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Post by spartanstokie on Mar 19, 2015 14:02:54 GMT
you know what i never understand why people moan about the England team ............. Ryan is better off without it he needs to sort his back out first plus i personally think if he was that worried he would of left for a team that is more fashionable in the England managers eyes.
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Post by 2004 on Mar 19, 2015 14:07:00 GMT
That squad is depressing to look at. Hart and Clyne are the only defensive players I like. I'd rather we picked conference players ahead of Jones and Smalling. Some baffling selections in Jagielka, Barkley, Townsend and Delph. Austin should have been in instead of Welbeck. We will scrape 2 wins and Woy will be the messiah.
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Post by shrewspotter on Mar 19, 2015 15:03:01 GMT
fair point.....you actually said you'd want your own nation to lose just to prove a petty point; that's actually worse i could understand if you though that getting someone else in as manager would dramatically improve us but the fact is that in terms of results in qualifiers Hodgson is doing a good job. in terms of performances at major tournaments he falls down..but then again so has EVERY England manager in history apart from Alf Ramsay. if you think that bringing in someone else who'd pick the squad you want would make us contenders then you're just deluded and instead of looking at the facts (i.e. no matter what England squad anyone selected we're just not good enough to compete for trophies at intenrational level) you're just using the age old lazy excuse of "Blame the manager" lazy excuse ha......this guy couldn't get us out of group containing Costa Rica, a poor Italy side and a Uruguay side that had one good player in its ranks. Have you forgot this?
We should have waltzed that group, end of.....but we didn't and what do the FA, do, re appoint him for another 2 years, just because Eriksson, Capello etc were poor doesn't mean we should accept it, we should do better and if you think we are punching a the right level with the likes of Hodgson it is in fact you that is delusional. You say the qualifiers, please please mate, we are up against friggin Lithuania and other garbage that quite frankly are more Port Vales level.
The fact is that Jagielka gets mullered by decent international strikers and he gets in, Smalling is crap and Jones overrated (even Uts fans agree!!), Shawcross gets mullered for 15 minutes and career over, that my friend is hypocrisy
anyway rant over
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Post by bignickhowes on Mar 19, 2015 15:17:37 GMT
delph alsongside clark have been villas best players this season, I see you are judging players off the odd game though.. Some HUGE irony in that post Nick lad Villa have had a terrible season but they have performed well which says a lot about them
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Post by Pugsley on Mar 19, 2015 15:24:00 GMT
fair point.....you actually said you'd want your own nation to lose just to prove a petty point; that's actually worse i could understand if you though that getting someone else in as manager would dramatically improve us but the fact is that in terms of results in qualifiers Hodgson is doing a good job. in terms of performances at major tournaments he falls down..but then again so has EVERY England manager in history apart from Alf Ramsay. if you think that bringing in someone else who'd pick the squad you want would make us contenders then you're just deluded and instead of looking at the facts (i.e. no matter what England squad anyone selected we're just not good enough to compete for trophies at intenrational level) you're just using the age old lazy excuse of "Blame the manager"
Sorry but this manager has had two tournaments and we have been abject in both. Other managers have got us to 1/4 finals of the world cup, this tool hasn't. Given the nature of groups nowadays, qualification should be a given.
He get's a free pass for the Euro's and we park the bus and serve up some of the worst football since the binary season. Goes to Brazil and decides to play 4-2-4 and doesn't pick our best left back and we get torn a new arsehole. We're terrible under this bloke.
It's time for the next cab on the rank - Bruce or Allardyce to have a go.
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Post by onionman on Mar 19, 2015 15:40:37 GMT
The saddest part of this particular squad, for me, is the omission of Charlie Austin.
Charlie Austin now knows that scoring 14 goals in 23 games for QPR is not good enough to get himself in the England squad.
However he could join a club like Arsenal and score 4 goals in 21 games, as Welbeck has, and he would be straight on the team sheet.
