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Post by 3putts on Jan 9, 2019 10:47:05 GMT
We simply are not being told the full truth, in a honest and clear way, in the stop Brexit agenda. obv he has no vested interest  |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 9, 2019 10:51:04 GMT
We simply are not being told the full truth, in a honest and clear way, in the stop Brexit agenda. obv he has no vested interest Of course he has a vested interest ( whichever" he" you are referring to) As does this man / |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Jan 9, 2019 11:30:46 GMT
When there is a vote to stop us relinquishing our membership of the European Union, parliament would've killed Brexit. As far as I'm aware, this vote didn't do that. As a consequence of that vote, what is now possible is Brino not Brexit By the same logic, our membership of the EU is in name only so maybe we only need to leave in name only. So maybe Brino is the logical conclusion to this saga. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 11:37:00 GMT
When there is a vote to stop us relinquishing our membership of the European Union, parliament would've killed Brexit. As far as I'm aware, this vote didn't do that. As a consequence of that vote, what is now possible is Brino not Brexit Well technically no. If the 650 public servants in the HoC just got on with debating Universal Credit or the homeless then Brexit happens. It is written into primary legislation as per the Miller ruling. But of course they're not going to do that because the HoC is majority remain. The word is that the Yvette Cooper amendment is more show boat and virtue signalling for her inevitable bid for the Labour Leadership. The restrictions it brings are (only) on changing tax laws to make the UK more competitive after a No Deal exit. 1) No.10 has said that all necessary funds are already arranged for No Deal and 2) changes in tax law really only come into effect at the beginning of each tax year. So April 2020 and by then a clean Brexit will be in the rear view mirror and Remoaners will just have to suck it up to coin a phrase. Any 'emergency' sector by sector funds needed before then could come out of the £39 bn. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 12:05:48 GMT
When there is a vote to stop us relinquishing our membership of the European Union, parliament would've killed Brexit. As far as I'm aware, this vote didn't do that. As a consequence of that vote, what is now possible is Brino not Brexit What is more interesting is today Bercow allowing Grieve's amendment on the vote over the EU's Withdrawal Agreement next week. If that passes, which I think it will, that means May only has 3 days not 21 to bring back her next step. Which can be amended again. Basically, Grieve's amendment stops May running down the clock into February. All sounds good but the kicker is that the bill was unamendable but Bercow overrode that and allowed the amendment. Bercow's clerks advised him this was against constitutional process. Bercow ignored that. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 9, 2019 12:24:26 GMT
The UK basic rate taxpayer contributes to the £90m and of course there are admin costs as our money goes to the EU from the young person on £16,000 and then is given to Michael.Seems fair?
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Post by maxplonk on Jan 9, 2019 13:47:44 GMT
As a consequence of that vote, what is now possible is Brino not Brexit What is more interesting is today Bercow allowing Grieve's amendment on the vote over the EU's Withdrawal Agreement next week. If that passes, which I think it will, that means May only has 3 days not 21 to bring back her next step. Which can be amended again. Basically, Grieve's amendment stops May running down the clock into February. All sounds good but the kicker is that the bill was unamendable but Bercow overrode that and allowed the amendment. Bercow's clerks advised him this was against constitutional process. Bercow ignored that. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Jan 9, 2019 14:21:08 GMT
I called it from day one, as did TDC. There was never any intention of carrying Brexit through.
They have had two and a half years to get either a decent deal, or to leave under WTO. Now the MPs decide that WTO is a non starter because there is no majority in the Commons for it. So what? There is no majority for any form of Brexit and never was!
