|
Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2023 14:14:51 GMT
At which point, you could cost effectively hire more people to process claims then send them back rather than putting them in hotels. Target the banks that are supporting the human trafficking endeavor. If gangs can’t launder their money, they won’t see the business as profitable. They would just move onto crypto So, punish the desperate people trying to make a decent life for themselves instead of going after the gangs and the banks that profiteer from that desperation? Crypto isn’t infinite. It costs more and more money to “mine” and it uses an extortionate amount of energy to do so. Any half rate cop could just start looking at the grid.
|
|
|
Post by phileetin on Dec 13, 2023 14:17:05 GMT
And you say I'm uninformed. It's not about deporting 500 a year, it's about deterring 10's of thousands making the journey in the first place. If 70k a year are making it over and only 500 can be sent off, each person has a 1 in 140 chance of being sent to Rwanda that year. Rwanda (as long as it isn’t in a war) is still probably better than where they come from. Some people could live their entire lives in a hotel before this policy gets to them. When you are fleeing war, why would that sound like a deterrent?
or , the , lets grant them all asylum plan .
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2023 14:18:49 GMT
If 70k a year are making it over and only 500 can be sent off, each person has a 1 in 140 chance of being sent to Rwanda that year. Rwanda (as long as it isn’t in a war) is still probably better than where they come from. Some people could live their entire lives in a hotel before this policy gets to them. When you are fleeing war, why would that sound like a deterrent?
or , the , lets grant them all asylum plan . Good idea 👍
|
|
|
Post by wagsastokie on Dec 13, 2023 14:18:54 GMT
Now that Sir Kier has outlined his detailed plans to stop the boats I may even consider voting Labour... He didn’t. But I agree it is far better than the tory plan: Or were you being sarcastic to accuse Starmer of having no plan when actually you are just uninformed as to what it is because it doesn’t make the front page of the Express and Mail. It isn’t Starmer’s fault that his solution to a non-issue isn’t big news. There are a thousand other bigger issues this country faces rather than worrying about whether or not we can deport 500 people a year to Rwanda (who get sent straight back by Rwanda if they wish but we still pay for them). More labour bullshit If starmer thought it would currently be more popular to vote for it Him and his lickspittles would of raced the Tory’s into the yes lobby
|
|
|
Post by oggyoggy on Dec 13, 2023 14:45:20 GMT
He didn’t. But I agree it is far better than the tory plan: Or were you being sarcastic to accuse Starmer of having no plan when actually you are just uninformed as to what it is because it doesn’t make the front page of the Express and Mail. It isn’t Starmer’s fault that his solution to a non-issue isn’t big news. There are a thousand other bigger issues this country faces rather than worrying about whether or not we can deport 500 people a year to Rwanda (who get sent straight back by Rwanda if they wish but we still pay for them). And you say I'm uninformed. It's not about deporting 500 a year, it's about deterring 10's of thousands making the journey in the first place. If they are willing to make the journey, I imagine they are willing to gamble that they won’t be part of the very small percentage of those who do who end up on a flight to Rwanda. The government has admitted there is no evidence of the policy so far working as a deterrent . It could change if flights ever start. But I doubt it. The labour plan is far better. Dealing with the backlog will save billions.
|
|
|
Post by oggyoggy on Dec 13, 2023 14:47:20 GMT
He didn’t. But I agree it is far better than the tory plan: Or were you being sarcastic to accuse Starmer of having no plan when actually you are just uninformed as to what it is because it doesn’t make the front page of the Express and Mail. It isn’t Starmer’s fault that his solution to a non-issue isn’t big news. There are a thousand other bigger issues this country faces rather than worrying about whether or not we can deport 500 people a year to Rwanda (who get sent straight back by Rwanda if they wish but we still pay for them). More labour bullshit If starmer thought it would currently be more popular to vote for it Him and his lickspittles would of raced the Tory’s into the yes lobby So if Starmer doesn’t say what he would do he is accused of fence sitting and having no policies, and when he does it is “more labour bullshit”. Starmer can never do right by your eyes then even if he somehow caused world peace and solved the climate crisis you would hate him because of the badge he is under.
