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Post by middleoftheboothen on Nov 8, 2024 13:36:40 GMT
Had a right chuckle reading through the last few pages of this thread š
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Post by wannabee on Nov 8, 2024 13:44:32 GMT
Under STV (which Gawa referenced in a previous post) which is used in Northern Ireland to elect MLAs voting patterns don't change but the result may Under the List System which was formerly used to Elect MEPs you Vote for a Party not a Candidate. I consider this system even less democratic than FPTP STV was introduced in Scotland in 2004. Here is the trend in Scottish elections since that introduction: 1999
Labour - 38.8% (Const vote) 33.6% (reg vote) (56 seats)
SNP - 28.7% (const vote) 27.3% (reg vote) (35 seats)
Tory - 15.6% (const vote) 15.4% (reg vote) (18 seats)
2003
Labour - 34.6% (const vote) 29.3% (reg vote) (50 seats)
SNP - 23.8% (const vote) 20.9% (reg vote) (27 seats)
Tory - 16.6% (const vote) 15.6% (reg vote) (18 seats)
STV introduced in Scottish Parliament for Elections
2007
SNP - 32.9% (const vote) 31.0% (reg vote)(47 seats)
Labour - 32.1% (cost vote) 29.2% (reg vote) (46 seats)
Tory - 16.6% (cost vote) 13.9% (reg vote) (17 seats)
2011
SNP - 45.4% (const vote) 44% (reg vote) (69 seats)
Labour - 31.7% (const vote) 26.3% (reg vote) (37 seats)
Tory - 13.9% (const vote) 12.4% (reg vote) (15 seats)
2016
SNP - 46.5% (const vote) 41.7% (reg vote) (63 seats)
Labour - 22.6% (const vote) 19.1% (reg vote) (24 seats)
Tory - 22% (const vote) 22.9% (reg vote) (31 seats)
2021
SNP - 47.7% (const vote) 40.3% (reg vote) (64 seats)
Labour - 21.6% (const vote) 17.9% (reg vote) (22 seats)
Tory - 21.9% (const vote) 23.5% (reg vote) (31 seats)
Pre STV average:
Labour - 36.7% (const vote) 31.5% (reg vote)
SNP - 26.3% (const vote) 24.1% (reg vote)
Tory - 16.1% (const vote) 15.5% (reg vote)
Post STV average:
Labour - 26.8% (const vote) 23.1% (reg vote)
SNP - 43.1% (const vote) 39.3% (reg vote)
Tory - 18.6% (const vote) 18.2% (reg vote) One massive noticeable difference after the change was the difference between the local gov STV elections and the national FPTP elections. In 2005 with FPTP only 17.7% voting SNP but with STV in 2007 32.9% (const) voted SNP. In 2010 with FPTP only 19.9% voted SNP but with STV in 2011 47.7% (const) voted SNP. Then it was at this point that the Scottish electorate realised that the only thing which was keeping them voting for Labour in national elections was the FPTP system created to keep people in this binary "next best thing" mindset. Once the people realised this, the trends which seen more people vote SNP in STV because it wasn't "wasted" were then replicated into national elections. And that's when the government realised that they need to up their ante on their smear campaigns and the SNP Alex Salmond received the same fate as what was to meet Jeremy Corbyn a few years later with the assistance of course from a very complicit media too who are well documented with their bias against the SNP*. I have no doubt that those in Scotland will continue along the same trajectory they have done since STV was introduced in 2004 which is rejecting this two party system of voting for different clowns from the same circus, and instead voting for parties who represent their values and beliefs. *Also just like the labour party it's worth highlighting an Alex Salmond led SNP is different from a Swinney/Sturgeon one. Just like a Starmer Labour compared to a Corbyn Labour. Scotland doesn't use STV to elect MSPs to Scottish Parliament it uses Additional Members System AMS. It is a semi-proportional system Scotland does use STV for local elections Both AMS and STV are designed to create more diversity of representation. In Scotland it didn't when a single issue, Independence, dominated the agenda and gave the results you quoted. In any case it's quite irrelevant to the only point I have made twice previously is that whatever Voting System is used the Candidates don't and people will obviously select their first choice based on their preference. They may or may not choose to select their 2nd preference and do on. Therefore the Voting selection doesn't change but again as I have also said twice previously the result may. It is also irrelevant (at least for a considerably amount of time) as far as Westminster Elections are concerned because Labour have no intention of changing from FPTP so the earliest possible date it might be introduced would be after the next General Election or in 11 years time.