It really doesn't help the smaller clubs hang onto their best players, and therefore have any chance of closing the gap on the moneybags giants, when the England manager is so lazily and blindly favouring the rich and famous clubs.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2015 15:50:29 GMT
The saddest part of this particular squad, for me, is the omission of Charlie Austin. Charlie Austin now knows that scoring 14 goals in 23 games for QPR is not good enough to get himself in the England squad. However he could join a club like Arsenal and score 4 goals in 21 games, as Welbeck has, and he would be straight on the team sheet. It really doesn't help the smaller clubs hang onto their best players, and therefore have any chance of closing the gap on the moneybags giants, when the England manager is so lazily and blindly favouring the rich and famous clubs. 100% spot on the fucktard who is our current manager picks players on who they play for not how they are playing which is a disgrace How the FA still think this tosser could lead our Country is beyond me.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2015 16:00:28 GMT
fair point.....you actually said you'd want your own nation to lose just to prove a petty point; that's actually worse i could understand if you though that getting someone else in as manager would dramatically improve us but the fact is that in terms of results in qualifiers Hodgson is doing a good job. in terms of performances at major tournaments he falls down..but then again so has EVERY England manager in history apart from Alf Ramsay. if you think that bringing in someone else who'd pick the squad you want would make us contenders then you're just deluded and instead of looking at the facts (i.e. no matter what England squad anyone selected we're just not good enough to compete for trophies at intenrational level) you're just using the age old lazy excuse of "Blame the manager" lazy excuse ha......this guy couldn't get us out of group containing Costa Rica, a poor Italy side and a Uruguay side that had one good player in its ranks. Have you forgot this?
We should have waltzed that group, end of.....but we didn't and what do the FA, do, re appoint him for another 2 years, just because Eriksson, Capello etc were poor doesn't mean we should accept it, we should do better and if you think we are punching a the right level with the likes of Hodgson it is in fact you that is delusional. You say the qualifiers, please please mate, we are up against friggin Lithuania and other garbage that quite frankly are more Port Vales level.
The fact is that Jagielka gets mullered by decent international strikers and he gets in, Smalling is crap and Jones overrated (even Uts fans agree!!), Shawcross gets mullered for 15 minutes and career over, that my friend is hypocrisy
anyway rant over
pretty sure i already said he's found wanting at major tournaments haven't i? oh yeah i did! i also pointed out that every manager since 1966 has as well..the difference is that nowadays, no matter which players you select we're just not even in the same ballpark as the "big" teams anymore. this complete fallacy that we should automatically be getting out of the groups is based on nothing other than bullshit media overhyping because "We're England". we're absolutely no better whatsoever than Italy or Uruguay in any way..we're about the same level so not progressing wasn't a big shock for most people. the only people that seemed to find it bemusing seem to be those that but into this idea that England are automatically one of the best teams around and that hasn't been true for a good few years now mate! the personnel we have at our disposal just isn't anywhere near the standard of the truly quality sides out there and until it is, NO manager on the planet could do much more with our side than hodgson has. i'm not saying i like him or that he's irreplaceable or that he doesn't make mistakes but this utter bullshit idea that we should be doing better than we are just isn't true at all, in any way, shape or form! we're failing because our players aren't of the same quality (hence the whole call for improving grass roots football etc. because those experts know we're not at the same level as other countries players are so they want to address that)...end of!
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Post by dirtygary69 on Mar 19, 2015 16:05:08 GMT
Oh get off your high horse for once Mick. I can't be frigged getting into a debate. How else am I supposed to gauge an opinion? I don't need to watch every minute of every game to know that much of this squad is a fucking joke.
He's only mentioned Delph because he's a Villa weapon who's on here for no other reason than to ram Villa down our throats even though they're fucking dump.
