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Post by musik on May 14, 2020 12:38:00 GMT
Curious: In England, do they say EVERYBODY will get Corona in the end?
It started w the former boss Giesecke here, and now several others have the same opinion.
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 12:43:31 GMT
What and allowed someone back into the nursing home? What I meant as well to the above question is what do you think the government should have done. 1. Well that's what the government were telling them to do, so why should they think to themselves, ah the government must be wrong, I'll ignore them and do what I think instead? 2. Not send them back until they had been tested negative. So my wife used common sense to (1) and demanded (2) Like I said, i wish more nursing home managers had used common sense and stood firm to protect all their staff and residents instead of either taking the money or being generally thick as I know of one.
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 14, 2020 12:46:52 GMT
Follow up to yesterday’s post about the Rhesus Monkey model. This is a paper detailing the efficacy of a single dose of the ChAdOx1 vaccine conferring protection to monkeys within that model despite constant exposure. Lower viral load found in the vaccinated monkeys, no onset of pneumonia and crucially no adverse effects. [mention]bayernoatcake [/mention] This is what we were discussing yesterday, model out first and then the small (but still important) vaccine study. Replicate this data in the Phase 1 trial underway, and we’ve got a start at least! Really good news that! Amazing how clever it all is.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2020 12:49:37 GMT
Follow up to yesterday’s post about the Rhesus Monkey model. This is a paper detailing the efficacy of a single dose of the ChAdOx1 vaccine conferring protection to monkeys within that model despite constant exposure. Lower viral load found in the vaccinated monkeys, no onset of pneumonia and crucially no adverse effects. [mention]bayernoatcake [/mention] This is what we were discussing yesterday, model out first and then the small (but still important) vaccine study. Replicate this data in the Phase 1 trial underway, and we’ve got a start at least! How significant is this news? How often in this type of vaccine work, once proven to work in monkeys, does it transfer into being successful and suitable for humans? Finally, will the vaccine be available tomorrow? 😉😀
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Post by werrington on May 14, 2020 12:50:53 GMT
1. Well that's what the government were telling them to do, so why should they think to themselves, ah the government must be wrong, I'll ignore them and do what I think instead? 2. Not send them back until they had been tested negative. So my wife used common sense to (1) and demanded (2) Like I said, i wish more nursing home managers had used common sense and stood firm to protect all their staff and residents instead of either taking the money or being generally thick as I know of one. In normal times Nursing/resi homes make a lot of money from hospitals in regards homes suitable for patient discharge if that patient is unable to return home The majority aren’t daft and won’t
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 14, 2020 12:54:10 GMT
Follow up to yesterday’s post about the Rhesus Monkey model. This is a paper detailing the efficacy of a single dose of the ChAdOx1 vaccine conferring protection to monkeys within that model despite constant exposure. Lower viral load found in the vaccinated monkeys, no onset of pneumonia and crucially no adverse effects. [mention]bayernoatcake [/mention] This is what we were discussing yesterday, model out first and then the small (but still important) vaccine study. Replicate this data in the Phase 1 trial underway, and we’ve got a start at least! How significant is this news? How often in this type of vaccine work, once proven to work in monkeys, does it transfer into being successful and suitable for humans? Finally, will the vaccine be available tomorrow? 😉😀 It’s good because it further adds to the safety profile of the vector, which has been now well established for multiple diseases. Including MERS. So you now wouldn’t expect the vaccine trial to produce adverse effects as a bare minimum. But, we still have to wait. Transfer from models to successful treatments/prophylaxis is pretty poor unfortunately (that’s often due to the ridiculous amount of candidates being screened too for any disease) but most pre-clinical models in research use rodents rather than monkeys, as the ethical/administrative/housing restrictions with using monkeys are extensive and often unaffordable. So a monkey is a better model than a rat or mouse so it does have a better replication of success in humans when transferred from the model. But, without sounding too much like a broken record, we really can’t say anything until that trial is complete as crap as that is!
