAR before 7th October Israeli Intelligence dismissed the Report as being aspirational and beyond the capability of Hamas Weeks before 7th October the IDF Female Soldier Observers reported intensive military training in Northern Gaza including Paragliding. Their reports were dismissed, one senior IDF Observer broke Military Protocol and sent a strongly worded objection up the line that the warnings were being overlooked The 7th October was a holiday weekend in Israel and many IDF Soldiers were on leave Just prior to 7th October 2 Battalions of IDF were redeployed from the South to the West Bank to support the Settlers taking over Palestinians land which was causing increased unrest Questions will be asked and have already been asked within Israeli Intelligence, it will not be shared The narrative of the Israeli Intelligence and Defence Forces being one if not the most skilled in the World doesn't tally with events of 7th October Given that narrative and in the absence of ever receiving an honest answer from Israel it is obvious people will speculate A person seeking Public Office doesn't need to speculate in such a crass way but it doesn't stop speculation as to why there was such a catastrophic breakdown of ignoring Intelligence, observed Military Training and Weakening Defence Forces of Manpower www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.htmlGoing from memory but think they moved the location from the south of the country to a few miles from the border with <72 hours notice. The whole thing is fishy as fuck.
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