Like I said before, it's never going to be completely overhauled and Delph has been in the last couple of squads so it was unlikely he was going to be dropped. Doesn't mean that he's been in brilliant form all season, does it? Maybe calling him gash was harsh, he just doesn't do anything that stands out. The odd good goal and the odd bad tackle. Nothing more, nothing less.
not about being on a high horse more about you needing some fucking anger management mate and realising that getting so het up about something that by your own admission you know very little about (i.e. Delph's form) is just daft and makes you look like a dick (no change there then) calm the fuck down...you'd be the first to go mad at someone if they called Ryan "gash" on the basis of watching 3 games all season. stop being a prat and chill the fuck out Mr. Angry
Mick (I know that isn't your name), my issue with you is that you seem to take issue with the tiniest aspect of a post and pick it apart. I made a throwaway comment about Delph being gash. He hasn't impressed me whenever I've seen him play, so what. I also made a few other points yet you choose to try and pick apart my Delph opinion for whatever reason. Am I now only allowed an opinion on players I see every week? How do you form your opinions?
If someone said Ryan was gash I'd say they were talking shit - you're bang on. He is our captain, an ever-present up until this season and a player who has led us to (what looks to be) two consecutive top 10 PL finishes. And he's still only 27. I'd say that I had a fair point. Maybe I've missed Delph being anything other than bang average. I certainly wouldn't say he was deserving of a place in the squad but there are few options to choose from.
I don't think I'm usually that much of dick. Nor do I think you are. I just think you go off tangent somewhat and try and win meaningless arguments sometimes.
XXX
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Post by Pugsley on Mar 19, 2015 16:05:54 GMT
lazy excuse ha......this guy couldn't get us out of group containing Costa Rica, a poor Italy side and a Uruguay side that had one good player in its ranks. Have you forgot this?
We should have waltzed that group, end of.....but we didn't and what do the FA, do, re appoint him for another 2 years, just because Eriksson, Capello etc were poor doesn't mean we should accept it, we should do better and if you think we are punching a the right level with the likes of Hodgson it is in fact you that is delusional. You say the qualifiers, please please mate, we are up against friggin Lithuania and other garbage that quite frankly are more Port Vales level.
The fact is that Jagielka gets mullered by decent international strikers and he gets in, Smalling is crap and Jones overrated (even Uts fans agree!!), Shawcross gets mullered for 15 minutes and career over, that my friend is hypocrisy
anyway rant over
pretty sure i already said he's found wanting at major tournaments haven't i? oh yeah i did! i also pointed out that every manager since 1966 has as well..the difference is that nowadays, no matter which players you select we're just not even in the same ballpark as the "big" teams anymore. this complete fallacy that we should automatically be getting out of the groups is based on nothing other than bullshit media overhyping because "We're England". we're absolutely no better whatsoever than Italy or Uruguay in any way..we're about the same level so not progressing wasn't a big shock for most people. the only people that seemed to find it bemusing seem to be those that but into this idea that England are automatically one of the best teams around and that hasn't been true for a good few years now mate! the personnel we have at our disposal just isn't anywhere near the standard of the truly quality sides out there and until it is, NO manager on the planet could do much more with our side than hodgson has. i'm not saying i like him or that he's irreplaceable or that he doesn't make mistakes but this utter bullshit idea that we should be doing better than we are just isn't true at all, in any way, shape or form! we're failing because our players aren't of the same quality (hence the whole call for improving grass roots football etc. because those experts know we're not at the same level as other countries players are so they want to address that)...end of!
Are you actually saying Hodgson couldn't have done more in the World cup just gone? Tactically alone we were a laughing stock, not to mention mind boggling selections and moronic statements in the press. He's had his chance, next please.
