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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Apr 6, 2024 9:38:20 GMT
It'd be genuinely interesting to see the result of a vote where individual votes count for proportional represemtation as oppose to the first past the post system.
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Apr 6, 2024 9:39:22 GMT
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Apr 6, 2024 9:39:22 GMT
It'd be genuinely interesting to see the result of a vote where individual votes count for proportional represemtation as oppose to the first past the post system. Could it be time for an oatcake poll?👀
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Post by redstriper on Apr 6, 2024 9:39:34 GMT
I'm thinking of changing my name by deed poll to Mr "NoneOfTheAbove" - and standing locally. I suspect I'll win comfortably.
I did consider a name change to "OurSystemStinks" but it looks bad on a passport.
Within four years I hope to voting in Portugal instead.
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Post by mrnovember on Apr 6, 2024 10:19:38 GMT
Personally I'll be putting all my chips on current thingism. My vote will hinge entirely on the candidates stance on a single, specific issue that is happening thousands of miles away from my house.
I mean, how much can you really tell from a manifesto? Fiscal policies? Strategy? They never come true. What matters is how many marches have they been on in solidarity with the victims of the aforementioned single, specific issue.
Sure there are other foreign affairs, ones where you could argue we have more skin in the game, but they've not really been in the news so it doesn't matter.
So stuff Labour and it's plans to improve health care, education, living standards and access to renewable energy in the country that I live in. I don't care that they have pledged to stop spending our money on expensive hotel suites for asylum seekers. And bringing back family doctors? Free breakfasts for school children? Pah! It's all about the placards mate.
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Post by wannabee on Apr 6, 2024 10:56:42 GMT
Taking into account the comments on here and the various Polls there has never been as much Public anger in a ruling party in my lifetime
The grudging support for Labour in National Polls, if not on here, I think reflects that under a Labour Government not much will change economically just less corruption and sleaze hopefully
I think when the Election arrives in 6/7 months time despite the apathy on here there will be a large turnout and I doubt the number of spoiled Votes will be significant
Of course there will be tactical Voting against the Conservatives and the main beneficiaries will be the Lib Dems who have built a Constituency structure around hard working local Councillors
Reform who are Polling at about the same as Lib Dems at 10% don't have that infrastructure and are likely to get no seats
Undoubtedly in some Constituencies Reform will split the Right Wing Vote and allow a third Party, mostly Labour win. I wouldn't rule out a grubby deal being worked out before GE for Reform to stand down the same as UKIP did in 2017 and Brexit Party did in 2019
When people clamour for PR for fairer representation I wonder which type of PR they are looking for. Under UK Parliamentary Democracy FPTP system currently people vote for a Candidate not a Party to represent them. If the Voting system was changed to PR in the vast majority of the Constituencies the result wouldn't change.
In the most recent YouGov Poll which analysed Reform at the Constituency Level, the highest share of Vote Reform received was 27% in Barnsley which means that as the candidates with the fewest votes drop out their 2nd and 3rd choice of Candidate etc must eventually give 50% +1 I find it highly unlikely Reform would receive transfers other than from Conservatives and again in YouGov Poll Reform were 2nd Conservatives 3rd in only 7 Constituencies
An alternative PR System is which was used for EU Elections. In that system people voted for a Party not any Candidate. The Parties then decided themselves depending on what share of the Vote they received the order in which their Candidates would be Elected (This was the method UK selected, nothing to do with EU Rules)
Personally I think this method is even less Democratic and you could end up being represented by someone who lives hundreds of miles away.
Can't wait for Election Night with ample quantities of Popcorn to see one after another of these Entitled Conservative Arseholes being given their comeuppance, it will be a Portillo moment in Spades.
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Post by GrahamHyde on Apr 6, 2024 11:40:56 GMT
Can't wait for Election Night with ample quantities of Popcorn to see one after another of these Entitled Conservative Arseholes being given their comeuppance, it will be a Portillo moment in Spades. I just really hope Gullis is one of them. He's an embarrassment for the local area. People see him chirping up on social media and conflate that with hard work. My concern is that those who are apathetic with the Tories but equally see Labour as being no better will just revert to type rather than a spoiled ballot or an amnesty.
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Post by Dave the Rave on Apr 6, 2024 12:08:22 GMT
Labour.
