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Post by foxysgloves on Dec 28, 2023 12:49:07 GMT
Schumacher has taken two games to turn Burger into Nzonzi and Mmaee into Firmino.
Give him one more game with McNally and we’ll have the new Shawcross.
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Post by TinkerT on Dec 28, 2023 13:06:28 GMT
We're priming him so he'll be in top form for our rivals next season. He's getting better but illustrates why we should avoid this type of signing. At the start of the season he was unproven at this level and his inconsistent performances have cost us dearly. He's now getting better but it's too late for us to have a good season. We can only hope to avoid relegation. But he'll be in good form when he faces us next season I still think we can get a better centre back than him. If he was any good kompany would have him around the place.
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Post by dirtclod on Dec 28, 2023 13:53:32 GMT
IF a player makes a mistake because he looks to take on a defender and move the ball FORWARD on the pitch instead of limping it back to a keeper, ffs then I'll take it. And I'll take McNally too - permanently. We're not in the PL - he's what you get at this level. (Actually better than usual) We've had far too much of this alleged "safe, find a way not to lose" football going on the past 8 years. (The approach where we STILL lose) Have literally wanted to slap some of our former managers - that flaccid, chicken-shit method of play is turgid to watch and hasn't gotten us anywhere. I'm not asking for Real Madrid levels of play here, it's the championship. The teams getting up and OUT of this league aren't sitting back parking the bus.
Attacking football leaves you open to counters and open to mistakes. Then so be it. This league is made up of inconsistent, imperfect teams - if we don't show some guts, we're not even testing them.
Schu is apparently aware that dour, pessimistic, chicken-shit football is what GETS you to 20th place and keeps you there. If we want to change where we're at then we have to change how we play. We have some athletes in this squad. With proper rotation of players, we can sustain an attack - the real way to improve fitness and put balls in nets. January then can be used to incrementally improve the defense for a more balanced approach. But right now - use the tools we have and put pressure on the opposition at least. Foot on the gas.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Dec 28, 2023 14:01:12 GMT
IF a player makes a mistake because he looks to take on a defender and move the ball FORWARD on the pitch instead of limping it back to a keeper, ffs then I'll take it. And I'll take McNally too - permanently. We're not in the PL - he's what you get at this level. (Actually better than usual) We've had far too much of this alleged "safe, find a way not to lose" football going on the past 8 years. (The approach where we STILL lose) Have literally wanted to slap some of our former managers - that flaccid, chicken-shit method of play is turgid to watch and hasn't gotten us anywhere. I'm not asking for Real Madrid levels of play here, it's the championship. The teams getting up and OUT of this league aren't sitting back parking the bus. Attacking football leaves you open to counters and open to mistakes. Then so be it. This league is made up of inconsistent, imperfect teams - if we don't show some guts, we're not even testing them. Schu is apparently aware that dour, pessimistic, chicken-shit football is what GETS you to 20th place and keeps you there. If we want to change where we're at then we have to change how we play. We have some athletes in this squad. With proper rotation of players, we can sustain an attack - the real way to improve fitness and put balls in nets. January then can be used to incrementally improve the defense for a more balanced approach. But right now - use the tools we have and put pressure on the opposition at least. Foot on the gas. Bang on. Ipswich have shown what limited players can do if they play positive football as a team. SCFC in 2008 anyone?