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2020 12:59:18 GMT
How significant is this news? How often in this type of vaccine work, once proven to work in monkeys, does it transfer into being successful and suitable for humans? Finally, will the vaccine be available tomorrow? 😉😀 It’s good because it further adds to the safety profile of the vector, which has been now well established for multiple diseases. Including MERS. So you now wouldn’t expect the vaccine trial to produce adverse effects as a bare minimum. But, we still have to wait. Transfer from models to successful treatments/prophylaxis is pretty poor unfortunately (that’s often due to the ridiculous amount of candidates being screened too for any disease) but most pre-clinical models in research use rodents rather than monkeys, as the ethical/administrative/housing restrictions with using monkeys are extensive and often unaffordable. So a monkey is a better model than a rat or mouse so it does have a better replication of success in humans when transferred from the model. But, without sounding too much like a broken record, we really can’t say anything until that trial is complete as crap as that is! Does the trial finish over the weekend?
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 12:59:43 GMT
Follow up to yesterday’s post about the Rhesus Monkey model. This is a paper detailing the efficacy of a single dose of the ChAdOx1 vaccine conferring protection to monkeys within that model despite constant exposure. Lower viral load found in the vaccinated monkeys, no onset of pneumonia and crucially no adverse effects. [mention]bayernoatcake [/mention] This is what we were discussing yesterday, model out first and then the small (but still important) vaccine study. Replicate this data in the Phase 1 trial underway, and we’ve got a start at least! Wonder if Chad on here knows more about the Chad vaccine? 😉
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 13:02:03 GMT
Follow up to yesterday’s post about the Rhesus Monkey model. This is a paper detailing the efficacy of a single dose of the ChAdOx1 vaccine conferring protection to monkeys within that model despite constant exposure. Lower viral load found in the vaccinated monkeys, no onset of pneumonia and crucially no adverse effects. [mention]bayernoatcake [/mention] This is what we were discussing yesterday, model out first and then the small (but still important) vaccine study. Replicate this data in the Phase 1 trial underway, and we’ve got a start at least! Excuse me for being a bit think with some of this. Didn't they highlight hundreds in stoke for some kind of trial testing on a vaccine?
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Post by Paul Spencer on May 14, 2020 13:05:49 GMT
1. Well that's what the government were telling them to do, so why should they think to themselves, ah the government must be wrong, I'll ignore them and do what I think instead? 2. Not send them back until they had been tested negative. So my wife used common sense to (1) and demanded (2) Like I said, i wish more nursing home managers had used common sense and stood firm to protect all their staff and residents instead of either taking the money or being generally thick as I know of one. Come on mate, you can't seriously expect people to go against the government advice, thinking they know better. You're calling people thick because they didn't listen to what the government were telling them to do? Don't you think it would have been easier if the government hadn't advised them wrongly in the first place?
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 14, 2020 13:06:36 GMT
Follow up to yesterday’s post about the Rhesus Monkey model. This is a paper detailing the efficacy of a single dose of the ChAdOx1 vaccine conferring protection to monkeys within that model despite constant exposure. Lower viral load found in the vaccinated monkeys, no onset of pneumonia and crucially no adverse effects. [mention]bayernoatcake [/mention] This is what we were discussing yesterday, model out first and then the small (but still important) vaccine study. Replicate this data in the Phase 1 trial underway, and we’ve got a start at least! Excuse me for being a bit think with some of this. Didn't they highlight hundreds in stoke for some kind of trial testing on a vaccine? Loads of Royal Stoke patients have enlisted and taken in clinical trials for a lot of different treatments, not for the vaccine but still really commendable.
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 13:13:19 GMT
So my wife used common sense to (1) and demanded (2) Like I said, i wish more nursing home managers had used common sense and stood firm to protect all their staff and residents instead of either taking the money or being generally thick as I know of one. Come on mate, you can't seriously expect people to go against the government advice, thinking they know better. You're calling people thick because they didn't listen to what the government were telling them to do? Don't you think it would have been easier if the government hadn't advised them wrongly in the first place? No I do expect them to go against what the nhs hospital are trying get then to do. Offering residents for money either without being tested or some that have covid after being tested? I really can't understand any nursing home to allow this. Like I say my wife knows one or two homes that have willingly taken them in and had plenty of deaths. Sorry, if I was a nursing home manager or owner I couldn't live with myself for putting the rest of my nursing home staff and residents at risk.
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Post by sheikhmomo on May 14, 2020 13:14:06 GMT
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 13:14:27 GMT
Excuse me for being a bit think with some of this. Didn't they highlight hundreds in stoke for some kind of trial testing on a vaccine? Loads of Royal Stoke patients have enlisted and taken in clinical trials for a lot of different treatments, not for the vaccine but still really commendable. Is that the drugs and stuff?