It'd be nice to have someone in No. 10 who grew up in a way that I can actually relate to.
It's time to stop entrusting our future to corrupt Eton boys.
The Tories are modern day aristocrats who only seek to serve themselves. The ruling classes have never sought to improve the lives of working class people unless it benefits them too.
The wealth inequality in this country is grotesque and I believe only Labour will try and address that (try being the operative word given the strangle hold that the wealthy have on practically everything).
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Apr 6, 2024 12:21:41 GMT
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Post by iancransonsknees on Apr 6, 2024 12:21:41 GMT
That's a pisser He's a footnote now Both Sunak and Starmer are shit scared of Nige Got them in the palm of his hand.
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Apr 6, 2024 12:38:56 GMT
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Apr 6, 2024 12:38:56 GMT
Taking into account the comments on here and the various Polls there has never been as much Public anger in a ruling party in my lifetime The grudging support for Labour in National Polls, if not on here, I think reflects that under a Labour Government not much will change economically just less corruption and sleaze hopefully I think when the Election arrives in 6/7 months time despite the apathy on here there will be a large turnout and I doubt the number of spoiled Votes will be significant Of course there will be tactical Voting against the Conservatives and the main beneficiaries will be the Lib Dems who have built a Constituency structure around hard working local Councillors Reform who are Polling at about the same as Lib Dems at 10% don't have that infrastructure and are likely to get no seats Undoubtedly in some Constituencies Reform will split the Right Wing Vote and allow a third Party, mostly Labour win. I wouldn't rule out a grubby deal being worked out before GE for Reform to stand down the same as UKIP did in 2017 and Brexit Party did in 2019 When people clamour for PR for fairer representation I wonder which type of PR they are looking for. Under UK Parliamentary Democracy FPTP system currently people vote for a Candidate not a Party to represent them. If the Voting system was changed to PR in the vast majority of the Constituencies the result wouldn't change. In the most recent YouGov Poll which analysed Reform at the Constituency Level, the highest share of Vote Reform received was 27% in Barnsley which means that as the candidates with the fewest votes drop out their 2nd and 3rd choice of Candidate etc must eventually give 50% +1 I find it highly unlikely Reform would receive transfers other than from Conservatives and again in YouGov Poll Reform were 2nd Conservatives 3rd in only 7 Constituencies An alternative PR System is which was used for EU Elections. In that system people voted for a Party not any Candidate. The Parties then decided themselves depending on what share of the Vote they received the order in which their Candidates would be Elected (This was the method UK selected, nothing to do with EU Rules) Personally I think this method is even less Democratic and you could end up being represented by someone who lives hundreds of miles away. Can't wait for Election Night with ample quantities of Popcorn to see one after another of these Entitled Conservative Arseholes being given their comeuppance, it will be a Portillo moment in Spades. The single transferable vote (STV) does preserve the principle of voting for an individual but as you say does still skew representation. However it is more proportional than FTP. As you say the alternative vote (AV) is more proportional but you do lose the opportunity to vote for an individual. It is also possible to combine STV with AV to get the best if both worlds No system is perfect but it's a poor argument to say we can't get rid of FPTP because the alternatives aren't perfect. You can see on here that people are pissed off with the current political system + it's there purely for the benefit of the two main parties, not the electorate. My politics is founded in my belief in democracy and it pains me to spoil my vote but the current system isn't fit for purpose and I'm not prepared to accept a system that effectively disenfranchises millions of people and shepherds people into voting for two parties they don't necessarily want.