I will never vote for a major party again.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2019 14:32:28 GMT
I will make it my business at the next General Election to vote against our current MP who won the last General Election on a Brexit manifesto but is now openly intending to vote for a "People's Vote" and is campaigning to Remain, even though the constituency clearly voted Leave in the 2016 referendum. I just found this on AOL link |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 14:49:03 GMT
I called it from day one, as did TDC. There was never any intention of carrying Brexit through. They have had two and a half years to get either a decent deal, or to leave under WTO. Now the MPs decide that WTO is a non starter because there is no majority in the Commons for it. So what? There is no majority for any form of Brexit and never was! I will never vote for a major party again. Here you go. Small Government. Free Market economy but some nationalisation-esque ideas. Pro Brexit. Social awareness. Social Democratic PartyI'm tempted. |
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Post by shangamuzo on Jan 9, 2019 15:10:17 GMT
I called it from day one, as did TDC. There was never any intention of carrying Brexit through. They have had two and a half years to get either a decent deal, or to leave under WTO. Now the MPs decide that WTO is a non starter because there is no majority in the Commons for it. So what? There is no majority for any form of Brexit and never was! I will never vote for a major party again. There was a public majority for brexit but parliament is remain biased. If the political class kill brexit before it's birth. I believe it'll do grave damage to democracy itself with a lot of people thinking voting at all is a waste of time. |
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Post by Northy on Jan 9, 2019 16:05:24 GMT
I called it from day one, as did TDC. There was never any intention of carrying Brexit through. They have had two and a half years to get either a decent deal, or to leave under WTO. Now the MPs decide that WTO is a non starter because there is no majority in the Commons for it. So what? There is no majority for any form of Brexit and never was! I will never vote for a major party again. Here you go. Small Government. Free Market economy but some nationalisation-esque ideas. Pro Brexit. Social awareness. Social Democratic PartyI'm tempted. Nah, vote for me, we have dancing girls  |
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Post by essexstokey on Jan 9, 2019 16:24:30 GMT
Brexit: Second Commons defeat for Theresa May in 24 hours It means the government will have to come up with fresh plans within three days if Mrs May's EU withdrawal deal is rejected by MPs next week. link |
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Post by harryburrows on Jan 9, 2019 16:46:59 GMT
Brexit: Second Commons defeat for Theresa May in 24 hours It means the government will have to come up with fresh plans within three days if Mrs May's EU withdrawal deal is rejected by MPs next week. linkHow about that , EU says no new deals , parliament reject only deal on offer , no deal brexit won't be allowed , where is this heading? What fresh plans will the prime minister have to offer in 3 days ? |
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 9, 2019 16:53:14 GMT
Brexit: Second Commons defeat for Theresa May in 24 hours It means the government will have to come up with fresh plans within three days if Mrs May's EU withdrawal deal is rejected by MPs next week. linkHow about that , EU says no new deals , parliament reject only deal on offer , no deal brexit won't be allowed , where is this heading? What fresh plans will the prime minister have to offer in 3 days ? It's Parliament setting up a situation where they kill Brexit - first by extending A50 and then implementing "The People's Vote' which they assume will deliver the "correct" result this time. |
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Post by harryburrows on Jan 9, 2019 17:30:17 GMT
How about that , EU says no new deals , parliament reject only deal on offer , no deal brexit won't be allowed , where is this heading? What fresh plans will the prime minister have to offer in 3 days ? It's Parliament setting up a situation where they kill Brexit - first by extending A50 and then implementing "The People's Vote' which they assume will deliver the "correct" result this time. Yes Partick , the EU's interpretation of democracy . |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2019 17:36:14 GMT
How about that , EU says no new deals , parliament reject only deal on offer , no deal brexit won't be allowed , where is this heading? What fresh plans will the prime minister have to offer in 3 days ? It's Parliament setting up a situation where they kill Brexit - first by extending A50 and then implementing "The People's Vote' which they assume will deliver the "correct" result this time. It's been their sole intention since the 2016 referendum and they're slowly but surely eliminating all possible options. What will be the point of a "People's Vote" if they've already said No Deal won't be allowed, they will vote next week and reject May's Deal, so what else is there to vote for apart from Remain ? Complete and utter bunch of smug shysters ! All this bullsh*t about a "People's Vote", all they're interested in is overturning the original decision. |
