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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 11:19:07 GMT
To be fair to Starmer, it is hard to differentiate labour from the tories when the tories steal most policies he announces: 1. Energy price cap -originally a lib dem policy stolen by labour 2. Windfall tax on oil and gas (albeit a limp one) - originally a lib dem policy stolen by labour 3. Negotiating with unions (finally the tories have admitted defeat and are negotiating and settling and had they done so from the outset (as labour and lib dems said they would) it would have saves billions for the economy) 4. Increasing childcare provision (albeit in a not particularly effective manner as without more funding (which Labour promised and the Lib Dem’s have campaigned on for years), the childcare providers go under) No wonder Starmer is reluctant to announce lots of big policies, and it would be foolish to do so when we are almost 2 years from an election. Where Starmer differs is he would remove perhaps the biggest tax cut for the rich in living memory just introduced in the budget. Nationalised investment in green energy (which you hate) for zero carbon electricity by 2030, 5 years before the government Significant clampdown on tax loopholes exploited by the rich. NHS reform with significant investment in R&D, perhaps the most underfunded part of the NHs, and changing the GP partnership model, and moving to a preventative health approach so people are generally healthier (a model adopted by most of the wealthy nations who all have much better health services) Major reform to policing and crime, undoing some of the cuts by the tories to funding in the system so cases move faster. This includes tackling fraud in a big way, but i am not sure on specifics other than going after the PPE covid fraudsters and not ignoring them like Starmer Removing the charitable status of private schools which will raise a lot of tax revenue to put into the state system. Investigate legal routes to seek asylum here to help stop the boats. A big difference is governing on policy and not hate filled rhetoric. I am sure there are more that I have missed. Many you and I may disagree with. Many are light on detail. But to say Starmer does nothing and is the same as Sunak and the tories is lazy on your part. "Investigate legal routes to help asylum here to help stop the boats" And how many years will that investigation take place....while boats are still landing illegally every day... ...typical labour, see a problem..form a committee to think about it and get nothing done.. Not sure how many times people like you have to be told. Seeking asylum is NOT illegal. Stop it will you?
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Post by oggyoggy on Mar 21, 2023 11:49:21 GMT
To be fair to Starmer, it is hard to differentiate labour from the tories when the tories steal most policies he announces: 1. Energy price cap -originally a lib dem policy stolen by labour 2. Windfall tax on oil and gas (albeit a limp one) - originally a lib dem policy stolen by labour 3. Negotiating with unions (finally the tories have admitted defeat and are negotiating and settling and had they done so from the outset (as labour and lib dems said they would) it would have saves billions for the economy) 4. Increasing childcare provision (albeit in a not particularly effective manner as without more funding (which Labour promised and the Lib Dem’s have campaigned on for years), the childcare providers go under) No wonder Starmer is reluctant to announce lots of big policies, and it would be foolish to do so when we are almost 2 years from an election. Where Starmer differs is he would remove perhaps the biggest tax cut for the rich in living memory just introduced in the budget. Nationalised investment in green energy (which you hate) for zero carbon electricity by 2030, 5 years before the government Significant clampdown on tax loopholes exploited by the rich. NHS reform with significant investment in R&D, perhaps the most underfunded part of the NHs, and changing the GP partnership model, and moving to a preventative health approach so people are generally healthier (a model adopted by most of the wealthy nations who all have much better health services) Major reform to policing and crime, undoing some of the cuts by the tories to funding in the system so cases move faster. This includes tackling fraud in a big way, but i am not sure on specifics other than going after the PPE covid fraudsters and not ignoring them like Starmer Removing the charitable status of private schools which will raise a lot of tax revenue to put into the state system. Investigate legal routes to seek asylum here to help stop the boats. A big difference is governing on policy and not hate filled rhetoric. I am sure there are more that I have missed. Many you and I may disagree with. Many are light on detail. But to say Starmer does nothing and is the same as Sunak and the tories is lazy on your part. "Investigate legal routes to help asylum here to help stop the boats" And how many years will that investigation take place....while boats are still landing illegally every day... ...typical labour, see a problem..form a committee to think about it and get nothing done.. Providing safe alternatives to genuine asylum seekers is the only way to actually deal with the problem. At least Labour are looking at dealing with the problem rather than stirring up a culture war with hate filled rhetoric (similar to that of 1930s Germany I hear!!). My solution is keeping the current “stop the boats” legislation, which is entirely impotent by itself, but also bringing in high speed claims for asylum that can be made at embassies across the world. With a safe and legal route to get here, the impotent legislative becomes legal and enforceable, and the boats will reduce massively (save for those who aren’t really asylum seekers).