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Post by HarryTheHat on Dec 28, 2023 14:22:13 GMT
I know, the shit some people come out with to justify an irrational agenda is incredible isn't it? 🤣 Horseshit Our best CB this season, and Burger’s friend, sign him. We’ve tried a lot of different back line configurations this season and the best we’ve looked was McNally and Rose in a back four. McNally and Wilmot have only had 2.5 games as a pair though (1 win and 2 losses) so, they didn’t have much time working together. And with Wilmot, McNally, and Rose as a back three, 1 win, 2 losses, 1 draw. However, with McNally and Rose as a pair we have 4 wins, 5 draws, and 1 loss. That’s a very good record. Improving the back four should be a priority, but no one in our current squad should start ahead of McNally or Rose. You're (typically) convenienently missing the obvious point above that Wilmot has been unavailable for over 2 months and hence has barely played in a pair with McNally. The ONLY reason that McNally and Rose have played together so often just lately is because Wilmot has been unavailable and Clark is frankly crap. The manager (AN and SS) have had nobody else to pick in that position. We'll see who SS prefers as his back 2 once Wilmot is fit again
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Dec 28, 2023 14:30:23 GMT
We're priming him so he'll be in top form for our rivals next season. He's getting better but illustrates why we should avoid this type of signing. At the start of the season he was unproven at this level and his inconsistent performances have cost us dearly. He's now getting better but it's too late for us to have a good season. We can only hope to avoid relegation. But he'll be in good form when he faces us next season Eh? He was a mainstay for Coventry, who reached the play-off final last season. He's not a rookie we're taking from the cradle. He's just not premiership level yet. He only had 20 or so games with them, joined them in January didn't be? My view is he was a rookie when he started but will be far better by the end of the season and we won't reap the benefits. I'm not a fan of this kind of loan signing, developing other teams players so they get an advantage over us whether financial or otherwise. I prefer the type of loan signings pulis made in this league, experienced players who played at a higher level but are not getting a chance to play.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 28, 2023 14:38:13 GMT
You're (typically) convenienently missing the obvious point above that Wilmot has been unavailable for over 2 months and hence has barely played in a pair with McNally. The ONLY reason that McNally and Rose have played together so often just lately is because Wilmot has been unavailable and Clark is frankly crap. The manager (AN and SS) have had nobody else to pick in that position. We'll see who SS prefers as his back 2 once Wilmot is fit again And in that time I think the defence has looked better than when Wilmot was available. It’s still looked bad don’t get me wrong but it looked way worse with Wilmot in there.
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Post by idle on Dec 28, 2023 15:04:59 GMT
Eh? He was a mainstay for Coventry, who reached the play-off final last season. He's not a rookie we're taking from the cradle. He's just not premiership level yet. He only had 20 or so games with them, joined them in January didn't be? My view is he was a rookie when he started but will be far better by the end of the season and we won't reap the benefits. Well, he kept Rose out of the team all of the second half of the season... I'm not a fan of this kind of loan signing, developing other teams players so they get an advantage over us whether financial or otherwise. I prefer the type of loan signings pulis made in this league, experienced players who played at a higher level but are not getting a chance to play. How many of those players are you seeing these days? They all rather want to sit in the stands in the PL than risk an injury in the tough championship. There's some who were ok when teams go up, but fail to play in the PL, but none who actually tear the championship apart. But we all want our own players, that goes without saying.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Dec 28, 2023 16:00:10 GMT
IF a player makes a mistake because he looks to take on a defender and move the ball FORWARD on the pitch instead of limping it back to a keeper, ffs then I'll take it. And I'll take McNally too - permanently. We're not in the PL - he's what you get at this level. (Actually better than usual) We've had far too much of this alleged "safe, find a way not to lose" football going on the past 8 years. (The approach where we STILL lose) Have literally wanted to slap some of our former managers - that flaccid, chicken-shit method of play is turgid to watch and hasn't gotten us anywhere. I'm not asking for Real Madrid levels of play here, it's the championship. The teams getting up and OUT of this league aren't sitting back parking the bus. Attacking football leaves you open to counters and open to mistakes. Then so be it. This league is made up of inconsistent, imperfect teams - if we don't show some guts, we're not even testing them. Schu is apparently aware that dour, pessimistic, chicken-shit football is what GETS you to 20th place and keeps you there. If we want to change where we're at then we have to change how we play. We have some athletes in this squad. With proper rotation of players, we can sustain an attack - the real way to improve fitness and put balls in nets. January then can be used to incrementally improve the defense for a more balanced approach. But right now - use the tools we have and put pressure on the opposition at least. Foot on the gas. Having good defenders who play the percentage ball when necessary has fuck all to do with playing defensive football. You can have a a solid mistake free defence AND play attacking football. The idea you have to put up with flakey, error prone defenders if you want to play attacking, front foot football is bollocks. Virtually the first thing Schumacher mentioned in the post Birmingham interview was his disappointment at not keep a clean sheet. He may well play attacking football but he knows full well that doesn't absolve his defenders from getting the basics right. In terms of McNally I think he's got potential and I rate him more highly than Wilmott. With a solid, experienced no nonsense partner he would be fine but any combination of him, Wilmott and Rose is just an accident waiting to happen. Throw in Hoever and you really haven't got a defence that will get you out of the bottom half of the table.