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Post by xchpotter on Jan 9, 2019 18:59:21 GMT
What spineless and treacherous politicians we have, it was never going to be any different though. I wonder weather there will be any civil disobedience to the point where they will then call in the EU police tanks next. I would love to know what the Queen’s private opinion is on this betrayal of democracy.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 19:02:45 GMT
Brexit: Second Commons defeat for Theresa May in 24 hours It means the government will have to come up with fresh plans within three days if Mrs May's EU withdrawal deal is rejected by MPs next week. linkHow about that , EU says no new deals , parliament reject only deal on offer , no deal brexit won't be allowed , where is this heading? What fresh plans will the prime minister have to offer in 3 days ? Technically it's still up for negotiation. Grieve's amendment demanding a response within 3 days isn't quite the body blow people think. The 3 days are 3 'sitting' days for the HoC and they don't sit on Friday's (nice work if you can get it!) so vote on Tuesday night, Wednesday, Thursday and the following Monday 21st all count and the 21st was the date that May had promised to return with her next step anyway. EDIT: I'm not sure what she needs to provide in 3 days. If she only needs to come back with a statement or she needs a statement with absolute detail about the next step. Either way it's all a little meh for me. She comes back on the Monday and says she's trying or she comes back on the Monday and says she's trying and that means a definite meeting with Juncker in a couple of days. Who knows?? |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 9, 2019 19:10:42 GMT
How about that , EU says no new deals , parliament reject only deal on offer , no deal brexit won't be allowed , where is this heading? What fresh plans will the prime minister have to offer in 3 days ? Technically it's still up for negotiation. Grieve's amendment demanding a response within 3 days isn't quite the body blow people think. The 3 days are 3 'sitting' days for the HoC and they don't sit on Friday's (nice work if you can get it!) so vote on Tuesday night, Wednesday, Thursday and the following Monday 21st all count and the 21st was the date that May had promised to return with her next step anyway. EDIT: I'm not sure what she needs to provide in 3 days. If she only needs to come back with a statement or she needs a statement with absolute detail about the next step. Either way it's all a little meh for me. She comes back on the Monday and says she's trying or she comes back on the Monday and says she's trying and that means a definite meeting with Juncker in a couple of days. Who knows?? The consequences of not doing so are not clear. Maybe just series of meaningless words will suffice BUT isn't the real problem that it opens the door for other MPs to offer ' solutions to the mess" and ' a compromise to which everyone can agree" |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 19:11:26 GMT
What spineless and treacherous politicians we have, it was never going to be any different though. I wonder weather there will be any civil disobedience to the point where they will then call in the EU police tanks next. I would love to know what the Queen’s private opinion is on this betrayal of democracy. You mean politician's like Dominic Grieve, President of the Franco-British Society and Vice-Chairman of the Franco-British Council, who was presented with the Légion d’honneur (as was his father!) just after the referendum result and has done nothing but put down UK interests ever since. This is not a 5th column. Honest. Attachment DeletedDominic Grieve decorated for work in Franco-British relations - Embassy of France in London |
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Jan 9, 2019 19:17:02 GMT
It's all set-up for what I said the other day. All hope is lost, we're heading for a catastrophic, cliff edge, no deal Brexit... Untill the EU come riding to the rescue with a last minute deal - Which is barely different to the current deal May has got planned for us, but it'll have just one or two minor changes & will be sold to us as the greatest deal of all time that we simply must accept, and that'll be that, we'll be remaining under the EU's control just like some of us have said all along.
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 9, 2019 19:22:00 GMT
The nerve of some of you leave voting hypocrites who voted leave for our parliament (in our parliamentary democracy) to take back control!
