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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 10:11:09 GMT
There's no fucking way lilfraise is looking after me I still clean his fucking car for him  "Squander all my money? What.....you mean spend what I've earned rather than give it to the government? if the government stopped giving our taxes away ie 'foreign aid' bullshit and lies it might help. And all the other dodgy deals that cost the tax payers Needs a revolution in this country .... labour and the tories are not the answer You know he,s just going to leave you at keele services in your dressing gown when the time comes Preferable than the thought of him caring for me  |
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Post by ohbottom on May 19, 2017 10:20:08 GMT
There's a big difference which the tories have been careful not to spell out, which is that for homeowners the value of your house will be taken into consideration for people being cared for in their own home. Currently it's only a factor for those who have to go into residential care. Around 75% of over 65s own their own home, so if this pledge is enacted a large number of pensioners who currently receive state funded care will now have to pay for it out of their estate. Three times as many are cared for at home than are in a care home so there are far more losers than winners. What about if I have my parent living with me and care is needed? Where does that leave them and me? Dunno, most of the Tory manifesto seems somewhat vague. You could try asking Theresa May  |
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Post by essexstokey on May 19, 2017 10:21:22 GMT
"Tories keep refusing to turn up to debate, because so many of their policies are damaging ordinary people" - Lib Dem
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Post by trickydicky73 on May 19, 2017 10:32:08 GMT
"Tories keep refusing to turn up to debate, because so many of their policies are damaging ordinary people" - Lib Dem If that is the case, why weren't they trounced at the last election and why are they miles ahead in the polls? |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 10:33:13 GMT
What about if I have my parent living with me and care is needed? Where does that leave them and me? Dunno, most of the Tory manifesto seems somewhat vague. You could try asking Theresa May |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 19, 2017 10:34:51 GMT
Fraise at the moment if you need to go into a care home you can be made to sell your home to fund it. You are allowed to keep £27k Under Tory proposals they would put a charge on your house and you wouldn't pay until you die. Regardless of cost your family keep £100k So it's paying for care after you die with your house but your family still get 100k. Another inheritance tax as such. I do t know why the socialists are so angry and abusive about it There's a big difference which the tories have been careful not to spell out, which is that for homeowners the value of your house will be taken into consideration for people being cared for in their own home. Currently it's only a factor for those who have to go into residential care. Around 75% of over 65s own their own home, so if this pledge is enacted a large number of pensioners who currently receive state funded care will now have to pay for it out of their estate. Three times as many are cared for at home than are in a care home so there are far more losers than winners. It's more complicated than this. My mother was confined to a wheelchair after a spinal operation and just couldn't manage anymore at home. Both pre and post-op she spent time in a care home where she eventually stayed for 2 years. Those care home bills kicked in from minute 1 when she arrived before her op. About £750/week. We had to consolidate all of her estate to pay for open ended care home expenses. She was eventually moved to a more specialist nursing and dementia home where the costs rose to about £900/week. The reality was that we watched her money dwindle downwards heading towards the 23K floor where State aid kicked in. We were told that the council had no responsibility to continue paying the costs at the current home and could have chosen a cheaper option and still fulfilled their obligation. However, we were also told that after "some time" they try not to move residents on to give them a more settled life. So we crossed our fingers hoping this would be the case. State aid kicking in at 100K not 23k would have been a very welcome thought. |
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Post by salopstick on May 19, 2017 10:36:50 GMT
There's a big difference which the tories have been careful not to spell out, which is that for homeowners the value of your house will be taken into consideration for people being cared for in their own home. Currently it's only a factor for those who have to go into residential care. Around 75% of over 65s own their own home, so if this pledge is enacted a large number of pensioners who currently receive state funded care will now have to pay for it out of their estate. Three times as many are cared for at home than are in a care home so there are far more losers than winners. What about if I have my parent living with me and care is needed? Where does that leave them and me? In the shit |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 10:49:05 GMT
Tories clearing deficit by 2022, now to be 2025. This country is a laughing stock! Austerity not working. Nothing ever will, because everything worth having has been sold off, by various governments. You need to make stuff that people want, as have the Germans for one example. It appears to me, that all we have is distribution outlets, to sell stuff made abroad. Don't get me started on the financial industry. They are not to be trusted!