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 13:27:19 GMT
So my wife used common sense to (1) and demanded (2) Like I said, i wish more nursing home managers had used common sense and stood firm to protect all their staff and residents instead of either taking the money or being generally thick as I know of one. Come on mate, you can't seriously expect people to go against the government advice, thinking they know better. You're calling people thick because they didn't listen to what the government were telling them to do? Don't you think it would have been easier if the government hadn't advised them wrongly in the first place? Paul. My wife was asked, no told, to go out with 4 of the residents to the post office to draw out their funds for the monthly payments for the home, this was in the middle of lockdown. She refused and said no way am I taking my residents out of the nursing home and that the money will still be there to draw back on at later date. She stuck to that and said now way. I know the government and nhs whatever have made mistakes but a lot of stuff I hear off my wife about various nursing homes makes me just sit in amazement at the lack of understanding what's going on in the world and back to a bit of common sense.
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Post by Paul Spencer on May 14, 2020 13:27:29 GMT
Come on mate, you can't seriously expect people to go against the government advice, thinking they know better. You're calling people thick because they didn't listen to what the government were telling them to do? Don't you think it would have been easier if the government hadn't advised them wrongly in the first place? No I do expect them to go against what the nhs hospital are trying get then to do. Offering residents for money either without being tested or some that have covid after being tested? I really can't understand any nursing home to allow this. Like I say my wife knows one or two homes that have willingly taken them in and had plenty of deaths. Sorry, if I was a nursing home manager or owner I couldn't live with myself for putting the rest of my nursing home staff and residents at risk. Because that's exactly what the official advice told them to do. " As part of the national effort, the care sector also plays a vital role in accepting patients as they are discharged from hospital - both because recuperation is better in non-accute settings and because hospitals need to have enough beds to treat acutely sick patients. Residents may also be admitted to a care home from a home setting. Some of these patients my have COVID-19, whether symptomatic or asymptomatic. ALL of these patients can be safely cared for in a care home if the guidance is followed.""Negative tests are NOT required prior to transfers/admissions into the care home." So what you're saying, is that care home managers across the country, should have said, well that's a load of old bollocks, straight in the bin you go, I know better. Seriously?
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Post by Han Solo on May 14, 2020 13:34:02 GMT
I think you have something of a romanticised view of WW2. Throughout the conflict there remained a body of opinion that we should not be at war with Germany - some for pacifist reasons, others more idealogical. Numerous people avoided conscription, 'funkholes' for the wealthy existed whilst there was a thriving black market and rapes during air raids were not uncommon. It just didn't show you all that in the Pathe news reels which was subject to censorship anyway. Meanwhile back in the present - yes we've had bog roll hoarders and footballers parties breaking the lockdown but we've slso had massive lockdown compliance, over one million official volunteers to help the elderly and the shielded, thousands of local unofficial volunteer groups, students unable to study backfilling in foodbanks where regular stalwarts are self isolating and millions coming out of their houses every Thursday to show support for Care and Key workers. Social media message boards such as this are binary devices on which extreme arguements develop, some of it interesting, most of it frankly bollocks and - in the case of the Oatcake - generally populated by white middle aged males. It is therefore not representative of the wider population which by and large seems to have acted responsibly andcwith a spirit of community not seen for a few generations. As my old grandad used to say."The Good Old Days?? There wanner any!" Brilliant response SB. As one who lived through most of the war I can agree with your granddad's sentiments. Then came the 50's and 60's and I can honestly say they were the two stand-out decades following the war because people were, for the most part, pulling in the same direction. After the 60's we again became a dog-eat-dog nation where togetherness was discarded; replaced by ideological bullshit. But now, as we enter this existential crisis for humanity, we're again witnessing acts of self-sacrifice and unselfishness from many as we did after the war. There'll always be exceptions and pigs with snouts in the trough, but on the whole we're doing okay despite incompetence from those who should not be incompetent. OS. A good post OS and I’m happy to admit I get things wrong. I guess the mass media doesn’t help sometimes we don’t have a clue what’s going on there’s so much pulling and pushing and point scoring. I have been working the last 2-3 months and have to say with the odd exceptions (and they are a minority which often get in the paper) people are doing well.