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Post by sportsman on Mar 19, 2015 16:14:10 GMT
I wouldn't have Fabian stealth anywhere near stoke's side. Massively overrated.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2015 16:16:53 GMT
not about being on a high horse more about you needing some fucking anger management mate and realising that getting so het up about something that by your own admission you know very little about (i.e. Delph's form) is just daft and makes you look like a dick (no change there then) calm the fuck down...you'd be the first to go mad at someone if they called Ryan "gash" on the basis of watching 3 games all season. stop being a prat and chill the fuck out Mr. Angry
Mick (I know that isn't your name), my issue with you is that you seem to take issue with the tiniest aspect of a post and pick it apart. I made a throwaway comment about Delph being gash. He hasn't impressed me whenever I've seen him play, so what. I also made a few other points yet you choose to try and pick apart my Delph opinion for whatever reason. Am I now only allowed an opinion on players I see every week? How do you form your opinions?
If someone said Ryan was gash I'd say they were talking shit - you're bang on. He is our captain, an ever-present up until this season and a player who has led us to (what looks to be) two consecutive top 10 PL finishes. And he's still only 27. I'd say that I had a fair point. Maybe I've missed Delph being anything other than bang average. I certainly wouldn't say he was deserving of a place in the squad but there are few options to choose from.
I don't think I'm usually that much of dick. Nor do I think you are. I just think you go off tangent somewhat and try and win meaningless arguments sometimes.
XXX
it wasn't even me that picked apart your comment on Delph!!! all i did was explain the point the other poster was trying to make when you went off on him for disagreeing with you
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2015 16:24:23 GMT
pretty sure i already said he's found wanting at major tournaments haven't i? oh yeah i did! i also pointed out that every manager since 1966 has as well..the difference is that nowadays, no matter which players you select we're just not even in the same ballpark as the "big" teams anymore. this complete fallacy that we should automatically be getting out of the groups is based on nothing other than bullshit media overhyping because "We're England". we're absolutely no better whatsoever than Italy or Uruguay in any way..we're about the same level so not progressing wasn't a big shock for most people. the only people that seemed to find it bemusing seem to be those that but into this idea that England are automatically one of the best teams around and that hasn't been true for a good few years now mate! the personnel we have at our disposal just isn't anywhere near the standard of the truly quality sides out there and until it is, NO manager on the planet could do much more with our side than hodgson has. i'm not saying i like him or that he's irreplaceable or that he doesn't make mistakes but this utter bullshit idea that we should be doing better than we are just isn't true at all, in any way, shape or form! we're failing because our players aren't of the same quality (hence the whole call for improving grass roots football etc. because those experts know we're not at the same level as other countries players are so they want to address that)...end of!
Are you actually saying Hodgson couldn't have done more in the World cup just gone? Tactically alone we were a laughing stock, not to mention mind boggling selections and moronic statements in the press. He's had his chance, next please.
not only have i not said that but i actually specified that i DON'T think he irreplaceable or incapable of making mistakes. what i said was that if anyone thinks that a new manager would significantly improve us is conveniently ignoring the fact that we just aren't very good simply because our personnel on the pitch aren't even close to the quality of international sides that actually are good.(i.e. in reality, not just the minds of the press or the fans who think we should achieve based on nothing other than the word "England") i think the stat is something along the lines that in the last 23 major tournaments, we've gone out either in the group stages or the first knock out round in about 16 of them. this idea that we SHOULD be achieving more has never been based on anything factual and given the mediocre quality of most of our players nowadays it most definitely doesn't have anything to base it on now! i wouldn't give a shit if Hodgson was sacked but if you really think that he's the root cause of England's problems at international level then you really are sticking your head firmly in the sand mate and completely ignoring the reality of the situation.
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Post by trigger on Mar 19, 2015 16:29:04 GMT
He was never going to get in the squad but I fukinc hate that sour faced wanker Hodgson, he's got a face you'd never get sick of punching.
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Post by coates on Mar 19, 2015 17:00:45 GMT
Its pretty obvious shawcross will never get picked for england again.
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Post by mywaydesolzan on Mar 19, 2015 17:17:08 GMT
Its pretty obvious shawcross will never get picked for england again. On what do you base that assumption?