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Post by oggyoggy on Mar 21, 2023 11:50:49 GMT
"Investigate legal routes to help asylum here to help stop the boats" And how many years will that investigation take place....while boats are still landing illegally every day... ...typical labour, see a problem..form a committee to think about it and get nothing done.. The Home Office department for processing refugees and asylum seekers has come to a grinding halt and you have the cheek to accuse others of "getting nothing done?" That is another way to differentiate labour and tory. Labour want to process claims efficiently and save us tons of money. The tories are happy to pay for long hotel stays for those arriving by small boat.
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Post by oggyoggy on Mar 21, 2023 11:56:47 GMT
I agree. But who cares. They lost both. That’s all that counts. And they must “win” the next (be the biggest party) to save us from the worst period of governance in recent history. It's not all that counts. Because the trend from Blair through to the present day shows about the only bright spot was 2017 (despite the defeat), so it's about understanding how you build on what little bit's of success you may have had. The policy of "we're not as shit as the Tories" might win them a majority - who can say when a month is such a long time in politics these days - but they may also see their lead in the polls eroded. It's fairly simple maths, in the main Labour have 3 types of voters, the left leaning liberal usually found in the metropolitan boroughs, the socially conservative "red wall" voters predominantly in the North, and the predominantly 18-30 "left wingers". They either need to bring together the three (that's clearly not happening) or go out and court the millions of disenfranchised voters that would automatically align to Labour rather than the Tories, if they do neither they won't get a majority barring more Tory disasters or a ringing endorsement from the right-wing press a la Tony Blair (I wouldn't rule either of those things out either). In a nutshell nothing is off the table....... Like I have said, I don’t think they are just adopting a “not as shit as the tories” approach. I have listed many ways they differentiate themselves and I am sure at the appropriate time when their manifesto is published there will many other areas of digression. Could Starmer be doing more? Obviously. Is he perfect? Not even close. Is he better than the current government and the last few governments? By a million miles I would say. But with our incredibly unrepresentative and undemocratic voting system, nothing is off the table because it is winning a very small proportion of votes that matter in the swing seats. If we haven’t seen the light from years of decay (and corruption and sleaze) of our country under the tories (nothing is better now than when they came into power) then I may lose all faith in our democracy.
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Post by foster on Mar 21, 2023 11:57:03 GMT
"Investigate legal routes to help asylum here to help stop the boats" And how many years will that investigation take place....while boats are still landing illegally every day... ...typical labour, see a problem..form a committee to think about it and get nothing done.. The Home Office department for processing refugees and asylum seekers has come to a grinding halt and you have the cheek to accuse others of "getting nothing done?" Totally agree, this is a Tory issue. Nothing to do with Labour.
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Post by knype on Mar 21, 2023 12:11:17 GMT
The Home Office department for processing refugees and asylum seekers has come to a grinding halt and you have the cheek to accuse others of "getting nothing done?" Totally agree, this is a Tory issue. Nothing to do with Labour. Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them?
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 12:12:34 GMT
Totally agree, this is a Tory issue. Nothing to do with Labour. Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? BINGO!!!!