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Post by sportsman on May 14, 2020 13:34:05 GMT
No I do expect them to go against what the nhs hospital are trying get then to do. Offering residents for money either without being tested or some that have covid after being tested? I really can't understand any nursing home to allow this. Like I say my wife knows one or two homes that have willingly taken them in and had plenty of deaths. Sorry, if I was a nursing home manager or owner I couldn't live with myself for putting the rest of my nursing home staff and residents at risk. Because that's exactly what the official advice told them to do. " As part of the national effort, the care sector also plays a vital role in accepting patients as they are discharged from hospital - both because recuperation is better in non-accute settings and because hospitals need to have enough beds to treat acutely sick patients. Residents may also be admitted to a care home from a home setting. Some of these patients my have COVID-19, whether symptomatic or asymptomatic. ALL of these patients can be safely cared for in a care home if the guidance is followed.""Negative tests are NOT required prior to transfers/admissions into the care home." So what you're saying, is that care home managers across the country, should have said, well that's a load of old bollocks, straight in the bin you go, I know better. Seriously? I can only go on what my wife told the hospital in her case and that she refused until she had been tested. I take it that guidance has changed now. Where is that from and have you got the up to date one.
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Post by Paul Spencer on May 14, 2020 13:40:28 GMT
Because that's exactly what the official advice told them to do. " As part of the national effort, the care sector also plays a vital role in accepting patients as they are discharged from hospital - both because recuperation is better in non-accute settings and because hospitals need to have enough beds to treat acutely sick patients. Residents may also be admitted to a care home from a home setting. Some of these patients my have COVID-19, whether symptomatic or asymptomatic. ALL of these patients can be safely cared for in a care home if the guidance is followed.""Negative tests are NOT required prior to transfers/admissions into the care home." So what you're saying, is that care home managers across the country, should have said, well that's a load of old bollocks, straight in the bin you go, I know better. Seriously? I can only go on what my wife told the hospital in her case and that she refused until she had been tested. I take it that guidance has changed now. Where is that from and have you got the up to date one.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2020 13:50:05 GMT
UK reports 3,446 new coronavirus cases and 428 new deaths in the last 24hrs taking the totals to 233,151 cases and 33,614 deaths.
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Post by Paul Spencer on May 14, 2020 13:56:50 GMT
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Post by crapslinger on May 14, 2020 13:57:23 GMT
I think the saddest thing for me with this whole virus is the negativity from so many and the amount of selfishness in society. So different to WW2 where everyone appeared to pull together to defeat the common goal. The feeling is so different Today where everyone’s just trying to point-score against each other whether it’s politicians, press or just posters on here. I appreciate it’s a very different fight but if we’d had the same attitude in 39-45 then Hitler would be laughing his boots off because we’d be fighting each other and not him. One of the biggest problems now is the mass media and the fact that everyone has a voice. Not a bad thing some would say but mighty confusing when everyone thinks they’re right. Reading some of the posts on here we might as well just give up now. Fuck me harping on about ww2. Where we got rid of a leader not doing his job right and replaced him with a better one. Where everything wasn’t rosy, the black market was rife, you needed wardens on the street to tell people to “put that light out” etc. Romanticised horse shite. The amount of people that don’t think a government should be held accountable is frightening. The only government that is accountable for this World wide pandemic is the lying deceitful, oppressive communist government of the PRC the rest is waffle and piss to suit mainly the left wing losers agendas, ironically it's a left wing Pariah state that is at the heart of this shitstorm you couldn't make it up.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2020 13:58:30 GMT
Fuck me harping on about ww2. Where we got rid of a leader not doing his job right and replaced him with a better one. Where everything wasn’t rosy, the black market was rife, you needed wardens on the street to tell people to “put that light out” etc. Romanticised horse shite. The amount of people that don’t think a government should be held accountable is frightening. The only government that is accountable for this World wide pandemic is the lying deceitful, oppressive communist government of the PRC the rest is waffle and piss to suit mainly the left wing losers agendas, ironically it's a left wing Pariah state that is at the heart of this shitstorm you couldn't make it up. You just did......
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Post by Gods on May 14, 2020 14:04:29 GMT
We really did go too far protecting the NHS hospitals it seems.
Emptied bed loads of Covid infected patients in to our Care Homes to free up hospital beds while all the additional hospital capacity we hurriedly put together at Excel, NEC etc. went unused.