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Apr 6, 2024 14:01:51 GMT
Post by wannabee on Apr 6, 2024 14:01:51 GMT
Taking into account the comments on here and the various Polls there has never been as much Public anger in a ruling party in my lifetime The grudging support for Labour in National Polls, if not on here, I think reflects that under a Labour Government not much will change economically just less corruption and sleaze hopefully I think when the Election arrives in 6/7 months time despite the apathy on here there will be a large turnout and I doubt the number of spoiled Votes will be significant Of course there will be tactical Voting against the Conservatives and the main beneficiaries will be the Lib Dems who have built a Constituency structure around hard working local Councillors Reform who are Polling at about the same as Lib Dems at 10% don't have that infrastructure and are likely to get no seats Undoubtedly in some Constituencies Reform will split the Right Wing Vote and allow a third Party, mostly Labour win. I wouldn't rule out a grubby deal being worked out before GE for Reform to stand down the same as UKIP did in 2017 and Brexit Party did in 2019 When people clamour for PR for fairer representation I wonder which type of PR they are looking for. Under UK Parliamentary Democracy FPTP system currently people vote for a Candidate not a Party to represent them. If the Voting system was changed to PR in the vast majority of the Constituencies the result wouldn't change. In the most recent YouGov Poll which analysed Reform at the Constituency Level, the highest share of Vote Reform received was 27% in Barnsley which means that as the candidates with the fewest votes drop out their 2nd and 3rd choice of Candidate etc must eventually give 50% +1 I find it highly unlikely Reform would receive transfers other than from Conservatives and again in YouGov Poll Reform were 2nd Conservatives 3rd in only 7 Constituencies An alternative PR System is which was used for EU Elections. In that system people voted for a Party not any Candidate. The Parties then decided themselves depending on what share of the Vote they received the order in which their Candidates would be Elected (This was the method UK selected, nothing to do with EU Rules) Personally I think this method is even less Democratic and you could end up being represented by someone who lives hundreds of miles away. Can't wait for Election Night with ample quantities of Popcorn to see one after another of these Entitled Conservative Arseholes being given their comeuppance, it will be a Portillo moment in Spades. The single transferable vote (STV) does preserve the principle of voting for an individual but as you say does still skew representation. However it is more proportional than FTP. As you say the alternative vote (AV) is more proportional but you do lose the opportunity to vote for an individual. It is also possible to combine STV with AV to get the best if both worlds No system is perfect but it's a poor argument to say we can't get rid of FPTP because the alternatives aren't perfect. You can see on here that people are pissed off with the current political system + it's there purely for the benefit of the two main parties, not the electorate. My politics is founded in my belief in democracy and it pains me to spoil my vote but the current system isn't fit for purpose and I'm not prepared to accept a system that effectively disenfranchises millions of people and shepherds people into voting for two parties they don't necessarily want. I made no particular argument in favour of retention of FPTP or for an alternative but posed which system people were proposing Now giving my opinion STV is the system I would favour with Constituencies of between 3/5 MPs as no vote is wasted on no hopers and gives a far greater proportional result than FPTP FPTP can actually elect the least favoured Candidate if they receive less than 50% and the remainder is split evenly over the other Candidates AV (rejected by referendum in 2011, I thought once a Referendum had taken place that's it ) is not a PR system, but a Majoritarian system like FPTP based upon ranked choices in single-member constituencies. In my opinion it is only marginally better than FPTP List PR as used to elect MEPs produces the most Proportional result but puts power in the hands of parties and distances MPs from voters with very large Constituencies. This can partially overcome by reducing the size of the Constituencies but it then becomes less proportional. It is my least favoured system.
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Post by gawa on Apr 6, 2024 14:34:54 GMT
It'd be genuinely interesting to see the result of a vote where individual votes count for proportional represemtation as oppose to the first past the post system. Northern Ireland MLA elections are great to watch as we use the single transferable vote system. In out last election this is how the seats worked out based on popular vote: SF 29% 27 seats DUP 21.3% 25 seats Alliance 13.5% 17 seats UUP 11.2% 9 seats SDLP 9.1% 8 seats A much better spread of seats which represents the electorates views better. Still not perfect but better than FPTP
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Apr 6, 2024 19:46:39 GMT
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Post by knype on Apr 6, 2024 19:46:39 GMT
Oh dear Angela, tut, tut, tut
