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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Jul 30, 2019 13:24:11 GMT
I don't think QPR will be a pushover. Eze impressed at Stoke last season and of course Geoff Cameron is bound to score. Mark Warburton will be keen to rebuild his reputation. Like a lot of last season, they will come here trying not to get beat. I guess they'll sit deep, let us have a lot of the ball and try to break fast. I'd certainly take a scrappy 1-0 win right now, just to get us off and running. I'd bite your arm for a 1-0 win tbh. As you say, they're gonna sit and try and hit us on the break. Have we learnt how to break a side down? It's a big test on the first day. The attacking movement off the ball in pre-season certainly provides some encouragement in that respect. It's something we've not done in a while, coupled with no progressive passing options from the midfield. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 30, 2019 13:25:59 GMT
I'd bite your arm for a 1-0 win tbh. As you say, they're gonna sit and try and hit us on the break. Have we learnt how to break a side down? It's a big test on the first day. The attacking movement off the ball in pre-season certainly provides some encouragement in that respect. It's something we've not done in a while, coupled with no progressive passing options from the midfield. I've only watched the Leicester game and I thought it was toss so I'm not as expectant as others!  |
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Post by okeydokeystokie2 on Jul 30, 2019 13:39:23 GMT
Our ability (or inability) to break down teams that sit back will be the main thing that dictates our season. Last year our off the ball movement was fucking none existent at times. From what I've seen in pre-season, it looks to have gotten a bit better and the players look fitter. Powell is likely going to be our most important player this year. Totally agree. Just worries me that he'll have little support. Agree with you both. I've said previously that in Nick Powell we might just have the Championship's Player of the Season. "God Willing" he stays fit and motivated. It looks like he's going to start with Afobe, so his running off Vokes and in behind will be massive if we are to break teams down. There isn't going to be a lot of space behind either. If he makes those runs, Powell has the ability to find him. If we didn't sign Gayle, it wouldn't surprise me to see Ty Campbell force his way in. From what little I've seen, he's fast, mobile and a decent finisher and might fit in our front 3 better. Happy to trust what NJ sees on the training pitch though. I'm excited about seeing how it develops and as I have been for the last 48 years, insanely and irrationally optimistic with 3 days to go until kick off. |
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Post by bloodtypered on Jul 30, 2019 16:19:29 GMT
qpr have signed 9 players and have a decent manager
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Post by pez75 on Jul 30, 2019 16:32:37 GMT
There are fans with extreme views at each end of the spectrum but the majority sit somewhere in the middle and will offer patience & support. If & when the mutterings of discontent grow louder and more widespread, then Jones will have no-one but himself to blame. It is in his hands now.
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Post by mrcoke on Jul 30, 2019 16:50:22 GMT
There are fans with extreme views at each end of the spectrum but the majority sit somewhere in the middle and will offer patience & support. If & when the mutterings of discontent grow louder and more widespread, then Jones will have no-one but himself to blame. It is in his hands now. Thank goodness for a bit of sanity. As was pointed out above, Jones now has his own squad. He is choosing to play a particular way, let's see how his team performs. Certainly this pre-season has looked better than 12 months ago. 12 months ago I was optimistically waiting for the season to start. We had held onto some crown jewels who were expected to depart, we had got a fresh manager with his own ideas, we had spent big. The pre-season performances had been pretty dire, but no matter we were the bookies' favourite for promotion. If the first 10 games go the same way as Rowett's first 10 games, then I will possibly join the ranks of those who suspect we have hired a bum manager again, but somehow I don't think we will be shipping goals like those first 10 games. Our problem is going to be scoring, although with a packed MF, attacking FBs, and 2 strikers, if we can't score goals then someone wants shooting! |
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Post by wuzza on Jul 30, 2019 16:50:30 GMT
To be fair Jones doesn’t make half the excuses as some on this board do or indeed have anywhere near as low expectations of his or the team’s performance.
To listen to some he only has to get the team to the right place at the right time for the kick off and that’s him doing an admirable job ‘in the circumstances’.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 30, 2019 17:07:23 GMT
To be fair Jones doesn’t make half the excuses as some on this board do or indeed have anywhere near as low expectations of his or the team’s performance. To listen to some he only has to get the team to the right place at the right time for the kick off and that’s him doing an admirable job ‘in the circumstances’. His optimism is admirable. |
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Post by stokeson on Jul 30, 2019 17:41:49 GMT
Am I missing something .Hes got to be given 3 seasons and 5 windows and then we will play like "LUTON" one of the greatest clubs in football .What has changed?