It was well intentioned I'm sure but we're paying a terrible price.
It would help if ministers and medics admitted they messed up rather than continuing to hawk around this 'Care Homes were an equal priority to the NHS from Day 1' baloney.
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Post by thisisouryear on May 14, 2020 14:15:04 GMT
Fuck me harping on about ww2. Where we got rid of a leader not doing his job right and replaced him with a better one. Where everything wasn’t rosy, the black market was rife, you needed wardens on the street to tell people to “put that light out” etc. Romanticised horse shite. The amount of people that don’t think a government should be held accountable is frightening. The only government that is accountable for this World wide pandemic is the lying deceitful, oppressive communist government of the PRC the rest is waffle and piss to suit mainly the left wing losers agendas, ironically it's a left wing Pariah state that is at the heart of this shitstorm you couldn't make it up. Ok, so what should we do?
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Post by Gods on May 14, 2020 14:23:06 GMT
Office for National Statistics ONS - 148,000 infected with coronavirus in the last fortnight so just over 10,000 new cases per day.
The Guardian said experts were estimating double that last weekend so overall maybe not as bad as some sages thought.
2nd mini-peak looks nailed on on this basis though you would imagine. Still plenty of the virus flying around.
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Post by spitthedog on May 14, 2020 14:25:02 GMT
Fuck me harping on about ww2. Where we got rid of a leader not doing his job right and replaced him with a better one. Where everything wasn’t rosy, the black market was rife, you needed wardens on the street to tell people to “put that light out” etc. Romanticised horse shite. The amount of people that don’t think a government should be held accountable is frightening. The only government that is accountable for this World wide pandemic is the lying deceitful, oppressive communist government of the PRC the rest is waffle and piss to suit mainly the left wing losers agendas, ironically it's a left wing Pariah state that is at the heart of this shitstorm you couldn't make it up. So...how is that useful or helpful in anyway to people in the UK at the moment??? So if someone comes to burn down your house, you wouldn't try to put the fire out, rather you would be content to sit their watching it burn while pointing your finger in the direction of the person you thought responsible.
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Post by adri2008 on May 14, 2020 14:28:13 GMT
We really did go too far protecting the NHS hospitals it seems. Emptied bed loads of Covid infected patients in to our Care Homes to free up hospital beds while all the additional hospital capacity we hurriedly put together at Excel, NEC etc. went unused. It was well intentioned I'm sure but we're paying a terrible price. It would help if ministers and medics admitted they messed up rather than continuing to hawk around this 'Care Homes were an equal priority to the NHS from Day 1' baloney. To be fair to the government, initially the various models were predicting massive hospitalisation peaks which would have completely swamped the NHS several times over with nowhere near enough ventilators to keep people alive. They just don't seem to have reacted quickly enough once it became clear that this wasn't happening and the virus has continued to 'gut' nursing homes after hospital deaths began falling.
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 14, 2020 14:28:43 GMT
Office for National Statistics ONS - 148,000 infected with coronavirus in the last fortnight so just over 10,000 new cases per day. The Guardian was estimating double that last weekend so maybe not as bad as thought 2nd mini-peak looks nailed on on this basis you would imagine. Still plenty of the virus flying around. Still only an estimate though. No idea what it means tbh
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Post by mrcoke on May 14, 2020 14:34:25 GMT
Apologies if this has been covered already (as in the interests of my sanity I am trying to avoid this thread as much as possible). Israel claims to be very close to producing an oral vaccine: www.jpost.com/health-science/israeli-scientists-in-three-weeks-we-will-have-coronavirus-vaccine-619101but this was some weeks ago and may be false - I bow to the experts on this MB to comment. I heard about it this morning in a prayer meeting from a retired doctor who is very active in supporting israel. Israeli scientists are on the cusp of developing the first vaccine against the novel coronavirus, according to Science and Technology Minister Ofir Akunis. If all goes as planned, the vaccine could be ready within a few weeks and available in 90 days, according to a release. (Akunis made his statement at the end of February.)
“Congratulations to MIGAL [The Galilee Research Institute] on this exciting breakthrough,” Akunis said. “I am confident there will be further rapid progress, enabling us to provide a needed response to the grave global COVID-19 threat,” Akunis said, referring to the disease caused by the novel coronavirus.
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