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Post by dirtclod on Dec 28, 2023 16:20:40 GMT
Just to be clear, I'm not advocating flaky defenders. Just suggesting what we should do with what we actually HAVE right now. Totally agree that January would be an excellent opportunity to improve our defense. Totally agree that you can defend AND attack.
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Post by lordb on Dec 28, 2023 16:43:02 GMT
Just to be clear, I'm not advocating flaky defenders. Just suggesting what we should do with what we actually HAVE right now. Totally agree that January would be an excellent opportunity to improve our defense. Totally agree that you can defend AND attack. good post but 'defence' please
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Post by dirtclod on Dec 28, 2023 16:44:36 GMT
Just to be clear, I'm not advocating flaky defenders. Just suggesting what we should do with what we actually HAVE right now. Totally agree that January would be an excellent opportunity to improve our defense. Totally agree that you can defend AND attack. good post but 'defence' please I keep forgetting that we 'Mericans don't know how to spell.
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Post by mtrstudent on Dec 28, 2023 16:54:56 GMT
We're priming him so he'll be in top form for our rivals next season. He's getting better but illustrates why we should avoid this type of signing. At the start of the season he was unproven at this level and his inconsistent performances have cost us dearly. He's now getting better but it's too late for us to have a good season. We can only hope to avoid relegation. But he'll be in good form when he faces us next season I still think we can get a better centre back than him. If he was any good kompany would have him around the place. McNally's a bit old for the comparison but we loaned out Souttar several times and he was good. Obviously kompany knows defenders but we can't know for sure if he thinks McNally will have what it takes yet. I'd take him if we could.
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Post by Veritas on Dec 28, 2023 16:59:14 GMT
Schumacher has taken two games to turn Burger into Nzonzi and Mmaee into Firmino. Give him one more game with McNally and we’ll have the new Shawcross. Someone obviously been at the sherry.
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Post by Veritas on Dec 28, 2023 17:00:09 GMT
You're (typically) convenienently missing the obvious point above that Wilmot has been unavailable for over 2 months and hence has barely played in a pair with McNally. The ONLY reason that McNally and Rose have played together so often just lately is because Wilmot has been unavailable and Clark is frankly crap. The manager (AN and SS) have had nobody else to pick in that position. We'll see who SS prefers as his back 2 once Wilmot is fit again And in that time I think the defence has looked better than when Wilmot was available. It’s still looked bad don’t get me wrong but it looked way worse with Wilmot in there. No it didn't
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Post by TinkerT on Dec 28, 2023 17:03:44 GMT
I still think we can get a better centre back than him. If he was any good kompany would have him around the place. McNally's a bit old for the comparison but we loaned out Souttar several times and he was good. Obviously kompany knows defenders but we can't know for sure if he thinks McNally will have what it takes yet. I'd take him if we could. Mate kompany has dara o.shea starting for him in the PL and he couldn't get in the West brom side. If he rated mcnally he would be starting that's for sure.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Dec 28, 2023 17:09:06 GMT
And in that time I think the defence has looked better than when Wilmot was available. It’s still looked bad don’t get me wrong but it looked way worse with Wilmot in there. No it didn't Oh yes it did.
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Post by jezzascfc on Dec 28, 2023 17:10:40 GMT
I agree with Bayern more than most (and not just because we are both Leeses!), but I struggle with his Wilmot analysis. Ben is the only one of our 4 CBs I would want to keep for next season. Give him a big Jake Cooper style partner (see his time with Axel) and he should be fine - he is quick enough, mobile, can bring the ball out from the back and doesn't shirk a challenge. As for the others Rose looks composed until he drops a bollock out of nowhere which causes a goal, McNally has all the physical attributes but somehow never looks comfortable and has to do too much last ditch defending (which suggests he does not read the game too well) for my liking and Clark was a panic buy who looks well past his best.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Dec 28, 2023 17:12:14 GMT
good post but 'defence' please I keep forgetting that we 'Mericans don't know how to spell. Bloody colonials. And shirley the correct spelling is 'Muricans'?