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 9, 2019 19:27:59 GMT
It's all set-up for what I said the other day. All hope is lost, we're heading for a catastrophic, cliff edge, no deal Brexit... Untill the EU come riding to the rescue with a last minute deal - Which is barely different to the current deal May has got planned for us, but it'll have just one or two minor changes & will be sold to us as the greatest deal of all time that we simply must accept, and that'll be that, we'll be remaining under the EU's control just like some of us have said all along. In other words what was previously called a "soft" Brexit now more correctly called Brino. I'm not sure this was inevitable after the referendum, but it certainly was after the General Election. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 19:28:03 GMT
Technically it's still up for negotiation. Grieve's amendment demanding a response within 3 days isn't quite the body blow people think. The 3 days are 3 'sitting' days for the HoC and they don't sit on Friday's (nice work if you can get it!) so vote on Tuesday night, Wednesday, Thursday and the following Monday 21st all count and the 21st was the date that May had promised to return with her next step anyway. EDIT: I'm not sure what she needs to provide in 3 days. If she only needs to come back with a statement or she needs a statement with absolute detail about the next step. Either way it's all a little meh for me. She comes back on the Monday and says she's trying or she comes back on the Monday and says she's trying and that means a definite meeting with Juncker in a couple of days. Who knows?? The consequences of not doing so are not clear. Maybe just series of meaningless words will suffice BUT isn't the real problem that it opens the door for other MPs to offer ' solutions to the mess" and ' a compromise to which everyone can agree" Yes. It allows more time for even more votes and even more amendments, including another 3 day return, and a possible 2nd ref but all this depends on the PM and the Cabinet. She/they still control a lot of the direction here, including unilaterally choosing to offer an A50 revocation, which the HoC would snap up, and I still think this will happen. |
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 9, 2019 19:28:06 GMT
Technically it's still up for negotiation. Grieve's amendment demanding a response within 3 days isn't quite the body blow people think. The 3 days are 3 'sitting' days for the HoC and they don't sit on Friday's (nice work if you can get it!) so vote on Tuesday night, Wednesday, Thursday and the following Monday 21st all count and the 21st was the date that May had promised to return with her next step anyway. EDIT: I'm not sure what she needs to provide in 3 days. If she only needs to come back with a statement or she needs a statement with absolute detail about the next step. Either way it's all a little meh for me. She comes back on the Monday and says she's trying or she comes back on the Monday and says she's trying and that means a definite meeting with Juncker in a couple of days. Who knows?? The consequences of not doing so are not clear. Maybe just series of meaningless words will suffice BUT isn't the real problem that it opens the door for other MPs to offer ' solutions to the mess" and ' a compromise to which everyone can agree" The real problem, according to you, is that our elected representatives have a say in the biggest issue facing this country since the second world war!!! You certainly hate parliamentary sovereignty then don’t you! No wonder you wanted out of the EU, you believe in an all powerful executive who cannot be held to account by Parliament. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 9, 2019 19:29:50 GMT
The consequences of not doing so are not clear. Maybe just series of meaningless words will suffice BUT isn't the real problem that it opens the door for other MPs to offer ' solutions to the mess" and ' a compromise to which everyone can agree" The real problem, according to you, is that our elected representatives have a say in the biggest issue facing this country since the second world war!!! You certainly hate parliamentary sovereignty then don’t you! No wonder you wanted out of the EU, you believe in an all powerful executive who cannot be held to account by Parliament. Give it a rest Oggy , if you don't know what is really going on |
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 9, 2019 19:31:22 GMT
The real problem, according to you, is that our elected representatives have a say in the biggest issue facing this country since the second world war!!! You certainly hate parliamentary sovereignty then don’t you! No wonder you wanted out of the EU, you believe in an all powerful executive who cannot be held to account by Parliament. Give it a rest Oggy , if you don't know what is really going on No, you give it out on here as if you care about sovereignty and democracy but you say MPs having a say over brexit is wrong!? It is staggering how hypocritical you are. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jan 9, 2019 19:32:57 GMT
Of course all you Remainers voted for this because you knew about this direction of travel and were happy with it because of course it was in the manifesto that you read, of the MEP you voted for. France and Germany join forces as a single superpower - The Times "France and Germany are to forge shared defence, foreign and economic policies in an unprecedented “twinning” arrangement regarded as a prototype for the future of the European Union."
"France and Germany also intend to speak with one voice in Brussels, drawing up common positions before pivotal EU summits in an attempt to turn the bloc into a more decisive power on the world stage." |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 9, 2019 19:34:25 GMT
Give it a rest Oggy , if you don't know what is really going on No, you give it out on here as if you care about sovereignty and democracy but you say MPs having a say over brexit is wrong!? It is staggering how hypocritical you are. Unfortunately as has been said the political class are part of the problem, and the specific problem as we all know is that the majority of MPs don't actually want Brexit, despite the promises made to them. No point going round in circles, you either get that and it matters to you, or you don't. |
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