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Post by musik on Apr 6, 2024 20:55:35 GMT
Here in the US I am going to keep my head down during this upcoming election civil war in November. Down to a choice between two ideologues, one half-dead, the other half-crazy, which has been the "norm" for a decade now. OR, I could do what I usually do, wait until the Libertarians pick their candidate and "protest vote" for them. One half-dead, the other half-crazy - easily the best post of today! 👍🤠👍
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Post by desman2 on Apr 6, 2024 21:01:34 GMT
Labour. It'd be nice to have someone in No. 10 who grew up in a way that I can actually relate to. It's time to stop entrusting our future to corrupt Eton boys. The Tories are modern day aristocrats who only seek to serve themselves. The ruling classes have never sought to improve the lives of working class people unless it benefits them too. The wealth inequality in this country is grotesque and I believe only Labour will try and address that (try being the operative word given the strangle hold that the wealthy have on practically everything). The thorn in the side there though is that Mr Starmer stated publicly that he likes the Davos way which is maybe a clue as to where he wants it to go.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Apr 6, 2024 22:38:38 GMT
Labour. It'd be nice to have someone in No. 10 who grew up in a way that I can actually relate to. It's time to stop entrusting our future to corrupt Eton boys. The Tories are modern day aristocrats who only seek to serve themselves. The ruling classes have never sought to improve the lives of working class people unless it benefits them too. The wealth inequality in this country is grotesque and I believe only Labour will try and address that (try being the operative word given the strangle hold that the wealthy have on practically everything). The thorn in the side there though is that Mr Starmer stated publicly that he likes the Davos way which is maybe a clue as to where he wants it to go. Davos advocates managed globalised capitalism with the aim of eradicating poverty. The right don't like it because it involves the redistribution of wealth and the the left don't like it because it is based on accepting capitalism and the little Englanders don't like it because it accepts that globalisation is a fact of life and isn't going to go away. Much as I don't like Starmer it'd no surprise that he backs this because Labour isn't a socialist party - it accepts that globalised capitalism is here to stay and he does want to eradicate poverty and has no problem with the redistribution of wealth. I can't see how that is a thorn in the side for anyone who supports Labour - unless they don't really understand where the Labour Party is now positioned on these matters.
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Apr 6, 2024 23:34:48 GMT
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Post by musik on Apr 6, 2024 23:34:48 GMT
I had to read about Reform UK a little.
First of all, when you say "populist" party, is it seen as something, negative, neutral or positive in England? In Sweden it is seen as something very negative.
They want to lower the income taxes considerably. It said you don't have to pay any income tax if you earn below £12400 or something like that per year, and they want to set the limit at £20000 per year.
My God!!! In Sweden you can only earn £1750 per year before you have to pay +30% of what you earn. Apart from that, we have a high value added tax on almost everything you'll buy.
And seriously, £20.000 per year and no income tax?? It would mean 3 million people would have to support 11 million people here. What would happen with the Swedish societal security system then? Our Health Care system and more.
It goes hand in hand with the promise to eliminate the waiting list to health care, I guess, since with no taxes paid the fees would go up enormously - so it would be no point to some to get in line for treatment. Of course the queues would be shorter ...
Reform UKs mentions the answer to many problems lies in an increased growth factor the coming years. It seems you can still work your way out of the problems or mess if you like.
In Sweden that would have been or was true in the 60ies and 70ies and partly in the beginning of the new millenium, but not thereafter.
We are trapped. The solution is something else. Giving societal payouts actually leads to a better situation in Sweden than giving 1 million people jobs. The latter comes with an even higher cost.
But aren't there things that has to be done? maybe someone cries. Yes there are, for instance in health care, but how the hell shall we pay for those jobs, they are tax financed and it's unreasonable to think the people in the private sector can hold them up forever.
Not much about law and order, and crime, in your political parties programs. In Sweden it's the #1 issue and topic. All seems to be economical over there.
What are the names of the communists party in England? Do you have any Christ Democrats?
Glenn Hysén, former Lpool defender and Swedish National team player happened to do a commercial for the right wing party Alternative for Sweden here the other day. He says he didn't know. Apparently, he sends small video messages every day to people's birthdays, weddings or whatever and AFS had made an order without him knowing who they were.