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Post by ceejays on Dec 28, 2023 17:17:27 GMT
Wilmot is the quickest and the best defender we’ve got . And that opinion is backed up by the stars rather than attention seeker agendas
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Post by numpty40 on Dec 28, 2023 17:38:57 GMT
I would rather see a defensive partnership from any three of McNally, Wilmot and even Rose than the thought of a lumbering hoofer who shouts and shakes his fist as he hoofs it straight out of play.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Dec 28, 2023 18:22:38 GMT
Wilmot is the quickest and the best defender we’ve got . And that opinion is backed up by the stars rather than attention seeker agendas You mentioned the 'a' word but I think you might have got away with it.
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Post by foxysgloves on Dec 28, 2023 18:28:15 GMT
Schumacher has taken two games to turn Burger into Nzonzi and Mmaee into Firmino. Give him one more game with McNally and we’ll have the new Shawcross. Someone obviously been at the sherry. My tongue was firmly in cheek. Although I have seen Burger and Mmaee compared to the players above on here recently….
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Post by mtrstudent on Dec 28, 2023 18:31:10 GMT
McNally's a bit old for the comparison but we loaned out Souttar several times and he was good. Obviously kompany knows defenders but we can't know for sure if he thinks McNally will have what it takes yet. I'd take him if we could. Mate kompany has dara o.shea starting for him in the PL and he couldn't get in the West brom side. If he rated mcnally he would be starting that's for sure. You're right - he obviously doesn't rate him enough right now. I just don't think we can tell if kompany sees a foundation there. Maybe he thinks he needs more championship seasoning, or wasn't trained in the way he wants? You're probably right but I can't help but think kompany wouldn't blow £2 million on a complete duffer.
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Post by tuum on Dec 29, 2023 11:05:55 GMT
I agree with Bayern more than most (and not just because we are both Leeses!), but I struggle with his Wilmot analysis. Ben is the only one of our 4 CBs I would want to keep for next season. Give him a big Jake Cooper style partner (see his time with Axel) and he should be fine - he is quick enough, mobile, can bring the ball out from the back and doesn't shirk a challenge. As for the others Rose looks composed until he drops a bollock out of nowhere which causes a goal, McNally has all the physical attributes but somehow never looks comfortable and has to do too much last ditch defending (which suggests he does not read the game too well) for my liking and Clark was a panic buy who looks well past his best. Agree with your comment re.McNally not reading the game well. I would also add that he is still too negative in his passing. At Birmingham, 1st half Bae made two runs across their back four waiting for a ball over the top from McNally into the (lots of) space behind.McNally had plenty of time to make the pass. He chose to pass it square to Rose both times. Either he didn't see the pass or he saw it but his default mindset is caution.
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Post by idle on Dec 29, 2023 12:50:47 GMT
I agree with Bayern more than most (and not just because we are both Leeses!), but I struggle with his Wilmot analysis. Ben is the only one of our 4 CBs I would want to keep for next season. Give him a big Jake Cooper style partner (see his time with Axel) and he should be fine - he is quick enough, mobile, can bring the ball out from the back and doesn't shirk a challenge. As for the others Rose looks composed until he drops a bollock out of nowhere which causes a goal, McNally has all the physical attributes but somehow never looks comfortable and has to do too much last ditch defending (which suggests he does not read the game too well) for my liking and Clark was a panic buy who looks well past his best. Agree with your comment re.McNally not reading the game well. I would also add that he is still too negative in his passing. At Birmingham, 1st half Bae made two runs across their back four waiting for a ball over the top from McNally into the (lots of) space behind.McNally had plenty of time to make the pass. He chose to pass it square to Rose both times. Either he didn't see the pass or he saw it but his default mindset is caution. Well half the posters in this thread wants him to only make safe choices, so there's that. I'm not sure I agree McNally needs to make more "last ditch" tackles than other CBs in the division, but as all CBs under 25 he needs more experience to read the game better.
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