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Post by lawrieleslie on Nov 8, 2024 14:00:34 GMT
Anybody see the 'family photo' of Trump? Musk was on it but no Melania. I always watch her body language when she's with 'hubby' and often it's not so subtle that she doesn't like him. When he pops his clogs, I can see hell up when they're squabbling over who inherits his assets. And I reckon at the next election we will see the beginning of a dynasty when his eldest son takes the reigns. I've little doubt Donald will already be setting things in motion. Not a pleasant thought. OS. nothing the bushes, and kennedy's didnt do beforehand back on this forum in 2016 i suggested the dems needed to prepare for 8 years of trump and spend this time to get at least two credible candidates ready for 2024 (although they won unexpectedley in 2020 and now this loss) they still need to find these credible candidates these candidates need policies and a vision simply being "not trump" has proved it does not work Donāt know why but to me Elon Musk cuts the dash of a James Bond villain. A shadowy, filthy rich trouble maker.
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Post by starkiller on Nov 8, 2024 14:33:04 GMT
Anybody see the 'family photo' of Trump? Musk was on it but no Melania. I always watch her body language when she's with 'hubby' and often it's not so subtle that she doesn't like him. When he pops his clogs, I can see hell up when they're squabbling over who inherits his assets. And I reckon at the next election we will see the beginning of a dynasty when his eldest son takes the reigns. I've little doubt Donald will already be setting things in motion. Not a pleasant thought. OS. Not much different than our own Prime Minister and wife. Americans had more important things to vote on than bedroom fantasies about candidates.
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Post by Foster on Nov 8, 2024 14:35:31 GMT
Martha needs to stay away from you I think! Oggy's wank bank doesn't sound too healthy. š¤¢ Have you guys considered getting a room? They did, but apparently you and Gawa booked the last one
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Post by sticky on Nov 8, 2024 14:49:57 GMT
I can see some fun and games on here later when folk have a had a few beersš
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Post by Gawa on Nov 8, 2024 15:05:29 GMT
So much for draining the swamp, this is filling it. Lots of rumours of a big job for our Mike.
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Post by oggyoggy on Nov 8, 2024 15:07:36 GMT
Have you guys considered getting a room? They did, but apparently you and Gawa booked the last one Paul and Ariel have been in the room together for hours if you look at the other election threadā¦. They are real goers.
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Post by Foster on Nov 8, 2024 15:43:05 GMT
They did, but apparently you and Gawa booked the last one Paul and Ariel have been in the room together for hours if you look at the other election threadā¦. They are real goers. That would explain the optimism over the next few years
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Nov 8, 2024 15:49:13 GMT
I can see some fun and games on here later when folk have a had a few beersš šIt has been a highly enjoyable thread to be involved in thus far. That said, the prospect of pissed up oatcakers discussing Trump...
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Post by wannabee on Nov 8, 2024 17:01:40 GMT
So much for draining the swamp, this is filling it. Lots of rumours of a big job for our Mike. He and Trump should make a perfect couple As a true Evangelical Mike hates everyone who isn't like him and even his fellow Americans he wants to keep under surveillance especially, err you know, those ones. Trump should provide a perfect counterbalance because I've learned on here he's a Man of Peace.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Nov 8, 2024 17:43:40 GMT
So much for draining the swamp, this is filling it. Lots of rumours of a big job for our Mike. He and Trump should make a perfect coupleĀ As a true Evangelical Mike hates everyone who isn't like him and even his fellow Americans he wants to keep under surveillance especially, err you know, those ones. Trump should provide a perfect counterbalance because I've learned on here he's a Man of Peace. Indeed. Brian Hook announced now. Looking like a team of right peaceful hippy doves he's putting together around him! š¤¦āāļø
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Post by Paul Spencer on Nov 8, 2024 17:51:14 GMT
He really is the second coming of Gandhi ... š
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Post by Gawa on Nov 8, 2024 18:01:34 GMT
He really is the second coming of Gandhi ... š And you think this imperialist is going to be handing Ukraine to Russia? I think the fabricated unrequited special relationship with Putin may be shown up. Donald Trump will not be the man to exit Ukraine after spending billions unless the American economy is going to benefit financially off the back of it.