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Post by foster on Mar 21, 2023 12:15:24 GMT
Totally agree, this is a Tory issue. Nothing to do with Labour. Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? I can't answer that question as I don't speak on behalf of everyone on here. I don't think there's a hardcore group of labour supporters here... Just anti-Tory supporters. Labor isn't my preference either.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 21, 2023 12:21:44 GMT
Totally agree, this is a Tory issue. Nothing to do with Labour. Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? How many homeless veterans have you got living with you? 2 in the spare wing, 1 in the summer house?
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Post by foster on Mar 21, 2023 12:26:05 GMT
Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? BINGO!!!! Congrats...and thanks for the great input as usual.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 12:28:51 GMT
Congrats...and thanks for the great input as usual. You're welcome mate. What...no meme?
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Post by foster on Mar 21, 2023 12:35:21 GMT
Congrats...and thanks for the great input as usual. You're welcome mate. What...no meme? I prefer to engage in adult discussion mate. Quiet day on twitter I take it?
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 12:36:31 GMT
You're welcome mate. What...no meme? I prefer to engage in adult discussion mate. Quiet day on twitter I take it? Not your usual jokey self today then, apologies.
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Post by foster on Mar 21, 2023 12:41:41 GMT
I prefer to engage in adult discussion mate. Quiet day on twitter I take it? Not your usual jokey self today then, apologies. I'm fine mate, just have more time to actually type... although I do have some work which is piling up so I'll need to focus on that soon
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Post by knype on Mar 21, 2023 12:44:37 GMT
Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? BINGO!!!! You got one with you currently?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 21, 2023 12:49:26 GMT
You got one with you currently? This from a bloke who thinks he isn't right wing...
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Post by knype on Mar 21, 2023 12:49:43 GMT
Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? How many homeless veterans have you got living with you? 2 in the spare wing, 1 in the summer house? How many immigrants have you got with you?
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 21, 2023 12:55:49 GMT
How many homeless veterans have you got living with you? 2 in the spare wing, 1 in the summer house? How many immigrants have you got with you? It's almost like no one gives a shit about homeless veterans when they step over them on the street, but they just bring them up to show their outrage when it comes to refugees. I have none living in my 4 bedroom house in which 5 of us live as I doubt they'd want to sleep in the shed. There is a Ukranian family (a mum and her boys) living in a bungalow in Congleton that my wife inherited, and when they move on we would quite happily allow a family from another part of the world to live there........
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 13:05:08 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 13:05:40 GMT
Not your usual jokey self today then, apologies. I'm fine mate, just have more time to actually type... although I do have some work which is piling up so I'll need to focus on that soon Me too brother. Catch you later.
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Post by gawa on Mar 21, 2023 13:11:39 GMT
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Post by oggyoggy on Mar 21, 2023 13:31:43 GMT
Totally agree, this is a Tory issue. Nothing to do with Labour. Labour will let them all in without paperwork soon anyway if it's like their hardcore supporters on here...I am sure all of them are willing to have one live with them? The tories are not only letting them in without paperwork, but keeping them in hotels indefinitely, and not processing any asylum claims.
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Post by foster on Mar 21, 2023 13:33:14 GMT
Bit racist how they draw Sunak with a massive hooter. I've just googled him and he doesn't have an exceptionally big nose. They make him look like your stereotypical Taliban member. I love being woke.
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Post by dutchstokie on Mar 21, 2023 13:37:43 GMT
WAHEY ! BINGO !!!!!!
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Post by knype on Mar 21, 2023 13:42:16 GMT
You got one with you currently? This from a bloke who thinks he isn't right wing... I'm not
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 21, 2023 13:43:30 GMT
This from a bloke who thinks he isn't right wing... I'm not Every single opinion you voice on this side of the board is.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 13:53:46 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Mar 21, 2023 13:54:13 GMT
This from a bloke who thinks he isn't right wing... I'm not You absolutely are.
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Post by knype on Mar 21, 2023 14:08:54 GMT
never voted right wing...
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 21, 2023 14:14:27 GMT
never voted right wing... Yet you hate everything left wing, you're not exactly one for the middle ground either. What does that leave us with?
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