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Mar 19, 2015 17:18:25 GMT
Its pretty obvious shawcross will never get picked for england again. On what do you base that assumption? He won't while this manager is in charged.
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Post by Bowyer83 on Mar 19, 2015 17:27:11 GMT
I would like to see Ryan in an England shirt again but under the management of Hodgson it won't happen.
It doesn't matter who's picked in his current squad because our group is so poor we will walk it. He could pick a mixture of players from any English league and we would qualify.
The frustrating thing is Shawcross out of the defenders chosen would gain solid experience and possibly build a partnership with somebody like Cahill.
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Post by mywaydesolzan on Mar 19, 2015 17:33:41 GMT
On what do you base that assumption? He won't while this manager is in charged. Maybe not, but the post stated that he would never play for his country again. What if he is off in the summer? What if Hodgson leaves his post? I don't know and nor does anyone else.
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Post by mrpickles on Mar 19, 2015 17:34:31 GMT
Are you actually saying Hodgson couldn't have done more in the World cup just gone? Tactically alone we were a laughing stock, not to mention mind boggling selections and moronic statements in the press. He's had his chance, next please.
not only have i not said that but i actually specified that i DON'T think he irreplaceable or incapable of making mistakes. what i said was that if anyone thinks that a new manager would significantly improve us is conveniently ignoring the fact that we just aren't very good simply because our personnel on the pitch aren't even close to the quality of international sides that actually are good.(i.e. in reality, not just the minds of the press or the fans who think we should achieve based on nothing other than the word "England") i think the stat is something along the lines that in the last 23 major tournaments, we've gone out either in the group stages or the first knock out round in about 16 of them. this idea that we SHOULD be achieving more has never been based on anything factual and given the mediocre quality of most of our players nowadays it most definitely doesn't have anything to base it on now! i wouldn't give a shit if Hodgson was sacked but if you really think that he's the root cause of England's problems at international level then you really are sticking your head firmly in the sand mate and completely ignoring the reality of the situation. It's his approach that pisses me off mick. Whilst we haven't got the quality of player good enough to win a tournament, I'd argue that we could at least put a team out that could play some decent attacking football and not be any worse off than we are now. Better still, I think we would be playing to the strengths of our better players. While none of the below are perfect, when you have the likes of Sterling, Sturridge, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Barkley, and Rooney to choose from, as well as a couple of decent attacking full backs (well... Attacking at least), and are as shite to watch and predictable as we were on the way to finishing bottom of an average world cup group, then it's definitely time for a change. If Hodgson was boring AND successful (getting England to a tournament isn't success), then fair enough, but he's got a half decent group of attacking players that if he had the bollocks to put on the pitch at the same time, and let them express themselves a bit, could at least give us a good time on our journey to not winning a major competition His mentality is not right for the current crop of lads he has to choose from imo. I don't like the guy, but I reckon if Brendan Rodgers was put in charge of the same group, he would have them playing a more adventurous style of play better suited to the personnel, and not be any worse off results wise. Edit - I forgot the Ox got injured Still the same point though
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Post by stokemanusa on Mar 19, 2015 17:35:40 GMT
The saddest part of this particular squad, for me, is the omission of Charlie Austin. Charlie Austin now knows that scoring 14 goals in 23 games for QPR is not good enough to get himself in the England squad. However he could join a club like Arsenal and score 4 goals in 21 games, as Welbeck has, and he would be straight on the team sheet. It really doesn't help the smaller clubs hang onto their best players, and therefore have any chance of closing the gap on the moneybags giants, when the England manager is so lazily and blindly favouring the rich and famous clubs. Nailed on. This sheet is depressing at best... Carrick... Am I reading that correctly? Fucking hell the old git has lost it!
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Post by mrcoke on Mar 19, 2015 17:50:54 GMT
For Hodgson to pick Ryan now, he would be admitting he has been wrong not to pick him in the past.