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Apr 6, 2024 23:51:32 GMT
Post by wannabee on Apr 6, 2024 23:51:32 GMT
The thorn in the side there though is that Mr Starmer stated publicly that he likes the Davos way which is maybe a clue as to where he wants it to go. Davos advocates managed globalised capitalism with the aim of eradicating poverty. The right don't like it because it involves the redistribution of wealth and the the left don't like it because it is based on accepting capitalism and the little Englanders don't like it because it accepts that globalisation is a fact of life and isn't going to go away. Much as I don't like Starmer it'd no surprise that he backs this because Labour isn't a socialist party - it accepts that globalised capitalism is here to stay and he does want to eradicate poverty and has no problem with the redistribution of wealth. I can't see how that is a thorn in the side for anyone who supports Labour - unless they don't really understand where the Labour Party is now positioned on these matters. That's all very good Chief but Globalisation is yesterday's news Due to the threat from China Biden introduced the Inflation Reduction Act IRA as a protectionist measure with $656Bn of Incentives and Tax Credits to US Companies to Manufacture in US with US components If there is a change in President Donald "America First" Trump is hardly likely to change Policy. In response the EU's introduced the Green Deal which has a €558Bn offering It's why Rishi went to US last July to try and cut UK Companies a piece of the pie (little point in asking EU) He returned with his thumb up his arse waving a piece of paper called the Atlantic Declaration which was as useful as a previous PMs Chamberlain's piece of paper
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Apr 6, 2024 23:59:54 GMT
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Post by mtrstudent on Apr 6, 2024 23:59:54 GMT
Reform UKs mentions the answer to many problems lies in an increased growth factor the coming years. It seems you can still work your way out of the problems or mess if you like. Yeah they all say that though and it's usually bollocks! Truss tried one way and blew up £40 billion in tax money for fuck all because the markets thought her plan was stupid.
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Apr 7, 2024 0:45:33 GMT
Post by wannabee on Apr 7, 2024 0:45:33 GMT
I had to read about Reform UK a little. First of all, when you say "populist" party, is it seen as something, negative, neutral or positive in England? In Sweden it is seen as something very negative. They want to lower the income taxes considerably. It said you don't have to pay any income tax if you earn below £12400 or something like that per year, and they want to set the limit at £20000 per year. My God!!! In Sweden you can only earn £1750 per year before you have to pay +30% of what you earn. Apart from that, we have a high value added tax on almost everything you'll buy. And seriously, £20.000 per year and no income tax?? It would mean 3 million people would have to support 11 million people here. What would happen with the Swedish societal security system then? Our Health Care system and more. It goes hand in hand with the promise to eliminate the waiting list to health care, I guess, since with no taxes paid the fees would go up enormously - so it would be no point to some to get in line for treatment. Of course the queues would be shorter ... Reform UKs mentions the answer to many problems lies in an increased growth factor the coming years. It seems you can still work your way out of the problems or mess if you like. In Sweden that would have been or was true in the 60ies and 70ies and partly in the beginning of the new millenium, but not thereafter. We are trapped. The solution is something else. Giving societal payouts actually leads to a better situation in Sweden than giving 1 million people jobs. The latter comes with an even higher cost. But aren't there things that has to be done? maybe someone cries. Yes there are, for instance in health care, but how the hell shall we pay for those jobs, they are tax financed and it's unreasonable to think the people in the private sector can hold them up forever. Not much about law and order, and crime, in your political parties programs. In Sweden it's the #1 issue and topic. All seems to be economical over there. What are the names of the communists party in England? Do you have any Christ Democrats? Glenn Hysén, former Lpool defender and Swedish National team player happened to do a commercial for the right wing party Alternative for Sweden here the other day. He says he didn't know. Apparently, he sends small video messages every day to people's birthdays, weddings or whatever and AFS had made an order without him knowing who they were. 🤣 you crack me up sometimes Musik but you often hit the nail on the head Part of Reforms Financial Plan to remove tax on all earnings below £20,000 is typical of a Political Party that knows it will never have the responsibility of implementing anything Your story about Glenn Hysén amusingly reminds me of Grifter Farage who is seen as a Messiah who will somehow enter on a White Horse and lead Reform to Electoral Victory. At one time between jobs said Grifter Farage had a gig wishing people a Happy Birthday on Social Media for £50 a pop and did so for Gerry Adams who at the time was Leader of a UK Terrorist Organisation A Grifters gotta Grift.