|
|
|
Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 13, 2023 14:57:49 GMT
More labour bullshit If starmer thought it would currently be more popular to vote for it Him and his lickspittles would of raced the Tory’s into the yes lobby So if Starmer doesn’t say what he would do he is accused of fence sitting and having no policies, and when he does it is “more labour bullshit”. Starmer can never do right by your eyes then even if he somehow caused world peace and solved the climate crisis you would hate him because of the badge he is under. Starmer's government (if elected) may well turn out to be shit and waga may prove to have been correct in his opprobrium all along, we'll have to wait and see. They'll have to be going some to outdo the last dozen or so years in terms of fucking up the country, but you never know! In the meantime, it's quite entertaining seeing the contrast in the amount of energy and focus spent on criticising what he says he might do, what he might not do and when he doesn't say anything at all, while, at the same time, exercising nowhere near the same level of critique on the actual government and their actual record
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Dec 13, 2023 15:12:08 GMT
So if Starmer doesn’t say what he would do he is accused of fence sitting and having no policies, and when he does it is “more labour bullshit”. Starmer can never do right by your eyes then even if he somehow caused world peace and solved the climate crisis you would hate him because of the badge he is under. Starmer's government (if elected) may well turn out to be shit and waga may prove to have been correct in his opprobrium all along, we'll have to wait and see. They'll have to be going some to outdo the last dozen or so years in terms of fucking up the country, but you never know! In the meantime, it's quite entertaining seeing the contrast in the amount of energy and focus spent on criticising what he says he might do, what he might not do and when he doesn't say anything at all, while, at the same time, exercising nowhere near the same level of critique on the actual government and their actual record It's just an extension of the 'they're all the same' bollocks. Based on absolutely fuck all it's now confirmed that Starmer's mob are going to be even more corrupt and more inept than the current bunch of charlatans. I'm no huge fan of the fella or the party as it stands but they're really going to have to go some. That straw man warehouse has taken a proper hammering today.
|
|
|
Post by phileetin on Dec 13, 2023 15:12:52 GMT
only just noticed the starmer pinup boy drakeford has resigned .
apparently wales was the blueprint for labour going forward .
thank god we'll only get one term , hopefully they won't leave as bigger mess as last time.
|
|
|
Post by wagsastokie on Dec 13, 2023 15:31:20 GMT
More labour bullshit If starmer thought it would currently be more popular to vote for it Him and his lickspittles would of raced the Tory’s into the yes lobby So if Starmer doesn’t say what he would do he is accused of fence sitting and having no policies, and when he does it is “more labour bullshit”. Starmer can never do right by your eyes then even if he somehow caused world peace and solved the climate crisis you would hate him because of the badge he is under. Piss all to do with a so called badge I don’t think I’ve ever hated someone far to negative and tiring emotion I dislike starmer for his complete lack of integrity and his continued swaying to the focus groups As for my political views if asked who I admired I would put both Tony Benn and Enoch Powell in my top Five Complete polar opposites but both conviction politicians Who both sacrificed high office to stand by there beliefs wether they were right of not
|
|
|
Post by wagsastokie on Dec 13, 2023 15:38:10 GMT
Starmer's government (if elected) may well turn out to be shit and waga may prove to have been correct in his opprobrium all along, we'll have to wait and see. They'll have to be going some to outdo the last dozen or so years in terms of fucking up the country, but you never know! In the meantime, it's quite entertaining seeing the contrast in the amount of energy and focus spent on criticising what he says he might do, what he might not do and when he doesn't say anything at all, while, at the same time, exercising nowhere near the same level of critique on the actual government and their actual record It's just an extension of the 'they're all the same' bollocks. Based on absolutely fuck all it's now confirmed that Starmer's mob are going to be even more corrupt and more inept than the current bunch of charlatans. I'm no huge fan of the fella or the party as it stands but they're really going to have to go some. That straw man warehouse has taken a proper hammering today. Where have I stated labour will be more corrupt or inept My original post was more about a labour mp posting how he voted against the bill I was merely pointing out ( not particularly very well ) If the whip instructed him to vote for than he would probably of ran into the yes lobby If he’s particularly worried about the treatment of the downtrodden I presume he voted against the labour Israeli policy
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Dec 13, 2023 16:35:34 GMT
It's just an extension of the 'they're all the same' bollocks. Based on absolutely fuck all it's now confirmed that Starmer's mob are going to be even more corrupt and more inept than the current bunch of charlatans. I'm no huge fan of the fella or the party as it stands but they're really going to have to go some. That straw man warehouse has taken a proper hammering today. Where have I stated labour will be more corrupt or inept My original post was more about a labour mp posting how he voted against the bill I was merely pointing out ( not particularly very well ) If the whip instructed him to vote for than he would probably of ran into the yes lobby If he’s particularly worried about the treatment of the downtrodden I presume he voted against the labour Israeli policy Where have I said you have?