The guy must be one of the worst managers England has ever had; effectively knocked out of the WC finals after 2 games. The only ones's who could be deemed worse are those that failed to qualify England for the finals like McClaren. The only sympathy I have is that IMO there are very few true world class England player these days.
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Post by robrigo on Mar 19, 2015 18:07:50 GMT
England...I just can't be arsed with our International team now and it truly hurts to say that. I remember the days when I used to get excited about watching them in tournaments and qualifiers, usually down the pub with my mates. Maybe because i'm getting older, maybe because of all the false dawns, the so called Golden generation, the same tired excuses when we fail to do anything of note. I always watch the games but by half time i've usually lost interest. I don't know why really, theres no particular reason. Ryan should be in the England squad, as should others, but its not going to change. I'm just completely indifferent to England now. Of course I want us to do well but I don't have any real hope we will. Perhaps thats the problem...hope and belief. I don't think we will win another major trophy in our lifetime. I can sort of accept that but really we are as a nation miles behind many other nations.
This continous picking players out of form and from the 'big' clubs sorts of adds to it. Stoke City is my priority. If i was Ryan, i'd play for Wales.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Mar 19, 2015 18:18:33 GMT
England...I just can't be arsed with our International team now and it truly hurts to say that. I remember the days when I used to get excited about watching them in tournaments and qualifiers, usually down the pub with my mates. Maybe because i'm getting older, maybe because of all the false dawns, the so called Golden generation, the same tired excuses when we fail to do anything of note. I always watch the games but by half time i've usually lost interest. I don't know why really, theres no particular reason. Ryan should be in the England squad, as should others, but its not going to change. I'm just completely indifferent to England now. Of course I want us to do well but I don't have any real hope we will. Perhaps thats the problem...hope and belief. I don't think we will win another major trophy in our lifetime. I can sort of accept that but really we are as a nation miles behind many other nations. This continous picking players out of form and from the 'big' clubs sorts of adds to it. Stoke City is my priority. If i was Ryan, i'd play for Wales. What robrigo said. I think long gone are the days when players were proud to be picked, the modern day footballer it seems to me,is like they couldn't care less one way or the other.
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Post by mrcoke on Mar 19, 2015 18:18:39 GMT
England...I just can't be arsed with our International team now and it truly hurts to say that. I remember the days when I used to get excited about watching them in tournaments and qualifiers, usually down the pub with my mates. Maybe because i'm getting older, maybe because of all the false dawns, the so called Golden generation, the same tired excuses when we fail to do anything of note. I always watch the games but by half time i've usually lost interest. I don't know why really, theres no particular reason. Ryan should be in the England squad, as should others, but its not going to change. I'm just completely indifferent to England now. Of course I want us to do well but I don't have any real hope we will. Perhaps thats the problem...hope and belief. I don't think we will win another major trophy in our lifetime. I can sort of accept that but really we are as a nation miles behind many other nations. This continous picking players out of form and from the 'big' clubs sorts of adds to it. Stoke City is my priority. If i was Ryan, i'd play for Wales. He would be genuinely appreciated by the Welsh, just as he is at Stoke. If he went to play for a top 6 club he would only be watched critically and derided for every mistake by the so called supporters. That's assuming he is not just kept on the bench.
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Post by StokeAz on Mar 19, 2015 18:31:38 GMT
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Post by StokeAz on Mar 19, 2015 18:33:23 GMT
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 19, 2015 18:33:54 GMT
How have Shaw and Barkley got into it?
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Post by geoff321 on Mar 19, 2015 18:39:21 GMT
It's fairly obvious, at least to me, that England managers pick the players they think are the best.
Regarding Smalling, Jones and Carrick the present United manager seems to rate them as did Ferguson and Moyes.
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Post by spiderpuss on Mar 19, 2015 18:48:50 GMT
Just watching Jags getting mullered at the back, and Woy thinks he's good enough. Oh dear.
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