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Apr 7, 2024 3:27:46 GMT
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Post by essexstokey on Apr 7, 2024 3:27:46 GMT
I've allways said you need to vote even if it's to spoil the paper as you have no right to comment after the fact if you don't I've allways said vote anti tory as they don't care about anyone but themselves It's even more important to vote anti tory now than ever before to get rid of these idiots So vote anti tory to get rid of these parasites
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Apr 7, 2024 7:29:50 GMT
Davos advocates managed globalised capitalism with the aim of eradicating poverty. The right don't like it because it involves the redistribution of wealth and the the left don't like it because it is based on accepting capitalism and the little Englanders don't like it because it accepts that globalisation is a fact of life and isn't going to go away. Much as I don't like Starmer it'd no surprise that he backs this because Labour isn't a socialist party - it accepts that globalised capitalism is here to stay and he does want to eradicate poverty and has no problem with the redistribution of wealth. I can't see how that is a thorn in the side for anyone who supports Labour - unless they don't really understand where the Labour Party is now positioned on these matters. That's all very good Chief but Globalisation is yesterday's news Due to the threat from China Biden introduced the Inflation Reduction Act IRA as a protectionist measure with $656Bn of Incentives and Tax Credits to US Companies to Manufacture in US with US components If there is a change in President Donald "America First" Trump is hardly likely to change Policy. In response the EU's introduced the Green Deal which has a €558Bn offering It's why Rishi went to US last July to try and cut UK Companies a piece of the pie (little point in asking EU) He returned with his thumb up his arse waving a piece of paper called the Atlantic Declaration which was as useful as a previous PMs Chamberlain's piece of paper What some here today gone tomorrow politicians say or do makes no difference to the way the world conducts it's business. There are no major economies based on some form of localised state control - to different degrees they are all committed to a globalised free market and globalised trade will continue whatever the likes of Trump and Sunak do. The fact is the real power brokers sit in boardrooms, not in government buildings. The politicians might want to make out they are all important but they aren't. Global trade will just carry on regardless. Starmer recognises that the UK operates in a globalised capitalist system and has no intention of introducing some form of localized socialism - the nearest mainstream party to that position is Reform UK. Labour is not a socialist party - it's economic policy is wedded to the global free market. Labour is trying to emulate the mainstream social democratic parties in Europe - accept capitalism but manage it's excesses and redistribute wealth that would otherwise just accumulate in the hands of fewer and fewer people. Which is what bodies like Davos and the WEF are trying to do.
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Apr 7, 2024 9:21:42 GMT
Post by wannabee on Apr 7, 2024 9:21:42 GMT
That's all very good Chief but Globalisation is yesterday's news Due to the threat from China Biden introduced the Inflation Reduction Act IRA as a protectionist measure with $656Bn of Incentives and Tax Credits to US Companies to Manufacture in US with US components If there is a change in President Donald "America First" Trump is hardly likely to change Policy. In response the EU's introduced the Green Deal which has a €558Bn offering It's why Rishi went to US last July to try and cut UK Companies a piece of the pie (little point in asking EU) He returned with his thumb up his arse waving a piece of paper called the Atlantic Declaration which was as useful as a previous PMs Chamberlain's piece of paper What some here today gone tomorrow politicians say or do makes no difference to the way the world conducts it's business. There are no major economies based on some form of localised state control - to different degrees they are all committed to a globalised free market and globalised trade will continue whatever the likes of Trump and Sunak do. The fact is the real power brokers sit in boardrooms, not in government buildings. The politicians might want to make out they are all important but they aren't. Global trade will just carry on regardless. Starmer recognises that the UK operates in a globalised capitalist system and has no intention of introducing some form of localized socialism - the nearest mainstream party to that position is Reform UK. Labour is not a socialist party - it's economic policy is wedded to the global free market. Labour is trying to emulate the mainstream social democratic parties in Europe - accept capitalism but manage it's excesses and redistribute wealth that would otherwise just accumulate in the hands of fewer and fewer people. Which is what bodies like Davos and the WEF are trying to do. I won't waste my own words I'll leave it to others that know what they are talking about and recognise what is happening Globally This is how the Wilson Centre a Think Tank founded by Congress and funded by it explain this Paradigm Shift Protectionism Is Back – But Not as You Know It: How the US Inflation Reduction Act Is Reshaping the Path to a Green Energy Transition A new brand of state-led