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Post by Northy on May 19, 2017 10:51:43 GMT
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 19, 2017 10:53:48 GMT
Tory Water Fuel Payment cut will affect everyone not receiving Pension Credit:
"McDonnell says he was using the Resolution Foundation figure. If the Tories want to raise something in the region of £1.4bn, they need to restrict winter fuel payments to those on pension credit.
He says if that is not the Tory plan, they must say so."
Lying, conning Tories!
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 11:00:45 GMT
What about if I have my parent living with me and care is needed? Where does that leave them and me? In the shit |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 11:02:47 GMT
Tory Water Fuel Payment cut will affect everyone not receiving Pension Credit: "McDonnell says he was using the Resolution Foundation figure. If the Tories want to raise something in the region of £1.4bn, they need to restrict winter fuel payments to those on pension credit. He says if that is not the Tory plan, they must say so." Lying, conning Tories! I have no argument that they are lying conning tories But, the others are exactly the fucking same you big dope |
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 19, 2017 11:05:57 GMT
Tory Water Fuel Payment cut will affect everyone not receiving Pension Credit: "McDonnell says he was using the Resolution Foundation figure. If the Tories want to raise something in the region of £1.4bn, they need to restrict winter fuel payments to those on pension credit. He says if that is not the Tory plan, they must say so." Lying, conning Tories! I have no argument that they are lying conning tories But, the others are exactly the fucking same you big dope But the Tories do it more and are cleverer at it! Nancy girl!  |
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josh
Academy Starlet
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Post by josh on May 19, 2017 11:32:40 GMT
Labour manifesto: fully costed with built in contingency, so may actually have more money available than stated.
Conservative manifesto: who needs costings. We aren't actually going to give the NHS or education anymore money anyway. Just rip off pensioners.
So much jip for Labour's costings and the conservatives non exsistent costings go unchallenged. Bias yet again.
If they actually put any money back into the system it will be with the likes of us paying more income tax and NI while her mates continue to rake it in. If you vote for her you need to realise that it will cost you. Either with the quality of our services or in your back pocket.
'Benefit scroungers' and 'working class' mean the exact same thing to the ruling class. We all have to pay.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 11:35:38 GMT
I have no argument that they are lying conning tories But, the others are exactly the fucking same you big dope But the Tories do it more and are cleverer at it! Nancy girl! Politicians in general, all no different. |
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Post by ohbottom on May 19, 2017 11:55:24 GMT
There's a big difference which the tories have been careful not to spell out, which is that for homeowners the value of your house will be taken into consideration for people being cared for in their own home. Currently it's only a factor for those who have to go into residential care. Around 75% of over 65s own their own home, so if this pledge is enacted a large number of pensioners who currently receive state funded care will now have to pay for it out of their estate. Three times as many are cared for at home than are in a care home so there are far more losers than winners. It's more complicated than this. My mother was confined to a wheelchair after a spinal operation and just couldn't manage anymore at home. Both pre and post-op she spent time in a care home where she eventually stayed for 2 years. Those care home bills kicked in from minute 1 when she arrived before her op. About £750/week. We had to consolidate all of her estate to pay for open ended care home expenses. She was eventually moved to a more specialist nursing and dementia home where the costs rose to about £900/week. The reality was that we watched her money dwindle downwards heading towards the 23K floor where State aid kicked in. We were told that the council had no responsibility to continue paying the costs at the current home and could have chosen a cheaper option and still fulfilled their obligation. However, we were also told that after "some time" they try not to move residents on to give them a more settled life. So we crossed our fingers hoping this would be the case. State aid kicking in at 100K not 23k would have been a very welcome thought. Sorry to hear about your mother. I'm sure the £72,000 cap on care costs (which the Tories had said they'd be introducing) would have been even more welcome. Alas, that promise has been scrapped. It's true that someone in your mother's situation would be better off under the proposals. But many wouldn't be. I'm not making a judgement about the comparative fairness compared to the existing situation - in my view neither is generous. Just pointing out the side of it the Tories won't mention. |
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Post by ohbottom on May 19, 2017 11:57:04 GMT
"Tories keep refusing to turn up to debate, because so many of their policies are damaging ordinary people" - Lib Dem If that is the case, why weren't they trounced at the last election and why are they miles ahead in the polls? Because the mass media is overwhelmingly biased in their favour? |
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Post by LL Cool Dave on May 19, 2017 12:04:55 GMT
3 elderly callers in a row on Radio Stoke saying they were previously certain Tory voters who have now changed their minds due to yesterday's manifesto.