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jul 30, 2019 18:01:20 GMT
There are fans with extreme views at each end of the spectrum but the majority sit somewhere in the middle and will offer patience & support. If & when the mutterings of discontent grow louder and more widespread, then Jones will have no-one but himself to blame. It is in his hands now. As far as I can see Jones has been completely upfront about taking responsibility for what happens on the pitch and has set his stall at aiming for promotion - which is what any manager would say if they are serious about motivating their players. Whether we are there yet is another matter. The real question is what counts as "success" for most fans. For me a top 8 finish in the circumstances of what is a complete squad rebuild would be a decent outcome. Whether that is good enough for the majority of fans is another question entirely - especially as a good number haven't really accepted the reality that we are now just one of 19 out of 24 (I think) ex-Premiership clubs in the Championship. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 18:04:45 GMT
Am I missing something .Hes got to be given 3 seasons and 5 windows and then we will play like "LUTON" one of the greatest clubs in football .What has changed? I’m confused too...they must have thought 3 seasons and 5 windows must have been to get in the Champions League 😂 Or signing an average DM and another No.10 to play in a system which suits no-one else whatsoever is enough to have changed the goal posts? |
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Post by philb on Jul 30, 2019 19:57:21 GMT
If we can't beat QPR at home then we might as well pack up. Can’t really have asked for a better chance of a good start really. We’re at home against average opposition. Should be the 3 points we need to at least settle everybody’s nerves. Like you say it’ll be a bit worrying if we lose on Saturday, but it is only one game. Got a good feeling we’ll all be walking away from the ground at 5 o’ clock with 3 points in the bag and the start we were hoping for 🤞😀 |
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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Jul 30, 2019 20:11:11 GMT
We'll win the first three games It still wouldn't be good enough for some. |
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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Jul 30, 2019 20:14:02 GMT
I get pissed off like the rest of us after losing one game, 3 losses to start the season would be terrible obviously but that doesn’t mean that the fans should be turning on the gaffa that soon. Even after his record last season? I think on the whole, we've been really patient with him. Losing 3 in a row, with who the opposition is, would be disastrous. Half a year. Saint 'Buy An', you patience is virtuous. Want, want, want, immediate, short term thinking. |
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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Jul 30, 2019 20:15:37 GMT
Let's be honest, three games into a new season is long enough isn't it? I think giving managers the first 45 minutes of the first game is ample, but maybe I'm harsh? Why wait for the new season when you can get involved straight away. Bonus points and shiny stick for those who doubted him first in the Oatcake nursery class. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 20:17:59 GMT
Even after his record last season? I think on the whole, we've been really patient with him. Losing 3 in a row, with who the opposition is, would be disastrous. Half a year. Saint 'Buy An', you patience is virtuous. Want, want, want, immediate, short term thinking. Says he who thinks we’re getting promoted this season 😂 |
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Post by tony1234 on Jul 30, 2019 20:19:34 GMT
I read the thread on what would be a good season - seldom has there been such difference going into a season - you can really look at what "reasonable expectations" are any which way you want this time round.
On the one hand:- He's had 1/2 a season already - getting 20pts from 21games. That would be one place above the relegation places over last season with the league's most expensive squad, which he added to with 12m of his own players. Managers don't ever get anything like the luxury of being able to change the entire first team before getting judged - Managers usually come in and are expected to improve things with the same team. But that's the pass NJ has had to date, with the league's most expensive squad and 12m added to it on top. There are a fair few complete "amateurs" on this board, me included, who look at that squad and set up and think it looks really flawed; no creativity to get assists and a reliance on fullbacks who aren't wingbacks. NJ is paid to see what we don't though - but if those flaws come to pass, then its pretty indefensible he can't spot what so many can.
On the other hand: This is a club that has gone on a downward spiral for three years. Any business that does that, you'd need a turnaround strategy. They don't happen quickly - and its the toughest job there is. NJ is starting with the culture of the squad, and doing very well to attract those players to the club. He is working on a shoestring this summer - to create a squad of professionals defined by work-ethic, team-ethic, integrity and determination. Whatever follows, this was needed, and its an incredibly tough job he is doing that transcends just the first team. He has to do this hedging bets that certain players may leave too. He needs not only this next season but the one after to build on his foundations - but what he has effectively done is to ensure this club don't become the next Sunderland. He has made it a professional, functioning club again.
