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Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 14:41:05 GMT
and we aren't breaking those rules as far as anyone of us know. We are managing the situation and we aren't sailing close enough to the wind that the manager has been forced to sell players he doesn't want to let go. We are sailing that close that we were prevented from bringing in a striker in January or are you saying MON didn't think we needed one ? Of he isn't don't be a twat if we were sailing too close re FFP Collins would have been sold for the below par offer Burnley offered we have of course spent a bit this window obviously O'Neill wants a striker but he wants a good one so in conclusion we must be not in danger re FFP i.e. we are not going to get 12 points deduction (as you have promised we will) but neither can we go out & spend the £7m+ we would need to to get a goalscorer
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 14:52:51 GMT
We are sailing that close that we were prevented from bringing in a striker in January or are you saying MON didn't think we needed one ? I'm not sure we were prevented from bringing in a Striker. Pretty sure in either the pre or post match press conference of our last fixture he referenced trying to get a couple of striker options in but that the clubs in question weren't prepared to let the players come. It's good that we aren't spending money on players we don't want isn't it? Indeed we have done more than enough of that already, fact is we needed a striker desperately but ended up letting one go.
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 14:57:26 GMT
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Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 14:57:26 GMT
I'm not sure we were prevented from bringing in a Striker. Pretty sure in either the pre or post match press conference of our last fixture he referenced trying to get a couple of striker options in but that the clubs in question weren't prepared to let the players come. It's good that we aren't spending money on players we don't want isn't it? Indeed we have done more than enough of that already, fact is we needed a striker desperately but ended up letting one go. Replace striker with goalscorer and no we didn't let one go. Last goalscorer we let go was Thorne
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 14:57:29 GMT
So they are not really bothered about a points deduction, maybe you are right that would be one plausible reason. Anyone who really believed the likes of Afobe, Ince, Woods and McClean would take us back up with the dross we still had on our books is at best delusional. Would you want the Directors and the CEO saying who is and who isn’t a good player ? If I was investing that amount of money I would ensure that I was satisfied that all due diligence had been carried out especially after the situation with Imbula, Wimmer and Berahino wouldn't you ?
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Post by wuzza on Feb 10, 2021 15:21:30 GMT
Would you want the Directors and the CEO saying who is and who isn’t a good player ? If I was investing that amount of money I would ensure that I was satisfied that all due diligence had been carried out especially after the situation with Imbula, Wimmer and Berahino wouldn't you ? I’m sure it was. I not certain the problems we have had post Hughes have been attitude issues just playing ability. Like I said a Director of Football might help with that scenario but a lot of managers ain’t keen on that.
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Post by march4 on Feb 10, 2021 15:28:11 GMT
I was not really on about the signings under MON apart from Fletcher who will not be on a low wage, Mikel due to his age is short term I understand that, Chester is short term and not a massive success , Brown £2m is terrible especially as we seem to have spunked away whatever leeway we had due to FFP, the problem lies with the BOD which includes Teflon Tony do you believe he still deserves to be in the position he is in ? no he doesn't & have been arguing for his removal for years now, but don't agree with your assessment there Brown is super cheap at £2m & very low wages, other than the kids who have come through he must be on the lowest wages on the books Fletcher will be on more but he's not going to be on the stupid wages the likes of Wimmer,Ince,Afobe e.t.c will be on , he's good value, all O'Neill signings are even Brown But Brown isn’t super cheap when the £2M we spent on him is the only £2M we have.
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Post by Squeekster on Feb 10, 2021 15:35:54 GMT
If you accept that we are a manager led club and that the board/owners have done everything possible to support their managers, couldn't it be argued that we are actually doing a half decent job of managing a very difficult situation whilst remaining compliant with rules around FFP? Why would I accept we are a manager led club ? because you say so, the difficult situation we find ourselves in is self inflicted is that not obvious millions thrown away on poor players with poor attitudes on huge wages on long contracts with little or no resale value that is the reason we are in this mess, all overseen by our board of directors and CEO. Why would I accept we are a manager led club ? Because Hughes made it perfectly clear he wanted Berahino and the club bent over backwards to get him after a long chase, it was common knowledge he insisted on Wimmer and Imbula and was the one chasing N'dye who we signed after he'd gone. Rowett and Phillips insisted that Afobie would fire us back to the prem and Rowett insisted on Woods and really wanted Ince.PS forgot about Vokes. I'd say we were at the time a manager led club.