They have well and truly fucked some of their core voters over.
As my nine year old said to me yesterday about the Tories.
'Are they trying to lose this election?'
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Post by trickydicky73 on May 19, 2017 12:10:36 GMT
If that is the case, why weren't they trounced at the last election and why are they miles ahead in the polls? Because the mass media is overwhelmingly biased in their favour? Are you fucking serious? Corbyn gets a free ride from Sky, Channel 4 and the Beeb. Anyone Tory or "right wing" gets slaughtered. Maybe working class people have seen through Labour after years of experience? I know several former Labour voters who have gone from Labour to UKIP and will now vote Tory. Have they been hoodwinked, too, or do they feel let down by Labour, especially over Brexit? |
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 19, 2017 12:18:32 GMT
Because the mass media is overwhelmingly biased in their favour? Are you fucking serious? Corbyn gets a free ride from Sky, Channel 4 and the Beeb. Anyone Tory or "right wing" gets slaughtered. Maybe working class people have seen through Labour after years of experience? I know several former Labour voters who have gone from Labour to UKIP and will now vote Tory. Have they been hoodwinked, too, or do they feel let down by Labour, especially over Brexit? Fallon has said this morning getting immigration down to the tens of thousands is an ambition not a policy! Haha! Haha! Conning voters hard Brexit means less migration! TORIES LYING AND CONNING HERE
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Post by trickydicky73 on May 19, 2017 12:26:18 GMT
Are you fucking serious? Corbyn gets a free ride from Sky, Channel 4 and the Beeb. Anyone Tory or "right wing" gets slaughtered. Maybe working class people have seen through Labour after years of experience? I know several former Labour voters who have gone from Labour to UKIP and will now vote Tory. Have they been hoodwinked, too, or do they feel let down by Labour, especially over Brexit? Fallon has said this morning getting immigration down to the tens of thousands is an ambition not a policy! Haha! Haha! Conning voters hard Brexit means less migration! TORIES LYING AND CONNING HERE
The point I was trying to make is that a lot of traditional Labour voters wanted lower immigration. Whether that is possible or likely is another matter. |
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Post by ohbottom on May 19, 2017 12:36:53 GMT
Because the mass media is overwhelmingly biased in their favour? Are you fucking serious? Corbyn gets a free ride from Sky, Channel 4 and the Beeb. Anyone Tory or "right wing" gets slaughtered. Maybe working class people have seen through Labour after years of experience? I know several former Labour voters who have gone from Labour to UKIP and will now vote Tory. Have they been hoodwinked, too, or do they feel let down by Labour, especially over Brexit? Of course I'm serious! I can't speak for Sky as I don't have it, C4 and BBC definitely aren't biased. The BBC can't be by statute, unlike the print media which is the most right-wing in Europe. It's the right-wing press which fosters the perception of bias on the BBC. The red tops use more colourful, strident language but the Times & Telegraph have the same agenda. It's BBC news which attempts to analyse the claims and statements of ALL sides critically. But if they say anything which doesn't agree with the rhetoric espoused by the right-wing, the press goes into a hysteria of screaming "Bias! Bias!". To say Corbyn gets a "free ride" is nonsensical. On the other hand, the sycophantic fawning over May by the Sun, Mail, Express, Times, Telegraph et al is nauseating. Have former Labour voters been "hoodwinked" (as you put it)? I'd say they have, especially over Brexit. We're leaving the EU and we have a Tory government largely because a half-dozen or so billionaires (none of whom pay tax in the UK) used their enormous press influence to leverage it. |
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Post by essexstokey on May 19, 2017 12:39:52 GMT
Because the mass media is overwhelmingly biased in their favour? Are you fucking serious? Corbyn gets a free ride from Sky, Channel 4 and the Beeb. Anyone Tory or "right wing" gets slaughtered. Maybe working class people have seen through Labour after years of experience? I know several former Labour voters who have gone from Labour to UKIP and will now vote Tory. Have they been hoodwinked, too, or do they feel let down by Labour, especially over Brexit? What a load of bull you talk about Corbin given an easy ride did you watch him being interviewed on the BBC I guess not but that fits in with your perception so go with it , the Tories were caught out by sky i.e. panning out on the tory stage managed crowed and guess what they lose accreditation and the rights of access to the pm and other members of the government you and the other brain dead Tories keep on bringing up Brexit and Labours opposition and you just ignore or have selected amnesia on what Corbin has said I.e. we will be out (which I personally object to) however he would try and negotiate a soft exit rather than a hard one he also hasn't tried to antagonise the people that he would be negotiating with like chicken May who given her resent form will not do any negotiating go hiding and leave it to the bumbling buffoon Boris.