So, the problem with the OP title is that there are two constrasting perspectives and both sound reasonable to me!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 30, 2019 20:21:05 GMT
Even after his record last season? I think on the whole, we've been really patient with him. Losing 3 in a row, with who the opposition is, would be disastrous. Half a year. Saint 'Buy An', you patience is virtuous. Want, want, want, immediate, short term thinking. He’s pretty much said the same thing. He expects promotion. |
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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Jul 30, 2019 20:23:26 GMT
Half a year. Saint 'Buy An', you patience is virtuous. Want, want, want, immediate, short term thinking. Says he who thinks we’re getting promoted this season 😂 That fact that I've said I don't think we'll get promoted this season says everything you need to know about your rationale. You don't know whether you're coming or going. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 20:37:54 GMT
Says he who thinks we’re getting promoted this season 😂 That fact that I've said I don't think we'll get promoted this season says everything you need to know about your rationale. You don't know whether you're coming or going. Sorry “pushing for promotion” - my bad. |
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Post by tony1234 on Jul 30, 2019 21:01:46 GMT
QPR will be trickier than some think - they seem set to go upwards next season
Will have Barbet at CB, Amos (ex Spuds) and Cameron in MF, Pugh (ex Bournemouth) on the wing and Hugill up top - Luongo is a really good midfielder i've long wished we'd gone for, as he drives forward, scores and assists. All are better than average Champ players
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Post by wilcopotter on Jul 30, 2019 21:34:03 GMT
We need a goal scorer. We need a defensive midfielder. We could do with a left back. We could do with all the fans getting behind the team and no hissy fitting👍. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 21:36:20 GMT
We need a goal scorer. We need a defensive midfielder. We could do with a left back. We could do with all the fans getting behind the team and no hissy fitting👍. Yes of course that will sort everything. We will “will” ourselves into to the Premier League by posting on this board. We don’t even need god to do it for us. |
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Post by Pugsley on Jul 30, 2019 21:40:25 GMT
qpr have signed 9 players and have a decent manager So have we this year. |
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Post by Pugsley on Jul 30, 2019 21:41:43 GMT
QPR will be trickier than some think - they seem set to go upwards next season Will have Barbet at CB, Amos (ex Spuds) and Cameron in MF, Pugh (ex Bournemouth) on the wing and Hugill up top - Luongo is a really good midfielder i've long wished we'd gone for, as he drives forward, scores and assists. All are better than average Champ players We've invested best part of £70million on a championship team. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 21:42:29 GMT
QPR will be trickier than some think - they seem set to go upwards next season Will have Barbet at CB, Amos (ex Spuds) and Cameron in MF, Pugh (ex Bournemouth) on the wing and Hugill up top - Luongo is a really good midfielder i've long wished we'd gone for, as he drives forward, scores and assists. All are better than average Champ players We've invested best part of £70million on a championship team. Not very well though! |
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Post by tony1234 on Jul 30, 2019 21:51:07 GMT
QPR will be trickier than some think - they seem set to go upwards next season Will have Barbet at CB, Amos (ex Spuds) and Cameron in MF, Pugh (ex Bournemouth) on the wing and Hugill up top - Luongo is a really good midfielder i've long wished we'd gone for, as he drives forward, scores and assists. All are better than average Champ players We've invested best part of £70million on a championship team. ... to create a first XI worth about £60m.... which is probably not a whole lot more than QPR's are worth. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 22:00:10 GMT
Before it all starts......Norwich lost the first 3 games, Sheffield lost first 2 Leeds ran out of steam Norwich lost 2 and drew one. But I agree, I don't think there's much one can extrapolate out of the opening 3 games win or lose. Luton lost 2 and drew 1 of their first 3 games too, both ending up as champions on 94 points. It’s a sign I tell thee! |
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Post by mrcoke on Jul 30, 2019 22:45:28 GMT
I read the thread on what would be a good season - seldom has there been such difference going into a season - you can really look at what "reasonable expectations" are any which way you want this time round. On the one hand:- He's had 1/2 a season already - getting 20pts from 21games. That would be one place above the relegation places over last season with the league's most expensive squad, which he added to with 12m of his own players. Managers don't ever get anything like the luxury of being able to change the entire first team before getting judged - Managers usually come in and are expected to improve things with the same team. But that's the pass NJ has had to date, with the league's most expensive squad and 12m added to it on top. There are a fair few complete "amateurs" on this board, me included, who look at that squad and set up and think it looks really flawed; no creativity to get assists and a reliance on fullbacks who aren't wingbacks. NJ is paid to see what we don't though - but if those flaws come to pass, then its pretty indefensible he can't spot what so many can. On the other hand: This is a club that has gone on a downward spiral for three years. Any business that does that, you'd need a turnaround strategy. They don't happen quickly - and its the toughest job there is. NJ is starting with the culture of the squad, and doing very well to attract those players to the club. He is working on a shoestring this summer - to create a squad of professionals defined by work-ethic, team-ethic, integrity and determination. Whatever follows, this was needed, and its an incredibly tough job he is doing that transcends just the first team. He has to do this hedging bets that certain players may leave too. He needs not only this next season but the one after to build on his foundations - but what he has effectively done is to ensure this club don't become the next Sunderland. He has made it a professional, functioning club again. So, the problem with the OP title is that there are two contrasting perspectives and both sound reasonable to me! Everyone has two contrasting perspectives. We look at ourselves through rose-tinted glasses and look at everyone else through a magnifying glass. |
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Post by Scrotnig on Jul 30, 2019 23:34:32 GMT
Where did the idea of losing the first three games come from?
We haven't played them yet.
I'm as dubious as anyone about our chances this coming season, but I do think we ought to wait until the first three games have actually been played before we criticise too much.
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