|
|
|
Post by oggyoggy on Dec 13, 2023 17:15:40 GMT
He didn’t. But I agree it is far better than the tory plan: Or were you being sarcastic to accuse Starmer of having no plan when actually you are just uninformed as to what it is because it doesn’t make the front page of the Express and Mail. It isn’t Starmer’s fault that his solution to a non-issue isn’t big news. There are a thousand other bigger issues this country faces rather than worrying about whether or not we can deport 500 people a year to Rwanda (who get sent straight back by Rwanda if they wish but we still pay for them). And you say I'm uninformed. It's not about deporting 500 a year, it's about deterring 10's of thousands making the journey in the first place. news.sky.com/story/amp/less-than-1-of-small-boat-arrivals-returned-home-since-2020-13029598 The Home Office has just confirmed: a total of 1,182 returns of people arriving on small boats since the start of 2020, of which only 420 are not Albanian. 109,000 have arrived on small boats since then. That means less than 1% of people who have come here on a small boat have been returned. The rest are being put up in hotels (or elsewhere) at the tax payer’s expense at a cost of many billions. The tory solution of deporting a few hundred a year is not going to work. Let’s assume it is the magic deterrent they think it is (and it does not get held up in the courts for years - two massive assumptions). If 500 people are deported a year (which is what the Rwanda deal says), it will take 216 years to deport all the arrivals assuming no more cross the channel ever again. It is a ridiculous policy even if it works as a deterrent. This highlights why the labour policy of clearing the asylum backlog within a year is crucial as that means actually sending people back who don’t meet requirements and everyone else who is legitimately here can stay. Rwanda is costing hundreds of millions. Bibby Stockholm has cost £22.5m. Put the money towards the backlog of asylum claims! It isn’t rocket science.
|
|
|
Post by wannabee on Dec 13, 2023 17:21:46 GMT
France have plenty of migrants that stay there as well. This is the consequence for blowing up Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria etc. Destroy places that people live and they are going to look somewhere else. If we truly wanted to stop this type of migration, we would crack down on banks that enable money laundering. They’ll never do that. It doesn’t explain the influx of Albanians 8 years ago Germany had an influx of Economic Migrants from Albania Its Parliament declared Albania a safe Country, did a deal with Albanian Government to return them. Albania doesn't want these Economic Migrants leaving as it damages their Economy I wrote extensively on here about it well over a year ago as a simple solution to solve the Albanian problem Eventually UK Government followed the German lead relatively recently and Economic Migrants from Albania are now a trickle. They are now making Political Capital for implementing a solution that was staring them in the face but they couldn't get off their fat arse to implement before it became a crises.
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Dec 13, 2023 17:27:11 GMT
So if Starmer doesn’t say what he would do he is accused of fence sitting and having no policies, and when he does it is “more labour bullshit”. Starmer can never do right by your eyes then even if he somehow caused world peace and solved the climate crisis you would hate him because of the badge he is under. Starmer's government (if elected) may well turn out to be shit and waga may prove to have been correct in his opprobrium all along, we'll have to wait and see. They'll have to be going some to outdo the last dozen or so years in terms of fucking up the country, but you never know! In the meantime, it's quite entertaining seeing the contrast in the amount of energy and focus spent on criticising what he says he might do, what he might not do and when he doesn't say anything at all, while, at the same time, exercising nowhere near the same level of critique on the actual government and their actual record There's nothing wrong with having high standards and expecting much needed change. For some it feels like "oh well he's better than the tories" is enough, and tbh I feel that rings similar to the rhetoric we see from philiteen except batting for the other team. It's startling the amount of Starmer fan boys who get offended by any form of criticism of him. They hold the tories to high standards but because starmer is labour that's enough for them - standards go out the window. Waga regularly criticises the Tory government too. Those who have spent the last number of years being hyper critical of every tory mishap but turn a blind eye towards Starmer are at risk of looking like hypocrites.
|
|
|
Post by adri2008 on Dec 13, 2023 17:59:15 GMT
Personally I think Starmer will run a competent government - he's a technocrat and will be effective at the nitty gritty of running the country on a day to day basis.
The issue is that I don't think he has any real vision of where the UK should be heading and won't deal with the underlying problems which largely stem from the country's aging population/reducing tax base i.e. how we are going to fund public services to the level they need whilst not further increasing the tax burden on workers. Something I don't actually think is possible myself but nobody seems willing to grasp this particular nettle.