You cant trust a tory!!
the conservatives putting the con in politics! |
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Post by trickydicky73 on May 19, 2017 12:53:38 GMT
Are you fucking serious? Corbyn gets a free ride from Sky, Channel 4 and the Beeb. Anyone Tory or "right wing" gets slaughtered. Maybe working class people have seen through Labour after years of experience? I know several former Labour voters who have gone from Labour to UKIP and will now vote Tory. Have they been hoodwinked, too, or do they feel let down by Labour, especially over Brexit? What a load of bull you talk about Corbin given an easy ride did you watch him being interviewed on the BBC I guess not but that fits in with your perception so go with it , the Tories were caught out by sky i.e. panning out on the tory stage managed crowed and guess what they lose accreditation and the rights of access to the pm and other members of the government you and the other brain dead Tories keep on bringing up Brexit and Labours opposition and you just ignore or have selected amnesia on what Corbin has said I.e. we will be out (which I personally object to) however he would try and negotiate a soft exit rather than a hard one he also hasn't tried to antagonise the people that he would be negotiating with like chicken May who given her resent form will not do any negotiating go hiding and leave it to the bumbling buffoon Boris.
You cant trust a tory!!
the conservatives putting the con in politics!We all see what we want to see, I guess. Sky News are anti-Tory(in my opinion)and Channel 4 News is anti right wing. Question Time audiences are 80% Labour week in, week out, so why they aren't way ahead in the polls is beyond me. I'll say one thing for Corbyn, at least he's given people a straight choice this time, no more " a fag paper between the lot of them" in this election. I was just pointing out that he's lost a lot of Labour voters and it's not down to the right wing press. Much of it is down to his stance on Brexit. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 19, 2017 13:01:38 GMT
It's more complicated than this. My mother was confined to a wheelchair after a spinal operation and just couldn't manage anymore at home. Both pre and post-op she spent time in a care home where she eventually stayed for 2 years. Those care home bills kicked in from minute 1 when she arrived before her op. About £750/week. We had to consolidate all of her estate to pay for open ended care home expenses. She was eventually moved to a more specialist nursing and dementia home where the costs rose to about £900/week. The reality was that we watched her money dwindle downwards heading towards the 23K floor where State aid kicked in. We were told that the council had no responsibility to continue paying the costs at the current home and could have chosen a cheaper option and still fulfilled their obligation. However, we were also told that after "some time" they try not to move residents on to give them a more settled life. So we crossed our fingers hoping this would be the case. State aid kicking in at 100K not 23k would have been a very welcome thought. Sorry to hear about your mother. I'm sure the £72,000 cap on care costs (which the Tories had said they'd be introducing) would have been even more welcome. Alas, that promise has been scrapped. It's true that someone in your mother's situation would be better off under the proposals. But many wouldn't be. I'm not making a judgement about the comparative fairness compared to the existing situation - in my view neither is generous. Just pointing out the side of it the Tories won't mention. I tell you what would make it better. I understand there'll be legislation to prevent anyone having to sell their home to afford the care while they stil live there. The State puts a charge on the property while it pays the care bill. If that legislation also applied to those families with relatives in homes then they could rent the property in the meantime. Maybe even a tax incentive if the property was made available for local community housing plans. |
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 19, 2017 13:15:34 GMT
Tories in Scotland want exemption from Winter Fuel Cut:
"Scottish Tories are demanding to keep Winter Fuel Allowances that the party wants to take from up to ten million pensioners across the UK – because it is colder north of the border.