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Post by questionable on Nov 8, 2024 18:06:38 GMT
I think the world will be a safer place with Trump at the helm
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Nov 8, 2024 18:22:17 GMT
I think the world will be a safer place with Trump at the helm Uh oh youāve done it nowā¦ā¦..
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Post by questionable on Nov 8, 2024 18:28:46 GMT
I think the world will be a safer place with Trump at the helm Uh oh youāve done it nowā¦ā¦.. Iām watching him now live on TV and he talks a lot of sense regarding the Biden administration and how theyāre totally wrecked America, no arguing with him really
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Nov 8, 2024 18:31:05 GMT
Uh oh youāve done it nowā¦ā¦.. Iām watching him now live on TV and he talks a lot of sense regarding the Biden administration and how theyāre totally wrecked America, no arguing with him really Oh agree completely
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Post by questionable on Nov 8, 2024 18:47:43 GMT
Iām watching him now live on TV and he talks a lot of sense regarding the Biden administration and how theyāre totally wrecked America, no arguing with him really Oh agree completely Tariff wise heās going to hammer Europe heās literally naming and shaming individual countries and companies, no stopping this bloke heās got a long memory and doesnāt forget ā watching Starmerā ??
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Nov 8, 2024 18:48:31 GMT
Tariff wise heās going to hammer Europe heās literally naming and shaming individual countries and companies, no stopping this bloke heās got a long memory and doesnāt forget ā watching Starmerā ?? What goes around comes around
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Nov 8, 2024 19:15:38 GMT
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Post by questionable on Nov 8, 2024 19:23:07 GMT
First time Iāve actually watched and listened to Trump, Iām ashamed Iāve actually believed what the MSM have fed to me about him, heās hard to argue against. New world order resumed??
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Nov 8, 2024 19:42:57 GMT
First time Iāve actually watched and listened to Trump, Iām ashamed Iāve actually believed what the MSM have fed to me about him, heās hard to argue against. New world order resumed?? Seems like the grown ups are back in the room š
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Post by georgeberrysafro on Nov 8, 2024 19:46:14 GMT
Reading through the last few pages or I don't think many people grasp the consequences of what has just happened in the US election - just mindless gloating.
Bernie Sanders - How does the Republican party do so well? Worth the 5 minutes.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Nov 8, 2024 19:53:03 GMT
He really is the second coming of Gandhi ... š And you think this imperialist is going to be handing Ukraine to Russia? I think the fabricated unrequited special relationship with Putin may be shown up. Donald Trump will not be the man to exit Ukraine after spending billions unless the American economy is going to benefit financially off the back of it. To be fair, I've addressed this on the other thread mate, it's a pity there's two running side by side.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 8, 2024 19:55:55 GMT
Massive hypocrite alert....
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 8, 2024 19:58:33 GMT
Reading through the last few pages or I don't think many people grasp the consequences of what has just happened in the US election - just mindless gloating. Bernie Sanders - How does the Republican party do so well? Worth the 5 minutes. I think this thread demonstrates this perfectly. You cannot argue with stupid.
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Post by georgeberrysafro on Nov 8, 2024 19:58:44 GMT
Brilliant role model - fired from WWE after leaked sex tapes revealed his racist N word rant about his daughter sleeping with a black man.
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Post by OldStokie on Nov 8, 2024 19:59:06 GMT
I saw on the news that The Donald wants to make public what they know about aliens from outta space. He could start on this board. I can think of two... one who resembles a zebra crossing and another from the Nordic countries who has strange neighbours. OS.
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Post by oggyoggy on Nov 8, 2024 20:07:07 GMT
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