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 16:01:51 GMT
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Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 16:01:51 GMT
no he doesn't & have been arguing for his removal for years now, but don't agree with your assessment there Brown is super cheap at £2m & very low wages, other than the kids who have come through he must be on the lowest wages on the books Fletcher will be on more but he's not going to be on the stupid wages the likes of Wimmer,Ince,Afobe e.t.c will be on , he's good value, all O'Neill signings are even Brown But Brown isn’t super cheap when the £2M we spent on him is the only £2M we have. Well it obviously wasn't as we have spent more money since His wages will be super cheap If you think spending under £3m is likely to get you a goalscorer your off your bonce
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:08:05 GMT
no he doesn't & have been arguing for his removal for years now, but don't agree with your assessment there Brown is super cheap at £2m & very low wages, other than the kids who have come through he must be on the lowest wages on the books Fletcher will be on more but he's not going to be on the stupid wages the likes of Wimmer,Ince,Afobe e.t.c will be on , he's good value, all O'Neill signings are even Brown But Brown isn’t super cheap when the £2M we spent on him is the only £2M we have. I have tried to reason this point, £2m on a poor player is £2m wasted that could have been used to buy striker that we desperately need.
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 16:09:45 GMT
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Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 16:09:45 GMT
But Brown isn’t super cheap when the £2M we spent on him is the only £2M we have. I have tried to reason this point, £2m on a poor player is £2m wasted that could have been used to buy striker that we desperately need. £2m would not buy you a goalscorer Toney, standard we need, was £11m
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:12:54 GMT
If I was investing that amount of money I would ensure that I was satisfied that all due diligence had been carried out especially after the situation with Imbula, Wimmer and Berahino wouldn't you ? I’m sure it was. I not certain the problems we have had post Hughes have been attitude issues just playing ability. Like I said a Director of Football might help with that scenario but a lot of managers ain’t keen on that. Due diligence should cover playing ability surely as we watch each potential signing 25 times before we sign them it would have been clearly apparent that they we not of the required standard.
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:16:15 GMT
I have tried to reason this point, £2m on a poor player is £2m wasted that could have been used to buy striker that we desperately need. £2m would not buy you a goalscorer Toney, standard we need, was £11m £2m would have paid for a decent loan until the end of the season I would have thought, instead we have a player on our books on contract who will be drawing a wage until the contract ends who will most likely be a bit part squad filler another body in the building contributing very little.
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:19:11 GMT
Indeed we have done more than enough of that already, fact is we needed a striker desperately but ended up letting one go. Replace striker with goalscorer and no we didn't let one go. Last goalscorer we let go was Thorne How many did Gregory score last season ?
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 16:20:34 GMT
via mobile
Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 16:20:34 GMT
£2m would not buy you a goalscorer Toney, standard we need, was £11m £2m would have paid for a decent loan until the end of the season I would have thought, instead we have a player on our books on contract who will be drawing a wage until the contract ends who will most likely be a bit part squad filler another body in the building contributing very little. Any one we could have got on a £2m loan? I see Gayle is out of contract, 31 and big wages mind
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 16:21:14 GMT
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Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 16:21:14 GMT
Replace striker with goalscorer and no we didn't let one go. Last goalscorer we let go was Thorne How many did Gregory score last season ? 7 in 46 games
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:22:13 GMT
Why would I accept we are a manager led club ? because you say so, the difficult situation we find ourselves in is self inflicted is that not obvious millions thrown away on poor players with poor attitudes on huge wages on long contracts with little or no resale value that is the reason we are in this mess, all overseen by our board of directors and CEO. Why would I accept we are a manager led club ? Because Hughes made it perfectly clear he wanted Berahino and the club bent over backwards to get him after a long chase, it was common knowledge he insisted on Wimmer and Imbula and was the one chasing N'dye who we signed after he'd gone. Rowett and Phillips insisted that Afobie would fire us back to the prem and Rowett insisted on Woods and really wanted Ince.PS forgot about Vokes. I'd say we were at the time a manager led club. Ah the good old common knowledge chestnut.
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 16:22:49 GMT
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Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 16:22:49 GMT
Why would I accept we are a manager led club ? Because Hughes made it perfectly clear he wanted Berahino and the club bent over backwards to get him after a long chase, it was common knowledge he insisted on Wimmer and Imbula and was the one chasing N'dye who we signed after he'd gone. Rowett and Phillips insisted that Afobie would fire us back to the prem and Rowett insisted on Woods and really wanted Ince.PS forgot about Vokes. I'd say we were at the time a manager led club. Ah the good old common knowledge chestnut. What's wrong with you?
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:24:00 GMT
How many did Gregory score last season ? 7 in 46 games How many of those 46 games did he start ?
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:25:23 GMT
Ah the good old common knowledge chestnut. What's wrong with you? Nowt what's wrong with you ?