David Mundell, the Scottish Secretary, said the controversial proposal to means-test the payments of up to £300 would be dropped from the Conservative manifesto in Scotland."
Stoke and Newcastle is every bit as cold as Scotland. Will the two blonde nodding donkeys in Newcastle and Stoke South ask for similar treatment or haven't they got the balls?
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Post by followyoudown on May 19, 2017 13:35:15 GMT
Sorry to hear about your mother. I'm sure the £72,000 cap on care costs (which the Tories had said they'd be introducing) would have been even more welcome. Alas, that promise has been scrapped. It's true that someone in your mother's situation would be better off under the proposals. But many wouldn't be. I'm not making a judgement about the comparative fairness compared to the existing situation - in my view neither is generous. Just pointing out the side of it the Tories won't mention. I tell you what would make it better. I understand there'll be legislation to prevent anyone having to sell their home to afford the care while they stil live there. The State puts a charge on the property while it pays the care bill. If that legislation also applied to those families with relatives in homes then they could rent the property in the meantime. Maybe even a tax incentive if the property was made available for local community housing plans. There's something deeply dishonest and opportunist about Labour calling it a dementia tax, once dementia has fully taken hold that person needs pretty much 24 hour care so in most cases the ill person will go into a care home and have to sell their home anyway. My missus gran had dementia and the only reason her family did not have to put her into a home was the number of kids they had (6) with grandkids and their partners meant that there was enough people to care and this was not to protect the house as it was one of her children's house anyway. This is not going to be the normal situation for most people so for all Labour's invective they will maintain the status quo and leave people with £23k rather than £100k in the proposal. |
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Post by followyoudown on May 19, 2017 13:37:55 GMT
Tory Water Fuel Payment cut will affect everyone not receiving Pension Credit: "McDonnell says he was using the Resolution Foundation figure. If the Tories want to raise something in the region of £1.4bn, they need to restrict winter fuel payments to those on pension credit. He says if that is not the Tory plan, they must say so." Lying, conning Tories! So John McDonnell wants the Tories to deny a story he has made up, yeah ok then. He also wants to give 30 questions for journalists to ask the Tories and mark they progress very politburo-ish. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 19, 2017 14:07:00 GMT
I tell you what would make it better. I understand there'll be legislation to prevent anyone having to sell their home to afford the care while they stil live there. The State puts a charge on the property while it pays the care bill. If that legislation also applied to those families with relatives in homes then they could rent the property in the meantime. Maybe even a tax incentive if the property was made available for local community housing plans. There's something deeply dishonest and opportunist about Labour calling it a dementia tax, once dementia has fully taken hold that person needs pretty much 24 hour care so in most cases the ill person will go into a care home and have to sell their home anyway. My missus gran had dementia and the only reason her family did not have to put her into a home was the number of kids they had (6) with grandkids and their partners meant that there was enough people to care and this was not to protect the house as it was one of her children's house anyway. This is not going to be the normal situation for most people so for all Labour's invective they will maintain the status quo and leave people with £23k rather than £100k in the proposal. Correct. |
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 19, 2017 14:10:55 GMT
I tell you what would make it better. I understand there'll be legislation to prevent anyone having to sell their home to afford the care while they stil live there. The State puts a charge on the property while it pays the care bill. If that legislation also applied to those families with relatives in homes then they could rent the property in the meantime. Maybe even a tax incentive if the property was made available for local community housing plans. There's something deeply dishonest and opportunist about Labour calling it a dementia tax, once dementia has fully taken hold that person needs pretty much 24 hour care so in most cases the ill person will go into a care home and have to sell their home anyway. My missus gran had dementia and the only reason her family did not have to put her into a home was the number of kids they had (6) with grandkids and their partners meant that there was enough people to care and this was not to protect the house as it was one of her children's house anyway. This is not going to be the normal situation for most people so for all Labour's invective they will maintain the status quo and leave people with £23k rather than £100k in the proposal. So the house had already been left to somebody to avoid being sold! There was someone on Radio Stoke yesterday who said he had done the same. So, it is deeply opportunistic of Tories to use inheritance tax/house planning whilst expecting others to pay taxes for their relatives upkeep! Hypocritical scum! |
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