I expect further managed decline with the excuse of 'we're picking up the pieces of the past 13 years of Tory misrule' rolled out for a decade or so.
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Dec 13, 2023 18:26:08 GMT
I know I'm very critical of Starmer myself, more so recently. But I don't doubt for one second that he will likely do a better job than what we've seen recently. I'm not contesting that.
When he does good speeches or yvette does a good speech I post that and compliment it. But I'm not going to stand back from criticising him either.
I shouldn't say starmer fan boys or reference philiteen either because that's maybe slightly personal. I defend Corbyn to the halt, many times were others think I'm wrong, so everyone is entitled to their view.
But being critical of Starmer doesn't mean I or others are suddenly complimenting sunak. Just like criticising Trump/Biden doesn't make you a supporter of the other.
I think Starmer should be better than what we've seen recently. And happy to agree ro disagree on things I criticise him over too. It's not personal (sorry philiteen for name dropping you as that maybe was unfair.)
|
|
|
Post by iancransonsknees on Dec 16, 2023 14:49:27 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2023 14:57:57 GMT
It’s a shame that people in the UK still use these terms to define themselves to be honest. I suppose it sounds better than, earns less than the median income of the country.
|
|
|
Post by iancransonsknees on Dec 16, 2023 15:28:20 GMT
It’s a shame that people in the UK still use these terms to define themselves to be honest. I suppose it sounds better than, earns less than the median income of the country. Class is probably the biggest barrier to progression and development in this country. It's certainly not a meritocracy.
|
|
|
Post by iancransonsknees on Dec 18, 2023 13:14:53 GMT
|
|
|
Post by phileetin on Dec 18, 2023 15:03:10 GMT
quote from die hard "Ho Ho Ho "
now i've got a machine gun
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2023 15:33:25 GMT
Honestly, a non-issue. I dislike Starmer because I think he’s a bit of a bellend. This wouldn’t sway my opinion one way or another. I also don’t believe it’s a real headline. Didn’t Izzard just fail to become Labour Candidate in Brighton? Hardly got the party’s full backing.
|
|
|
Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 3, 2024 9:56:59 GMT
Starmer to give yet another speech distancing himself from Jeremy Corbyn again today. Should be riveting..........
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Jan 3, 2024 19:52:09 GMT
Starmer to give yet another speech distancing himself from Jeremy Corbyn again today. Should be riveting.......... Most seats gained by a labour leader in a century. More than doubled the Labour membership to the highest levels seen since the 70s. It's a real shame that no left or central party is trying to take advantage of this situation. Labour best hope corbyn doesn't join or form another party because Starmers message is loud and clear. Corbyn supporters aren't welcome. Another murdoch sellout just like the last labour leader.
|
|
|
Post by iancransonsknees on Jan 3, 2024 19:53:31 GMT
Starmer to give yet another speech distancing himself from Jeremy Corbyn again today. Should be riveting.......... Most seats gained by a labour leader in a century. More than doubled the Labour membership to the highest levels seen since the 70s. It's a real shame that no left or central party is trying to take advantage of this situation. Labour best hope corbyn doesn't join or form another party because Starmers message is loud and clear. Corbyn supporters aren't welcome. Another murdoch sellout just like the last labour leader. He should join Reform with Nige.
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Jan 3, 2024 20:06:02 GMT
Most seats gained by a labour leader in a century. More than doubled the Labour membership to the highest levels seen since the 70s. It's a real shame that no left or central party is trying to take advantage of this situation. Labour best hope corbyn doesn't join or form another party because Starmers message is loud and clear. Corbyn supporters aren't welcome. Another murdoch sellout just like the last labour leader. He should join Reform with Nige. I actually think together they'd achieve quite alot. If it was an option at the polling station I'd take it over Sunak or Starmer.
|
|
|
Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 4, 2024 12:22:17 GMT
So Starmer is the man to clean up politics.
Probably not a good idea to bring Peter Mandleson into his inner circle then, especially when it was on record that he’d visited Epstein’s properties on a number of occasions at least one of which when he was in government…..
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Jan 8, 2024 1:36:05 GMT
Now this would be excellent.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2024 3:37:38 GMT
Now this would be excellent. . Would be a great way to keep Conservatives in power, as it stands. If Corbyn wants to go left, he should sit down and talk with someone like Braverman and do it at a time that she wants to create another party on the further right. The creating of genuine polar opposite parties would reinvigorate British politics. As it stands though, none of this sounds likely to happen. GB News are probably going to their boogeyman again to increase ratings.
|
|