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 16:27:02 GMT
via mobile
Post by lordb on Feb 10, 2021 16:27:02 GMT
How many of those 46 games did he start ? Don't know
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Feb 10, 2021 16:42:44 GMT
But Brown isn’t super cheap when the £2M we spent on him is the only £2M we have. I have tried to reason this point, £2m on a poor player is £2m wasted that could have been used to buy striker that we desperately need. £2M in the Summer on a forward was a bit of a gamble nothing more. MON has bought in younger players who he must think he might be able to develop(silk purse from a sow’s ear). £2M just doesn’t buy you a ready made forward of the standard required. We’ve seen how difficult it is to get it right when you’re spending loads on what’s meant to be the finished article, times that by ten when you’re buying potential. Not saying he doesn’t look a bad buy but can’t call him a massive mistake either.
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Post by Squeekster on Feb 10, 2021 16:46:51 GMT
Why would I accept we are a manager led club ? Because Hughes made it perfectly clear he wanted Berahino and the club bent over backwards to get him after a long chase, it was common knowledge he insisted on Wimmer and Imbula and was the one chasing N'dye who we signed after he'd gone. Rowett and Phillips insisted that Afobie would fire us back to the prem and Rowett insisted on Woods and really wanted Ince.PS forgot about Vokes. I'd say we were at the time a manager led club. Ah the good old common knowledge chestnut. So Hughes and Rowett spoke publicly about wanting those players I mentioned but it's okay for you to guess what goes on at boardroom as true hey, because of your superior knowledge I'm out!
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 16:52:50 GMT
How many of those 46 games did he start ? Don't know 2019-2020
41 appearances 1 was FA Cup 2077 mins played sub 18 out of 40 league appearances 6 league goals 1 cup goal.
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Post by wuzza on Feb 10, 2021 17:08:17 GMT
I’m sure it was. I not certain the problems we have had post Hughes have been attitude issues just playing ability. Like I said a Director of Football might help with that scenario but a lot of managers ain’t keen on that. Due diligence should cover playing ability surely as we watch each potential signing 25 times before we sign them it would have been clearly apparent that they we not of the required standard. Who tells the manager - ‘sorry in our opinion you don’t know what you are talking about regarding football ... but keep on working for us’ ?
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 17:17:23 GMT
Due diligence should cover playing ability surely as we watch each potential signing 25 times before we sign them it would have been clearly apparent that they we not of the required standard. Who tells the manager - ‘sorry in our opinion you don’t know what you are talking about regarding football ... but keep on working for us’ ? Someone with a backbone and some footballing knowledge ? would be in a worse position if said managers had spit their dummy out and resigned ?
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Post by wuzza on Feb 10, 2021 17:21:34 GMT
Who tells the manager - ‘sorry in our opinion you don’t know what you are talking about regarding football ... but keep on working for us’ ? Someone with a backbone and some footballing knowledge ? would be in a worse position if said managers had spit their dummy out and resigned ? There we go - back to a Director of Football not a CEO who is effectively a facilitator when it comes to transfers etc.
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 17:23:33 GMT
Ah the good old common knowledge chestnut. So Hughes and Rowett spoke publicly about wanting those players I mentioned but it's okay for you to guess what goes on at boardroom as true hey, because of your superior knowledge I'm out! Apologies but I never heard them say anything about players they wanted, you might be right can you show me where they stated this ?
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 10, 2021 17:25:54 GMT
Someone with a backbone and some footballing knowledge ? would be in a worse position if said managers had spit their dummy out and resigned ? There we go - back to a Director of Football not a CEO who is effectively a facilitator when it comes to transfers etc. We should appoint a DOF then someone who could also carry out the role as a facilitator as that must take about three weeks a year.
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Gregory
Feb 10, 2021 17:30:55 GMT
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Post by gingerninja on Feb 10, 2021 17:30:55 GMT
I am pretty confident we will bring in one, if not 2 strikers in the summer.. looking forward to seeing which ones.
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Post by wuzza on Feb 10, 2021 17:33:30 GMT
There we go - back to a Director of Football not a CEO who is effectively a facilitator when it comes to transfers etc. We should appoint a DOF then someone who could also carry out the role as a facilitator as that must take about three weeks a year. I’m sure a CEO has many other functions other than player acquisition but at least we have come full circle to the point that the one thing he ain’t is a football adviser to the manager and what he does do is whatever he can to fulfil the requirements of the man employed to bring success on the park. Hence our contract situation is what it is and heaping abuse on the bloke for this particular issue really is tilting at windmills.
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