capitalism is sweeping through developed economies. And the new era of competition among friends that it brings may be the unlikely path to the world’s green energy transition. In August 2022, US President Joe Biden signed the Inflation Reduction Act (IRA). It promised massive investment by the US government in US-built green infrastructure and industry. The IRA contains $394 billion in tax incentives, grants, and loans, most of which will flow to businesses. The funds will be directed to green investment in sectors like energy, transportation, and manufacturing, all to support US industry. One interesting feature of the IRA is its explicit shift toward protectionism. Protectionism takes the form of targeted intervention in markets by the US government to support domestic political and economic goals. However, while the IRA’s goals are domestic, its impact has been felt far beyond US borders. www.wilsoncenter.org/article/protectionism-back-not-you-know-it-how-us-inflation-reduction-act-reshaping-path-greenAs referenced in the above Article Japan, Australia, Canada and EU have responded to IRA with similar incentives for on-shoring. European Central Bank President Christine Lagarde on Friday said Europe is now at a critical juncture, with deglobalization, demographics and decarbonization looming on the horizon. "There are increasing signs that the global economy is fragmenting into competing blocs," she said at the European Banking Congress, according to a transcript. www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/11/17/lagarde-increasing-signs-that-the-global-economy-is-fragmenting.htmlThe EU recognising the shift and arguing there may be other ways Weatherhead Center Fellow and Directorate-General Taxation and Customs Union, EU Commission, Juan José García Sánchez argues that there’s a better way for the US to compete with China other than its current protectionist strategy. epicenter.wcfia.harvard.edu/blog/american-protectionism-can-it-workYou may have caught Rachel Reeves recent speech to CBI it was linked on here on some thread and commented on by me and others.Some misunderstood the message she was bringing Reeves proposed a State Led Investment Programme if Labour gained Office and referenced Bidens IRA as a model. But if you wish go ahead and think nothing is changing
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Apr 7, 2024 9:36:16 GMT
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Post by musik on Apr 7, 2024 9:36:16 GMT
Can't wait for Election Night with ample quantities of Popcorn to see--- When is it?
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Post by iancransonsknees on Apr 7, 2024 10:04:29 GMT
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Post by wannabee on Apr 7, 2024 10:08:51 GMT
Can't wait for Election Night with ample quantities of Popcorn to see--- When is it? Not Official yet but most likely October/November
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Post by Waggy on Apr 7, 2024 10:16:50 GMT
Still voting Reform Uk at the moment. Can’t vote Labour anymore and Tories are basically a centre left party these days, I’m possibly politically homeless as are many people from the left and right that o speak to on the subject. There is a good quiz online that if I knew how to do it would put it on here called ‘ I side with’ you have to expand the yes and no answers to be spot on but it helps me with a week or two to go.
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Post by andystokey on Apr 7, 2024 10:27:42 GMT
He was a man ahead of his time.
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Apr 7, 2024 11:11:48 GMT
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Apr 7, 2024 11:11:48 GMT
I take your point but it was people staying home and leaving it to others that gave us feckin' Brexit. No way am I leaving it to chance. The turn out for the EU Referendum, at 72.2%, was the highest for any national vote this century. Or - if we're quoting percentages - Leave was something only 38% of the electorate voted for.
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Voting
Apr 7, 2024 12:04:59 GMT
Post by lawrieleslie on Apr 7, 2024 12:04:59 GMT
The turn out for the EU Referendum, at 72.2%, was the highest for any national vote this century. Or - if we're quoting percentages - Leave was something only 38% of the electorate voted for. It's the old "joke", it was there if you wanted it but you chose not to. It’s relevant to both leave & remain…..only 34.5% of the electorate voted to remain. 33.5m of 46.5m registered voters chose to vote, I wonder what the result would have been if those other 13m people had voted?
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Voting
Apr 7, 2024 12:15:24 GMT
via mobile
Post by Seymour Beaver on Apr 7, 2024 12:15:24 GMT
Or - if we're quoting percentages - Leave was something only 38% of the electorate voted for. It's the old "joke", it was there if you wanted it but you chose not to. It’s relevant to both leave & remain…..only 34.5% of the electorate voted to remain. 33.5m of 46.5m registered voters chose to vote, I wonder what the result would have been if those other 13m people had voted? Nothing funny about it as far as I'm concerned. If you read the thread back my point was not about Brexit per se but that if you want the Tories out (I do) then don't just trust the opinion polls and assume that's what's going to happen and leave the voting to someone else. Even Farage agrees that's pretty much what happened with the Remain vote.
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